[Official] Toronto Blue Jays Major League Baseball thread

[Sean Monahan]

27 minutes ago, Xbox said:

Travis can be our leadoff hitter imo 

I think he's more of an ideal #2 hitter. He can handle the bat well- bunt, hit and run, etc. He can work a count reasonably well and he's right handed to boot.

[Xbox]

21 minutes ago, Standing_Tall#37 said:

I could see him signing for 8-12 for a year. Hopefully this experience has humbled him.  And I do believe he's a much better option than Bruce, so I welcome him back. If we can't aquire Revere and they don't do anything else with the outfield I wouldn't mind seeing Pompey get a chance  to platoon with Upton in left.

I really just hope Atkins/Shapiro tells him "its non-negotiable". I think Revere and Bautista would make our outfield feared again. Maybe not RF but at least the bat is back. Could always use him as DH and Morales at 1B for the times we play a left-handed loaded lineup.

 

21 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said:

I think he's more of an ideal #2 hitter. He can handle the bat well- bunt, hit and run, etc. He can work a count reasonably well and he's right handed to boot.

Yeah he will make the line-up a lot stronger. I remember in October Atkins was saying he's still a great outfielder in his eyes, but I also believe he was just boosting him for free agency. If you're out of options for RF and a 40 HR player comes and asks for work you dont say no lol

Edited December 10, 2016 by Xbox

[Sean Monahan]

1 minute ago, Xbox said:

I really just hope Atkins/Shapiro tells him "its non-negotiable". I think Revere and Bautista would make our outfield feared again. Maybe not RF but at least the bat is back.

 

Yeah he will make the line-up a lot stronger. I remember in October Atkins was saying he's still a great outfielder in his eyes, but I also believe he was just boosting him for free agency. If you're out of options for RF and a 40 HR player comes and asks for work you dont say no lol

Are you talking about JB? I was talking about Devon Travis.

[Xbox]

9 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said:

Are you talking about JB? I was talking about Devon Travis.

I was talking about JB. I still think Travis is our best leadoff option with Donaldson, Morales, Bautista following.

[Standing_Tall#37]

Just viewed some more stats and with the players we let go+ the players we brought in on offense alone the stats say we'll score 200 less runs as it is.

 

 That projects to be 10-20 more losses this year on production alone. That's if our pitching is lights out again. Looking at that, we might struggle to put up 70Ws this year as our roster currently sits.

[ShakyWalton]

18 minutes ago, Standing_Tall#37 said:

Just viewed some more stats and with the players we let go+ the players we brought in on offense alone the stats say we'll score 200 less runs as it is.

 

 That projects to be 10-20 more losses this year on production alone. That's if our pitching is lights out again. Looking at that, we might struggle to put up 70Ws this year as our roster currently sits.

Im with you..if there arent anymore QUALITY moves...this team is fooling itself...or better yet ..the public.

Edited December 10, 2016 by ShakyWalton

[RUPERTKBD]

5 hours ago, Xbox said:

If the rumours are true and EE signs with St. Louis i'll be pissed. Hooray for a pick around 50th overall...

 

Edwin will not succeed in the NL.

Not me. I'd much rather see him in the NL.

 

22 minutes ago, Standing_Tall#37 said:

Just viewed some more stats and with the players we let go+ the players we brought in on offense alone the stats say we'll score 200 less runs as it is.

 

 That projects to be 10-20 more losses this year on production alone. That's if our pitching is lights out again. Looking at that, we might struggle to put up 70Ws this year as our roster currently sits.

Just curious: What stats are those?

[Standing_Tall#37]

Hr/RBI/RS/xbh, with Saunders/EE/Bats gone and Morales/Pearce in, most of those stats are 100 less, but are almost 200 less runs scored total. 

[RUPERTKBD]

20 minutes ago, Standing_Tall#37 said:

Hr/RBI/RS/xbh, with Saunders/EE/Bats gone and Morales/Pearce in, most of those stats are 100 less, but are almost 200 less runs scored total. 

I think that's a flawed way to look at it. The Indians hit the long ball far less than the Jays, but they scored more runs.

 

Toronto is going to have to start manufacturing runs, something they've done minimally is the past two seasons. This is why we need a reliable lead off guy and Travis in the 2 hole, so he can move guys over.

[Sean Monahan]

 

 

Adapt or die guys. Time to change the way of thinking regarding the Jays' offence.

 

Also, the line about "Who's Fabio?" is the best line in the movie.

[Standing_Tall#37]

59 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

I think that's a flawed way to look at it. The Indians hit the long ball far less than the Jays, but they scored more runs.

 

Toronto is going to have to start manufacturing runs, something they've done minimally is the past two seasons. This is why we need a reliable lead off guy and Travis in the 2 hole, so he can move guys over.

True, but I think the jays last year hit 70 more home runs more, had 110 more RBI, and scored 190+ more times more than the replacements are projected to. So any way you look at scoring it however you want those runs to be manufactured the bottom line is that last years team was >>>>>> by 1.25 runs/game than this team projects to be as they sit currently.

 

That means any games we won by 1 run, you could project to be a loss...that's 20 less Ws if the pitching is great. I think a great leadoff addition could change that but I'm expecting a long season and a 4th place AL finish atm. But 60% of the off season is still left, so I hope they're not done yet.

[g_bassi13]

1 hour ago, Sean Monahan said:

 

 

Adapt or die guys. Time to change the way of thinking regarding the Jays' offence.

 

Also, the line about "Who's Fabio?" is the best line in the movie.

 

Billy makes a point of saying that we can't just approach the issue of replacing Giambi by looking for another Giambi, because there isn't another Giambi out there, but that's exactly what the Jays did when they signed up Morales to be a bargain bin Encarnacion.

 

That said though you're right that there's more than one approach to winning games, and the Jays could be better off by adding more dimensions to their offence. But I don't think they've done it. And the options moving forward are pretty small.

 

And unlike the Athletics's in the video, they're not losing Giambi and Damon because there's zero chance of retaining them in the face of teams like the Red Sox and the Yankees that were spending 3 to 4 times more than the A's were in those years, this is an ownership and a management team that's internally handicapping themselves with regards to retaining Encarnacion and Bautista. I think that's where the frustration comes from.

 

Billy would loved to have had Giambi and Damon back for another crack if he could. I guess the Jays are in a similar situation, whether internally created or not.

 

All that said though, I'd honestly love Bautista back on a discounted and short term contract if that's what he opts for. I think it would honestly help this team big time for next season if they could get him.

[Sean Monahan]

@g_bassi13

 

I would've rather seen management sign Morales and then use the money saved to bolster the pen and add a more dynamic lead off hitter, preferably one that hits left handed. I'm not terribly upset about not landing Fowler after seeing the contract he got but he's exactly what they could've used. As has been mentioned many times now, there's still plenty of pop in the lineup. They need to diversify the offence and find ways to create runs via means other than the long ball. If they could do that and solidify the pen they'd still be a very good team. 

[g_bassi13]

Just now, Sean Monahan said:

@g_bassi13

 

I would've rather seen management sign Morales and then use the money saved to bolster the pen and add a more dynamic lead off hitter, preferably one that hits left handed. I'm not terribly upset about not landing Fowler after seeing the contract he got but he's exactly what they could've used. As has been mentioned many times now, there's still plenty of pop in the lineup. They need to diversify the offence and find ways to create runs via means other than the long ball. If they could do that and solidify the pen they'd still be a very good team. 

 

I get what you're saying, but if this is a pivot, this feels like a very half assed one. I know there's time to go, but if we're looking at options available, I can't see them amassing a team that could take on the one from last year head to head.

 

I agree that if we were looking at two spots, that both the lead off hitter and the bullpen are where to look. Bullpen could use more than just a little help. Something so that we don't enter the season like last where they fluke into something half competent part way through. Come prepared. The Jays cycling through a committee of lead off hitters was equally frustrating for the same reasons.

 

Still playing wait and see with this team, but just getting more frustrated, and showings like at these winter meetings show a team that feels content dodging and scraping at talent rather than targeting the best of what we need. Maybe it will work out, but I remain sceptical.

[Xbox]

The plan was to bolster bullpen but I dont think Shapiro/Atkins anticipated the relief pitching market to be this bad.

Edited December 11, 2016 by Xbox

[Sean Monahan]

53 minutes ago, g_bassi13 said:

 

I get what you're saying, but if this is a pivot, this feels like a very half assed one. I know there's time to go, but if we're looking at options available, I can't see them amassing a team that could take on the one from last year head to head.

 

I agree that if we were looking at two spots, that both the lead off hitter and the bullpen are where to look. Bullpen could use more than just a little help. Something so that we don't enter the season like last where they fluke into something half competent part way through. Come prepared. The Jays cycling through a committee of lead off hitters was equally frustrating for the same reasons.

 

Still playing wait and see with this team, but just getting more frustrated, and showings like at these winter meetings show a team that feels content dodging and scraping at talent rather than targeting the best of what we need. Maybe it will work out, but I remain sceptical.

I can't disagree that it's a little frustrating but my point is the team is just fine in terms of power production without JB and Edwin. There are other greater needs. The whining about those two potentially leaving needs to stop, as their potential departures aren't what will hamper this team next year IMO.

 

 

not saying that you've been whining but there's been plenty of it in this thread

Edited December 11, 2016 by Sean Monahan

[Beary Sweet]

That moment when you realize Edwin and Joey Bats could go unsigned next season. If somehow we get them signed though, that would be pretty sick as we would have one of the best lineups in baseball. But it's obvious that we need a leadoff hitter and bullpen help. Kenley Jansen still remains unsigned so if we snag him, that would help this team alot since he can get into the game when a pitcher gets out of the game early because he had one of those terrible starts. Revere just seems like the logical leadoff hitter in my books but I think they're going to stick with Carrera as their leadoff hitter. That money used to sign a leadoff hitter could be used to sign Edwin or Bautista back here. It just doesn't seem right without the two here. Hope they make it happen.

[Xbox]

If Edwin goes unsigned that's his own doing because he's greedy af. Apparently 20M a year is not good enough to play in your most desired city? On top of that he wouldn't even have to play 1B next year either. 

[shiznak]

The moneyball approach only works if you a strong farm system, which the Jays do not have or if you're not playing in the AL East. AA tried the moneyball way, and it didn't work out well for him, until he became aware that to compete in AL East, you need to spend money. Which is why he made all those major trades and signings. 

 

Also, I was never much of a fan of spending money on the bullpen (although I did wanted Melancon). Sometimes the best way to improve your bullpen is within the organization. I like to see what Ryan Tepera, Danny Barnes, and Chad Girodo can do in a full season.

[ShakyWalton]

11 hours ago, Sean Monahan said:

I can't disagree that it's a little frustrating but my point is the team is just fine in terms of power production without JB and Edwin. There are other greater needs. The whining about those two potentially leaving needs to stop, as their potential departures aren't what will hamper this team next year IMO.

 

 

not saying that you've been whining but there's been plenty of it in this thread

OUT                                      IN

Brett Cecil							Pearce            Morales           Oberholzer
R.A. Dickey
Joaquin Benoit
Jose Bautista
Scott Feldman
Edwin Encarnacion
Dioner Navarro
Michael Saunders
Darwin Barney
Gavin Floyd
Chris Colabello
Josh Thole

 

Still need a back up catcher and relief help...not exactly setting the world on fire.