Gustavo Fring Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 With the way Schneiders playing, I don't think we need any trades. He is the saviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 So much is assumption....do you really think the fans are privvy to what is going on behind the scenes? And just because a GM says something to the public doesn't mean it's "how it is"...it's a game that is played. Teams that seem desperate are played upon with regard to that. You have to say you're not going after something, at times, when you really are. It's how bargaining works. If you go out with a laundry list of what you: want, need, are willing to pay/trade, etc. then you have no ability TO bargain...you put yourself in the passenger seat with someone else at the wheel. If you rush to a market where offers are accepted, do you say "I really, REALLY want/need that?" Or do you play it cool to see what you can work out? Buying a house? It's a chess board mentality. GM's don't have the luxury of hindsight either...they must act based upon what they "think" at the time. Nothing is a given when it comes to human beings and their performance...too many variables. And the prices are inflated when everyone's in the market for the same, few available commodities. He plays his hand close to his chest. He gives media friendly information that pacifies, but it doesn't mean he doesn't have an ace up his sleeve. It doesn't mean he hasn't tried things that just isn't public information. Iginla is awesome...love him. But he's at the downside of his career and has slowed down a lot...for the $$$$ that he'll command, really?...do we really want to go in that direction? We have some grit for the playoffs and this group, better than anyone, likely knows what a battle it will be...I think they're more prepared for that now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLASSJAW Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 If Brenden Morrow commands a pick and Joe Morrow, who hockeysfuture projects as being a solid top 4 player, then I don't want to see what Iginla would get. And even if we had the resources to go get aged worldclass stars, we couldn't afford to sign him in the off season anyway. The Canucks only have 14 players under contract for next year, and we're already over the cap. How could we afford Iginla? That's one expensive rental, and not at all worth it imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZephyrsSong Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 I'm just wondering what you would give up for Iginla. Unless it's a guarantee that he gets us a cup, I wouldn't sell the farm to get Iginla. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodee Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Honestly, I'm no big fan of MG but I think you have twisted so much of the down side to suit your argument. The character of this team is if anything stronger imo than 2 years ago. Do you even watch how they are playing and coping in adversity. Sorry that's as far as I.m willing to go on this as I feel I would be wasting my time. I think MG has failed the team only in his inability to bring in a big gritty sniper (of proven ability) and a bigger ass kicking 1st/2nd line D. I don't like his rehabs. I would not have traded for Booth and I say that in the full knowledge that the guy has still to have a long injury free run. Other than that I think he is doing a great job but he needs to do more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Honestly, I'm no big fan of MG but I think you have twisted so much of the down side to suit your argument. The character of this team is if anything stronger imo than 2 years ago. Do you even watch how they are playing and coping in adversity. Sorry that's as far as I.m willing to go on this as I feel I would be wasting my time. I think MG has failed the team only in his inability to bring in a big gritty sniper (of proven ability) and a bigger ass kicking 1st/2nd line D. I don't like his rehabs. I would not have traded for Booth and I say that in the full knowledge that the guy has still to have a long injury free run. Other than that I think he is doing a great job but he needs to do more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Iginla's salary barely affects us if its a deadline deal and he's a UFA at the end of the year. We have no one in this organization with the heart that man has. And while he has slowed down, he still scored 32 on a crap team last year and is on pace for similar this year. He wants a cup more than anyone, and that hunger is infectious in a room. You are measuring dollars when I am measuring character, desire and a willingess to do what it takes. This team is not the same team as 2011 Deb. It doesn't have that heart. It doesn't have that drive. Iginla shocks this team back there. Moreover, he will show Kesler what it means to check your ego at the door and become the player he was during the Selke year, and also teach Kassian what it takes to be the best power forward in the game. You and many others here are completely ignoring the intangibles and thats why you trade for Jerome Iginla. So why hasn't he had this effect in Calgary, who sits near the bottom of the pack? If he's going to turn things into gold here, why not there? It isn't some magic deal, whereby he'll click here but hasn't managed to there. If this is what you describe as a "needy/lacklustre" team then what makes you think that he'll be the solution (if he didn't have the impact you're describing where he currently plays?). And the group here have an off ice chemistry that is undeniable...a brotherhood. So you want to bring "Dad" into the room to keep them all in check? I'm sure that'd go over well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BananaMash Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 ADD SOME VALUE PLEASE OOps thats asking too much of you. I read other posts of yours. Carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 I'm just wondering what you would give up for Iginla. Unless it's a guarantee that he gets us a cup, I wouldn't sell the farm to get Iginla. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodee Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 With respect these are not the stats of someone who is over the hill. Especially when you consider his team and team mates. Jerome Iginla 2007–08 Calgary Flames 98 2009–10 Calgary Flames 69 2010–11 Calgary Flames 86 2011–12 Calgary Flames 67 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 So why hasn't he had this effect in Calgary, who sits near the bottom of the pack? If he's going to turn things into gold here, why not there? It isn't some magic deal, whereby he'll click here but hasn't managed to there. If this is what you describe as a "needy/lacklustre" team then what makes you think that he'll be the solution (if he didn't have the impact you're suggesting where he currently plays?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butters Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 OP... why don't you have a GM job yet? Or at least an assistant GM job. Surely you would be a shoe in for a minor league team at least? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroSen Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 The lack of depth on the farm team and on the main team is a knock against MG right now. I was hoping with a Luongo deal he may have been able to get a very good prospect and NHL starter, however as time goes on I am skeptical he could do that. I agree that Iginla's hunger would just take over the dressing room (in a positive way). Make that deal if you can Gillis, The Sedin's time is starting to run out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rampage Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 ADD SOME VALUE PLEASE OOps thats asking too much of you. I read other posts of yours. Carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thad Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Fair point, but that is the essence of my point. MG has sold us on "we're almost there" type attitude vs, we are going for it now. And this is not just this year. We all know/have known for years this team needed to address 4 things. 1. A real second line winger who can add scoring depth and take pressure away from Kesler 2. Depth at center 3. A puck moving Dman 4. Size on D 5. More grit Now before the last run, MG made a great deal for Erhoff, which I credited. But he lost that and didn't replace it. All the other issues have not been addressed and that is the essence of my argument. He has got us no closer, really and if anything further away.The mix of this team is his responsibility and its not the type of mix that can win. We all know it. As canucks fans we hope and pray we're wrong but honestly, anyone who knows and watches hockey can tell you this is not a stanley cup team. Boston, Chicago, Pittsburgh are. Even if we made it to the conf finals we won't beat Chicago with this team. And No WAY in hell we'd beat Boston or Pittsburgh with our talent and compete level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super_Canuck Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 haha gone are the days of idiots who use to say "MG is god". Finally some people on here are waking up to reality and realizing MG is not a very good GM! I've been saying this for about 3 years now and people on here would jump all over me. Fans over-rated this guy big time! He is nothing but full of sh!t. He seems very incompetent at evaluating talent. A team like Pittsburg, who has already won a cup recently, is already great as it is, yet they still go out there and make significant moves to improve themselves. They can do that because they have depth in the organization something we lack which Gillis said he would work on but in 5 years has yet to materialized. The only thing Gillis is good at is adding bottom 6 plugs. He has an asset in Luongo who could've been moved to improve the team, but he over valued the goalie market and decided to play hard ball with teams. He waited too long and now he will not get anything of significance for Lui, mark my word. There are already good young goalies on the market who are much cheaper then Lui. Why would anyone give up anything of significance for him? This team right now is nothing but a pretender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Okay, if that's what you want (tell me what you want, what you really really want). You provide examples of the players doing well, but provide absolutely no examples of the players who failed to compete in the post season. Though I do agree with you partly, Pahlsson was a bit of a failure in his time here and did not compete in the post season. I'd need more examples than just one though. The same players you mention competing like they had something to prove are the same players who let us down later, is that what you mean? I don't see how that's Gillis' fault, that's up to the players to play their hardest and the coaching staff to get the most out of their players. Last season when Booth was on his game inbetween injuries he played up to his salary. He didn't just have one good season either, he's had two fourty point seasons and the sixty point season. He was on pace for 42 points last season if he had played all 82 games. That's not bad at all. This season has been a different story though, but he's been too busy getting injured to play hockey. As far as they were concerned at the time, Luongo was the face of the franchise and Schneider would be traded. Schneider had not proven anything at this point (and realistically still hasn't). We still don't know for sure if Luongo will be moved or not, and the contract is decent for a goalie who is one of (if not the best) in the league when he's rolling. Torres was good at one thing: being suspended. You can't have that on your team, letting him walk was the right decision. How was Gillis supposed to have foresight to all the injuries we've had? When you look at our NHL able depth when everyone was healthy at center (Henrik, Kesler, Malholtra, Lapierre, Schroeder, Ebbett) it's perfectly fine. As for the size of our wingers: Daniel Sedin: 6'1" 187 Alex Burrows: 6'1" 188 David Booth: 6'0" 212 Mason Raymond: 6'0" 185 Jannik Hansen: 6'1" 195 Zack Kassian: 6'3" 214 Chris Higgins: 6'0" 205 Then you have Weise (6'2" 210) who's a fine fourth line forward, and Tom Sestito (6'5" 228) who is fine as a 13th forward. Wow would you look at that? None of them are under 6'0". Not exactly small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 His post was better than this whole thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 haha gone are the days of idiots who use to say "MG is god". Finally some people on here are waking up to reality and realizing MG is not a very good GM! I've been saying this for about 3 years now and people on here would jump all over me. Fans over-rated this guy big time! The reality is, this guy's not a very good GM. He is nothing but full of sh!t. He seems very incompetent at evaluating talent. A team like Pittsburg, who has already won a cup recently, is already great as it is, yet they still go out there and make significant moves to improve themselves. They can do that because they have depth in the organization something we lack which Gillis said he would work on but in 5 years has yet to materialized. The only thing Gillis is good at is adding bottom 6 plugs. He has an asset in Luongo who could've been moved to improve the team, but he over valued the goalie market and decided to play hard ball with teams. He waited too long and now he will not get anything of significance for Lui, mark my word. There are already good young goalies on the market who are much cheaper then Lui. Why would anyone give up anything of significance for him? This team right now is nothing but a pretender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 I understand what your saying I just think this year we have to try our luck and next year we get to do what pits did.. Google penguins deadline deals for 2011 and 2012.. They basically stood their ground and built up their prospect pool after they went all the way. It's exactly what we are doing now. Holding off and building up prospect pool, while still remaining an underdog playoff team. The penguins patiently waited untill Crosby was back to being the best and built up the sacrifice pieces to load his team up this year. Timing is everything or we turn into basement dwellers. Go for it when it's smart not when you have a rash of injuries. Subtract Jensen Schroeder gaunce or corrado now and were still a long shot no matter who we add because kesler and edler aren't back to form. Subtract one of them when a couple more prospects are starting to look like nhlers and we got options. For fun lets say andersson tommerness Lain/blomstrand take the next step to solid NHL prospect Now your 2014 deadline sacrifice pool looks like Jensen Gaunce Corrado Lain Andersson Tommerness 2013 first round guy 2014 first round pick, maybe a solid prospect we get for Lu or another late round corrado like steal I think this what gillis was talking about when he laid out his plan for us. Get in the playoffs consistently and you have a chance every year. This part he didn't say though. Keep icing a competitive team that gets you in.. But let your pool build up over and over and when it's full, pick and choose what you want to sacrifice to load up, while still taking into consideration of your projected future needs. Looking into Pittsburgh is what brought me to appreciate gillis plan. It's spot on with shero only we are a year behind them. they won the cup 2 years before we got to the finals, makes sense to me. I really don't think it would hurt to get rid of Lu now. That part is annoying on all levels. I guess if guys are offering second round picks i would probably be turning them down too tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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