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Has Hansen become a 2nd line player?


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#61 hockeywoot

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:02 AM

I remember some people saying that he'll never become a second line player.
Newsflash: Jannik Hansen is a second line player on a lot of teams in the NHL.
Is he a 2nd liner? Yes
Elite? No
Decent? Yes

He shouldn't be a top 6 forward on a contender.
I think his game is more suited to the third line.
He isn't that "top 6 scorer" we've been looking for to solve our problems.
He isn't the answer.

Of our tweener wingers (Raymond, Higgins, Booth, Hansen) I think Hansen is the most valuable.

Edited by hockeywoot, 20 March 2013 - 08:05 AM.


#62 Captain Aerosex

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:14 AM

I think you underestimate him. He's 3rd in team scoring this year and doesn' get PP time and usually plays a checking role. Pretty good numbers for a PK'ing 3rd liner.


Stats don't tell everything. He could have a very productive year, but Boyes put up 40 once. Cheechoo won a Richard. Nobody in their right mind thought that was their true potential.

Hansen's goals are usually very raw; he doesn't have the instinct or talent to score consistently like top 6 players on contenders (key word) do. His blue collar effort churns out goals every now and then, with help from his wheels. Don't get me wrong, that's great, but put him on a legit 2nd line for a season and he'll try to play a top 6 style which he can't do, and he'll be less effective overall.

He's a 3rd liner who can produce more than most other 3rd liners. A great player to have, but he's not top 6 and putting those expectations on him is unfair.

Edited by Witchcraft and Sedinery, 20 March 2013 - 08:21 AM.

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#63 Losing With Pride

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:14 AM

Our version of Brad Marchand... minus the dirtiness... and the nose.


Wait... He did destroy Hossa with that massive hit... oh wait... Hossa was back playing the next game... it's a miracle!

#64 Captain Aerosex

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:18 AM

Double post

Edited by Witchcraft and Sedinery, 20 March 2013 - 08:18 AM.

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#65 Edlerberry

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:47 AM

In addition to Baggins' excellent breakdown of scoring expectations and averages by position (ie: Hansen compared to the average 2nd line RW), I would submit the following (wrote this a couple hours earlier tonight and got pulled away before I could post):

Strictly by the numbers, I suppose you could argue that there are 180 "top-six" forwards in the NHL (30 teams X 2 lines X 3 forwards). Basically, the first 90 highest scoring forwards are "first liners" and the next 90 (#91-180) are "second liners." Last season, the the 180th highest scoring forward in the NHL put up 14 goals, 17 assists, and 32 points (stats reflect #180 in each category as per NHL.com).

Jannik Hansen in 2011-12: 82 GP, 16 goals, 23 assists, 39 points

So, by that standard, Hansen was a 2nd liner last season.

Jannik Hansen in 2012-12: 28 GP, 8 goals, 9 assists, 17 points

This season, Hansen is on pace (over an 82 game season) for 23 goals, 26 assists, and 50 points (rounded down for goals/assists and up for points--thus the addition "fail" of 23+26=50).

Using last seasons scoring stats, the top 90 forwards in the NHL put up 20 or more goals, 29 or more assists, and 51 or more points. By those numbers, Hansen's current projections have him at or close to first line numbers (or certainly top-end 2nd line numbers).

By this season's actual stats, Hansen sits tied (among NHL forwards) for #72 in goals, #109 in assists, and #105 in total points. So, whether you look at a projected 82-game season or just where Hansen sits currently among his peers for this season, his scoring numbers put him at a solid 2nd liner (between #91-180 of NHL forwards) and first line (goals) or near it (assists, points) in the three commonly-used scoring categories.

Of course, it's not just about scoring. The thing is, I find that Jannik Hansen excels at the non-scoring aspects of the game and is probably even more valuable for the things he does that don't show up on the scoresheet. So, if Hansen's scoring stats put make him a high-end 2nd liner and a fringe 1st liner, who are we to question whether or not he's actually become a 2nd line forward in the NHL?

The fact that his progression over the last couple years puts him right on the cusp of becoming a 20 goal scorer in this league speaks volumes. If you look at just how valuable 20 goals are in the NHL, Hansen's place becomes pretty clear (check out: http://crashingthene...0-goal-scorers/) . Last season, only two teams had five guys with 20+ goals. Of the remaining teams in the league, five teams had four, ten had three, eight had two, and five teams had only 1 player with 20 or more goals. If Hansen can maintain his numbers, the argument probably becomes one of whether he's good enough for to be "first line" or "second line."

That all said, I still prefer Hansen as a 3rd liner for this team (he's "elite" at this position, by any NHL team's standards). When the Canucks have the depth to justify placing Hansen in the bottom-six, it means that they have an "elite" forward corps in this league (by virtue of having 6 players ahead of Hansen in scoring potential). Of course, given the current roster situation, it's obvious that Hansen is playing well above the role of a 3rd liner. It'd be pretty difficult to argue against the fact that Hansen is now the #4 forward on the Canucks (until Kesler returns).


Doesn't take into account players with injuries, add in that fudge factor and the 39 points probably puts him on the cusp.

Which is where we all think he is now.

So in short, useless statistics are useless.

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#66 brownky

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:13 AM

He's one of the best third liners in hockey.

He isn't a second liner. He could fill in there, but he isn't one. As far as points and scoring, the concept that a third line's sole purpose is to stop the other team from scoring is a farce and an ancient concept. "Scoring more goals than the other team wins the game". Stupidly obvious statement, but it holds. Guys like Hansen are wizards on the third line, as they are sound defensively and yet will chip in 30-40 points for you regularly. Those points take pressure off the first two lines, as now a team with a suspect defence pairing can't effectively defend all three "scoring capable" lines. It does matter when you get those 30-40 points. If it's the SCF, game 7 and you're down a goal or two, it's often those guys who can make it happen, as the top two units are frequently locked down hard by the other team after 6 games of watching tape, tendencies and positioning.

Expecting them to do it game in and game out, on the other hand, is just disappointing. I actually think that Kesler could be the best "third line centre" in the league, if he could get and stay healthy. He's slotted into our second line, yes, but I don't think he's a great second liner.

That opinion might be a little controversial though.

#67 zamboni

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:25 AM

Those stone hands have worked pretty well this season, at least in comparison to our other players.


I was trying to make a joke on the "hands of stone" guys from the past. Seems like i failed :-)

#68 cbdoubleu

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:34 AM

Any player can be a second line player if he's playing on the second line.

#69 ZephyrsSong

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:40 AM

To me, he has already exceeded expectations as a 9th rounder.

#70 clynch

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 10:26 AM

I think the confusion comes that we need to label a 2nd line, as opposed to a line that works well together. Booth and Kassian seemed to be a good fit, just need a cantre. Raymond and hansen also work very well together, again just need a stable centre.

#71 Ray_Cathode

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 10:52 AM

Now I love Honey Badger as much as the next guy but I was having a chat with a friend and he thinks that Hansen has become a 2nd line player.

Now there's no doubt that he has the effort, the will, the speed to become one, however I think that just because we lack a real second line threat at the moment that Hansen has stepped up but to a second line skill? I think he can get there and is almost there but not quite.

What do you think though, has Hansen become a second line player? or is he not quite there yet?


Hansen would be a great second line player - with Raymond, centred by Kesler. Higgins and Booth could play third line if NG can find another decent centre - I wouldn't hold my breath, though, our one legitimate trading piece is Luongo, and he has cooled off and he has that albatross of a contract.

#72 Raffi Torres's Smirk

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 10:52 AM

It took this thread to make me realize there was a daily quota for +1's.

Great job everyone. Hansen is the greatest. Where on earth did "Honeybadger" come from?

#73 canucklehead44

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 11:23 AM

Forwards in the top 180 in scoring could be considered all of the first and second line players in the NHL (30 teams x 6)

Given there are injuries and what not, plus teams with players who are given better minutes than they deserve due to lack of depth, I would consider the forwards ranking 80-140 second line players. On the high end side you the Fleischmann, J. Staal, Hudler type players (good second line guys) and on the low-end side you have the MacArthur, Read, Brassard type players.

This year Hansen is ranked smack dab in the middle at 107. Last season he was 141. So given being just outside second line production last year and being better than half the second line players this year I would say yes. But he is used more as a Mike Fisher kind of second liner (defensive focus vs offensive focus).
Sig too big.

#74 CrazyAL

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 11:24 AM

I remember some people saying that he'll never become a second line player.
Newsflash: Jannik Hansen is a second line player on a lot of teams in the NHL.
Is he a 2nd liner? Yes
Elite? No
Decent? Yes

He shouldn't be a top 6 forward on a contender.
I think his game is more suited to the third line.
He isn't that "top 6 scorer" we've been looking for to solve our problems.
He isn't the answer.

Of our tweener wingers (Raymond, Higgins, Booth, Hansen) I think Hansen is the most valuable.



Yep the same people that said Burrows is a career 4th liner, *cough* Ray Ferraro *cough*

#75 Fred65

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 11:25 AM

Hansen is fine where he is, I don't think he takes to well to top end checking from the opposition

#76 Vansicle

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 11:40 AM

What better scoreres ar you referring to? He's tied for the team lead in goals.

Hansen is a gold mine for this team. He can and does play every style asked. He hits, he aggrevates, he checks, kills penalties, is fast as lightening and scores goals.

His shot and his hands have imprived significantly this year. That shot tonight was a bloody laser.

He can play on any of the 4 lines and specioal teams within reason.

He's also durable. We are very fortunate to have him.

This. Plus he doesn't ask for a mountain of money.
He makes every line he plays on better. In my mind, Hansen is a 2nd liner, a 4th liner, a 1st liner and a 3rd liner all wrapped up into one ferocious ball.

Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#77 cammy

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:17 PM

Hansen, Kesler, Burrows = Ultimate shutdown & Scoring line it is the epitome of a can do it all line.

#78 clutesi

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:22 PM

He has high end NHL speed, he's strong defensively, and he plays a strong physical game. It looks like he's developed a shot. I don't know what else you could ask for.

#79 pibroch

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:24 PM

He's currently evolving into a second liner. It's not just the goals and assists, you tell can by the way he plays, creating offense by himself, like that two on one he created last night (on the PP?). Next year he will definitely be a legit second liner.

Hansen should get re-signed for 5 years if we can get a good price, because he won't just work hard in his contract year (playing his best hockey now, not a contract year). He wants to be better at everything for the sake of himself and the team. If his offense keeps on improving over the years Hansen is going to become one scary player.

#80 ThaBestPlaceOnEarth

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:29 PM

Hansen-Raymond-Schroeder needs to be the second line going forward, their speed gives them all kinds of versatility, they can play a checking game, an offensive game, whatever. When Kesler comes back, put him with Higgins and somebody on the third line, he's the shutdown guy and can take all the key faceoffs, ease him back into things on the third line. No doubt Hansen with Raymond and Schroeder is the second best line this season, they've been solid all along.

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#81 Hunter.S-Kerouac

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:30 PM

Honey badger don't give a sh*& he plays any line.

#82 5minutesinthebox

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:46 PM

no i think Hansen is still better suited playing on the 3rd line. he's really good defensively and usually don't get the 1st or 2nd defensive pairing which is beneficial i think moving him into a 2nd line role his production will drop.. and he has more playmakers playing on the 3rd line then he'll on the 2nd line lol.


Well to be fair he has been playing 2nd line minutes at 4th on the team amongst forwards. He is seeing plenty of 2nd pariings.

#83 Opmac

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:53 PM

For sure third liner. Complementary second liner.

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#84 Nashi

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 01:06 PM

I hope he turns into an elite player next year. He is really steping it up this season.

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#85 Guest_Gumballthechewy_*

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 01:07 PM

I love Hansen and what he brings but he's a second liner on a team like Columbus (probably even a first liner there) and he's a great 2nd line sub here but when this roster is healthy he's a 3rd.

He's like Burrows, you can play him on any line and he'll fit great.

Edited by Gumballthechewy, 20 March 2013 - 01:11 PM.


#86 gocanuckzgo

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 01:50 PM

Hansen is whatever you ask him to be. That's why he's my favorite player. You put him on any line and he'll adapt. If you give him limited ice time and ask him to play physical he will, if you ask him to forecheck he will, if you ask him to score and give him the right linemates and enough icetime he will.

If he ever leaves the Canucks I'll be devastated.

#87 Baggins

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 02:21 PM

Stats don't tell everything. He could have a very productive year, but Boyes put up 40 once. Cheechoo won a Richard. Nobody in their right mind thought that was their true potential.

Hansen's goals are usually very raw; he doesn't have the instinct or talent to score consistently like top 6 players on contenders (key word) do. His blue collar effort churns out goals every now and then, with help from his wheels. Don't get me wrong, that's great, but put him on a legit 2nd line for a season and he'll try to play a top 6 style which he can't do, and he'll be less effective overall.

He's a 3rd liner who can produce more than most other 3rd liners. A great player to have, but he's not top 6 and putting those expectations on him is unfair.


I seem to recall the same being said of another Canuck. Yet Kesler proved many naysayers wrong. Players often move up the ranks as they mature.

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#88 Buckeye Fruit

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 02:56 PM



Nastya$$ honeybadger don't give a $h!t what line hes on
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#89 RonMexico

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 03:05 PM

Hands of stone, all i'm saying.


100% agree. I have seen him miss the net more than hit it. However, Kesler and Burrows used to be the same way and they both panned out after a few years of missing wide open goals.

#90 Ginu

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 03:12 PM

Hard to determine, but I think hes really close (one to two years)... its hard to determine as we dont really have a second line, however hes working really hard.
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