What was with WD?

[TimberWolf]

Rookie coach, rookie management

Vet core

I wonder if the inmates run the asylum and it doesn't matter what WD says. Maybe we ship some of the core out and we can see what WD can do with a younger hungrier team

[PhillipBlunt]

H-E-'S A R-O-O-K-I-E!

[Qwags]

I think that Willie has learned many things this year, and that we should expect less mistakes next year. Don't know about the "too many men" calls though.

[Ghostsof1915]

I have always thought Willie would be a great assistant coach. I think he will be a good head coach, but the winners seem to have an edge or mean streak that Willie appears to lack. You look at Sutter, Quenville, Babcock they all have an extreme intensity about them at certain moments.

Willie was terrible with line matching and timeouts.

Didn't people say that about AV when he started?

[GreyHatnDart]

"And lets not forget that Willie has freely admitted that he didn't really want Bo at the beginning of the year. Who will he not want next year? I want a coach that is willing to give our youth opportunities, and yes that might means some failures but that's how they learn and grow."

@stormriders:

I for one didn't want Bo at the beginning of this season either. At the time I had said that he should stay in junior one more year and get some valuable time and memories playing in the WJC. Fortubately, I was wrong and Bo turned out to be one of the most exciting things this season.

WD showing loyalty to his vets in his very first season is appropriate IMO. Rookie coach in his very first gig comes in and starts kicking vets to the curb for an unproven commodity? Let's not forget Horvat didn't exactly set the world on fire in exhibition or his first handful of games. As the season progressed however, we all saw him emerge into what looks to be a player we can begin building around as we move forward.

Why is this? Hmm... Proper development, consistent linemates, and keeping little pressure on him to do too much? We should be thanking WD for his coaching of Bo this season, not flogging him for it.

WD was stubborn in some aspects, yes (no Vrb on line 1 towards the end was glaring to me), but continuing to use Bo in the manner he did isn't something I'd hang him for.

[Maniwaki Canuck]

I am critical of a lot of things WD did this year, but I do think in fairness, we have to acknowledge that he is subject to contradictory pressures: win now with this lineup vs. develop youth. Of course it's possible to do both, but with Benning's acquisitions of Miller and Vrbata, plus all the public statements about how the retool is supposed to take place in a winning environment, it's pretty clear that making the playoffs was a minimum expectation, and that using the vets was meant to be part of that effort.

[snucks]

Its no wonder the team blew game 6. The D is no good, the coach is a rookie, and much of the team is too old. As well they know the management is hand cuffed against making major changes by mistakes made by Gillis and Bening. The coach is not expecting much change next year. Eventually the team loses faith because management is just treading water. So players that should be traded, and have no trade clauses, just go through the motions finishing out their careers

[tyhee]

It wasn't speculation and happened. Was reported in the province . Why would it be hard to believe? Linden must have been pulling his hair out and wanted to slap Willie so it would make sense for Linden to go talk to Willie about it.

People are saying it was in the Province. I'm sorry to quote only one post, but would like to comment on the general idea of giving sources.

There are a lot of things said on CDC without a source. Opinions are fine-they can be argued without sources, though often the argument is weaker without some sort of reasoning with sources.

But with respect to something being relied on as fact (in this case, Sedins and Linden asked for more ice time for the twins) then when asked for a source the proper response is a url showing the fact relied on.

It is possible to prove it was reported just by giving the url. It is not possible to prove the negative, that it was not reported. I think the burden has to be on the one relying on something as fact.

To be more specific, I don't see a reason to believe as fact someting stated by anyone that when asked for a source, fails to give a specific source that can be checked.

[John316]

Well even Gillis said in general WD should have done things differently in the playoffs....oh well

[Duodenum]

Willie was a huge reason we lost the series.

Canucks wouldn't have won another series regardless though so it's difficult to be disappointed.

Let Willie work through his own coaching issues as this team isn't going to be a contender for a while.

[Standing_Tall#37]

Maybe I am being too hard on him but to me WD looked like the most rookie coach I have ever seen. Thoroughly out coached but it was easy as he made basic mistakes that anyone studying coaching could avoid.

1. Playing top players

- Sedins - it's obvious

Linden and Sedins asked for more time after game 3, how did WD respond, he played them the same amount until we were down by 2 in the last 5 min and then he played them 3 min straight at the end of the game- real smart!

That's right, forget match ups, forget putting them out against the 4th line and Derek eglland and Witherspoon or whatever (15s total against him in the first 4 games, although he didn't play much)

Puts them out at the end down by 2 when Calgary packs their end and it's harder to make plays, the other 3 players on the ice are nervous and Calgary is confident

Should have put them out more and earlier, after timeouts, icings, commercial breaks

2. Combos

Vrabata - why not double shift him once burrows is injured, double shift him a few times and get his minutes over 20, 21, he was their MVP in the regular season

Double shift him after timeouts and commercial breaks EARLY in the game not the last 5 min

Horvat- tied for team lead in points, yet he stays buried on the 4th line

No, do not put him on the second line between Bonino (who played LW in ANA and vrabat who WD insisted should be on the 2nd L)

3. Minutes

Horvat- too few

Bieksa, Sbisa- too little

Tanev, Edler- too few

Sedins, vrabata, too few total and together.

4.players Health

- perhaps the most egregious error

-played Miller when he said he wasnt close to healthy when he had Eddie who was arguably the better goalie this year when miller WAS 100%

I am just confused as to why he made such basic errors?

Perhaps someone who know more about hockey can tell me.

Agree with the first 3.... But correct me if I'm wrong, Eddy didnt have a single win until Miller got injured, miller was 28-15-1 before that and in the top 3 for wins behind Rinne & Price. I know people love Lack and when he's on his game he's good, but you have to go with your big gun if he's ready to go.

[coryberg]

But correct me if I'm wrong, Eddy didnt have a single win until Miller got injured

wrong.... he had 6 wins and 3 OT losses before the miller injury.

[redhdlois]

I dunno.....but I have a feeling Willie's got a stubborn streak in him.

Even though the Sedin x2 / Hansen experiment clearly wasn't working in the playoffs he stuck to it.

There needed to be a finisher on that line i.e. Vrbata........and it could have possibly given us a few more goals.

[babych]

People are saying it was in the Province. I'm sorry to quote only one post, but would like to comment on the general idea of giving sources.

There are a lot of things said on CDC without a source. Opinions are fine-they can be argued without sources, though often the argument is weaker without some sort of reasoning with sources.

But with respect to something being relied on as fact (in this case, Sedins and Linden asked for more ice time for the twins) then when asked for a source the proper response is a url showing the fact relied on.

It is possible to prove it was reported just by giving the url. It is not possible to prove the negative, that it was not reported. I think the burden has to be on the one relying on something as fact.

To be more specific, I don't see a reason to believe as fact someting stated by anyone that when asked for a source, fails to give a specific source that can be checked.

This is an excellent post - thanks tyhee.

Further - does anyone actually have any sources to verify that WD was told by Linden to play the Sedins more?

[Hunter.S-Kerouac]

Players outplayed, coach out-coached, fans out-fan'ed. That's why we lost.

perfect comment end thread would plus x10 if I could

[Standing_Tall#37]

wrong.... he had 6 wins and 3 OT losses before the miller injury.

Fair enough I couldn't remember just that I think he had a really rough start, so I felt bad for him.

[newgm]

H-E-'S A R-O-O-K-I-E!

There's no way Willy gets a pass for being a rookie coach. Once you eliminate the coin flip, damned if you do damned if you don't, arm chair quarterback criticisms, you're still left with 3 or 4 perplexing head scratchers for a coach facing elimination.

That short list of legitimate criticisms was obvious to the media who kept wondering out loud about his seemingly stubborn lack of adjusting and still do, and to the collective wisdom of the idiots on CDC.

If the idiots on CDC, most of whom have never coached a day in their lives can recognize obvious adjustments like loading up your number one line in the face of elimination with no tomorrow, how can a professional coach wait until it's too late to make such basic and obvious adjustments? How is being a first year NHL coach a legitimate excuse for lacking simple common sense, that's ridiculous and disturbing?

[PhillipBlunt]

Go and get a hobby and maybe that will stop you dreaming up stuff like this. It's a disgrace.

You admit you have a limited knowledge of hockey probably the same as 99% of us on here but you start a thread like that.

I get it, you're disappointed but don't lose your class.

By the way the other rookie coach Mike Johnston (coach of the Pens, with Malkin, Crosby, Downie, Fluery, Hornqvist, Comeau, Kunitz, Spalling, Sutter, Winnick and Lapierre ) went out in 5. Is he suspect as well?

Get a grip all you posters! Alfstonker (above quote) is the only one on this thread who makes sense! The rest of you would like to think you have a lot of coaching/gm/playing experience to come up with your ideas, but your lack of knowledge and inexperience is coming through loud and clear. Benning and his management team will make changes for the good of the playing team. I trust his judgement better than reading posts from armchair Coaches and couch potato GMs.

Take Alfstoner's advice, and get a hobby!

Get bent

[ice orca]

Disturbing thing to me was the ice time of the d-corps. Edler had less average ice time agains't the Flames than he did in the regular season and Tanev was even ice time. These guys are our best shutdown pair. Compare what Hartley did with his top 3 and you start to wonder. It's almost like the coaches underestimated the Flames and were trying to keep guys ice time low and fresh for the next round. Rookie coach got worked big time, hope he learns from this. I like Desjardins but he is going to have to adjust a lot of things for next year. Lets see what happens when some vets are moved and a couple of kids are in the lineup next year.

[ShakyWalton]

Given what he took over, Willie did a good job with the team in his first year, and hopefully will improve with this experience, BUT . . . . .

What worries me is his stubbornness [many have made this same point] plus his conservativeness. In my opinion, he does not like to take risks that he might be criticised for later if it does not work out. As an example, people say what a great job he did in managing and bring along Bo during the year. He did it by limiting his ice time and exposure. Even when Bo clearly demonstrated he could do much more, he did not get as much ice time as most people think he should have, nor did he get much powerplay time, [when others on the PP were clearly not producing]. Who Willie plays most is conservative players like Bonino and Higgins because they make less mistakes and can be counted on more, but look at their limited upside!

And lets not forget that Willie has freely admitted that he didn't really want Bo at the beginning of the year. Who will he not want next year? I want a coach that is willing to give our youth opportunities, and yes that might means some failures but that's how they learn and grow.

I listen to Bob Hartley after the series, [and I do not like him], but I loved what he said about how he handled the youth, and look at their success. He wasn't afraid to play them and have them make mistakes. Other teams play their youth and succeed but we in Canuckland seem to have this theory that you don't want to bring them along to soon, that they need to have this long drawn out development plan, ... and some do. But we need to give some of them a chance earlier and stop holding on so tight.

Even with Bo and the fantastic season he had, people on here want to bring him along slowly, maybe have him as the third line centre next year, and second the year after. The thing is he is already the second best centre and we should be giving him the opportunity to show it. And if he fails, scale it back, but give him the chance, and not for just a few games, I am talking about a real chance.

Can Willie be less stubborn and conservative and really get behind a youth movement, or will he remain so focussed on the short term end result to support his job as coach?

Good post...I agree with this 100%