DonLever

Donald J. Trump, 45th US President of the United States

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2 hours ago, CBH1926 said:

One would think that Mexicans would be more supportive of their Central American neighbors.

But just like with everything in life, most people only care about themselves.

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/mexicans-support-migrant-caravan-drops-sharply-poll-finds-n940246

 

Some of them are certainly seeking the economic benefits of the United States. It is a little more than simply applying for asylum in some cases which many could have clearly done so in Mexico several weeks ago. They're not winning over any minds by trying to break their way in or assault the border personnel either. 

 

 

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12 hours ago, Tortorella's Rant said:

Interesting that there's this wall like obstacle down along the border that is literally assisting the border agents in keeping people from illegally entering the United States. 

Apparently we have to build a new one though that spans thousands of miles..

but that is not a "big beautiful wall"

usa needs a big beautiful wall

to symbolize their move to nationalism

to isolate them in their greatness

and to keep the non whites out

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10 hours ago, Chicken. said:

Yep.... unless I'm mistaken Mexico is a part of the same international convention that states asylum claims must be heard.... and asylum shall be claimed in the first safe country reached by those fleeing violence in their home countries. 

 

Isn't Mexico a safe place to live ?  

 

TBH the US is pretty dangerous itself with all the shootings

that is a very good point

so how is it that any claimant who comes from south of mexico

can claim refugee status in the usa?

unless mexico refuses to process such claims

and tells them to go back home or continue north ?

 

there must be some good information online about this

just not up to doing this search tonight

maybe tomorrow

unless someone else feels ambitious

 

edit:  a very quick search showed me an amnesty international release

that basically states that mexico does not allow these people to seek asylum in mexico

and they are in fact told to turn around and go back home if confronted

and so most (not in caravans) appear to simply pass north through mexico quietly to reach the usa

 

p.s. it is actually much more complicated then set out in my edit above

 

an article from time has more information

http://time.com/5431447/donald-trump-threat-turn-back-caravan-migrants-not-legal/

 

 

 

Edited by coastal.view

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1 hour ago, Curmudgeon said:

There is much to unpack in your statement. The first thing is that you generalize by referring to "Mexicans". You seem to assume that there is one prototypical Mexican, but this is no more true for Mexico than it is for Canada, where we all realize that there are dozens of cultural threads running through Canadian society. This is also the case for Mexico, where there is everything from the highly educated, highly creative and highly intelligent, to the poorest, illiterate campesino whose first priority in life is to grow enough to feed his family, and everything in between. There are modern sophisticates, typical consumers driven by pop culture, and those whose lives are still essentially tribal, with all the traditions and beliefs that go with them. 

 

In Chiapas and Oaxaca, Mexico's two least wealthy states, the economy is mostly agrarian, and life is pretty straightforward, intertwined with the weather, the seasons and the harvests. And this is not an easy life, since it requires a willingness to engage in physically taxing field work of a type that American farmers claim is lacking in American workers. They stick close to home and are sometimes wary of strangers, sometimes because there is such a fine line between living well and simply living that any additional people are perceived as a threat to the delicate balance that is the life of a campesino. Your damned right they aren't particularly supportive of their Central American neighbours; those neighbours represent competition for scarce resources.

 

And you just now figured that out?

I think you are assuming too much, Mexican, American, Canadian etc. refer to country of origin.

There is no stereotypical Mexican, in my line of work I have worked with thousands of people from Mexico.

 

Jalisco, Pueblo, Durango, SLP, DF, Chiapas, Guanajuato, Michoacán, Sinaloa etc.

They look different, sound different, have different  background etc. just like any group of people.

 

Besides the article, my Mexican friends have been complaining about the Central Americans.

Since my Spanish is pretty good, I am able to watch Spanish speaking channels.

I just find it strange since they share a lot with those same people, including immigration struggles.

 

Just as I found strange that lot of my foreign workers and friends  have voted for Trump.

Why would someone as a foreigner vote for the man that is stoking anti immigrant feelings?

Finally to answer your last question, no I figured that out decades ago.

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Tortorella's Rant said:

Some of them are certainly seeking the economic benefits of the United States. It is a little more than simply applying for asylum in some cases which many could have clearly done so in Mexico several weeks ago. They're not winning over any minds by trying to break their way in or assault the border personnel either. 

 

 

Once you start throwing rocks, you can expect rubber bullets and tear gas in return.

 

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6 hours ago, bishopshodan said:

EDIT: Come to think of it...

Probably not nice to try to figure out who people are in their real lives. I retract my conspiracy !

I've shared enough with Mr Chicken. ;)

 

I read your original post was replying then had something really important come up and had to shut my phone off.

 

From the docos I saw these bots just want people to be distracted,arguing amongst themselves about issues that are not about the countries they originate from.

CC and bone spurs fit the bill.

 

I know I have stated this many times before under my other user names however imagine if we all worked together on the real problems that beset our species.

 

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4 hours ago, CBH1926 said:

 

But just like with everything in life, most people only care about themselves.

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/mexicans-support-migrant-caravan-drops-sharply-poll-finds-n940246

 

Not all of us.

Some of us have realised our bodies are designed to help our fellow human beings and when one does that sets of the dopamine and makes you feel good.

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51 minutes ago, CBH1926 said:

Once you start throwing rocks, you can expect rubber bullets and tear gas in return.

 

Human beings can rationalise the most terrible things.

After reading the book Germans into Nazis by  Peter Fritzsche your statement reminds me of how Hitler convinced tens of millions of Germans to do nothing while he exterminated 6 million people.

 

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7 hours ago, Ilunga said:

Human beings can rationalise the most terrible things.

After reading the book Germans into Nazis by  Peter Fritzsche your statement reminds me of how Hitler convinced tens of millions of Germans to do nothing while he exterminated 6 million people.

Speaking of rationalizing:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/newspolitics/trump-suggests-without-evidence-that-some-tear-gassed-migrants-were-‘grabbers’-who-took-others’-children/ar-BBQ8AGz?li=AAggNb9

Quote

 

“We’ve just said, look, if they come over here, we’re going to apprehend them and we’re going to close the border,” Trump said Monday night. “That’s not really been done to the extent that I’m doing because I mean it, and I’ll close it for a long time.”

Earlier Monday, Trump denied that women and children were among those affected by the tear gas. But in his remarks to reporters here, he shifted his response, first claiming that the tear gas was “very safe,” then blaming migrants with children for being in harm’s way and finally questioning whether the children were theirs at all.

“I say, why are they there?” Trump said. “First of all, the tear gas is a very minor form of the tear gas itself. It’s very safe. The ones that were suffering to a certain extent were the people that were putting it out there but it’s very safe.”

He asked why parents were “running up into an area where they know the tear gas is forming.”

“In some cases, you know, they’re not the parents,” Trump claimed. “These are people, they call ‘em ‘grabbers.’ They grab a child because they think they’ll have a certain status by having a child. You know, you have certain advantages in terms of our crazy laws that frankly Congress should be changing.”

 

Luckily for the migrants, Border Patrol was using the "safe" tear gas, instead of the "unsafe" kind....<_<

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1 hour ago, RUPERTKBD said:

“In some cases, you know, they’re not the parents,” Trump claimed. “These are people, they call ‘em ‘grabbers.’

The sweet, sweet irony of that comment.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/08/us/donald-trump-tape-transcript.html

 

Quote

Grab ’em by the p****. You can do anything

 

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8 hours ago, Ilunga said:

Human beings can rationalise the most terrible things.

After reading the book Germans into Nazis by  Peter Fritzsche your statement reminds me of how Hitler convinced tens of millions of Germans to do nothing while he exterminated 6 million people.

 

Having lost 9 family members to those same nazis, your statment reminds me of willful ignorance and lack of empathy. Comparing group of people attempting to cross the border illegally with murder of 6 million people is stupid to say the least.

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13 minutes ago, CBH1926 said:

Having lost 9 family members to those same nazis, your statment reminds me of willful ignorance and lack of empathy. Comparing group of people attempting to cross the border illegally with murder of 6 million people is stupid to say the least.

One could also your statement is ignorant and lacking of empathy regarding the plight of the people that make-up the caravans. 

 

https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/central-americas-violent-northern-triangle

 

Ilunga has always been an empathetic poster from what I've read. He's just bringing something he read into discussion. The crimes of the Nazi regimen is not something to be hidden away and not talked about because of how terrible they were. It's something to learn from. 

 

Edit: Sorry for your loss

Edited by Duodenum
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On 11/26/2018 at 4:27 AM, Alflives said:

Fire his arse into Space! Do you think The 

Donald drinks scothch? Minbet he drinks coolers.mm :lol:

not that there’s anything wrong with that, of course.

Oh you hoity toity scotch drinkers. Good ole fashion rye for me!

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On 11/26/2018 at 2:05 AM, Ilunga said:

I maybe wrong but I sense that from this post and the link in your reply to Rupert you are not really interested in hearing any evidence that CC is actually happening or if it is human beings actions are the major contributor to it.

If I am wrong there are plenty of studies available that are easily found online.

There is also the evidence of increasing extreme weather events,record temperatures being set.

I have seen the weather model on my farm change in 50 years,1 third less rain, longer,hotter and dryer summers. 

 

I just thought maybe you read some of them and could answer the question. No question the earth must be warming. We have been for hundreds of years I think.

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On 11/25/2018 at 8:24 PM, RUPERTKBD said:

TBH, I don't remember for sure. I think it was this thread, but I've gotten into CC "debates" in several threads over the years.

 

A lot of the details fade over time, but when someone tries to make the argument that NASA and NOAA scientists would falsify data in order to maintain funding, it tend to stick in your memory.

I hope that there is enough CO2 up there to hold off another mini ice age during this sun spot slow down.

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If there was any doubt about Faux News being nothing but right-wing propaganda, this story should dispel it:

 

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fox-and-friends-fed-interview-script-to-trumps-epa-chief-emails-show
 

Quote

Former Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Scott Pruitt was clearly taken aback last year when occasional Fox & Friends fill-in host Ed Henry grilled him about a number of ethical scandals facing his administration.

And Pruitt had a good reason to be surprised. In past interviews with President Trump’s favorite cable-news show, the then-EPA chief’s team chose the topics for interviews, and knew the questions in advance.

In one instance, according to emails revealed in a Freedom of Information Act request submitted by the Sierra Club and reviewed by The Daily Beast, Pruitt’s team even approved part of the show’s script.

Fox & Friends has long been a friendly venue for Trump and his allies, but the emails demonstrate how the show has pushed standard cable-news practices to the extreme in order to make interviews a comfortable, non-confrontational experience for favored government officials.

 

I can't help thinking about the outrage from the Right over Donna Brazile leaking information to the Dems ahead of a CNN Town Hall. Faux does this stuff as a matter of course, but zero outrage from the "Nationalist" cabal....

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I remember watching a CNN segment a few months ago, where they had Alan Dershowitz on as a guest. The moderator made some comment about AD being a Republican/Trump supporter, which had Dershowitz bristling. He claimed to be impartial and took umbrage at the suggestion that he was anything otherwise.

 

Then today, I read this story on Faux News:

 

http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/11/27/alan-dershowitz-advises-trump-legal-team-write-rebuttal-robert-mueller-report
 

Quote

Alan Dershowitz said President Trump and his legal team have to be ready when Special Counsel Robert Mueller releases his findings in the Russia probe, because the American public should not be presented with a "one-sided report."

Dershowitz, a Harvard Law professor emeritus, explained that Mueller -- who's investigating Russian election meddling and possible collusion between the Trump campaign and Moscow -- is not going to produce a "neutral" report.

"He's not going to be fair. He's going to produce what he believes is going to be a devastating attack," Dershowitz said. "They're going to put together every bit of evidence and present a mosaic which points to the White House, the Oval Office, the president."

He said that's why he has suggested the president's legal team demand that when Mueller's report is released, they are able to simultaneously release their own report.

 

The report hasn't even been released yet, but Dershowitz is already calling it "unfair". Sounds totally unbiased....:rolleyes:

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1 hour ago, RUPERTKBD said:

I remember watching a CNN segment a few months ago, where they had Alan Dershowitz on as a guest. The moderator made some comment about AD being a Republican/Trump supporter, which had Dershowitz bristling. He claimed to be impartial and took umbrage at the suggestion that he was anything otherwise.

 

Then today, I read this story on Faux News:

 

http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/11/27/alan-dershowitz-advises-trump-legal-team-write-rebuttal-robert-mueller-report
 

The report hasn't even been released yet, but Dershowitz is already calling it "unfair". Sounds totally unbiased....:rolleyes:

 

man

Alan Dershowitz

lay off the orange kool-aid a bit

you are beginning to look a little silly

Edited by coastal.view

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No wonder the orange one has a bedrock of support.  His followers don't get the news.  And they blame everyone (UNIONS) but TRUMP!! and his tariffs.

 

 

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fox-news-goes-4-12-hours-in-primetime-without-once-mentioning-gm-layoffs

Fox News Goes 4 1/2 Hours in Primetime Without Once Mentioning GM Layoffs

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8 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

No wonder the orange one has a bedrock of support.  His followers don't get the news.  And they blame everyone (UNIONS) but TRUMP!! and his tariffs.

 

 

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fox-news-goes-4-12-hours-in-primetime-without-once-mentioning-gm-layoffs

Fox News Goes 4 1/2 Hours in Primetime Without Once Mentioning GM Layoffs

Their "news" is certainly targeted. I swear I have seen a story about a hunter who bagged a 16 pointer on their front page....

 

Case in point: Where everyone else today is talking about Manafort, Tear Gas and the GM closures, Faux has a run-in between Jim Acosta and Sarah Sanders as their top story, along with the fact that some people are criticizing Melania's choice of Christmas decorations at the WH...:rolleyes:

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