Longtime Fan Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 1 hour ago, kingofsurrey said: Canucks were never a playoff team this year... That was only Canuck corporate spin to keep tickets moving. CDC fans vastly overate our team and our prospects. It has been an eye opener for many on here to see our players clearing waivers with no interest. Our prospects are also mid to late first rounders , that mostly project to be 2nd line forwards. We need to address our talent moving forward and make so big moves if we want to compete. Agree completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugor Hill Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 In a way we have already began selling when we traded for Etem and waived Higgins. I can't help but notice even though Higgins hadn't done much on the score board this year, we have been losing since we waived Higgins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shazzam Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 1 minute ago, Longtime Fan said: Sorry Captain Marvel, but if all we could get for Eddy Lack was a 3rd Round pick why would get a 1st round pick for Dan Hamhuis. I would suggest a 3rd or 4th would be all we would get. I would keep him. Vrbata - IMO the best we get a 5th Round or lower pick. His goal production has fallen way off and his + - is awful. Perhaps you don't understand the market for defenseman at the trade deadline. He will be highly sought after if we made him available. Why would Eddie Lack's trade have anything to do with Hamhius? Even in a down year Vrbata is still very capable of putting the puck in the back of the net. If he had any years left on his contract, there would be a problem moving him but he is a pending UFA. A second rounder should be the baseline but that is determined by the market, not us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 1 minute ago, Hugor Hill said: In a way we have already began selling when we traded for Etem and waived Higgins. I can't help but notice even though Higgins hadn't done much on the score board this year, we have been losing since we waived Higgins. Well the youth shouldn't be relied on winning you games. Not yet at least. Topple inexperience with stale vets then you got a bad mix. Higgins wasn't doing anything. Him being waived is not the reason we are losing. Higgins and multiple other veterans disappointing play is the reason we are losing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longtime Fan Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 4 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said: Hamhuis is more valuable than Lack. A lot more. Teams looked at Lack as a backup goalie. Teams look at Hamhuis as a top 4 D. Top 4 D are not a dime a dozen. Maybe, maybe not. But if Hamhuis is a top 4 D-Man then keep him. IMO we are weak on D. and need a guy like Hamhuis. Do not trade a proven asset, as you have said he is, for a prospect. Not a good idea, IMO Hamhuis should be able to give the Canucks another 2 years before his time is up. Most teams will not trade a 1st Round pick unless they are way down the Draft or have a 2nd 1st Round pick. It is always a risk / reward scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 Just now, Longtime Fan said: Maybe, maybe not. But if Hamhuis is a top 4 D-Man then keep him. IMO we are weak on D. and need a guy like Hamhuis. Do not trade a proven asset, as you have said he is, for a prospect. Not a good idea, IMO Hamhuis should be able to give the Canucks another 2 years before his time is up. Most teams will not trade a 1st Round pick unless they are way down the Draft or have a 2nd 1st Round pick. It is always a risk / reward scenario. Think Long term Longtime. I think Hamhuis can net a 1st. Timonen got two 2nds as a 40 year old defenseman who was injured. Sekera got a 1st and a decent prospect. Bieksa got a 2nd and we both know Hamhuis is better than Bieksa. If Hamhuis is able to get us a solid return that could help us in the long term then we should move him. Teams will be willing to make a trade if other teams in their division/conference are also improving or are interested in the same player as well. We just have to wait and see how things unfold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longtime Fan Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 12 minutes ago, shazzam said: Perhaps you don't understand the market for defenseman at the trade deadline. He will be highly sought after if we made him available. Why would Eddie Lack's trade have anything to do with Hamhius? Even in a down year Vrbata is still very capable of putting the puck in the back of the net. If he had any years left on his contract, there would be a problem moving him but he is a pending UFA. A second rounder should be the baseline but that is determined by the market, not us. Perhaps I do understand, very well, the market for defencemen at the trade deadline or at any other time. I would be very surprised if they traded Hamhuis as what they would get back would be less than you think they would get. Vrbata, forget it, his market value has taken plummeted this year and IMO he is not worth very much anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 2 minutes ago, Longtime Fan said: Perhaps I do understand, very well, the market for defencemen at the trade deadline or at any other time. I would be very surprised if they traded Hamhuis as what they would get back would be less than you think they would get. Vrbata, forget it, his market value has taken plummeted this year and IMO he is not worth very much anymore. You undervalue defenseman during the deadline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longtime Fan Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 3 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said: Think Long term Longtime. I think Hamhuis can net a 1st. Timonen got two 2nds as a 40 year old defenseman who was injured. Sekera got a 1st and a decent prospect. Bieksa got a 2nd and we both know Hamhuis is better than Bieksa. If Hamhuis is able to get us a solid return that could help us in the long term then we should move him. Teams will be willing to make a trade if other teams in their division/conference are also improving or are interested in the same player as well. We just have to wait and see how things unfold. Well in 3 weeks + 1 day we will know, for sure, where all this will play out. I still say that trading a top 4-D man as you have described Hamhuis, for who knows what - is a gamble. Not only that he wants to say and would play for less money on say a 2 year deal thereby freeing up Cap space. It is something of a "bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush" scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 2 hours ago, aliboy said: If we go to Markstrom right now we still have a shot, with Miller we do not. I say this is the only real issue. And we can still trade Vrbata, Miller and Hammer at the deadline and we will still have a shot. JUST PLAY MARKSTROM!!!!!! No, no.. sit the guy & be patient. Allow the fruit to ripen on the branch. Make RM earn his overpayment by mopping up this mess(head janitor). Work with Marky to ensure perfection, & give him favourable starts for confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 Just now, Longtime Fan said: Well in 3 weeks + 1 day we will know, for sure, where all this will play out. I still say that trading a top 4-D man as you have described Hamhuis, for who knows what - is a gamble. Not only that he wants to say and would play for less money on say a 2 year deal thereby freeing up Cap space. It is something of a "bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush" scenario. Who knows. He could pull a Vermette and re-sign with us during the off-season after being traded. We need to think about the future not the short term and Hamhuis won't be here in the future but only the short term. Getting a player and/or a pick that could potentially be with us for 5+ years is better than 1-2 more years of good hockey from Hamhuis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugor Hill Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 I just remember that a 1st from Washington is gonna be like a 2nd. We getting get a first for Hamhuis then. Or better yet, Bowey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86Viking Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 to the OP, pretty harsh on Etem for a guy who scored the only goal for the team last night. He is fast, similar to hansen in speed. He is newly acquired and wasn't brought in to be a top 6 scoring forward with an immediate impact, looks at his resume this isnt a bonafide top 6 or top 9 player. I think he has done a pretty good job overall since coming here, and for what we gave up can we really complain? Lets see how be progresses the rest of the way and what he can do next year. If you want to be hard on a player, why not mention baertschi and horvats winger, Vrbata what has he done to contribute to that line let alone remain a top 6 forward with 1st unit pp time? His time is up here and benning should try to jump the gun on the trades and move him first and try to get something decent for him. This team is retooling, so in comes the youth, we hope they can contribute and score, but its not fair to put that pressure on a pair of 19 yr olds or a recently acquired Etem. Give this team time, I love the speed and youth, last night seeing Ferland again made me wish we had a similar type player that had no problem going and hitting other teams top players. But we are moving out vets not in the way of a returning asset as of yet, but we have 2 vets who hold decent value in hamhuis and vrbata. Unless hammer doesnt waive Benning needs to move these assets to replenish the prospect pool even more. He can have a pass keeping middling players thru last deadline, we were in a playoff spot also. but this year I think he has to move them for assets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 One alternative I don't like to envision, is having promoted almost all the youth, to watch it all spiral down in flames like a kamikaze zero. It's better we've held back some youngins'; & let's emphasize the further progress of a fledgling farm system, that's actually becoming a 'decent' place to demote skaters to, if necc. How attractive would it all look to the Boesers/Demkos if we rushed youth into the show, then ripped/slagged them on CDC, cos' they sunk, not swam dammitall!! We NEED patience at this juncture. Some 'life-shortcuts' will bring ya to the East end, byGawd! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6string Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 If the Canucks go on a run and suddenly the playoffs are in sight, this discussion and others like it disappear. I want the kids to be exposed to important and meaningfull games for as long as possible, so I will not write them off or discourage them to think it is not possible to make post season. The teams just ahead of us are not that better they are more of equal value. We have a nice blend for now and in time changes will occur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chon derry Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 47 minutes ago, Hugor Hill said: I just remember that a 1st from Washington is gonna be like a 2nd. We getting get a first for Hamhuis then. Or better yet, Bowey. learn to spell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashNBash Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 They are competitive enough now to make the games close, fans will still come. They haven't gone on any streaks either way. The special teams are the problem this year. Goaltending is not an issue. The kids are improving and gaining experience and the team is basically playing shinny every night, I think it's to stay away from injuries. So after all that obvious blather, I think they are exactly where management wants them to be. Moving out the baggage one piece at a time, Hamhuis and Vrbata will definitely be gone, possibly Miller as well, who knows who else. They will have room for the needed pieces Benning wants, size, toughness, a top line scorer, a top defenseman and a higher draft pick. The future looks bright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, CrashNBash said: They are competitive enough now to make the games close, fans will still come. They haven't gone on any streaks either way. The special teams are the problem this year. Goaltending is not an issue. The kids are improving and gaining experience and the team is basically playing shinny every night, I think it's to stay away from injuries. So after all that obvious blather, I think they are exactly where management wants them to be. Moving out the baggage one piece at a time, Hamhuis and Vrbata will definitely be gone, possibly Miller as well, who knows who else. They will have room for the needed pieces Benning wants, size, toughness, a top line scorer, a top defenseman and a higher draft pick. The future looks bright. Those are the things he wants, but he thinks he can get those elite pieces later on the rounds at the draft. He may not move any pieces, because of his one flaw - arrogance. Which is tragic for the organization, because they will be destined to mediocracy- just as those drafted in the middle of the rounds can be predicted to play: mediocre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 22 minutes ago, Alflives said: Those are the things he wants, but he thinks he can get those elite pieces later on the rounds at the draft. He may not move any pieces, because of his one flaw - arrogance. Which is tragic for the organization, because they will be destined to mediocracy- just as those drafted in the middle of the rounds can be predicted to play: mediocre. Hey Alfy..is "mediocracy" the place where meritocracy meets mediocrity? & is that precisely where they built 'The garage'(or whatever it's dubbed today)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, Nuxfanabroad said: Hey Alfy..is "mediocracy" the place where meritocracy meets mediocrity? & is that precisely where they built 'The garage'(or whatever it's dubbed today)? That's very astute. Im thinking we use the Greek origin for theses terms and we get atrocity. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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