Great Drafting Evaluator from TSN

[nowhereman]

Not sure crosby is a generational player Talk to me in 15 yrs Crosby is injury prone and his top season he got 120 points and 50 goals

Gretzky top yr he has 215 points and 92 goals thats generational

(Orr, lemeiux, jagr) are pretty close if crosby can score 1000 more points and win 2-3 more cups hell be on level of jagr if hes lucky i seriously doubt he will

We can bump this thread in 15 years, when Sidney Crosby is considered the fourth best forward of all time, behind Gretz, Mario, and Howe.

Crosby is the definition of generational. He is, by far, the best player of his generation. If not for injuries, he'd already have four or five Art Ross Trophies, Harts, and Lindsays and he's only 26. Even with all those injuries, he'll still continue to pad his trophy case.

[D-Money]

Not sure crosby is a generational player Talk to me in 15 yrs Crosby is injury prone and his top season he got 120 points and 50 goals

Gretzky top yr he has 215 points and 92 goals thats generational

(Orr, lemeiux, jagr) are pretty close if crosby can score 1000 more points and win 2-3 more cups hell be on level of jagr if hes lucky i seriously doubt he will

OMG, that's just stupid.

The only Reason anybody but Crosby has won the Hart and Art Ross is because he's been hurt. When he's healthy, he is completely superior to any other player in the league.

He is most certainly "generational". Look at everyone else in this generation - and he's the best of the bunch.

[Hectic]

I always feel that if Crosby played 20 years ago when Gretzky was dominating the league that Crosby would be way better.. just seeing as how the game has evolved I don't think that Gretzky would be able to score as many points as he did whereas Crosby playing in the previous generation would have just lit it up ridiculously. Basically I think that Crosby > Gretzky but there's no way of ever comparing them properly.

[Absent Canuck]

Sedins are certainly 2nd ballot hall of famers. They are the only identical twins in the big 4 team sport history I believe. They both won gold medals. They both won scoring titles and 2 presidents trophies.

The cup would probably make them 1st ballot but there is no way the HHOF passes up on something this unique

[J.I.A.H.N]

I think they have the Generational hockey player a little skewed......

To me that has watched hockey far too long...my definition is a player that is above all the rest. People can talk about Crosby or Malkin or OV, but they all have equals in their own era, where as generational doesn't

Example: Crosby has Toews, is one better than the other, yes but only marginally

Malkin..............Crosby is better

OV....................Stamkos is equal...........................these are the upper crust of elite, but not generational

Generational: Gretzki, Orr, Lemieux, Howe, Hull............these guys controlled the puck agaist their piers every shift, their who carreer....every shift.........when on the ice they were better at almost everything when compared to other elite players

Generally speaking, they do not show up every 5 years or even 10........once every 20 years......hense the title Generational. Maybe twice in 20, but certainly not 3 and 4 times every 10 years

[Ghostsof1915]

There's also players that are unique and legendary.

Orr. Legendary, changed the way defensemen are looked at. Not did he change the job description of what a defenseman did, he changed the notion of what a defenseman could do.

Lemieux. Greatest example of skill, power, size, probably one of the most complete offensive players in hockey. It's tragic that cancer, and injuries derailed such a fantastic player. He was poetry in motion. He could fight too!

Gretzky. Greatest vision, and offensive instincts of anyone in the game. Not the greatest athlete, but he played the game 3 seconds ahead of everyone else. Scary how good his vision and instincts were. Not sure if his records will ever be broken.

Comparing players to guys like this is makes zero sense. Different eras, almost a different game. The reason goalies wear big pads, and defensive systems were put into place is stop players like this. If every goalie played a stand up style alone and the butterfly style was outlawed you'd see a way different game.

[nowhereman]

I think they have the Generational hockey player a little skewed......

To me that has watched hockey far too long...my definition is a player that is above all the rest. People can talk about Crosby or Malkin or OV, but they all have equals in their own era, where as generational doesn't

Example: Crosby has Toews, is one better than the other, yes but only marginally

Malkin..............Crosby is better

OV....................Stamkos is equal...........................these are the upper crust of elite, but not generational

Generational: Gretzki, Orr, Lemieux, Howe, Hull............these guys controlled the puck agaist their piers every shift, their who carreer....every shift.........when on the ice they were better at almost everything when compared to other elite players

Generally speaking, they do not show up every 5 years or even 10........once every 20 years......hense the title Generational. Maybe twice in 20, but certainly not 3 and 4 times every 10 years

Yeah, sorry but the difference between Crosby and Toews is not "marginal". It's not even remotely close. Crosby just had a below average season (by his standards) and still outscored Toews by close to 40 points, playing with Kuntiz and a revolving door of AHL-quality wingers. He also had to carry the Penguins, with Malkin, Neal, and Letang missing significant time.

[J.I.A.H.N]

Yeah, sorry but the difference between Crosby and Toews is not "marginal". It's not even remotely close. Crosby just had a below average season (by his standards) and still outscored Toews by close to 40 points, playing with Kuntiz and a revolving door of AHL-quality wingers. He also had to carry the Penguins, with Malkin, Neal, and Letang missing significant time.

I get what you mean about Crosby being better than Toews and may very well be generational.......and I maybe wrong with my definition, but Orr, Gretzki, Lemieux, which are my 3 generational players that I have seen are like 1a, 1b, 1c

Let me explain why I feel this way......... Orr could take off down the ice and no one could stop him....no one, except Bill Barbers leg, cause that is about all a player could get of Orr.......Could not get caught, could not be hit, had a great slap shot.....he could rag the puck for a whole shift.......ST. Louis once had a guy skate every where Orr went......trouble was Orr would just stand there....quite funny actually........then the guy would take his eye off him for one second......pooof he was gone! Check out his +-

Gretzki was different, and of course it was a different ERA, but he wasn't a great skater, but they had a hard time catching him, LOL.....thing was with Gretzki, he was a magician........nothing happening then.......what the frack just happened.....people say he was 2 plays ahead of the actual play......I hated Gretzki! He was a whinner!........and 1b........Can not compare him to anyone on the ice threse days.............I actually think he would invent plays on the bench and then go out and make them happen.

Lemieux........was actually closer to Crosby, but faster, stronger, and was the closest thing I have seen to Gretski for vision.....both in their prime, I am not sure which one was better, but Gretzki stood the test of time........hense his 1b rating

The word Amazing comes to mind with these 3 players......maybe they were beyond generational

Crosby is NOT there..........close but still not there..... Man that was fun just thinking of those 3, and remember I hated Gretzki! But Wow!

[Guest Dasein]

I get what you mean about Crosby being better than Toews and may very well be generational.......and I maybe wrong with my definition, but Orr, Gretzki, Lemieux, which are my 3 generational players that I have seen are like 1a, 1b, 1c

[...]

How do you feel about Eric Lindros? Just curious.

Also, I think Nick Lidstrom could fall under generational.

[nowhereman]

I get what you mean about Crosby being better than Toews and may very well be generational.......and I maybe wrong with my definition, but Orr, Gretzki, Lemieux, which are my 3 generational players that I have seen are like 1a, 1b, 1c

Let me explain why I feel this way......... Orr could take off down the ice and no one could stop him....no one, except Bill Barbers leg, cause that is about all a player could get of Orr.......Could not get caught, could not be hit, had a great slap shot.....he could rag the puck for a whole shift.......ST. Louis once had a guy skate every where Orr went......trouble was Orr would just stand there....quite funny actually........then the guy would take his eye off him for one second......pooof he was gone! Check out his +-

Gretzki was different, and of course it was a different ERA, but he wasn't a great skater, but they had a hard time catching him, LOL.....thing was with Gretzki, he was a magician........nothing happening then.......what the frack just happened.....people say he was 2 plays ahead of the actual play......I hated Gretzki! He was a whinner!........and 1b........Can not compare him to anyone on the ice threse days.............I actually think he would invent plays on the bench and then go out and make them happen.

Lemieux........was actually closer to Crosby, but faster, stronger, and was the closest thing I have seen to Gretski for vision.....both in their prime, I am not sure which one was better, but Gretzki stood the test of time........hense his 1b rating

The word Amazing comes to mind with these 3 players......maybe they were beyond generational

Crosby is NOT there..........close but still not there..... Man that was fun just thinking of those 3, and remember I hated Gretzki! But Wow!

If Gretzky, Lemieux, and Orr are the standard by which generational players are ranked, that would mean that there has only been three generational talents in 100 years of NHL hockey. IMO, that criteria is WAY to strict. I consider Howe, Hull, Richard, Harvey, and Hasek generational talents, as well. Crosby too. He's best player I've seen since Jagr came into the league, maybe Lemieux and will likely end up in the top 10 of all time. To me, that's generational.

Honestly, it felt like Crosby was coasting a lot of the year and he still had the largest margin in the scoring race since Gretzky in 1991.

[J.I.A.H.N]

If Gretzky, Lemieux, and Orr are the standard by which generational players are ranked, that would mean that there has only been three generational talents in 100 years of NHL hockey. IMO, that criteria is WAY to strict. I consider Howe, Hull, Richard, Harvey, and Hasek generational talents, as well. Crosby too. He's best player I've seen since Jagr came into the league, maybe Lemieux and will likely end up in the top 10 of all time. To me, that's generational.

Honestly, it felt like Crosby was coasting a lot of the year and he still had the largest margin in the scoring race since Gretzky in 1991.

Like I said earlier, those are the 3 that I have seen, and that is in 45+ years.I did see Hull, Howe and Hasek all that could be considered the top of the elite/ or generational.

But ask yourself, would Crosby be considered better than Pronger, Scott Stevens, Brad Park, Paul Coffee, Al McGuiness, Lindstrom, Potvin, Weber? Would he still dominate them? You see Orr / Gretzki / Lemieux could.

That is not to say that the bottom of the generational is near the top of the elite, I mean how do you really differentiate? I agree that Crosby could be generational, but then that means other could claim the same. But I do agree Hull and Howe would be considered generational right now. As would some of the others, Richard and Harvey.......but you don't have to have a player every 20 years, they show up when they show up!

In saying this, I could be splitting hairs!........but trust me, Orr was better than Hull and Howe as a rookie.......Harry Howell the Norris winner that year confirmed it by basically saying it. Gretzki changed the game the same way.....maybe they were visionary! LOL Beyond Generational.....an 11 on a scale of 10............IMO.................Crosby is not that!

[.Naslund]

Crosby is built like a TANK. And if you extrapolated his career PPG of 1.39 over 1,457 games (the length of Gretzky's career) he'd be the second player ever to reach the 2,000 point plateau.

Not only that, but have you seen the eras Gretzky, Lemiuex and Crosby play in? Goaltenders have evolved so much over the past decades, they're on a whole another level than what they were back then, and I'm sure its fair to say that if Crosby's production is on a whole another planet than the rest of the League, that it'd be the same way in the past.

Crosby IS a GENERATIONAL talent. it's just way easier to hate on players now because of social media. If everyone would just shut up and stop hating on players (Cindy Crybaby wah wah wah etc), maybe you guys could actually relax and enjoy this generational talent that Crosby is. Appreciate his game and how great he is, and just enjoy the game.


PS: Same thing applies to LeBron James too!

[J.I.A.H.N]

Crosby is built like a TANK. And if you extrapolated his career PPG of 1.39 over 1,457 games (the length of Gretzky's career) he'd be the second player ever to reach the 2,000 point plateau.

Not only that, but have you seen the eras Gretzky, Lemiuex and Crosby play in? Goaltenders have evolved so much over the past decades, they're on a whole another level than what they were back then, and I'm sure its fair to say that if Crosby's production is on a whole another planet than the rest of the League, that it'd be the same way in the past.

Crosby IS a GENERATIONAL talent. it's just way easier to hate on players now because of social media. If everyone would just shut up and stop hating on players (Cindy Crybaby wah wah wah etc), maybe you guys could actually relax and enjoy this generational talent that Crosby is. Appreciate his game and how great he is, and just enjoy the game.

PS: Same thing applies to LeBron James too!

Yeah, LOL

OK, first off no one is hating Crosby or LeBron for that matter! LOL.........So Ok! .......You think Crosby is generational........He is!

Pretty good player anyway you shake it.

But you can't compare points.etc of ERA's.........they change the rules to much.........example.......they use to allow clutching and grabbing in the neutral zone......today that is interference.........they used to play more 4 on 4 during penalties.....skated were heavier, goalie gear weighed 40lbs after a game....todays gear doesn't absorb water and sticks were wood! All Factors.

But what I noticed from my observations was that Orr and Gretzki and a few others over the years, could play keep away with the puck for extended periods of time by them selves. Gretzki ( who I hate) basically looked like both Sedins at once...he was amasing(And if my friends could hear me say this they would be laughing at me big time! LOL) Orr was like BURE, except way smarter and faster than him with the gear of the day.....that to me is Gereational

And they were both the best hockey player every game, every year they played, from day one to the end........Crosby no....but he is exceptional and generational in his own right! Not in Gretzki's or Orrs league....trust me......But he could play for us anytime!