Ghostsof1915 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Should there be a red flag, when Matthews was 10th in scoring in the Swiss League. And the legendary Josh Holden (Yes that Josh Holden, 12th overall in 1996 by the Canucks) got 2 more points? Considering Crawford gave the kid a ton of ice time as well. (Admittedly Auston played less games and got way more goals) If Matthews is an elite forward, shouldn't he have won the league in scoring or top 5? I know it's his first pro season, and he's going to be very, very good. I just get this RNH vibe about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 52 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: The only comparable Laine has to ovi is his shot, he's not very fast and has slow foot speed, He also doesn't hit that often, although he is hard to knock off the puck. Ovi's is the opposite, fast, shot, and lays big hits. Ovi is not a comparable to Laine. Laine has the better shot (comparable to ovi's wrister) but that's about it. Matthews also has a shot (comparable to sakic's wrister) Matthews has speed, Matthews has size, Matthews has the IQ, Matthews has compete, Matthews has a 2 way game. Matthews is a center. Matthews is by far the better player. But every year people try to make this debate.. Same thing happened with Eichel and Mcdavid, Ekblad and the Sam's. It's only cause is to create more hype for the draft, but when the 1st team goes up to the podium we all know which player is going to be selected first overall. Laine certainly looked fast to me and he plays with a definite edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwissCanucks Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Matthews was very good during the regular season in the Swiss League. But he disappeard during the playoff. That is my only concern with Matthews: I'm afraid he is a flashy guy, who can't raise his level of play during the playoff when physicality raises. On the other hand, Laine is amazing during his playoff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jägermeister Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 I feel like Matthews is a much smarter more well rounded player than Laine, however the tools Laine has could make him more effective as a scorer in the league. I'd still take Matthews, but would not be at all surprised if Laine outscores him during their primes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 1 hour ago, kloubek said: No kidding? Ok, well I stand corrected. I assumed virtually everyone would be on the Matthews bandwagon, considering: 1) He is the #1 consensus across virtually ALL "experts" to be drafted first overall. 2) He is a center, which someone already mentioned makes him more valuable than a winger. Cmen often have more valuable, but laine absolutely dominated the world juniors and now the finnish league playoffs......as a 17 year old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Just now, SwissCanucks said: Matthews was very good during the regular season in the Swiss League. but he disappeard during the playoff. That is my only concern with Matthews: I'm afraid he is a flashy guy, who can't raise his level of play during the playoff when physicality raises. On the other hand, Laine is amazing durin his playoff. he wasn't anything special in the world juniors either, despite his stat line. You knew every single time laine was on the ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJDDawg Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 3 minutes ago, Jägermeister said: I feel like Matthews is a much smarter more well rounded player than Laine, however the tools Laine has could make him more effective as a scorer in the league. I'd still take Matthews, but would not be at all surprised if Laine outscores him during their primes. I wouldn't be surprised either, but the way I look at it, Captain Serious gets outscored by a lot of players in this league, and he'd be on many peoples short list of players to draft when starting a franchise. I wouldn't get hung up on goals in this draft, Matthews offers much more than goals, but still scored a bushel of them in a men's league as an 18-year old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Just barely Mathews for me. But if ARZ wins say 2nd and we win 1st... I'd GLADLY do Strome + Laine + say their NYR 1st for Mathews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me_ Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Matthews over Laine no contest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono2009 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 4 hours ago, AriGold said: Personally I'm a bigger fan of Laine over Matthews. I see Matthews being more of a Dustin Brown and Laine being more of a Teemu Selanne. ewww dustin brown!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Someone on CDC (sorry, can't recall who), mentioned the other day of the possibility that Matthews could decide to stay in Europe to continue playing in the Swiss league, and the Canucks or whichever team gets 1st could lose him (given a 2nd rounder as compensation). Is this even a possibility? Does his character resemble Horvat or Kesler? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyhee Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said: Someone on CDC (sorry, can't recall who), mentioned the other day of the possibility that Matthews could decide to stay in Europe to continue playing in the Swiss league, and the Canucks or whichever team gets 1st could lose him (given a 2nd rounder as compensation). Is this even a possibility? Does his character resemble Horvat or Kesler? 1. It is a theoretical possibility that he could stay in Europe. It would cost him a fair bit of money in the long run as he'd start his elc later. Effectively, he'd be trading later RFA years in the NHL for the salary he'd make in Europe. It's extremely unlikely. 2. I don't see what character has to do with whether he'd choose to stay in Europe. Unless and until Matthews signs with an NHL team he's under no obligation to any NHL team. He's not avoiding any duty to anyone if he chooses to play outside the NHL. The Kesler situation with the Canucks was different in that Kesler was under contract to play for the Canucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 2 hours ago, stawns said: Laine certainly looked fast to me and he plays with a definite edge. From one or two highlight videos. Every scouting report on laine is he's not a very good skater but is improving on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 2 hours ago, stawns said: he wasn't anything special in the world juniors either, despite his stat line. You knew every single time laine was on the ice. Did you watch USA. Every time he was on the ice people were ogling over every play he made. He was two points off laine who apparently was an allstar? In the u18 he dominated it with 15 points in 7 games. In playoffs he was the best player on the ice and being counted on in a league filled with ex NHL talent and created a ton of scoring chances. We we get it you like laine. But trying to make up things, to put Matthews down Isn't a help to the debate. 30 NHL GM wouldn't even second guess who they'd pick if they had the first overall selection. And that exactly where the debate stops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khay Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 4 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said: Should there be a red flag, when Matthews was 10th in scoring in the Swiss League. And the legendary Josh Holden (Yes that Josh Holden, 12th overall in 1996 by the Canucks) got 2 more points? Considering Crawford gave the kid a ton of ice time as well. (Admittedly Auston played less games and got way more goals) If Matthews is an elite forward, shouldn't he have won the league in scoring or top 5? I know it's his first pro season, and he's going to be very, very good. I just get this RNH vibe about him. I think RNH is still a player with #1 center potential. Obviously not top 5 center in the legue but he can still hit 80-90 pts and could very well have reached that level if he was in a different organization. The injuries that RNH went through early on in his career definitely set him back from reaching his maximum potential I think. Anyhow, if Matthews has same level of potential as RNH, then I'd say that is actually not too bad. I think his ceiling is a bit higher than RNH though. And if you put Josh Holden in the OHL, he will probably get 150 points. Does that mean we should put red flag on Marner, Tkachuk, and etc? Holden is probably playing at or near his max capabilities whereas Matthews is playing near the bottom of his max capabilities. I wouldn't put red flag on Matthews if that is your concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 7 hours ago, Caknuckle Puck said: Who would you choose? personally I like Laine more does anyone else have Laine above Matthews? maybe I'm being stupid but lets have a poll! who would you rather have? Where's the poll? "Hey guys, who wants to play Yahtzee?" *forgets to bring dice* "Hey guys, poker?" *no cards* "Just rented Die Hard and Robocop, what do you guys want to watch first?" *no DVD player* "Do you want beer or wine?" *only has tap water* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 I WAS leaning towards Laine(love the clips I've seen of this kid), but this thread got me thinking about the question(again!). IF Laine's speed isn't up to snuff..well that's important. Would he always be slow? Does he show potential to greatly improve there(scouts must know)? *** 2 more issues*** -Are either of these two REALLY enthused to pull on a Van jersey? Who knows..one of them may have been a big fan for whatever reason. That kinda' positive vibe goes a long way, in keeping a star on a team(for career). -Lastly..on FREE AGENCY. It appears much easier to acquire a key FA winger, as opposed to C. I'd guess all 30 GM's are prone to prioritzing locking up their C's before free agency.. Will that trend continue? For example, this yr you might land Oks or Lucic..so maybe tying down that elusive 1st line C is a must, if possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 4 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said: Should there be a red flag, when Matthews was 10th in scoring in the Swiss League. And the legendary Josh Holden (Yes that Josh Holden, 12th overall in 1996 by the Canucks) got 2 more points? Considering Crawford gave the kid a ton of ice time as well. (Admittedly Auston played less games and got way more goals) If Matthews is an elite forward, shouldn't he have won the league in scoring or top 5? I know it's his first pro season, and he's going to be very, very good. I just get this RNH vibe about him. A red flag? What about the fins who didn't even make the top 30 in points and Gagnon was 5th in points and he wasn't even a ppg in the ahl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crackers Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 3 hours ago, J.R. said: Just barely Mathews for me. But if ARZ wins say 2nd and we win 1st... I'd GLADLY do Strome + Laine + say their NYR 1st for Mathews If Benning could pull off that trade it would be the most lopsided of the decade! I'm pretty sure if the Canucks had the 1st and Coyotes had the 2nd, we wouldn't get anything close to that much from them. Us approaching them shows we have no interest in picking Matthews, meaning they would have all the leverage in negotiations. That trade would probably be something like the 1st pick to ARI for the 2nd pick and a B prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 16 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: A red flag? What about the fins who didn't even make the top 30 in points and Gagnon was 5th in points and he wasn't even a ppg in the ahl. I did qualify it by saying it was his first year as a pro. And he was playing against adults. I'm just saying if he was this game-changing talent, wouldn't he have done better? He also disappeared in the playoffs as well. Putting the hopes of the franchise on the kids shoulders might be a bit much. Considering we have the Sedin's who have been the cornerstone of the franchise and people still complain about them. Just temper the expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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