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[Report] Hodgson Extensions talks started

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#31 canuck73_3

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 05:33 PM

Oh yes, cuz Henrik and Daniel had far less ice time than Hodgson, that's why Hodgson scored more. And Buffalo is a much weaker team than the Canucks so opponents can focus their energy on shutting down top players more easily.

I think you missed the part about playing in the East where it is easier to score. Also the Sedin's back check.

Edited by canuck73_3, 02 July 2013 - 05:34 PM.

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#32 wai_lai416

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 05:50 PM

i like how when he was on the team.. everyone loves him bashing the coach for putting him in bad situation blah blah blah.. as soon as we traded him he's overrated he only plays for himself.. he sux.. blah blah blah.. what does Cody's dad action have anything to do with Cody? it's his fault his dad is an ass?
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#33 oldnews

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:17 PM

Easily, he would have won the Calder had we kept him, playing 4-5 minutes less than any other rookie with comparable points on a 3rd line role.

Where the others were all playing top line minutes with PP time.

He will indeed get north of $4.5 million because he really is a good player no matter what we think of him. My gripe is the return, Gillis could have should have pried a pick as well.


You're dead wrong about that.
I've done these comparisons before - Hodgson was playing the same amount of minutes as some of the Calder candidates of the last two years - something that only made the ice-time controversy all the more ridiculous, given the fact very few teams have a one-two punch like Henrik and Kesler.
Hodgson was getting over 11(11.20) minutes a game 5 on 5, and another 2 minutes on the powerplay.
Gallagher got 11.43 minutes 5 on 5 and 2.5 pp this past season in Montreal - and finished second in Calder voting.
Galchenyuk got 11.05 minutes 5 on 5 and 1.00 on the pp.
Guys like Huberdeau and Landeskog have gotten a few more 5 on 5 minutes a game than Hodgson was, but then again, they were playing on far inferior teams than the Canucks, and they aren't as challenged in a two way sense as Hodgson was.
Henrique for example had a postive corsi on and relative corsi, getting only 47.4% offensive zone starts and facing a considerably stronger quality of competition than Hodgson.
Gabriel Landeskog, likewise, had a +9.8 relative corsi, +6.3 corsi on, faced very strong competition (+1.7 as opposed to Hodgson's -.2), and did that with 48% offensive zone starts - very strong underlying numbers.
Hodgson had more tailored minutes - weaker competition and ozone starts, had very strong linemates in Higgins and Hansen, and yet his -6.8 relative corsi put him in the range of shutdown defensive zone start players like Rome and Pahlsson.
The truth is that he wasn't good enough to command more minutes, particularly soft and absent in his own zone play.
In any event, his agent and Tony Gallagher sparked one of the silliest NHL controversies in recent memory - and the irony was that AV was using him precisely to his strengths and sheltering him from his poor defensive development. They protested way too much.
His agent also considered Steven Stamkos a comparable - something that no doubt set off the alarms regarding what he'd be expecting to re-sign. Bottom line is that the Canucks would have had to deal him regardless.

Edited by oldnews, 02 July 2013 - 06:25 PM.

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#34 Lulover88

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:24 PM

you can learn to defend .. offence is a gift .. you may be bummed about the trade , but you cant deny the kids talent
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#35 Warhippy

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:24 PM

You're dead wrong about that.
I've done these comparisons before - Hodgson was playing the same amount of minutes as some of the Calder candidates of the last two years - something that only made the ice-time controversy all the more ridiculous, given the fact very few teams have a one-two punch like Henrik and Kesler.
Hodgson was getting over 13 minutes a game, including 2 minutes on the powerplay.
Gallagher got 11.43 minutes 5 on 5 this past season and 2.5 pp this past season in Montreal - and finished second in Calder voting.
Galchenyuk got 11.05 minutes 5 on 5 and 1.00 on the pp.
Guys like Huberdeau and Landeskog have gotten a few more 5 on 5 minutes a game than Hodgson was, but then again, they were playing are far inferior teams, and they aren't as challenged in a two way sense as Hodgson was.
Henrique for example had a postive corsi on and relative corsi, getting only 47.4% offensive zone starts and facing a considerably stronger quality of competition than Hodgson.
Gabriel Landeskog, likewise, had a +9.8 relative corsi, +6.3 corsi on, faced very strong competition (+1.7 as opposed to Hodgson's -.2), and did that with 48% offensive zone starts - very strong underlying numbers.
Hodgson had more tailored minutes - weaker competition and ozone starts, had very strong linemates in Higgins and Hansen, and yet his -6.8 relative corsi put him in the range of shutdown defensive zone start players like Rome and Pahlsson.
The truth is that he wasn't good enough to command more minutes, particularly soft and absent in his own zone play.
In any event, his agent and Tony Gallagher sparked one of the silliest NHL controversies in recent memory - and the irony was that AV was using him precisely to his strengths and sheltering him from his poor defensive development.

Not sure why you're comparing Hodgson last year to guys who were playing this year....corsi ratings or not, In my opinion he was a strong candidate, as in the minds of some of the "experts and analysts"

Edited by Warhippy, 02 July 2013 - 06:25 PM.

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#36 oldnews

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:28 PM

Not sure why you're comparing Hodgson last year to guys who were playing this year....corsi ratings or not, In my opinion he was a strong candidate, as in the minds of some of the "experts and analysts"


I think it's pretty clear why I gave you those comparisons - you were going on as if he would have won the Calder if he had only gotten the minutes.... Those were Hodgson's numbers in his rookie/Calder year. AV was using him precisely as he should have here - I gave you some context of other Calder candidates to put the whining about not getting enough opportunity in perspective.

Edited by oldnews, 02 July 2013 - 06:29 PM.

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#37 hudson bay rules

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:31 PM

Dude, screw Hodgson. Kid is a dick. I hope Buffalo lets him walk for being a spoiled brat or he signs a huge contract and cripples the team's cap situation because of their stupidity.


Any word from Buffalo that he is a dick or are you just regurgitating Gillis' claims?

Would have rather had him than Kassian as we could've used him more (esp with the Kesler injuries) and trade him about now for a higher return than what he got.
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#38 a Fool

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:32 PM

If he gets 4.5 or higher then I'm glad we traded him. Stupid brat


The tithe to the church of Godson.

Edited by a Fool, 02 July 2013 - 06:32 PM.

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#39 missioncanucksfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:07 PM

Yes based on nothing. Sorry I won't kiss the ass of some punk who wants to take the easy road to top minutes. He only outscored our forwards due to playing in the East where it is easier to score and on a team that played him top 6 minutes which he whined his way into because he wouldn't be able to pass Sedin or Kesler on our depth chart. Hodgson's defence is also lacklustre which being a centre and having the heightened defensive responsibility is a gamble. Sure he scores but he's on the ice for a lot of goals against too.

Ya his defence mightve been suspect but where have you read that "he whined" his way to top minutes? The guy rocked the CHL world while winning a few respectable awards along the way. He played WJC with a few notable future prospects and we here can all agree that he helped make them all look good. The guy threw his back out while working out and training for Canucks training camp. This after playing 140 games on 3 continents. The kid proved he had "drive" and had star all over him up until his injury. Since then, he was thrown under the bus, misdiagnosed by Dr. Shlopnik and crew from Canucks. He went to seek other opinions and finally got the help he needed. Switched trainers, who also had praised Cody's heart and willingness to perservere. After Cody's father had realized the bang-up job Gillis and Co did for his son, he then threw in the towel and got his kid out of Vancouver

Now ask yourself Canucks 73.... You wouldnt do the same for your kid if you had that power?

Then what does Gillis do? He trades a blue chip center for Ogre from Revenge of the Nerds. Stud for dud trade and mismanagement of assets if you ask me. But its just soooo easy to put on the typical Canucks rose colored glasses and throw a person under the bus when they have NO CLUE about the whole story
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#40 WZRD

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:08 PM

uh...

he outscores all the forwards on our team..

a lot of good the lack of goals from our 4, 5 and 6 million forwards did for us eh??

The hate based on nothing for this kid is ridiculous

I think the respect Gillis showed his two star goaltenders through the last year up to this weekend shows how much we can believe gillis and the way he paints things after he makes an unpopular move.

I agree. Gillis was keeping quiet about the Hodgson trade but after the mounting criticism is explodes in the interview and blames everything on Cody. It was a stupid trade and Gillis knew that he messed up so he made up some BS story.
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#41 King Heffy

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:25 PM

you can learn to defend .. offence is a gift .. you may be bummed about the trade , but you cant deny the kids talent

You can't teach effort and Hodgson doesn't appear willing to work to improve his defensive zone play.

Guy spends more time floating than a tugboat.

Edited by Kiwis, 02 July 2013 - 07:26 PM.

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#42 Butters Stoch

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:45 PM

Were we even watching the same Cody Hodgson or are you people just making up BS to feel better about trading him away? I don't get how so many people here can consider him a defensive liability.
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#43 missioncanucksfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:54 PM

You can't teach effort and Hodgson doesn't appear willing to work to improve his defensive zone play.

Guy spends more time floating than a tugboat.

Ummmm thx tips but you DO realize that this is his 2nd year in the league right? And as for defensive liability.... He was only a -4.... Not too bad 5 on 5 eh? Which center on the Sabres was YOUR clear cut favorite? Ya, he sure whined his way to the top line. Unlike Kassian who both Ruff AND AV have both demoted to pressbox and minors.

Ask yourselves this.... You wanna talk about whining? Place Kesler on the 3rd line and watch what happens
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#44 canuck73_3

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:56 PM

Ya his defence mightve been suspect but where have you read that "he whined" his way to top minutes? The guy rocked the CHL world while winning a few respectable awards along the way. He played WJC with a few notable future prospects and we here can all agree that he helped make them all look good. The guy threw his back out while working out and training for Canucks training camp. This after playing 140 games on 3 continents. The kid proved he had "drive" and had star all over him up until his injury. Since then, he was thrown under the bus, misdiagnosed by Dr. Shlopnik and crew from Canucks. He went to seek other opinions and finally got the help he needed. Switched trainers, who also had praised Cody's heart and willingness to perservere. After Cody's father had realized the bang-up job Gillis and Co did for his son, he then threw in the towel and got his kid out of Vancouver

Now ask yourself Canucks 73.... You wouldnt do the same for your kid if you had that power?

Then what does Gillis do? He trades a blue chip center for Ogre from Revenge of the Nerds. Stud for dud trade and mismanagement of assets if you ask me. But its just soooo easy to put on the typical Canucks rose colored glasses and throw a person under the bus when they have NO CLUE about the whole story

If my kid was in the NHL I'd let the professionals do their jobs and not tell them what to do...
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#45 canuck73_3

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:58 PM

Ummmm thx tips but you DO realize that this is his 2nd year in the league right? And as for defensive liability.... He was only a -4.... Not too bad 5 on 5 eh? Which center on the Sabres was YOUR clear cut favorite? Ya, he sure whined his way to the top line. Unlike Kassian who both Ruff AND AV have both demoted to pressbox and minors.

Ask yourselves this.... You wanna talk about whining? Place Kesler on the 3rd line and watch what happens

Unlike you basing his defensive play on his +/- I actually watched him play both here and in Buffalo and yes he is a defensive liability. He's not terrible but he is below average defensively.
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#46 SamJamIam

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:09 PM

And you know this how???? The one person who says all the negativity is the same guy who cant seem to talk his own head out of his a$$. After the way Gillis and our genius team doctors misassessed his back problems then tried throwing him under the bus in the process. Would you blame Cody for wanting out?


Any word from Buffalo that he is a dick or are you just regurgitating Gillis' claims?

Would have rather had him than Kassian as we could've used him more (esp with the Kesler injuries) and trade him about now for a higher return than what he got.


Canucks fans continue to disappoint. If you're gonna get all high and mighty about the facts, at least have the sense to follow the story closely when it's going down. Cody, his dad and his new agent (you know, the one he got because his old agent didn't hassle MG enough) are all dicks. CoHo also was just an awkward, selfish kid who never meshed with the team and has had the same problems in Buffalo. If you want verification, dig up the threads and tweets but don't mistake your ignorance for my making assumptions.
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#47 SamJamIam

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:12 PM

Unlike you basing his defensive play on his +/- I actually watched him play both here and in Buffalo and yes he is a defensive liability. He's not terrible but he is below average defensively.


He's just slow because he has short legs and an awful stride. It's something he could have worked on after getting drafted but never addressed. He's not too bad positionally but as soon as the direction of the play changes, he's left looking like a pylon.
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#48 hudson bay rules

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:13 PM

Canucks fans continue to disappoint. If you're gonna get all high and mighty about the facts, at least have the sense to follow the story closely when it's going down. Cody, his dad and his new agent (you know, the one he got because his old agent didn't hassle MG enough) are all dicks. CoHo also was just an awkward, selfish kid who never meshed with the team and has had the same problems in Buffalo. If you want verification, dig up the threads and tweets but don't mistake your ignorance for my making assumptions.


thats a yes then? you are just regurgitating crap without any real evidence? Oh, he got a new agent, what a prick he must be.

Edited by hudson bay rules, 02 July 2013 - 08:20 PM.

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#49 missioncanucksfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:17 PM

If my kid was in the NHL I'd let the professionals do their jobs and not tell them what to do...

Well then why is it that when he decided to go out of the chain of command and seek outside opinions and options.... His back was fixed. It was all over the media on how "Those professionals" misdiagnosed his situation. I would laud my parents for helping me in that situation. Imagine if he had just "went the Canucks route"?
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#50 missioncanucksfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:20 PM

Canucks fans continue to disappoint. If you're gonna get all high and mighty about the facts, at least have the sense to follow the story closely when it's going down. Cody, his dad and his new agent (you know, the one he got because his old agent didn't hassle MG enough) are all dicks. CoHo also was just an awkward, selfish kid who never meshed with the team and has had the same problems in Buffalo. If you want verification, dig up the threads and tweets but don't mistake your ignorance for my making assumptions.

Well then maybe explain how an organization like OHL, the Canucks, later on a reputable source like Gary Roberts, had all the praise in the world for him with his character. After "the injury", THEN the story changes? C'monnn

Edited by missioncanucksfan, 02 July 2013 - 08:22 PM.

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#51 missioncanucksfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:24 PM

thats a yes then? you are just regurgitating crap without any real evidence? Oh, he got a new agent, what a prick he must be.

And with what agents charge for fees these days... I would love it if my father could slap me a solid and bid my contract for me....
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#52 missioncanucksfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:32 PM

Unlike you basing his defensive play on his +/- I actually watched him play both here and in Buffalo and yes he is a defensive liability. He's not terrible but he is below average defensively.

And Cody was the problem with Buffalo's downfall huh? Miller had a stellar season, Pominville was traded, Vanek in constant trade rumours, Little Ennis getting manhandled all over the ice, Their coach being let go....

Again, this is only Cody's 2nd season.
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#53 SamJamIam

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:43 PM

thats a yes then? you are just regurgitating crap without any real evidence? Oh, he got a new agent, what a prick he must be.


1) Spouts baseless, contrarian nonsense
2) Gets called out
3) Claims rebuttal is baseless nonsense

Sorry but #4 isn't "Profit!!" Please try again.
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#54 canuck73_3

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 09:04 PM

And Cody was the problem with Buffalo's downfall huh? Miller had a stellar season, Pominville was traded, Vanek in constant trade rumours, Little Ennis getting manhandled all over the ice, Their coach being let go....

Again, this is only Cody's 2nd season.

No he's not the problem nor is he the solution or saviour people make him out to be.
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#55 Edlerberry

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 09:15 PM

1) Spouts baseless, contrarian nonsense
2) Gets called out
3) Claims rebuttal is baseless nonsense

Sorry but #4 isn't "Profit!!" Please try again.


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July 7-2013

View Posttheminister, on 07 July 2013 - 03:48 AM, said:

Toronto will take a step back next year.
Feel free to quote me.

July 8-2013

View Postapollo, on 08 July 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

Wow I can't believe peoples replies...
Im done here. You people are disgusting..

#56 Kola Nuts

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 09:20 PM

If he gets 4.5 or higher then I'm glad we traded him. Stupid brat


He has this smug look that always seems to annoy me....
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#57 CookieCrumbs

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 09:23 PM

Yeah everybody, believe what Gillis said about this kid. Gillis is a gutless pig when it comes to his players. The guy is pathetic.
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#58 SamJamIam

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 09:48 PM

No he's not the problem nor is he the solution or saviour people make him out to be.


To be fair, given his offensive production his underlying numbers are shockingly poor. Some great offensive skill but not enough to offset his poor defensive game.
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#59 mikeburn

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 10:34 PM

*
POPULAR

uh...

he outscores all the forwards on our team..

a lot of good the lack of goals from our 4, 5 and 6 million forwards did for us eh??

The hate based on nothing for this kid is ridiculous

I think the respect Gillis showed his two star goaltenders through the last year up to this weekend shows how much we can believe gillis and the way he paints things after he makes an unpopular move.


^ This.

And wow, just incredible how some people seem to have wholesale bought into Gillis' promotional stories and decided this kid "demanded Sedin minutes" and "whined", etc. And sentiments about Hodgson's character that no one throughout the kid's career has ever even implied except for Canucks mgmt - when attempting to rationalize their poor mgmt decisions. Smart man, Gillis, gotta give him credit for how he's entirely played the sheep.

Fortunately the non-sheep, the average joe who thinks for himself, can see the pattern here...

Hodgson - Has only ever received praise from his coaches, trainers and managers throughout his development (and really, if the kid had "demanded" minutes or a trade, then you'd expect he'd arrive in Buffalo on even more of a punk ego trip, but instead all the accounts from Sabres management and veteran linemates heap further praise for Hodgson's character and talents...). The ONLY blemish against this kid's character is the IMPLIED accusations delivered by Canucks mgmt, most notably Gillis who even went as far as to suggest they'd scammed Buffalo into believing the kid was better than he is...

Canucks Mgmt - In addition to throwing Hodgson under the bus (and driving over him a few times), also managed to screw around others, such as -

- Naslund, not even offering a token contract after his last game, while Gillis later implied to the media that they just couldn't come to terms

- Morrison, after his tryout, again implying to the media that he wasn't signed only because Morrison wanted too much (except that unlike Hodgson who had to keep his mouth shut, Morrison was near the end of his career and actually challenged Gillis' version - clarifying that he'd hadn't refused anything, didn't want too much and in fact the Canucks hadn't even made an offer!)

- Malholtra, wow, just wow how his guy was handled... Great how Gillis tried to pass off the forced retirement as him being a "good guy" (rather than admitting it was a cap ploy), but facts are easy - Malholtra was not suddenly a "risk" to himself 2 years after the injury, Canucks mgmt needed the cap space though so tried to play it up, and now Malholtra is trying to find another team to play out his career with.

- The Lu/Cory mess.... what a mess, and straight at the feet of Gillis/AV. From implying just enough to the media to fuel rumours that a deal couldn't come together last summer because Luongo wanted only specific team(s), to the constant flipflopping and empty rationalizations for their own failures... Oh, claims Gilils now it's the "changed landscape" that did this, lack of a "crystal ball", yadda. yadda... Yep, sure, it's only because Gillis doesn't have a crystal ball that he couldn't at least be bothered giving either goalie the decency of a heads-up on what was unfolding.

- others? Linden forced into retirement? Ohlund walking without an offer (or rights at least traded for a pick)? Grabner?

Yep, the pattern is easy if one actually looks at how mgmt has "managed" this team's assets in recent years - Where Hodgson's only character blemish comes from his dealings with the Canucks and what has been implied/inferred against him by management, Canucks management has a lengthy list of players they've bus tossed and played head games with. So, best guess is that Hodgson doesn't deserve the insults any more than Naslund, Morrison, Ohlund, Malholtra, Lu, Cory, etc...
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#60 missioncanucksfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 10:43 PM

H.Sedin
Kesler
Hodgson
Gaunce
Horvat
Shinkaruk

Nice down the middle
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