Nikita Tryamkin | D

[aliboy]

8 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Tree is not getting six per.  He’s going to get 1.5 to 2 million and a 3 year term.  

I'm expecting something in the $2.5-4 range.

[VegasCanuck]

22 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Tree is not getting six per.  He’s going to get 1.5 to 2 million and a 3 year term.  

That's what I'd like him to be at, my gut tells me that Benning really wants him here and that he's going to be around 2.75 - 3.25. I think that if its accurate that he's coming back, it probably spells the end of Stecher in Vancouver, as sorry as I will be to see him leave.

 

If we do add him, its going to make us a much harder team to play against.

[aGENT]

27 minutes ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 

That trickle down effect is definitely a positive, but there's no way it's worth 6 million per. 

A healthy and historically productive Tanev, an Edler with gas in the tank for playoffs and a potential Calder season from Hughes aren't worth it...? 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, VegasCanuck said:

That's what I'd like him to be at, my gut tells me that Benning really wants him here and that he's going to be around 2.75 - 3.25. I think that if its accurate that he's coming back, it probably spells the end of Stecher in Vancouver, as sorry as I will be to see him leave.

 

If we do add him, its going to make us a much harder team to play against.

Or do we keep Stecher and let Tanev go to free agency?  Could Stecher play Tanev’s minutes as well as Tanev if he had Hughes fir his partner?  

[VegasCanuck]

Just now, Alflives said:

Or do we keep Stecher and let Tanev go to free agency?  Could Stecher play Tanev’s minutes as well as Tanev if he had Hughes fir his partner?  

I think Benning wants the size upgrade on D too much. Stecher is a really good (undervalued) D, but I also wonder if he might be part of a package that Canucks would use to try and replace their 1st round pick this year. Who in the NHL has 20 - 30 range, extra 1st round pick who could use a good quality D as well as maybe another prospect?

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

I think Benning wants the size upgrade on D too much. Stecher is a really good (undervalued) D, but I also wonder if he might be part of a package that Canucks would use to try and replace their 1st round pick this year. Who in the NHL has 20 - 30 range, extra 1st round pick who could use a good quality D as well as maybe another prospect?

I like Stecher too, but wonder if his RFA status with a guaranteed increase in salary might limit his value? 

[VegasCanuck]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I like Stecher too, but wonder if his RFA status with a guaranteed increase in salary might limit his value? 

Its possible, but Stecher at 2.5 million, signed for 4 - 5 years, is a pretty good 4 - 6 D, who can skate, handle the puck well, is fairly tough and durable. All things being equal, I'd rather keep him and if necessary, offer him up with a 3rd rounder to Seattle next summer in the expansion draft. That might actually not be a bad idea and either waive or trade Benn for a later round pick to make room. 

[Hairy Kneel]

1 hour ago, Silent Man said:

Here you go:

February 9, 2020:

https://sport.rambler.ru/other/43648303-kto-iz-ogranichenno-svobodnyh-agentov-khl-mozhet-smenit-klub-v-mezhsezone-2020/

https://www.khl.ru/players/17594/

https://sport24.ru/news/hockey/2020-01-19-zashchitnik-avtomobilista-nikita-tryamkin-mozhet-vernutsya-v-nkhl

 

Here are couple quotes from the last link:

"Кажется, что «Ванкувер» судит о Трямкине по старой памяти и не до конца понимает, что он из себя представляет здесь и сейчас."

It seems that Vancouver is judging about Triamkin based on  old memories about him and don't understand how he looks right now.

This is direct quote (Nikita):

"Ванкувер — наркоманский город, что уж тут. Все курят траву повсеместно. Город весь в дыму. "

"Vancouver is the city of drug addicts. Everybody smokes pot everyvere. The whole city is in smoke"

 

So, I doubt that he will be back. Keep in mind that $1.5mil in Russia >$2.5 mil here.

And he can sign for 1.5 somewhere in Russia, imo

 

 

 

 

 

They can't afford the 3-5 a year he'd make here. Plus he's been taking a HUGE hometown discount.He doesn't want to play for a hometown rival. Avto needs forwards/goalie first,  and would lose too much cap trying to match NHL money to keep him. The pot thing is an old comment. Even Toronto smells like weed everywhere you walk, its too commonplace to be a factor. I think he'll sign a bridge deal around 3 to start and go up from there. 

[khay]

2 hours ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 

That trickle down effect is definitely a positive, but there's no way it's worth 6 million per. 

I assume you are referring to Myers. So how much is Myers worth? 5? If so, we overpaid by 1 mil to sign a UFA. 

 

No way he is worth under 5 as a UFA.

 

His salary of 6 mil may be too much in year 3 or 4 of his contract but right now, it's worth it. It's a quick fix but gives us stability in the backend immediately. He hasn't even been injured, in fact, our defence has stayed healthy for the most part. I think Myers has something to do with that of course among other factors.

 

[SilentSam]

2 hours ago, aGENT said:

A healthy and historically productive Tanev, an Edler with gas in the tank for playoffs and a potential Calder season from Hughes aren't worth it...? 

He has only played 50% of the games he could have in his full regulation seasons agent. 
If he was closer to a 70 game per season player I’d say keep him,  but historically we are not getting our full value from Tanev..

if you can resign him for 3 m per .. sure.

Buffalo- Carolina is where I would be shopping him

[theo5789]

6 minutes ago, SilentSam said:

He has only played 50% of the games he could have in his full regulation seasons agent. 
If he was closer to a 70 game per season player I’d say keep him,  but historically we are not getting our full value from Tanev..

if you can resign him for 3 m per .. sure.

Buffalo- Carolina is where I would be shopping him

He's talking about the ripple effect of adding Myers and how it has helped keep Tanev healthy this season (knock on wood). Hughes plays a part in it as well, but we have another top 4 dman that can eat up some of the minutes that Tanev may have had to take.

[Noble 6]

3 hours ago, aGENT said:

A healthy and historically productive Tanev, an Edler with gas in the tank for playoffs and a potential Calder season from Hughes aren't worth it...? 

 

Nope, not if that's all he brings.

 

If you're being paid 6 million per year (I believe it's a top 30 cap hit in league among defensemen), you better offer something individually. 

 

I think you're also overselling this point. Tanev's average TOI has dropped by 18 seconds from last year to this year, which is hardly noticeable. He's blocking shots at pretty much the same rate. Tanev has played 209:30 short handed this year while Myers has only played 98:04 (less than half) in the same amount of games. That works out to 3.36 short handed minutes per game for Tanev versus 1:41 for Myers. Tanev played 177:48 short handed last season in 55 games, which works out to 3.23 short handed minutes per game. So Tanev's average short handed time on ice per game dropped a whole 13 seconds with the addition of 6 million dollar man Myers. The one area where Tanev has had a considerable shift is in his zone starts (56.5% this year vs. 62.5% last year), but that is because he is playing with our best offensive defenseman in Hughes. 

 

The extra protection that Tanev is wearing this year is more responsible for his healthy than Myers. Myers has less penalty killing time this year than Benn despite playing 17 more games. Myers is 4th overall and the drop off to 5th (Stetcher) is substantial. 

Edited February 15, 2020 by Horvat is a Boss

[Noble 6]

1 hour ago, khay said:

I assume you are referring to Myers. So how much is Myers worth? 5? If so, we overpaid by 1 mil to sign a UFA. 

 

No way he is worth under 5 as a UFA.

 

His salary of 6 mil may be too much in year 3 or 4 of his contract but right now, it's worth it. It's a quick fix but gives us stability in the backend immediately. He hasn't even been injured, in fact, our defence has stayed healthy for the most part. I think Myers has something to do with that of course among other factors.

 

 

He definitely has something to do with it, but he's not the main reason at all. Please refer to my reply to @aGENT

 

If the main benefit a player brings is making his teammates lives easier, but he actually doesn't do that in a noticeable way, how good is that player? Furthermore, is he worth 6 million against the cap?

[khay]

31 minutes ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 

He definitely has something to do with it, but he's not the main reason at all. Please refer to my reply to @aGENT

 

If the main benefit a player brings is making his teammates lives easier, but he actually doesn't do that in a noticeable way, how good is that player? Furthermore, is he worth 6 million against the cap?

I don't know. He does other things decently well plus making his teammates' lives easier. 

 

6G 18 points, decent offensive production. Not the best defender on the team but I'd say he is 3rd or 4th best. Uses his long stick to his advantage. Not sure where he lacks so much as to not deserve 6M as a UFA signing. 3 years later you might be right but now? 

 

[khay]

39 minutes ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 

Nope, not if that's all he brings.

 

If you're being paid 6 million per year (I believe it's a top 30 cap hit in league among defensemen), you better offer something individually. 

 

I think you're also overselling this point. Tanev's average TOI has dropped by 18 seconds from last year to this year, which is hardly noticeable. He's blocking shots at pretty much the same rate. Tanev has played 209:30 short handed this year while Myers has only played 98:04 (less than half) in the same amount of games. That works out to 3.36 short handed minutes per game for Tanev versus 1:41 for Myers. Tanev played 177:48 short handed last season in 55 games, which works out to 3.23 short handed minutes per game. So Tanev's average short handed time on ice per game dropped a whole 13 seconds with the addition of 6 million dollar man Myers. The one area where Tanev has had a considerable shift is in his zone starts (56.5% this year vs. 62.5% last year), but that is because he is playing with our best offensive defenseman in Hughes. 

 

The extra protection that Tanev is wearing this year is more responsible for his healthy than Myers. Myers has less penalty killing time this year than Benn despite playing 17 more games. Myers is 4th overall and the drop off to 5th (Stetcher) is substantial. 

So your post shows that Myers filled the gap between our #1, #2 defenceman and our next best defenceman. 

 

Last season: Edler > Tanev >>>>>> Stecher > Hutton, Biega, MDZ.

 

This season: Edler, Hughes > Tanev >= Myers >> Stecher. 

 

In an ideal world, we want that gap to be filled by someone within the system at a lower cap hit. You are not wrong there: 6M #4D may not be desirable. But we didn't have an option but to sign a UFA. We already traded our 1st rounder for Miller and bleeding more asset to fill another gap? It may weaken the team significantly. UFA players, although costly, provide options to fill gaps in the roster without a loss of an asset.

 

I think at worst, Myers is a #4 defenceman, whom on UFA market goes for at least 5M. We may have overpaid by 1M at most so I think it's worth it.

 

As for providing protection for Tanev, I guess having Myers exposed Tanev less to highly stressful situations. For example, because we had no one reliable after Edler and Tanev, these two guys had to play in more stressful situations, 5-on-5 not to mention PK during the course of last season. This season, with Myers being a reliable option, Tanev and Edler can take a break after a PK on some of these high stress 5-on-5 plays.

 

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

1 hour ago, khay said:

So your post shows that Myers filled the gap between our #1, #2 defenceman and our next best defenceman. 

 

Last season: Edler > Tanev >>>>>> Stecher > Hutton, Biega, MDZ.

 

This season: Edler, Hughes > Tanev >= Myers >> Stecher. 

 

In an ideal world, we want that gap to be filled by someone within the system at a lower cap hit. You are not wrong there: 6M #4D may not be desirable. But we didn't have an option but to sign a UFA. We already traded our 1st rounder for Miller and bleeding more asset to fill another gap? It may weaken the team significantly. UFA players, although costly, provide options to fill gaps in the roster without a loss of an asset.

 

I think at worst, Myers is a #4 defenceman, whom on UFA market goes for at least 5M. We may have overpaid by 1M at most so I think it's worth it.

 

As for providing protection for Tanev, I guess having Myers exposed Tanev less to highly stressful situations. For example, because we had no one reliable after Edler and Tanev, these two guys had to play in more stressful situations, 5-on-5 not to mention PK during the course of last season. This season, with Myers being a reliable option, Tanev and Edler can take a break after a PK on some of these high stress 5-on-5 plays.

 

 

I totally agree with you.....I have the Hughes higher than Edler, but it is really a mute point

 

The addition of Hughes and Myers, basically improved our defense expedientially. It is still not a great defense, but it is an above average defense, and the addition of Tryamkin would add another element to it.

 

I wonder how Hughes, Edler, Tanev, Myers, Tryamkin, Stecher, Juolevi, Benn and possibly Rafferty all fit into this scenario

 

Stay tuned to another exciting episode of AS the turn stile turns...…………...Sure hope the Cap goes up!   

 

 

Edited February 15, 2020 by janisahockeynut

[The Lock]

I think there's simply just too much overthinking towards this. If he comes over, it means we have another potentially good body in front of the net. That's all it should be about, Then we can let him decide where he fits in the lineup through his play rather than just pigeon holing him into a spot behind x player and ahead of y player.

 

You guys crack me up sometimes with how much detail you bring in cases where there shouldn't be detail and I get it, you're passionate about it, but perhaps take a step back a bit?

Edited February 15, 2020 by The Lock

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 

Nope, not if that's all he brings.

 

If you're being paid 6 million per year (I believe it's a top 30 cap hit in league among defensemen), you better offer something individually. 

 

Who said that's all he brings?

 

How many of the guys paid less are RFA's/ELC's? Apples. Oranges.

 

1 hour ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 

The one area where Tanev has had a considerable shift is in his zone starts (56.5% this year vs. 62.5% last year), but that is because he is playing with our best offensive defenseman in Hughes. 

That difference is not small (nor is playing even a little less PK etc). Fact is he's another top 4 body to play 20'ish minutes a night so we're not asking Edler out Tanev to play more or harder situations.

 

As for your last sentence there, it's also because we have Myers to play some of those minutes and situations.

[Noble 6]

1 hour ago, khay said:

I don't know. He does other things decently well plus making his teammates' lives easier. 

 

6G 18 points, decent offensive production. Not the best defender on the team but I'd say he is 3rd or 4th best. Uses his long stick to his advantage. Not sure where he lacks so much as to not deserve 6M as a UFA signing. 3 years later you might be right but now? 

 

 

53 minutes ago, khay said:

So your post shows that Myers filled the gap between our #1, #2 defenceman and our next best defenceman. 

 

Last season: Edler > Tanev >>>>>> Stecher > Hutton, Biega, MDZ.

 

This season: Edler, Hughes > Tanev >= Myers >> Stecher. 

 

In an ideal world, we want that gap to be filled by someone within the system at a lower cap hit. You are not wrong there: 6M #4D may not be desirable. But we didn't have an option but to sign a UFA. We already traded our 1st rounder for Miller and bleeding more asset to fill another gap? It may weaken the team significantly. UFA players, although costly, provide options to fill gaps in the roster without a loss of an asset.

 

I think at worst, Myers is a #4 defenceman, whom on UFA market goes for at least 5M. We may have overpaid by 1M at most so I think it's worth it.

 

As for providing protection for Tanev, I guess having Myers exposed Tanev less to highly stressful situations. For example, because we had no one reliable after Edler and Tanev, these two guys had to play in more stressful situations, 5-on-5 not to mention PK during the course of last season. This season, with Myers being a reliable option, Tanev and Edler can take a break after a PK on some of these high stress 5-on-5 plays.

 

 

 

The first bolded part isn't exactly true and those numbers were only looking at short handed time. Edler, Tanev and Benn are Green's clear top 3 options on the penalty kill. Myers takes the odd shorthanded shift (likely when one of the other 3 aren't available and/or when Benn got scratched). A more accurate way to describe it would be:

 

Tanev > Edler >>> Benn >>>>>>>>Myers>>>>>>>>> everyone else

 

Remember, that's purely on the penalty kill and only measures minutes played. I believe Stetcher's shorthanded stats are actually impressive and similar to Tanev's, but he doesn't get the same deployment. Myers isn't relied on to make any tangible difference on the penalty kill. Tanev still plays the same amount shorthanded as he did last year. 

 

Regarding the second bolded part, Myers' cap hit looks like it might directly push Stetcher off the team. It will probably cost us assets to get comfortably under the cap next year considering we need to make room for bonuses as well. These are directly caused by cap mismanagement, which Myers' contract is an example of. He's not the only reason we are in cap trouble and it's not entirely his fault by any means, but he is a contributor. Myers has been a good addition to our defensive core, but at a cost that is too high when you consider the cap implications. 

 

I get what you're saying about paying a premium for UFAs, but there is no rule saying that you MUST sign UFAs. The option to simply stand pat is available and often underutilized. 

[Noble 6]

9 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Who said that's all he brings?

 

How many of the guys paid less are RFA's/ELC's? Apples. Oranges.

 

That difference is not small (nor is playing even a little less PK etc). Fact is he's another top 4 body to play 20'ish minutes a night so we're not asking Edler out Tanev to play more or harder situations.

 

As for your last sentence there, it's also because we have Myers to play some of those minutes and situations.

 

What does Myers bring besides a warm body?

 

He is not someone who Green uses a lot on the penalty kill. He does not play on the top powerplay unit. At even strength he starts in the offensive zone more than anyone except Hughes. 

 

How many defenseman who are currently on ELCs would get paid 6+ million if they had to renegotiate their contract right now? Less than 10%? 

 

Myers does not take away any tough situations from Edler or Tanev. As I said, Tanev is playing the same amount on the penalty kill this year as he was last year. He also has more defensive zone starts than Myers. Again, Tanev's average is time has gone down 18 seconds. Do you have any examples that counter this?