Wings succeeding despite size etc.

[nuck nit]

Strong D and hot goaltending for Detroit.

Pull Luo for injured Schneids and ice a d corps with a raw rookie on it.

[Gollumpus]

3. One huge point Im making is that we have the Sedins as our top stars. They take up the biggest chunks of payroll. Do they have the desire, grit, aggessiveness, toughness etc that it takes to win a cup? All I can picture is Marchand punching Daniel's face in, as he bobbleheads over and over again. That is my answer. NO they are not tough enough to win it all.

[canucks_dynasty]

Datsyuk and Zetterberg anchor 2 separate scoring lines while the Sedins anchor only 1. Much easier to defend against 1 line vs 2. Look at Pittsburg. Which line do you shut down...Crosby or Malkin?

[PlayoffHockey]

Datsyuk and Zetterberg are 10x the players the Sedin Sisters are come playoffs.

[Nino]

Yes, because I'm sure that Datsyuk would have dropped the gloves and pounded Marchand back to the stone age.

A lot of Vancouver's recent top-9 scoring issues are injury related. The 2nd and third lines have cobbled together some decent seasons. From 2008 to 2010, the 2nd and 3rd lines put up around 125 goals in each of those three seasons (estimated - used guys like Kesler, Samuelsson, Higgins, Raymond, Hansen, Malhotra, Hodgson etc as the usual suspects).

In 2011 and 2012, the 2nd and 3rd line production was severely hampered by games lost due to injury, or from players being slow to recover from their injuries (Kesler, Samuelsson, Booth, Raymond, Malhotra, Higgins). The only guy, usually associated with the 2nd/3rd lines, who had a complete season was Hansen.

And you know another thing that Detroit has? A team that knows how to play defense and understands that stopping the other team from scoring is as important as scoring yourself.

For how Grabner and Hodgson were playing *at the time the Canucks traded them*, I could not see them playing on a regular basis for the Wings. Had each been drafted by the Wings, I suspect that Grabner would have been traded for a d-man and Hodgson would have been traded for a big winger. Ironic, isn't it?

regards,

G.

[Airjasper]

So the real question is what do they have that we dont?

1. History - History matters. I remember the dread I fealt when Boston brought out Bobbi Orr to wave the flag in the stand in 2010. The Wings have that same mojo going with Gordie Howe

[Van bc]

Detroit is a similar sized team to us but their core players keep pushing back in the playoffs our start diving and wining. That is a big difference and will always get different results. We will never win with 35-40 year old Swedish twins its that simple

[Nino]

Detroit is a similar sized team to us but their core players keep pushing back in the playoffs our start diving and wining. That is a big difference and will always get different results. We will never win with 35-40 year old Swedish twins its that simple

[EdgarM]

I think another important point to consider when we are looking at who is responsible, coach and/or players is leadership in the locker room. Is Henrik a suitable Captain? In the past, Captains generally lead by example and this may include picking up their game at the most crucial time in a game or series. Maybe what needs to be considered is taking some pressure off of Henrik and giving someone like Kesler the Captaincy. I believe if roles were reversed for Henrik and Kes, you would get better performances from both. Make him the Captain and give him a "top line" and make the Sedins the 2nd line and see what happens. Henrik needs to do the Noble thing just as Linden did for him when he passed the torch down to him.

[Avicii]

kesler can't go beastmode every game, if you watched the wings play Datsyuk doesn't go beastmode because he doesn't have to, everyone is contributing.

[puckinaround]

I think another important point to consider when we are looking at who is responsible, coach and/or players is leadership in the locker room. Is Henrik a suitable Captain? In the past, Captains generally lead by example and this may include picking up their game at the most crucial time in a game or series. Maybe what needs to be considered is taking some pressure off of Henrik and giving someone like Kesler the Captaincy. I believe if roles were reversed for Henrik and Kes, you would get better performances from both. Make him the Captain and give him a "top line" and make the Sedins the 2nd line and see what happens. Henrik needs to do the Noble thing just as Linden did for him when he passed the torch down to him.

[CupisAll]

heart it all boils down to heart

[Vansicle]

[....]

- the Canucks have the Sedins but they need to play together. That puts all our skill on one line (Kes yeah but he's injured 80% of the games lately)

[.....]

[Vansicle]

Do we also need better horoscopes than the other team?

[cbdoubleu]

We don't have a player like Pavel Datsyuk.

[TOMapleLaughs]

The American O4 factor is huge. They will always be favoured.

But Detroit isn't a soft team by any stretch. People underrated them again this season.

Our team doesn't have a particular style, unless 'hybrid' counts. We basically adapt to our opposition and play accordingly. I think all teams do that to a degree, but i see the Canucks folding to another teams' style more often than not. But then again, our forward lineup isn't that deep due to injury and under-utilization.

I don't understand why people go, 'hey, they've won a game! Let's copy dare style!' so often here. There are so many factors in winning, i'd say style points are well down the list.

[mpt]

kesler can't go beastmode every game, if you watched the wings play Datsyuk doesn't go beastmode because he doesn't have to, everyone is contributing.

[Vansicle]

I have to agree to a certain extent. The Sedins are not going to deter anyone from doing that stuff, nor should they have to though. Their job, as Baggins suggests here, is to score goals - especially at times like those.

Where I think that kind of stuff will diminish a bit is if the Canucks can surround the Sedins with some legitimate toughness on a consistent basis. And it needs to be from day 1 of the season that they get to play with a few guys who will start reinforcing the idea that if you touch the Sedins you will eventually pay a price. Even better, make them pay a price BEFORE they do it. That kind of intimidation will do wonders for the Sedins imo.

Everyone is slagging on the Sedins but they need to be protected better and this entire team needs to be willing to take a stand for each other instead of skating away and hoping for a power play. I can understand the Sedins doing it. Their job is to get goals, especially on the PP. But when the only guy who sticks up for one of your franchise players in the SCF is Ballard, something is wrong.

Gillis needs to bring in a guy like Clarkson, Clowe, etc. for some of that skilled toughness that can play. If that doesn't happen (and let's face it, it is very unlikely to) the team desperately needs Kassian to step into a key role doing the same type of stuff. They need to trust him through his mistakes and build his confidence and in return he needs to improve his conditioning and his effort level game in and game out.

[mpt]

I think another important point to consider when we are looking at who is responsible, coach and/or players is leadership in the locker room. Is Henrik a suitable Captain? In the past, Captains generally lead by example and this may include picking up their game at the most crucial time in a game or series. Maybe what needs to be considered is taking some pressure off of Henrik and giving someone like Kesler the Captaincy. I believe if roles were reversed for Henrik and Kes, you would get better performances from both. Make him the Captain and give him a "top line" and make the Sedins the 2nd line and see what happens. Henrik needs to do the Noble thing just as Linden did for him when he passed the torch down to him.

[mpt]

True. But pushaback is not black and white. You don't have to knock his block off. Anything but just standing there would have been good. I'm not saying the Twins need to be enforcers, but there's no reason to just stand there and get rope-a-doped by a little turd like that. It sends the wrong message. This is not Sunday School where you are rewarded with the Kingdome of heaven if you turn the other cheek. There is some middle ground. You can push the little clown on his ass. Or at least push him away and distance yourself. Especially if you know there won't be any calls made against the darling B's.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not in the "Sedin Sisters" camp, at all. I'd just like to see a little more - just a tad - push back from them. Finish checks. Play the body. Stand up to the turds without crossing the line. It can't be that difficult.