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The REAL problem with this team.


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#1 Live.&.Die.Nucks

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:39 PM

Although I try to avoid this message board, especially after playoff losses, I couldn't help but log in and see what the fans are saying. People are blaming everyone from the Sedins to the Coach, our playing style, and management. Now I am reading posts saying trade the Sedins or let them walk. Come on...

The REAL problem with this team dates back to two years ago. The Sedins led the league in scoring and had two 100 point seasons. The powerplay was the best and scored at will. We scored the most goals. We were exciting and fun to watch. High octane.

WHY did all of this stop?

Because we lost Christian Ehrhoff. He was here for 2 years. Our best two years.

I am not a huge fan of his, but you have to admit, ever since he left, our offence has dried up. The Sedins are back to where they were before he got here.

We could not score in the cup final either, but had no problems scoring before that. Besides other injuries to the team, the offence dried up when Ehrhoff hurt his shoulder. We couldn't score anymore.

The issue with this team is not the coach or the twins. It's that we never re-signed/replaced Ehrhoff. We need a puck moving defenseman. This problem falls on the shoulders of management.

I am a huge Gillis fan, but unfortunately, management ultimately failed when they did not address this issue adequately.
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#2 Jägermeister

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:41 PM

He wanted waaaayyy too much money, end of story.

And besides, he wanted to go win a Cup in Buffalo :lol:
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#3 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:42 PM

*
POPULAR

Garrison > Ehrhoff
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#4 samurai

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:43 PM

And he is now making a huge difference in buffalo
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#5 Jägermeister

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:44 PM

*
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Garrison > Ehrhoff


As a player in general, maybe.
But Ehrhoff was certainly better at making the break out pass and getting a cycle going on the PP.
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#6 Live.&.Die.Nucks

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:46 PM

Garrison > Ehrhoff


Garrison may have a harder shot, but the Hoff was probably our best skater/puck mover.
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#7 Boudrias

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:46 PM

Garrison > Ehrhoff

They miss Manny far more than Ehrhoff. Kessler plays lights out in the FO % and look how easily they moved up the ice last night.
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#8 Live.&.Die.Nucks

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:47 PM

He wanted waaaayyy too much money, end of story.

And besides, he wanted to go win a Cup in Buffalo :lol:


I agree, and him saying he would win the cup in Buffalo was and still is hilarious! I have no problem not re-signing him because he did ask for too much, but we then should have replaced him.
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#9 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:48 PM

As a player in general, maybe.
But Ehrhoff was certainly better at making the break out pass and getting a cycle going on the PP.


Garrison is definetly more reliable, he can handle a bigger workload, better defensively, better for matchups, exc.

I could say the same the other way too.
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#10 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:49 PM

Garrison may have a harder shot, but the Hoff was probably our best skater/puck mover.


Garrison has alot of other things that make him better than Hoff aswell.
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#11 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:50 PM

They miss Manny far more than Ehrhoff. Kessler plays lights out in the FO % and look how easily they moved up the ice last night.


I agree, the loss of Manny has totally been understated. Even as post injury Manny, I would love to have him. Atleast he is great on draws and kills penalties. Would be a 4th line upgrade on Ebbett.
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#12 S.Gill

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:52 PM

He wanted waaaayyy too much money, end of story.

And besides, he wanted to go win a Cup in Buffalo :lol:

win a cup in BUFFALO- ahahahhahah!
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#13 Melons

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:52 PM

Correlation does not equal causation.

I think one of our major problems is that we are a puck possession team that simply cannot get possession of the puck.
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#14 shazzam

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:53 PM

Garrison and Ehrhoff are different type of players.
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#15 Gross-Misconduct

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 01:15 PM

Thanks for clearing that up for everyone.

Note to self : Erhoff REAL reason Canucks can't beat Sharks.
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#16 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 01:21 PM

I miss Ehrhoff's speed as well, but other than in the last time we faced SJ, he made very little difference in the playoffs. Any offense created was countered by big minuses.

Still, i kinda miss that dynamic speed. And yes, so do the Sedins.
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#17 skyfall

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 01:36 PM

There are two real problems:

1) that 0.5 second between the regular season pace and playoff pace makes a huge difference in how the canucks play. The canucks don't have a higher gear while most teams do. I do not consider them a fast team relative to most of their opposition. This makes them look better than they are.

2) canucks cup run year was a year where they played teams that lost depth due to poor salary cap management. In that year though despite the competitive advantage they still almost lost to the hawks in 7 games and spent too much time screwing around against the preds. That advantage is gone because the other teams figured out how to build their teams in the new NHL.

Gillis and AV look better than they really are. I would say especially AV because there's no freakin way the canucks should have lost so badly to the hawks. Even in that year's regular season he was uptight about resting players. That uptight nature carries through to the team plus the ego they get for having regular season success makes them feel they are contenders when they really aren't. I'd say a good coach would make a massive difference plus adding some better offensive players.

Ehrhoff sucked against the bruins in game 7 of the cup run year and was too soft. It's really top down management/coaching that's the issue.



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#18 debluvscanucks

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 01:43 PM

Don't agree, Sami is the one who's missed more than anyone. Ehrhoff had blunders and could be very disinterested at times...sure, at times, he was awesome but there wasn't consistency that you could rely on.

I believe the poor officiating during our run really had this team question themselves and left a feeling of hopelessness that completely deflated them for a time. If you can't fire back and others are allowed to subject you to the humiliation and cheap shots without any chance to retaliate (because the theme was "NO, you're not allowed"), it's a little demoralizing.

They have taken awhile to deal with the mental blows and devastation....you lack energy and incentive when you feel defeated. I relate it to a PTS type thing.

They're getting older and I think it's hard for them to find that drive again...they're not young, eager guys and the brotherhood that they were - they're fathers and focuses change a bit. But I also don't think they're done just yet.
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#19 yabadabadoo

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 02:05 PM

2010-2011

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Raymond-Kesler-Samuelson
Higgins-Lapierre-Hansen
Torres-Tambellini-Oreskovich
Glass

Edler-Erhoff
Hamhuis-Bieksa
Rome-Salo
Ballard-Alberts

Luongo
Schneider

2012-2013

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Raymond-Kesler-Kassian
Higgins-Roy-Hansen
Ebbett-Lapierre-Wiese
Sestito-Pinizotto

Edler-Bieksa
Hamhuis-Garrison
Alberts-Corrado
Ballard-Barker

Schneider
Luongo
Cannatta

Sedins/Burrows of 2011 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>2013;
Samuelsson >>>>> Kassian;
Edler 2011>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>2013;
Salo >>>>>>>Corrado
Hansen 2011<<<<Hansen 2013
Bieksa 2011>>>>>>2013

Funny how the team was supposed to have gotten bigger, but we seem to be about the same size as we were 2 years ago. We're older and slower than we were in 2011. Not a good thing when you supposed to be a puck possession team. Malhotra is missed, even though he didn't play much in 2011 playoffs after his eye injury. To a man, the 2011 team played better than the 2013 team...must be that elusive extra 5% that Hank was referring to.

Edited by yabadabadoo, 04 May 2013 - 02:09 PM.

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#20 elvis15

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 02:40 PM

Not to pick on the OP, but so many threads today all about people who think they know how to run this team better than the people paid to do it. Everyone has to have their say because they're frustrated. Know what I did because I was frustrated? I got outside and took the dogs for a long, long walk in the nice weather.

Then I came back to relax and found the board is just as crazy as when I checked last night and again this morning. Nothing we do will change the outcome of this series, so let's just all relax.

As far as Ehrhoff, Gillis offered him a deal similar to Bieksa's and he didn't take it. That's not our fault. Should we throw a bigger deal at him like he's the be all and end all of this team? Nope, not a chance.

I think I'll go back outside.
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#21 Darius71

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 02:46 PM

Erhoff and Salo were huge pieces of the 2011 puzzle. People under rate Salo's abilities. He was reliable, had an excellent first pass out of the zone, and had a cannon from the point. Does anyone recall what the canucks record without Salo in the lineup was? It certainly was not as good as with him in the lineup.

Erhoff was at least as good offensively. He could get the puck out of the zone with speed. His passing was superb and he was a great qb on the powerplay.


The other error that Gillis has made was thinking that he was going to face the 2011 Boston Bruins in the playoffs every year. The team was humiliated by Boston from a physical perspective so he thought he had to sacrifice talent to beef up.

Kassian may be a good move in retrospect 5 years from now, but with the makeup of the team he should have known better than to trade Hodgson, a player that could help the team with its limited window now, for Kassian who may pan out to be a good power forward 3 -5 years from now.

The scary part is that the NW division teams are acquiring high end talent year after year with their high draft picks. Unless something drastic is done it wont be long until Vancouver is the division doormat.
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#22 mbal23

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 03:39 PM

I'd say Torres is a bigger factor than Hoff. He could change a series with a single hit or fight
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#23 Hockey Fever

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:10 PM

He definitely had his best years with us so far in his career. The only problem is if they would have paid him the money he wanted we probably would have lost a couple good players, as well as the fact that he may not have continued at the same level of production? I mean look at him with the high flying Sabers and he's still no were near what he accomplished here, you just never know?
Would have he went down hill with us after a big contract, or would the chemistry have continued ? One never knows but with the Canucks luck and after watching other recently signed big contract players here, they usually don't perform well.
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#24 canucksnihilist

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:12 PM

real problem is that the TEAM IS NOT READY TO PLAY to begin ANY PLAYOFF SERIES

period.
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#25 Bodee

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:16 PM

We have one(a better one imo) in Ballard............but until Ballard gets plastic surgery to look like Ebbett he won't get a chance.
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#26 Zuongo

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:16 PM

Sorry I disagree.
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#27 Edlerberry

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:19 PM

Manny+Torres+Ehrhoff+Salo+Samuelsson>>>> Kassian+Ebbett+Weise+Garrison+Corrado
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July 7-2013

Toronto will take a step back next year.
Feel free to quote me.


July 8-2013

Wow I can't believe peoples replies...
Im done here. You people are disgusting..


#28 cdubuya

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:20 PM

The real problem with this team is our secondary players haven't been clutch when we needed them to. We don't seem to bury the breakaways or 2 on 1s like other teams seem to do routinely. How many times have we seen Higgins or Hansen (2 good players for us usually) flub a breakaway or 2 on 1. I love Hansen, but if he buried that empty netter from past half way we woulda tied the series. In tight games like this sometimes you only get one shot. Our first 3 home games against Boston seemed even tighter than these first two but guys like Burrows, lappy and Torres delivered when they had to to get us 3 wins.
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#29 Tearloch7

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:25 PM

I'd say Torres is a bigger factor than Hoff. He could change a series with a single hit or fight


Just how many fights did Torres have in the playoffs as a Canuck?? .. was it one when forced to defend himself? .. Torres is NOT a fighter ..
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#30 spliced

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 05:29 PM

Nope. Other than the SJ series the Sedins weren't very good in the 2011 playoffs either.
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