Before you bash the team, consider this.

[Dazzle]

Well, here's a classic 'after the game' thread, but it's not what you think it's going to say. It's more like a moment of clarity.

This is one of the most intense, high pressure markets in the game. Every move that you make on ice, every word that you say - everything is scrutinized. You're paid big bucks. You make much more per game than someone makes in a week, full-time.

But if you're like me, I bring a piece of my work home with me. I have my 'what if' moments... sometimes I even dream about it. Work creeps into your downtime sometimes. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's the same for professional hockey players.

Playing the game for fun and playing the game for a living is completely different. They try their best and it just doesn't work out sometimes. Who the hell would pass up the opportunity to score and be the hero? Why let your teammates down? Why would you intentionally make yourself look bad? It makes no sense. Nobody wants to be badmouthed.

I was so frustrated with this team today, particularly at Bieksa, then I took a moment in the shower and just chilled.

I look at the facial reactions of Burrows/ Bieksa - they're one of the most (openly) emotional guys on the team. Burrows broke his stick intentionally on his knee, like Kesler did during the playoffs, when he missed a chance to score. Bieksa looked like he hated himself after he dove helplessly to see Rousell (sp?) score into that empty net.

They're frustrating players to watch and they're not paid cheaply either, but that doesn't mean they don't want to win or care.

Even Daniel Sedin (softly) slammed his stick on the ice out of frustration during the Superskills Competition when he only had 2/4. This was a guy that was 4/4 in 2011 during the NHL All-stars Superskills competition and has always been good at this. I think his confidence is down.

Hansen is criminally underrated - and now I really saw it in this game. The dude works his tail off.

Sbisa has been much better than the start. Weber's been good as a depth defenceman. Remember Andrew Alberts? That guy really improved too.

Edler's been beastly - I was one of many that wanted him traded before his NTC kicked in.

There's many others that I didn't mention whose efforts are often overlooked. It's not that I don't appreciate it. I just can't list them all individually right now.

This team isn't close to perfect, but there is no such thing as that. Winning a game doesn't mean that your team is the best nor does it mean that you were 'the better' team. Losing a game doesn't mean it's all over. It just means it's opportunity to do better next time - or opportunity for roster changes.

It's one journey to go into the NHL. One wrong path and it could be a dead end, though if given time, you could be back on the right track. There's 82 games for a reason. There's going to be all sorts of surprises - ups and downs. The players know it. It's time that we consider that and watch the season unfold as it does, win or lose.

Just support the team as it is, until it is modified. Benning's a good GM but he likely has some very tough moves to make - and moves that he can't make. What's the point in bashing the team? If they try hard and lose, then it was meant to be. There will be new stories to come.

[GreyHatnDart]

Amen brother. While I would say I'm healthily critical of this team, I also have watched every game this season I was able to and cheered them on through the wins and losses.

It's easy to point fingers and say trade this player or that player sucks during a losing streak. But hell, it's my team. Rain or shine baby. Blue and green forever.

EDIT. Good luck with this thread though. 5th straight loss and you will likely get roasted over the coals for this thread unfortunately. Oh CDC.

[Master Mind]

I look at the facial reactions of Burrows/ Bieksa - they're one of the most (openly) emotional guys on the team. Burrows broke his stick intentionally on his knee, like Kesler did during the playoffs, when he missed a chance to score. Bieksa looked like he hated himself after he dove helplessly to see Rousell (sp?) score into that empty net.

They're frustrating players to watch and they're not paid cheaply either, but that doesn't mean they don't want to win or care.

Even Daniel Sedin (softly) slammed his stick on the ice out of frustration during the Superskills Competition when he only had 2/4. This was a guy that was 4/4 in 2011 during the NHL All-stars Superskills competition and has always been good at this. I think his confidence is down.

I think this part is especially important. When I see the frustration from the players, knowing how much they care, that makes me care about the team that much more.

The only time I'm frustrated with the team is when they don't try. That usually isn't the case. I'm not going to hate a player for playing poorly, if the team gives it their all, then that's what matters.

[Dazzle]

Amen brother. While I would say I'm healthily critical of this team, I also have watched every game this season I was able to and cheered them on through the wins and losses.

It's easy to point fingers and say trade this player or that player sucks during a losing streak. But hell, it's my team. Rain or shine baby. Blue and green forever.

EDIT. Good luck with this thread though. 5th straight loss and you will likely get roasted over the coals for this thread unfortunately. Oh CDC.

Haha, it's "only" the 5th straight loss. I'm sure patience will be lost one it's seven straight games - and something like a 0/40 PP.

I think it's way too easy for a regular person to pretend that they know the game more than these professionals. There's no accountability.

I've decided to support this team entirely, even with Bieksa being the 6th player for the other team

Actually, Bieksa tries damn hard and is probably too hard on himself, like Burrows, like Daniel, etc. People in those 'leadership' roles have it tough.

[GreyHatnDart]

Haha, it's "only" the 5th straight loss. I'm sure patience will be lost one it's seven straight games - and something like a 0/40 PP.

I think it's way too easy for a regular person to pretend that they know the game more than these professionals. There's no accountability.

I've decided to support this team entirely, even with Bieksa being the 6th player for the other team

Actually, Bieksa tries damn hard and is probably too hard on himself, like Burrows, like Daniel, etc. People in those 'leadership' roles have it tough.

Lol well every team faces adversity season by season. Let's pray this is the one time this season it happens and be glad it's early.

I agree. And as pineapples said up there, I'm not going to hate my team if the other is simply more skilled. I will however get frustrated when they aren't trying. I felt last season there was a lot of that because everyone was unhappy playing under Torts. That doesn't seem to be the case this season. Unhappy right now perhaps, but not overall.

While you'll have people saying "well they're pros, they get big money to tough it out and give it their all" well that's all well and good. It still comes down to the fact this is these guys' job, and 95% of people want to be GOOD at their job. And when things aren't going their way, it's frustrating and easy to lose confidence. I think that's where this team is at right now. I wasn't upset by our effort (2nd period aside) for the most part tonight.

Lack looked great and you just can't help but love the guy. Watched his post game just now and I believe Joey Kenward tried baiting him a bit into a goalie controversy conversation and Eddie dodged that bullet like Neo.

Regardless of the outcome, I'm absolutely pulling for this team to do well. If by deadline time we're struggling, and look like a bubble team however, I hope Benning makes some moves to build towards next season and beyond by seeing what our veterans fetch for trades.

[Phil_314]

Some people watch games expecting the team to remain dominant, when we're a team in transition.

Some people watch games and then play the blame game after every loss, when sometimes the scapegoat didn't even do anything wrong (that hate on Weber).

Some people watch games with a level head and know that there will be blips of brilliance and times where they fall off a cliff, but they know to only dish judgment as needed and won't run around like a chicken with its head cut off after every loss. Even good teams lose.

CDC, please choose Door #3.

#NotTheOilers #BeGrateful

[Tom Sestito]

I don't think anyone's criticizing the effort of the players within the organization. These guys all have worked hard to get where they are and still work hard to try and play at a high level.

But at the end of the day, this is a results orientated business.. like every other job that has money involved. People take time out of their day to watch the games, or pull money from their wallet to go see a team expecting to be entertained. Certain employees, they earn more than others. Some deserving, some not deserving of their contract. You have to perform based on what your salary is. I respect the hell out of these guys for what they do; same as I do for a policeman or any other blue collar or white collar worker. I think every person on this forum respects these guys.

There's a huge difference between adversity for us, and adversity for a champion. We've been trending down... while a team like LA with a young core has won two of the past three cups. It's hard to put faith in our franchise in times like this.. especially after the debacle last year once we got hit with adversity. A lot of people aren't fans of our draft choices, and I don't think people can blame them after what's happened with our drafting the last few years. While yes, you want to have faith in Benning.. his moves have been pretty iffy so far.

Everyone supports the team. We're all Canucks, there's no dispute in that - except for Caboose. But at the same time it's just not easy for a lot of people to be okay with.. average. For me, I admire those people who can be happy no matter what the outcome is.. but I'll never be able to understand it.

[Rey]

I personally don't care if they win or lose because it is what it is and it's entertainment. I'm a hockey fan first, and a canuck fans second but whats the point of having any sort of discussion if you can't criticize? this is the canuck's board afterall.

Lots of people act like they care but have no reason to cheer for the team, like a lot of things, it's just a thing to do. Put things in perspective and have realistic expectations. Being patriotic can give you bias opinions on everything which is bad because you will always be disappointed if they don't win.

To me, if you are angry about a sport then it's your fault for putting too much expectations into the team. The canucks losing shouldn't surprise anyone. They were what they were suppose to be - a bubble team. If you followed hockey, you would have known.

The same people who are angry for no reason are the same people who rioted a few years during the cup finals. Stop following a crowd, and think for yourself. Canucks winning the cup or not doesn't effect you.

[lmm]

you know after 40+ years of following these Loveable Losers I must use this cliché, "The more things change, the more they stay the same". I like the players and at times the management, but I never expect them to actually get it done. They have had their share of "good guys" like Trevor, Markus, and the HankyDanks they have had funny guys like Jarko, and Bieksa, and the ones that truly embody what it is to be a Canuck like Bootner, Mathias, Pyatt, Oreskovich, King, Karia, Bernier and O'bewan. guys that are loveable and will tease you with streaks for flash that give hope but you know in the long run will not keep it up or perform when the stakes are down. Right now the team is old and tired but they are capable of winning enough to keep us clear of the next "Generational talent" but not good enough to really fly with the big boys. So we wait and cheer the small victories and know no matter what it will happen again, we will get close again only to fall short and implode again. Then it starts over, hope eternal.

[2SKATES1STICK]

but bieksa is bad

[JeremyCuddles]

It'd nice if Bieksa wasn't terrible. He is to Vancouver what Edler was last year.

[Rey]

Bieksa has always been bad. Dude always had the best defensive studs in Mitchell and Hamhuis to save his ass. He's always a fan favorite because he is the only one that can fight. Don't even compare him with Edler. Edler broke into the league himself and proved himself as a legit player. A few years ago, he looked like a Norris candidate. The only thing changes is when Ehrhoff left and they wanted him to be a puck mover but he clearly isn't that. What's Bieksa's excuse for sucking his entire career? His career has been handed to him by Alain Vignault since they known each other in Manitoba.

Who cares if he's bad? This team is bad. Bieksa is the only one that fights. fans like fights. That has been the story his whole career and it's not going to change but once Hamhuis is back. Hamhuis will save his butt again, and nobody will notice anything. Then you can all go back to cheering for Bieksa....and his fights.

[lmm]

^^^^ Awesome

[JeremyCuddles]

Bieksa has always been bad. Dude always had the best defensive studs in Mitchell and Hamhuis to save his ass. He's always a fan favorite because he is the only one that can fight. Don't even compare him with Edler. Edler broke into the league himself and proved himself as a legit player. A few years ago, he looked like a Norris candidate. The only thing changes is when Ehrhoff left and they wanted him to be a puck mover but he clearly isn't that. What's Bieksa's excuse for sucking his entire career? His career has been handed to him by Alain Vignault since they known each other in Manitoba.

Who cares if he's bad? This team is bad. Bieksa is the only one that fights. fans like fights. That has been the story his whole career and it's not going to change but once Hamhuis is back. Hamhuis will save his butt again, and nobody will notice anything. Then you can all go back to cheering for Bieksa....and his fights.

So essentially Erhoff is to Edler what Mitchell and Hamhuis were to Bieksa? The ironing is delicious.

[alfstonker]

I agree with much of what the OP says, and I am not really expecting miracles this season. I always said I would judge the team in the New Year and if they have not bounced back by then no judging will be required.

I sense frustration, not only in the team but personally and on these boards. I recall a lot of games last year when we missed loads of chances every game. We started to see on here posts saying "every goalie chooses a Canucks game to stand on his head" What that really meant was we hadn't the skill to beat them. Last night was a glaring example.

I now suspect. We have too few chance takers in the team, I used to think it was illustrated in just how poor we were in shootouts.

We have grafters but some are being paid for more than graft and others are too inconsistent.

It is no coincidence that around this time the game starts to get more physical, coaches and players have begun to figure out the top lines and teams start to settle on their net minders.

Sadly I feel we are still not physical enough to do real damage in this league but I have confidence that JB is working hard on rectifying this situation, if not in time for this season certainly for next.

[JeremyCuddles]

As long as we don't have a 10 game losing streak this season I am happy.

[Neversummer]

Luongo says to Miller ... welcome to Vancouver's hockey market.

[Ghostsof1915]

I'm getting the same vibe from the team as last year. The team needs size and speed. When the fourth line of the other team is out skating the Sedins, or Bieksa. That's slow. Horvat and the way Edler has turned around his game has been good news.

We seem to have a lot of inconsistency in our players. I think Stanton, Tanev, and Edler, and Hamhuis are good. Bieksa should understand if he can't keep up with the speed, he should be using his size and playing like Willie Mitchell, and use positioning and clearing the crease. Stop trying to be a player that you're not. Weber has a great shot, and that's all. I'd rather see Corrado up here and have another calm stay at home d-man.

When we were winning all lines were scoring. Now the offence has dried up. Benning has patience, he also is scouting for bargains. Players that will be good and undervalued. I didn't even predict the team making the playoffs. I predicted they'd be working harder and in the games and lose by a goal or two. It's the blowout losses I think that are disturbing. But I still have faith in Benning and the coaching staff.

[nuck nit]

The Canucks are a massive corporation and it needs a high level of success in order for ownership to continuously invest to the max..

When players are overpaid and under performing they are monitored and then given notice.

If the player has been a great employee he may catch a break but at $40-$50k payment per game ownership and management have already compensated them and must manage their assets.

Some fans might choose to mindlessly cheer for professional sports teams but the players,coaches and managers all have to perform or their lavish lifestyle and dream gig is up.

Nobody cheers a losing team and to expect mediocrity and suffer happily is not even realistic.

r

[EdgarM]

I don't think we can say they are getting too old or its Bieksa or this or that. We have all seen they can get it done as how the season started. One of the main problems is "mental toughness" and has been around for years now. When things are not going well the situation "snowballs" and deteriates over time like last season. I know they tried hiring a team shrink years ago but I don't know what has become of that. There is a pattern that this team has shown and it has not improved over time.