bluesman60 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Building a powerhouse team in the cap era cannot be done in the same way as in the past. With the cap playing such a prominent part in teams makeup, it is difficult to hold on to players over the years (unless you overpay or offer NTC's and years)necessary to assemble all the necessary players and have them come together and peak at the same time. With that, I look at Calgary as an example of what did go wrong when they tried to retool on the fly with Iginla in the lineup. There were mini trades and signings as management tried desperately to assemble a winning team before Iginla declined further. They were not good enough to make a run and not bad enough to get the quality young guns that they boast in their lineup today. They took a giant leap of faith and let Iginla go as well as trading away other vets and designating themselves to being non contenders for the necessary draft years in order to draft high end talent. It was not too long ago that Vancouver fans were making fun of the lowly Lames as they were called. I am not talking about 5-6 years ago, I am talking about 3 years ago. Edmonton has done the same and drafted some gems....they are not that far removed from being a powerhouse team again, especially after they draft McDavid this year. They need to add depth to their defense, a sure fire goalie and they will be in the hunt. They have not had the same success as Calgary because it took them longer but they have enough high end talent to get those ingredients through trade. Vancouver fans are ecstatic at the way Horvat came in and played this year. We drafted him with the #10 pick....unless we are unbelievably lucky this year we won't be getting that type of player at #23. We might get a project who can be that type of player but he will need a few years in the AHL to develop. We have Virtanen at #6 who could very well make the team next year. This is the year when we should be trading vets for picks and stocking the cupboard. While the prospects are developing, fill in the roster spots with FAs' and get those picks 1-5 for a couple of years. At the very least, Vancouver should be packaging our 1st and a vet to move up to grab a sure thing versus a project. We have had a couple of trips to the final round with the Sedins' but that only happened because Vancouver was bad enough to get those picks. If we had drafted a couple of players at our usual 10th spot as we did for so many years, we would not in all likelihood have enjoyed the success that we all enjoyed. I have been a fan of the Canucks since day 1 so we are talking about 40 plus years of waiting for a Cup. The times have changed and Vancouver has to adapt to the reality that you are hard pressed to sip from the Cup unless you can get a Crosby, Gaudreau, Hall, McDavid, Webber or S Jones or two. All the whining about us needing a Webber or Doughty on the blueline won't happen with #23 picks. There is a longshot chance that we could get lucky and out think the other 29 teams scouting and GMs and draft a superstar in the 2nd or third round but that is not something that should even be part of a plan to build a winner. If we were in the position to draft McDavid right now, do you think Vancouver fans would be more excited about that or would they rather be looking forward to getting a 1st round playoff next year? Based upon all our 1st round exits the last few years, I would bet on it being drafting McDavid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Goose Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Corey Perry drafted 28th Ryan Getzlaf 19th Just gotta draft smart and/or lucky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocksterh8 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 I absolutely agree with your thoughts, but the fans do not own or run the Canucks organization. The owner wants to make money on his investment, and the only way to do that is to have a competitive team every year or the arena will be empty and the Owner will not make his money. It may be a sport, but it is definitely driven by the dollars. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam126 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Yeah, let's tank and set a bad example for the young guys so they could do the same thing! Great Idea! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithers joe Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 bottle it...you'll have 30 teams paying good money for your can't lose plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Someone JUST posted a running thread about the 1st overall picks from 1986 to now. The shocking and most telling thing about it is how many teams recieved numerous 1st overall picks and never won a thing vs how many teams had 1 single pick and only won A cup vs how many will never win a cup in their lifetime. Drafting top 5 helps. NO question. But again, the time to tank is in the off season. Buffalo is prime example of why tanking doesn't always work out. And we still have far to competitive a team to lose unless our D sharts the bed something fierce which is entirely possible ala the 2013 Bolts who drafted #3 because their D was so god awful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48MPHSlapShot Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Holy wall of text, Batman! Also, Benning and Linden have stated they won't tank. End of thread/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoneypuckOverlord Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 how is using the 1st pick drafting gems? Please respond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman60 Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 Sure the owners would have to bite the bullet for a couple of seasons but I seriously doubt that the building would be empty in the Vancouver hockey crazed city. If you draft just one player with the talent of Pavel Bure, you would be hard pressed to find game day tickets. Or put another way, if we didn't make the playoffs this year and were fortunate enough to be drafting McDavid, do you really think the fans would stay away? One thing for sure, another couple of 1st round exits and the fans just might become disinterested. Playing just to make the playoffs is not a winning environment, it is just treading water to get the gate. If Edmonton gets the players to fill out their talented team and Calgary continues to shine you might be hard pressed to even make the playoffs especially when you can almost guarantee that LA will be back next year. If you wait too long, your vets will walk as UFAs or retire and then you are back on 1st base looking to steal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman60 Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 Yup Calgary sure tainted their young guys by tanking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman60 Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 There is only a two year window before the Sedins' contracts are up. If you don't have players of that calibre by then, you won't have to worry about calling it tanking. Throw in the fact that Bieksa and/or Hamhuis, Burrows and Higgins will probably have moved on by then, you better count on your #23 picks being ready. That is not wishful thinking, that is reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckylager Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 I repeat: Tanking is for losers. How do you build a winning team? Good scouting, coaching (AHL and NHL coaches) and a whole pile of luck (kinda goes back to good scouting and player development). A few real good trades and UFA's help a bunch too (luck). Draft order is a crap shoot. Stop it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman60 Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 Not sure what your question is MoneypuckOverLord? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman60 Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 LuckyLager, look up Mario Lemieux, Crosby and now McDavid. Are you telling me that Pittsburgh didn't build a winning team through tanking? Are you trying to tell me that Vancouver has a better chance at winning the Cup than Edmonton over the next 4 years? Are you trying to tell me that tanking has hurt Calgary's chances of winning a Cup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuongo Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 LuckyLager, look up Mario Lemieux, Crosby and now McDavid. Are you telling me that Pittsburgh didn't build a winning team through tanking? Are you trying to tell me that Vancouver has a better chance at winning the Cup than Edmonton over the next 4 years? Are you trying to tell me that tanking has hurt Calgary's chances of winning a Cup? Go cheers for pitts or edm then. We don't need losers like you supporting this team. Tanking = Losing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48MPHSlapShot Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 I shall reiterate. Tank isn't happening. That' a fact. Deal with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman60 Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 I don't need your advice on who I should cheer for and have probably been a Canuck fan when you were still in diapers. Just because I have a different view than you doesn't make me any less of a fan either. This isn't a rah rah site, it is a discussion board where posters throw out different ideas and thoughts. Tanking does not =losing. Pittsburgh tanking = SC and last time I looked, we lost to that losing team Calgary. Thanks for your useless input anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48MPHSlapShot Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 ^ Whatever your opinion is, it doesn't change the fact that Benning won't tank. End thread/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riviera82 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Go cheers for pitts or edm then. We don't need losers like you supporting this team. Tanking = Losing. Losing in the first round of the playoffs or just missing out every year = losing as well. A couple of high picks would at least provide some excitement and hope for the future. As it stands right now, it appears all we'll have to look forward to next year is the same old same old, a team competitive enough for the regular season but no threat whatsoever in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckylager Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 LuckyLager, look up Mario Lemieux, Crosby and now McDavid. Are you telling me that Pittsburgh didn't build a winning team through tanking? Are you trying to tell me that Vancouver has a better chance at winning the Cup than Edmonton over the next 4 years? Are you trying to tell me that tanking has hurt Calgary's chances of winning a Cup?Chicago never truly tanked, they just stunk for a while, same for LA. Boston, Detroit, Carolina, Tampa, Jersey and Colorado (well the Nord's were brutal, and I'm pretty sure they never "tanked") all won cups without being tank ass losers to get there. Sure, use Crapsburg as an example of tanking, however, they tanked by default for Crosby in a lockout year, if they tanked it was for Malkin.. 2nd overall. OV went first, how'd that tank work for Washington? (If memory serves, I could be wrong and I'll check if I care enough) CALGARY? ARE YOU KIDDING ME!? We have just as much of a shot at the cup in the next decade as Cowtown, please, Calgary... That argument sucks. Same with your Edmonton has a better shot crap. Ed's got no defence, no goaltentending, no grit, nothing but picks. Tanking is for losers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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