What are the Canucks ceiling if they just re-tool?

[BenDrinkin]

As a retool for the Cup, definitely. If not, there will be a good 10 years before all main core players have declined into retirement and a new core is groomed.

Not all star players take a decade to become stars like the Sedins did. Maybe we will have a new competitive core in 5 years or less.

[icycold]

Linden has already stated he wants to make the playoffs THIS year. Obviously we are going to keep some of our core players, but Kesler, Hansen, possibly others will be shipped off for good returns. Youth will also be infused into the lineup with Horvat, possibly 1 other young guy. Sometimes you only need a few new players to spark an entire team, not a full out rebuild.

We MIGHT squeak in the playoffs (MIGHT!) Highly doubtful unless we get a big hardnosed center for the twins or Kassian finds consistance which he's still a bit young for. This team is still done for another 2 years sadly enough unless Linden finds us a new GM who can pull something crazy off but with what we have that's almost impossible.

[icycold]

I'm now starting to agree with the folks who say split the Sedins up to 1st and 2nd line but that's still grasping at straws i'd say but it might work (kind of) depends on who can be brought in

[icycold]

i get the feeling something else was going on with MG. since the SCF his moves just didn't make sense.

say you want to be physical and let Torres walk. Waive Volpatti and lose him just to bring someone up from the minors... It's almost like he thought he could do anything he wanted and didn't have to worry about the consequences anymore. The whole Luongo thing with 2 great goaltenders... down to 0 (well I think Lack is a great goaltender - or at least he has the potential - but at the time...). It's almost like he took everything personally and kept grudges... How do you explain the rash of bad moves. Really bad moves? I used to think he was doing a great job until this fall off the cliff...

"How do you explain the rash of bad moves. Really bad moves? I used to think he was doing a great job until this fall off the cliff..."

My take on this was he was trying simply to upgrade those pieces with the same toughness but with added skill levels, same on all fronts of surrounding the core with what was needed BUT not much was available for what we needed at the time. Hence Booth and Kassian in the power forward position and what was needed in the tough skilled position didn't work out (still have kassian though and hope THAT works out eventually) so we simply sank to the bottom and here we are today in the same position.. nothing has changed much...

[Ben Kenobi]

Yes, Sedin, Sedin and Burrows were the worst first line in Canucks History. Paid 14 million plus 4, so 18 million combined for 112 points, as many as Bure used to score solo.

Put it this way, the Canucks could have bought Crosby for 12, and still have 6 million to spend on another player.

Henrik Sedin was the worst canuck number one forward in the history of the team, who played all season with the team. The only team that is even as close to being bad, still had Tony Tanti or Dan Quinn, Trevor Linden and Greg Adams. Even that year was not as bad as this year has been, and that was the worst the team has ever been.

This is what all the Sedin fans need to wake up and realize. It's over for them. They are done. They are now coach and GM killers with untradeable massive contracts that will doom this team to years of cellar dwelling unless they take a paycut or retire.

[Ben Kenobi]

"Despite the horrific production".

Look it up. The worst number 1 forward for the team who played the entire season for the Canucks scored 51 points in 1989-1990.
That record was shattered this year. That season the team had a young Trevor Linden, a young Greg Adams, had Tony Tanti, whom they traded for Dan Quinn.

The number one scorer for the team was Paul Reinhart, the first and the only time that a defenseman had that title, with 57 points. Henrik Sedin set another record this year.

That is the worst this team has ever done on offense. This year was worse for the top line than the horrific years in the 90s, worse than the 70s, worse than the 80s.

[Canuck Surfer]

The Canucks could easily be a wild card team next season. In addition to the depth issues it seems like most of the team had their worst offensive seasons. I would expect that trend to continue and guys like Daniel, Henrik, Kesler and Burrows will show a significant improvement next season.

The new GM (whomever that is) needs to focus mainly on improving the team's depth. I'd start be re-signing Santo, not for crazy money and for another 1-2 years. There's bound to be some lower level UFAs that the Canucks could scoop up early too.

Yes, Chicago and LA also proved that if you are solid in most respects you can go on a run in the play off's. I agree we can be a wild card team, but are two to three moves (or in young players stepping up) from being that fundamentally solid. If a Jensen (or Shinkaruk, or...) steps up, Higgins or Hansen become 3rd liners. Voila, you have depth? But its only 2 to 3 changes to the team: perhaps two stepping up big and one move?

Re-signing Santo should be a no brainer, and some luck to get and stay healthy.

Then get a Vanek, Gaborik or Carter at the deadline... And you can do real damage?

As for the comp?

I see Anaheim having a bit of a step down? Not long term, too much young talent. Just one year as Selanne and perhaps Koivu retire (or regress) and said young players find their game.

I dont really see LA or SJ going anywhere. LA has v good young talent coming up on D plus Toffoli. SJ has Vlasic, Couture, Hertl and Pavelski all all ready to assume even more dominant positions. These guys are ready to be stars. LA's core is in their prime, Kopitar will probably still grow and SJ's core is still productive. Although they need an answer for Boyle. Still, no reason for these teams to regress.

[canucklehead44]

Sedin Sedin Jensen

Higgins Matthias Kesler

Burrows Santorelli Hansen

Booth Richardson Kassian

Only Santorelli "over performed" last year. Bounce back years from the Sedins, Hansen, Burrows should get us back into the playoffs. A better coach who roles four lines. Eddie Lack plays solid. I think we could be a third place team, and capable of upsets in the playoffs.

[canucklehead44]

Yes, Sedin, Sedin and Burrows were the worst first line in Canucks History. Paid 14 million plus 4, so 18 million combined for 112 points, as many as Bure used to score solo.

Put it this way, the Canucks could have bought Crosby for 12, and still have 6 million to spend on another player.

Henrik Sedin was the worst canuck number one forward in the history of the team, who played all season with the team. The only team that is even as close to being bad, still had Tony Tanti or Dan Quinn, Trevor Linden and Greg Adams. Even that year was not as bad as this year has been, and that was the worst the team has ever been.

This is what all the Sedin fans need to wake up and realize. It's over for them. They are done. They are now coach and GM killers with untradeable massive contracts that will doom this team to years of cellar dwelling unless they take a paycut or retire.

Torts had one of the top producing, most consistent lines in hockey and he turned them into scrubs. Lets hope the new coach doesn't crap the bed.

[DecimatedHD]

AV was most definitely a problem. Good coach but he lost our locker room. However, replacing him with a worse coach obviously didn't help

[manudibango]

Am I the only one how thinks if we have a healthy team we are a Cup contender?

yes , U are

[canucktican]

Henrik, Daniel, Kesler that's the only top 6 forwards we have right now. you can add Burrows to that list too. We need more!

[Sedintwinpowersactivate]

With the salary cap the parity in the league is amazing. If you are a team that spends to the cap than the only way you can set yourselves above the rest is for your best players to be your best players and for surprises with young players making big contributions.

For the Canucks this means Sedins are back to ppg players. Kesler and Burrows stay health and productive. And our young players take big steps! Kassian and Jensen in a top six role. Horvat, Gaunce, Fox or Shinkuruk making the team and contributing.

Defense staying healthy... Edler bouncing back, Corrado making the team and Tanev staying healthy.

Lack building off last season.

And hiring a coach that will get the most out of each player... like AV did!

A lot of what ifs!!!!! But, it's not like this team is full of 40 year players. The core still has a few good years left.... but they are ticking by.

[Ben Kenobi]

"Torts turned them into scrubs"

Look at the Sedin point totals for the shortened season in 2012-2013 and tell me how they extrapolate out to a full 82 game season. I was surprised, but offense as a whole went up under Torts from AV in 2012-2013.

It's not just this year, and it's not just the injuries this year. We need to be prepared for a world in which the Sedins are 50 point players at best, and produce roughly at .5 ppg apiece.

Everyone's assuming they bounce back, but what if they don't?

[DeNiro]

"Torts turned them into scrubs"

Look at the Sedin point totals for the shortened season in 2012-2013 and tell me how they extrapolate out to a full 82 game season. I was surprised, but offense as a whole went up under Torts from AV in 2012-2013.

It's not just this year, and it's not just the injuries this year. We need to be prepared for a world in which the Sedins are 50 point players at best, and produce roughly at .5 ppg apiece.

Everyone's assuming they bounce back, but what if they don't?

Henrik Sedin was on pace for 77 points in 2012-13. This season he was on pace for 59 points

Daniel Sedin was on pace for 70 points in 2012-13. This season he was on pace for 53 points.

This season the Canucks scored 196 goals. In 2012-2013 they were on pace for 217 goals.

In what way did offense go up under Torts?

I know you're upset that he was fired, but please don't talk out of your a$$.

[Ben Kenobi]

Edit. Points were there, but where was the scoring? Burr's 13 goals were an all-time Canuck low of 22 for the number one player of the team when extrapolated out to a full season.

That's not just bad - that's apocalyptically bad. As bad as this season was, Kes still had 25.

217 is not great for a full season, DeNiro. The problems didn't start with Torts. The problems won't go away now that he's gone, and the core players are a full year older.

Sure, maybe the Sedins bounce back. What if 4 months in, they don't? What then?

Gillis got fired because he wanted to reward the Sedins and Burrows for their prior excellent years. I can't fault Gillis for doing what everyone here is doing and trusting the players to come back and play well. The players hung him and Torts out to dry.

Hard to believe but this team at the start of this year was a lock for a playoff position. You can't blame Torts for the result at the end of the season and not give him credit for the first 4 months.

It's not that hard to figure out. It's the players. And until that changes, the Canucks problems will continue.

[CanucksSayEh]

A lotta things you can't blame Torts for. Not his fault Daniel shoots like a girl, not his fault Edler has been in free fall for years. Hank finally got injured enough to miss games. 3 of the biggest reasons we tanked. Aside from ignoring some glaring problems in the roster as well, but he who was at fault there has since been fired.

[6string]

If the Canucks just re-tool the roster rather than do a full rebuild, what is their ceiling? Re-tool means keeping the same core of Sedins, Kesler, Burrows, Bieksa, Edler, and Hamhuis, but add some pieces via free agency, trade, or farm player.

Personally, I believe the window has not completely shut for this group of guys and what happened last year was an anomaly. Due to hiring the wrong coach, the Luongo debacle, and injuries, the Canucks underachieved. The Sedins will bounce back and become 75 to 80 point players and Burrows should get around 40 points.

I'm also hoping Horvat and Shinkaruk can make the Canucks roster next season.

anamoly is an incorrect excuse, it was mike gillis that mis-managed a cup contender from 2011 to this, all the remaining teams from our great run continue to flourish: boston, pittsburgh, chicago, los angeles have sustained strong regular seasons and are legitimate threats in the playoffs.

[6string]

alls i can say is that the sedins replaced the express line as the number one unit, the sedins are in decline but still an asset as a second line, therein lies the problem how do we get a number one line assembled in short order before the sedins expiry date....

[asian player]

alls i can say is that the sedins replaced the express line as the number one unit, the sedins are in decline but still an asset as a second line, therein lies the problem how do we get a number one line assembled in short order before the sedins expiry date....

At this point, our only true potential first liner is shinkaruk and he has a big bust potential. We need to rebuild. One tank year to get a true 1c and we're back on the road