Not Starting Lou Classless & embarrassing to the Player and Organization another big black eye

[Dogbyte]

Idiots. A goalie was chosen. He lost. Get over it, move on and stop trying to make it seem like it's more than it is.

I think Luongo is a great goalie and person but it's getting harder and harder for me to support him with all the butthurt Luongo lovers around here. It getting pretty sickening and I have quite a high tolerance for this crap.

[oldnews]

Dude, you're posting on page 8 of the thread talking about why it was disrespectful and embarrassing. If you need a refresher (which one would have thought you would have bothered to get before posting about how it's all just whining....) maybe try reading the first 7 pages.

Spare me "dudette". What I'm waiting for is a reasonable qualification of the storyline that Luongo has been mistreated. People can parrot a Don Cherry rant until they're blue in the face - the context is never as simple as his rants suggest. There is nothing embarrassing about Luongo not getting a start because, once again, a younger goalie is performing well enough to command the net. If anything is classless, it's suggesting that his team-mate is stuck here and that we all know how the script ends. Unlike Kesler, Luongo is extremely difficult to move. Here's hoping MG finds a way to #freeLuongo.

[Heretic]

Pretty disappointed in the organization right now. I don't agree with "oh he makes $5.3m a year! He should stop being a baby". I get that professional hockey players are assessed on their performances.

I get that he is making a large sum of money that was GUARANTEED to him by OUR management. At the time the deal looked like a steal. He was (might still be if the team in front of him didn't blow) a top flight goalie and that AAV was low in comparison to other goaltenders.

The issue is that instead of management getting full value for their assets (developing and grooming Schneider and then trading him when appropriate for a mammoth return - could've been a young roster player and a prospect and a pick if done right I believe) and riding their #1 guy (goaltending has not been an issue for this team since Luongo came here), they sold him down the river for these younger guys who could play MAYBE incrementally better. Schneider is a very good goalie and his technique allows players to feel calm (I play hockey myself). But the management and ownership has fully invested in Roberto, which is why they gave him that huge career-spanning contract to keep him in Vancouver at a cap hit that gives flexibility for other areas. THAT is the biggest mistake in the past few years.

Can you imagine this squad bolstered by a young impact forward? For imagination's sake, let's pick Brayden Schenn (as the Flyers had a huge need for a tendy). With one of those two, we likely don't trade Hodgson and they form an offensive third line that gets minutes too. Or, if we do trade Hodgson, we put Schenn on Kesler's wing and Kesler finally gets a skilled winger to play with. Kassian can come along (as he's doing now) with LESS (relative) expectation.

I'm not saying this team is a young impact forward from being elite again, but avoiding the goaltending situation (see: asset management) of the last few years would've helped the team OVERALL.

Now with Lack...we could do the same thing. Groom him UNDER Luongo, and then trade him when his value is high. Repeat with Canaata. Repeat with Eriksson. That's how you develop your assets. Then you flip them for organizational needs when their values are the highest.

I sincerely hope we get new management that understands hockey. Gillis has made some great moves, but his blunders have outnumbered them in my mind.

Sigh...you realize "mysteries" is a word, right?

Yes...sorry, Chrome auto correct...heavier sigh.

[Puckster]

I think a lot of us are totally missing the point here.

Torts decides who plays when. So why did he feel the need to sit Lou? to put Lu in his place and gain control of the locker room?

Remember, Lu used to be Team Captain and is clearly a leader in the locker room. Maybe , just maybe, Torts needed that locker room control for himself. I can see this as a clear possible outcome. Its a battle of wills and control. lets see where this goes, before we throw anyone under the Bus.

[cabinessence]

The only way I can think of that Lu has been mistreated is if when he was told he would be number 1, it included a clause that stated even if the backup outplays you, you will still be the starter.

If that was not in his deal, he needs to be a team player and not pout.

prompt 4 stringed instrument by itself

[oldnews]

Where are these twitter posts of Luo's trying to stir things up? Please go to his twitter account and post a copy of them here.

If you mean his joking comment about Kesler, that was tweeted by a reporter, not Luo, and without any context or verbal cues. And he was likely just trying to lighten the mood and help out a teammate by taking the heat off of him since he was obviously uncomfortable with the situation and Luo knows how that feels. But it was one comment reported second-hand without context, not multiple tweets from Luo. If you're going to hate on the guy, at least get your facts straight.

not sure if you've been paying much attention at all, but the video of Luongo making those comments was wall to wall on TSN and SN.

Besides, you're obviously fond of the sentimental BS because you keep posting the same thing in every thread where it comes up, even when it's in the thread title so you could easily give it a miss.

Your attempt to pigeon-hole what I've said regarding Luongo is out of line. I don't have to give anything a miss - and it's pretty pretentious of you to suggest it. I have defended Luongo countless times throughout this drama. If you care to address any of those posts, and do so in context, I'd be more than willing to discuss them. Otherwise, you are grossly oversimplifying and misrepresenting my input.

Dude, you're posting on page 8 of the thread talking about why it was disrespectful and embarrassing. If you need a refresher (which one would have thought you would have bothered to get before posting about how it's all just whining....) maybe try reading the first 7 pages.

I didn't participate in the first 7 pages of this particular Luongo drama, perhaps the 100th chapter of the ongoing saga. I must, thus, be disqualified from commenting.

I'm not really interested in arguing with you Poetica - I've been quite respectful and appreciative of your input on these boards - but if you insist on using belittling "dude" references, you and I would both be better off simply ignoring each other.

[VMR]

I think a lot of us are totally missing the point here.

Torts decides who plays when. So why did he feel the need to sit Lou? to put Lu in his place and gain control of the locker room?

Remember, Lu used to be Team Captain and is clearly a leader in the locker room. Maybe , just maybe, Torts needed that locker room control for himself. I can see this as a clear possible outcome. Its a battle of wills and control. lets see where this goes, before we throw anyone under the Bus.

I see what you are saying, not sure Torts would pick Lou to be the one though. That should be the current captain.

[poetica]

Spare me "dudette". What I'm waiting for is a reasonable qualification of the storyline that Luongo has been mistreated. People can parrot a Don Cherry rant until they're blue in the face - the context is never as simple as his rants suggest. There is nothing embarrassing about Luongo not getting a start because, once again, a younger goalie is performing well enough to command the net. If anything is classless, it's suggesting that his team-mate is stuck here and that we all know how the script ends. Unlike Kesler, Luongo is extremely difficult to move. Here's hoping MG finds a way to #freeLuongo.

Still waiting for what? Start reading! People have been explaining it in detail in this thread as well as the game day thread for the Classic.

Don't want to read the posts here? Try checking out some of the other sources. God knows there's no shortage. Google is your friend.

Or maybe you can tweet Marty Turco and ask him to explain why he thought it was disrespectful:

Marty Turco ‏@mturco35

Ok. Louie on the pine for his first outdoor game. The Dallas cowboys of the NHL. He deserves better. #norespect

And while you're at it, maybe you can realize that it's you that's missing the entire context. A coach's job is not to get a single win, but to put together a winning SEASON. Luo hasn't been having a bad season and was the main reason the team didn't get blow out during Tort's ill-timed suspension and the subsequent games. Lack is a good goalie who is playing very well, but Luongo is the starter and the guy we need to be in net for most of our games. He's also the guy we're going to rely on IF we make it to the playoffs and we need him to be confident and not cold from sitting on the bench. Furthermore, we need Lack to be confident and ready to go, not doubting himself because he was thrown into a needless high pressure situation he wasn't ready for that could have lasting impact on his development. I honestly don't get how you don't see any of that, or how you could have missed it being explained without really trying.

If you want to share your own opinion, do it. That's your right (just as it was Luo's right to make a joking comment which was reported second hand without any context whatsoever!) But stop WHINING just because other people are voicing their opinion that doesn't match yours.

[key2thecup]

Anyone else catch that rat Ron Mclean's jab at the Canucks, right at the start they're showing the '94 run, and his first highlight was the Bure goal against Calgary and how it was "illegal"

[oldnews]

Still waiting for what? Start reading! People have been explaining it in detail in this thread as well as the game day thread for the Classic.

Don't want to read the posts here? Try checking out some of the other sources. God knows there's no shortage. Google is your friend.

Or maybe you can tweet Marty Turco and ask him to explain why he thought it was disrespectful:

And while you're at it, maybe you can realize that it's you that's missing the entire context. A coach's job is not to get a single win, but to put together a winning SEASON. Luo hasn't been having a bad season and was the main reason the team didn't get blow out during Tort's ill-timed suspension and the subsequent games. Lack is a good goalie who is playing very well, but Luongo is the starter and the guy we need to be in net for most of our games. He's also the guy we're going to rely on IF we make it to the playoffs and we need him to be confident and not cold from sitting on the bench. Furthermore, we need Lack to be confident and ready to go, not doubting himself because he was thrown into a needless high pressure situation he wasn't ready for that could have lasting impact on his development. I honestly don't get how you don't see any of that, or how you could have missed it being explained without really trying.

If you want to share your own opinion, do it. That's your right (just as it was Luo's right to make a joking comment which was reported second hand without any context whatsoever!) But stop WHINING just because other people are voicing their opinion that doesn't match yours.

I don't see a word of you qualifying how any of this is mistreatment or embarrassing Poetica. Referrring me repeatedly to read previous pages doesn't qualify, nor does posting the one-liner opinion of others. This is a bunch of begging the question.

[CroSen]

Repost from another thread, more appropriate here:

Imagine when Torts came back from his suspension for the Calgary locker room incident, Gillis says, "Before your suspenstion, we were 2-5-2 in Jan, Sully went 2-3, I want to give Sully another couple of chances see how he does as Acting Head Coach, come and watch the next game in the box with me."

Do you think Torts would be a professional about it?

I am curious, when has such a situation ever happened with an NHL coach?I just want to add to my own opinion that it seems like nobody learned from the Schnieder/Luongo situation and that is what's most frustrating. I can understand a mistake was made the first time, but a 2cnd? If I were the owner I would have a hard time putting up with that.

[Canada Hockey Place]

One thing for certain is overreacting to things like this helps no one.

I'm glad both goalies have a strong head on their shoulders to ignore the drama.

[poetica]

not sure if you've been paying much attention at all, but the video of Luongo making those comments was wall to wall on TSN and SN.

Huh. I must have somehow missed it, but I'd love to see it. Do you have a link?

Your attempt to pigeon-hole what I've said regarding Luongo is out of line. I don't have to give anything a miss - and it's pretty pretentious of you to suggest it. I have defended Luongo countless times throughout this drama. If you care to address any of those posts, and do so in context, I'd be more than willing to discuss them. Otherwise, you are grossly oversimplifying and misrepresenting my input.

How exactly was I oversimplifying or misrepresenting you saying:

More than tired of the 'poor Luo' story, the Luo is a victim angle, and all this dramatic whining about how Luo has been "mistreated".

A bunch of sentimental bulls#!t.

What were the nuanced layers I was supposed to read into you saying other people's opinions are just "dramatic whining" and "A bunch of sentimental bulls#!t."?

I didn't participate in the first 7 pages of this particular Luongo drama, perhaps the 100th chapter of the ongoing saga. I must, thus, be disqualified from commenting.

Nope. You're as entitled to participate as anyone. But to participate you have to actually see what others are saying, instead of calling everyone else's opinion "A bunch of sentimental bulls#!t." and then saying that "What I'm waiting for is a reasonable qualification of the storyline that Luongo has been mistreated." Participating in the discussion means you read what others say so you know what they're saying, not calling it "A bunch of sentimental bulls#!t." without even reading it.

I'm not really interested in arguing with you Poetica - I've been quite respectful and appreciative of your input on these boards - but if you insist on using belittling "dude" references, you and I would both be better off simply ignoring each other.

Dude is not belittling. It's a commonly used generic term without any negative connotations that I'm aware of. It just means a person, often male but even that's not set in stone as women often address other women with the term.

But if you want to ignore me, feel free.

[Papayas]

I don't see a word of you qualifying how any of this is mistreatment or embarrassing Poetica. Referrring me repeatedly to read previous pages doesn't qualify, nor does posting the one-liner opinion of others. This is a bunch of begging the question.

the treatment to Lu is embarrassing because you don't treat our star players like this especially when he was actually having a pretty decent season. Do you even need explanation on why it's bad for team moral when you choose a rookie with 9 career wins under his belt over a franchise player who is currently holding all the goalie franchise records when both players perform similar this season? Seriously you actually need people to explain to you why this is bad for team moral?

Luongo is, or was, the core of this team and he was one of the players that was holding this team together. This is the reason he got a life time contract in the first place. Unless he was badly outplayed, you don't sit him on a game like that out of respect.

Your question is just like "can you explain how it is disrespectful when you disrespect someone?" This is mind boggling how anyone can ask this question.

Whether it was the right call or not can be debatable, but if you dont think that was a disrespectful thing then you got a serious logic problem or you are just seriously biased.

[Phantasystar]

One thing for certain is overreacting to things like this helps no one.

I'm glad both goalies have a strong head on their shoulders to ignore the drama.

What you don't understand is it doesn't matter if the goalies have a strong head on their shoulders. The media lives for this stuff. It's like Round 2 for them of a similar situation. Each game they are going to really laying it into Torts til he finally does lose it.

You guys have a thread asking about the problems with the Sedins. They are leading your team in points. It seems the problem isn't in goal or the Sedins but more like the system that isn't working for the team.

[poetica]

I don't see a word of you qualifying how any of this is mistreatment or embarrassing Poetica. Referrring me repeatedly to read previous pages doesn't qualify, nor does posting the one-liner opinion of others. This is a bunch of begging the question.

First, no one has to qualify their opinion to your satisfaction. You're entitled to your opinion, just as the rest of us are. You are not, however, the judge to which we must all submit our reasoning and get your permission to think what we think.

Second, stop begging the question and start finding the answer. YOU were the one who said he was "waiting for is a reasonable qualification of the storyline that Luongo has been mistreated." If you want more information on why other people feel the way they do, stop waiting for someone to deliver it to you and just go read the many posts already made about it. Or, if you can't be bothered to do that, why not at least refrain from belittling other people's opinions, which you admit to not even understanding, as mere "dramatic whining"?

[oldnews]

Huh. I must have somehow missed it, but I'd love to see it. Do you have a link?

you saying other people's opinions are just "dramatic whining" and "A bunch of sentimental bulls#!t."?

instead of calling everyone else's opinion...

Not sure how you could have missed it - it was wall to wall with Kesler's comments. Do you think TSN would have missed the opportunity to roll that scrum repeatedly?

"Whether he wants to go or stay, he's not going anywhere," Luongo said. "We all know how this script ends."

I'm sure you're fairly adept with google though, so fill your boots.

"Classless", "embarrassing" etc is dramatic whining in my books Poetica.

There is no such thing as "everyone else's opinion" - that kind of straw misrepresentation is a non-starter and precisely the sort of thing I'm talking about when I say you have oversimplified and misrepresented my input on these boards.

What you actually said was "you keep posting the same thing in every thread" - but re-quoting one post in this thread doesn't represent. I've also called Luongo a HOF goaltender, I maintained his value all along, starting in a blog where I refer to him as "the real deal"- I endlessly defended him against misrepresentations that his comments after the LA playoff loss constituted a 'trade demand' - when what he actually said, under pressure from a bunch of bottomfeeding local media in a scrum, was that he would waive if asked to do so, and do what was right for the team.

What I will not do is pretend that his numbers (or situational play) was better than Schneider's, nor better than Lack's. He is in a legitimate competition for starts - that is how professional sports work. The Canucks starting role, and team Canada's for that matter, are not patronage appointments. Even Luongo has to continue to earn his starts. Making stupid comments that feed the trolls at the expense of his management and organization don't exactly win him any victim points. The irony as far as I'm concerned is that the most embarrassing and classless comments regarding Luongo have come from the Eastern media - who ran him down incessantly - and then occassionally pretend to be his champion when it suits a different cause - ie trolling the Canucks management or coaching staff. Aside from that, the most embarrassing comments were his own - "my contract sucks". And now - "we all know how this script ends". Hopefully it ends soon, and with him somewhere like Florida.

[oldnews]

just go read the many posts already made about it. ?

Read them all. not starting a goaltender is not mistreatment. People will have to do better than that or it's really just unsubstantiated, overdramatized whining.

[thema]

This is an exemplary of Tortorella being... disconnected to his team. Break down the stars...make all automatons...no ego bigger or more import tant to the group....than Mr. Tortorella.

If I interpret your gibberish correctly you seem to be saying that the "star" players egos SHOULD be more important than the group, especially Lou's. Wrong wrong wrong.

[Pride]

lu lovers with their sense of entitlement rating lu above the team... (apparently this attitude extends to lu judging by his response)

this Is a team game, All players have to contribute to the teams success..

if you get outplayed in your position by a teammate, and he gives the team a better chance to win... then he plays over you. Simple as that.

if lu doesn't like that, He should leave. Tired of his/his fanboys whining.

Lack earned that start on the back of spectacular play, and outplaying Lu up to that point. Torts didn't start lack because he's a "big meanie" who wants to act like a jerk

logged in to let you know you are an idiot if you actually believe what you posted.