Burrows is french for throw me in the box

[bobopan]

I dno he seems to be taking alot of really dumb penalties this year and there's no excusing that. Does he get the raw end of calls AGAINST him sure but he earned his rep and it is what it is. I think he has tried to clean up his act but the fact remains that reputation is very hard to shake. I can understand why ppl would be pissed off about the situation but in the same token i understand why refs would be hesitant to make a call against the guy given his history.

[poetica]

9 times out of 10 Poetica? My spidey sense says I doubt it's that high but whatever.

Another way to look at it is how many of the power plays we get are weak calls as well. My point is that there could probably be 150 penalties called a game but they call 3-8 against each team, Burrows just makes it easy.

Am I the only one that say's, "frack Burrows", when he takes a dumb penalty at a crucial moment?

[nuck nit]

All of us are missing a very important thing in this thread...the name Burrows is actually English

[-DLC-]

I was just in the Richmond arena for the Mainland Cup tournament last weekend and saw Kelly's picture and bio on the wall. That's all. Richmond should be proud of producing an NHL referee. Nothing to do with bad refs.

Why would you put Kelly Sutherland and Cliff Olsen together in the same sentence? Very strange. One is an NHL ref and the other a serial killer. So I'll ask you, what is your point?

Why would you suggest we have to be proud if we're not? That was my comparison....that hailing from Richmond means nothing except geography to me. I put them together because they're BOTH from Richmond....you have attached some importance to that?

I am not "proud" simply because someone from here has done something to warrant a picture on the wall. Doesn't make them infallible to me.

My point was quite obvious....I don't care where he's from, he sucks. And "making" it to the NHL level is only part...what you do once you're there is also relevant to me.

[Dogbyte]

My math might not exact, but I doubt it's any less trustworthy than your arachnid sight. Even if 9 out of 10 is high, I'd still bet money that more times than not whenever Burrows is called for a penalty it was shortly after the other team went uncalled for a penalty committed against him.

And a few disgruntled fans at the CDC aren't the only ones to notice that it's "open season on Burrows":

Read the full article: http://www.theprovin...2817/story.html

Does he ever take dumb penalties? Of course. He's human. They all do. It's something he (like all of them) needs to avoid as much as possible, but I'm sure frustration comes into play when game after game he gets penalties committed against him that go uncalled. And if you don't see what is so abundantly obvious, your spidey sense might just need glasses.

[TimberWolf]

Okay sure, however you want to quantify it. I'd say that's a pretty inaccurate estimate but I guess that makes retaliation alright then? I know all about frustration and I also know you can't let it get the best of you. Lot's of players get typecasted or the refs just don't agree with them all that often.

I read the article and I have noticed the things that it says too. I have just accepted this as the give and take Alex gets because of the way he plays so maybe I do have the blinders on. To me this is just hockey. He cleans his game up in the corners he starts getting the call in front of the net.

All I'm saying is that when he leads the league in penalties he has got to shoulder some of the blame. We love to call out the refs and NHL but they're honestly not that bad. I've played a lot of amateur games where the bias is really obvious. He may get a raw deal once in a while but he is still a highly penalized player, which any player can cut out of their game.

[thema]

The problem is that, despite the pious claims here to the contrary, Burrows still dives and (especially) embellishes almost every hit he takes. Watch any Canuck game and count how many times in it he falls to the ice; it often counts in the dozens. Sometimes these are legitimate but an awful lot of the time it's pure "woody" behaviour (feel wood, fall down). Since Burrows' diving directly led to a (not very good) ref's dismissal it stands to reason that if a ref sees what he perceives to be a dive or an embellishment in a game he is going to be reluctant to call a penalty on that individual ESPECIALLY when they remember what happened to Auger when HE fell for a Burrows dive. He hasn't cleaned up his act at all and he still chirps like a bird at the refs constantly as well as trash talks the opposition in the most classless possible way. He will get no sympathy with the refs with his track record.

As for Gillis' "calling out the refs" during the Chicago series I feel it would have had a lot more validity if he would have done his whining after a Canuck win instead of waiting for the team to lose three straight playoff games in ignominious fashion to bring it up. Never mind that when a GM calls a press conference to complain about "not having a level playing field" when it is clearly a strategy of his team to sell calls hard in order to bring their dominant power play into action nobody in a position of authority takes him at all seriously. Gamesmanship at best, pathetic whining at worst and poorly advised since it apparently cost the team big $$$. This team has built a rep that it will not soon lose as long as it has the likes of Burrows, Kesler, Lapierre and, yes, even Hank (who sells it hard almost every night, much as I love him). Lose the rats and play with some honour, I say.

[TimberWolf]

No doubt Burr is getting a raw deal,not surprised after the Auger incident.Gillis hasn't made the Nucks situation better by calling out the Refs in our last playoff series against Chicago.

[nuck nit]

It is easy for detractors to say what you think Burr should do but you are not Burr playing top line minutes against every butcher at the highest level of the game in North America.So,please,save your breath when I tell you I don't care about you or your game.

Burr gets it from the opposition and he gives it out when he gets it and I agree with that.

He should not be meek and he should not take any crap from any player or expect unbiased decisions from refs or change his game.

He does not take crap,nor should he.

Ever.

This game is WWF on ice.I say Burr should give it all he can by playing right on the edge,as Burr is doing more effectively every year.

Quit your whining.This game is brutal and I am glad Burr takes no crap without being a vicious player.

[TimberWolf]

The problem is that, despite the pious claims here to the contrary, Burrows still dives and (especially) embellishes almost every hit he takes. Watch any Canuck game and count how many times in it he falls to the ice; it often counts in the dozens.

[Gross-Misconduct]

Why would you suggest we have to be proud if we're not? That was my comparison....that hailing from Richmond means nothing except geography to me. I put them together because they're BOTH from Richmond....you have attached some importance to that?

I am not "proud" simply because someone from here has done something to warrant a picture on the wall. Doesn't make them infallible to me.

My point was quite obvious....I don't care where he's from, he sucks. And "making" it to the NHL level is only part...what you do once you're there is also relevant to me.

[thema]

I've seen burrows get cross-checked to the head more then once right infront of the ref and no call... This guy could get hurt and there be no call.. It really drives me crazy knowing we miss out on power plays because the ref's hate him

[TimberWolf]

Wow

Ok, I see your point now. He doesn't do his job very well in the NHL (according to a CDC forum moderator) so he should be compared to a child killer. I don't know why that wasn't obvious to me before. My bad. Thanks for clarifying.

[Gross-Misconduct]

That wasn't her point. Her point was obvious. That him coming from Richmond doesn't give him Angel wings and remove him from the scrutiny of bad reffing.

[shazzam]

some players just have bad rep

[thema]

some players just have bad rep

[poetica]

Okay sure, however you want to quantify it. I'd say that's a pretty inaccurate estimate but I guess that makes retaliation alright then?

[Snake Doctor]

Even Shawn Avery was treated better than Burrows. Bunch of BS IMO

[Dogbyte]

That's a loaded question, isn't it? When players stand up for themselves, a la Burrows, it's called "retaliation" and they're maligned for it. But, when players just take it, a la the Sedins from previous years, it's called "weak" and they're maligned for it. Tell me, what is the appropriate response when people keep crosschecking, punching, and holding you without getting a penalty? Is it better to be called out as weak and blamed for allowing it to continue, or better to stand up for yourself and get called for a penalty? React or not, what other option is there?

Exactly. There's a problem with the reffing system that allows personal feelings to come into it too often. I guess we can agree on that. The bone of contention seems to be that you always blame the player, but I also blame the refs who turn a blind eye to penalties against players they don't like, but see everything those players do. Or even make up "diving" calls against players who are obviously the wronged party just because of their feelings (again, a la the Sedins).

That's a lovely thought that it's completely within Burrows' power to reduce his PIM, but it's based on what evidence? Can you show that Burrows' game has changed significantly in a way that would justify more penalties called against him and the number of "missed" penalties committed against him? As far as I've seen, Burrows is a cleaner, more calm player than he used to be. That being the case, he should be getting fewer penalties and at least most of those against him should be called. But, that's not what's happening.

Let's have a look at Burrows' PIM over his NHL career:

2005-2006 - PIM 61 TOI/g 10:24

2006-2007 - PIM 93 TOI/g 11:26

2007-2008 - PIM 179 TOI/g 15:05

2008-2009 - PIM 150 TOI/g 16:50

2009-2010 - PIM 121 TOI/g 17:51

2010-2011 - PIM 77 TOI/g 17:01

2011-2012 - PIM 90 TOI/g 18:28

2012-2013 - PIM 54 TOI/g 18:54 (On pace for 94 PIM.)

(Source)

You'll notice that initially his PIM rose as he got more ice time, but then began a steady decline even as his ice time continued to increase as he became more of a scorer than a agitator and cleaned up his game. And then for some reason his PIM began to rise again starting in the 2011/12 season.

Obviously there aren't stats on uncalled penalties against players, so we can continue to disagree on the prevalence of that issue. But, we can compare the number of penalties given to him and the number of penalties he draws.

PT = Individual penalties taken per 60 minutes

PD = Individual penalties drawn per 60 minutes

2007-08 PT - 1.2 PD - 2.5

2008-09 PT - 1.5 PD - 1.9

2009-10 PT - 2.0 PD - 1.7

2010-11 PT - 1.1 PD - 1.4

2011-12 PT - 0.9 PD - 0.9

2012-13 PT - 1.1 PD - 1.0

(Source)

You'll notice that while there's been a modest 0.1 increase in drawn penalties per 60 minutes this season over last season, it marks the only time in his NHL career that his drawn penalties has increased, and that it is offset by the fact that he is given 0.2 more penalties per 60 minutes this season over last. With the exception of this year, he has seen the number of penalties drawn decrease. That's interesting for a guy who's ice time has increased in almost every year. One would think that for most players, more ice time would equal more penalties drawn.

I suppose you could try to argue that the tiny increase in PD shows that refs aren't ignoring penalties committed against him in a greater rate, but the problem is that we have nothing objective to measure the number of UNcalled penalties. Though you may disagree, based on what I've seen game in and game out this season, I (and others) believe that there are more penalties being committed against Burrows and that the slight increase in calls is simply a result of the egregious nature of some of those actions that make them that much harder to ignore. Agree or disagree, the fact remains that though he is tied this season for his second lowest PT rate he is also getting his second lowest PD rate. So, your assertion that he's responsible for the lack of calls drawn because of his own "dirty" play seems unproven, unless you want to change your position on the fairness of reffing to argue that they should be calling far more against him than they are.

This season, Burrows is 52nd is overall PIM. This supposedly dirty player did not receive a single major penalty or misconduct penalty during this entire season. Even still, he is tied for the most number of minor penalties with Chris Neil, a player who has also received 5 majors, 4 misconducts and 1 game misconduct this season. Tell me, do you honestly believe that Burrows' game is deserving of the same number of minor penalties as a player like Neil? I'm not saying he didn't deserve any of them. I'm not even saying he didn't deserve most of them, but does that comparison to how every other player in the league is being called really seem like a fair and accurate representation of how Burrows plays to you?

[Vansicle]

I think you're full of it.

Have you watched Burrows play? He takes dumb penalties ... all the time. Whenever he gets beat he pulls the guy down. When he goes into the corners he basically sticks the guy somewhere in the legs everytime. He's chippy but small and that gets him a lot of penalites too. Worst of all he's a yap box and he yells at the refs all the time.

Take the homer glasses off folks, Burrows is leading the league in penalties because he is undisciplined, not because there is a league wide referee vendetta against him.

It's time for Burrows to start thinking about the team because his penalties are hurting the entire team.

All players can get a bad rep. It's up to the player to fly under the radar and pay a cleaner game then usual, not the refs job to be extra nice to him. This happens to all players, you got to suck it up and get back in their good books by playing 100% by the rules. LOL, trust me I know. I've been known to rub a referee or two the wrong way myself and it always plays out the same way. The ref is in charge and the player is sitting for 2.