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StealthNuck

Bo Horvat | #53 | C

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Just now, Cowichan Canuck said:

Beartschi and Etem/Virtanen, I think we sign two FA wingers.

 

Sedin-Sedin-FA(Eriksson/Okposo)

FA(Lucic)-Sutter-Hansen

Baertschi-Horvat-Etem/Virtanen

Guance-Granlund-Virtanen/Etem

With our D and goalies, that's a playoff team you just posted.  You realize that means no high pick next season?

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3 minutes ago, Cowichan Canuck said:

Next year isn't worth "tanking" for anyways...supposedly a fairly weak draft.

Who can quantify what playing playoff style hockey down the stretch and missing out by one spot does for the development of 23 players vs finishing last and actually getting 1st pick and what that player can do to development of the team. 

 

Tanking should only even be a consideration if there is the perfect storm of: a pretty barren cupboard, bad luck, suspensions and close to league high lost games to injury.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Salacious Crumb said:

Who can quantify what playing playoff style hockey down the stretch and missing out by one spot does for the development of 23 players vs finishing last and actually getting 1st pick and what that player can do to development of the team. 

 

Tanking should only even be a consideration if there is the perfect storm of: a pretty barren cupboard, bad luck, suspensions and close to league high lost games to injury.

 

 

Yup, this year was the perfect year to tank.  Those other loser teams were just too good for us:(

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14 hours ago, Alflives said:

With our D and goalies, that's a playoff team you just posted.  You realize that means no high pick next season?

We are going to either make the playoffs, or be close, regardless.  If we're not going to get a high pick, then we might as well assemble the best team possible.

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2 minutes ago, kloubek said:

We are going to either make the playoffs, or be close, regardless.  If we're not going to get a high pick, then we might as well assemble the best team possible.

I'm happy with a good team too, but not at the expense of a proper rebuild.  The players contributing need to be the younger guys, and not old free agents.  Look at the Sharks.  Will they even be in the playoffs next season?  

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39 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I'm happy with a good team too, but not at the expense of a proper rebuild.  The players contributing need to be the younger guys, and not old free agents.  Look at the Sharks.  Will they even be in the playoffs next season?  

I suppose it depends on what you mean by a "proper rebuild".  If you mean that we put players in roles above where they should be just to give them experience, then you're totally right.... getting UFAs would reduce this.  I don't think that's the best way to develop a player though, or you destroy confidence if they don't produce under the pressure.

If you mean that you're dropping a young guy to a lesser role than he can *properly* handle, then I would agree with you.  But I don't think we really run a risk of this, since we're talking about UFAs who play in roles that our young guys just are not skilled enough to handle.  Assuming we draft a prospect who legitimately has top line talent, and Boeser turns out to be a home run, THEN we have players who, after they are ready, would be deserving of a top six role.  But that won't likely be for another year or two *minimum*, and by that point the Sedins will be at the end of their contract... either retiring, or taking on a lesser role for a short, final contract with us.

I think the only current example on our team of a player who maybe should be playing a bigger role than he is (or likely will be) is, in fact, Horvat.  I think he is ready for a second line center role, but I believe Benning did impede Horvat's ability to be properly placed with the addition of Sutter.  (Which is why I was puzzled by that trade in the first place).  With Sutter's contract being until 20/21, I really have no idea what the plan is there; boost Horvat all the way up to the first line, even if he doesn't turn out to be good enough to justify it?  Was puzzled then and I'm still puzzled now.  It is almost as if Sutter will *have* to be put on the wing to effectively place him into our lineup.

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Horvat is getting the Hodgson treatment for the first half this year, some shelter and softer minutes to polish his game. 

 

Sutter allows for this, as he can take the harder minutes. This was likely the plan last year, until Sutter went down. Horvat did well with the circumstances. Vrbrata did not help at all. 

 

Looking forward to this year.  

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1 hour ago, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said:

Horvat is getting the Hodgson treatment for the first half this year, some shelter and softer minutes to polish his game. 

 

Sutter allows for this, as he can take the harder minutes. This was likely the plan last year, until Sutter went down. Horvat did well with the circumstances. Vrbrata did not help at all. 

 

Looking forward to this year.  

Or the Bonino role in Pitsburgh?B)  But Bo won't have Kessel and Haglund on his wings.

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2 hours ago, kloubek said:

I suppose it depends on what you mean by a "proper rebuild".  If you mean that we put players in roles above where they should be just to give them experience, then you're totally right.... getting UFAs would reduce this.  I don't think that's the best way to develop a player though, or you destroy confidence if they don't produce under the pressure.

If you mean that you're dropping a young guy to a lesser role than he can *properly* handle, then I would agree with you.  But I don't think we really run a risk of this, since we're talking about UFAs who play in roles that our young guys just are not skilled enough to handle.  Assuming we draft a prospect who legitimately has top line talent, and Boeser turns out to be a home run, THEN we have players who, after they are ready, would be deserving of a top six role.  But that won't likely be for another year or two *minimum*, and by that point the Sedins will be at the end of their contract... either retiring, or taking on a lesser role for a short, final contract with us.

I think the only current example on our team of a player who maybe should be playing a bigger role than he is (or likely will be) is, in fact, Horvat.  I think he is ready for a second line center role, but I believe Benning did impede Horvat's ability to be properly placed with the addition of Sutter.  (Which is why I was puzzled by that trade in the first place).  With Sutter's contract being until 20/21, I really have no idea what the plan is there; boost Horvat all the way up to the first line, even if he doesn't turn out to be good enough to justify it?  Was puzzled then and I'm still puzzled now.  It is almost as if Sutter will *have* to be put on the wing to effectively place him into our lineup.

Pretty sure JB will trade Bo for a real good 2 way winger.:ph34r:

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He better not.  Horvat is our only young player who is pretty much a lock for a top six role and might even progress to a top 3 role going forward.  On our left wing we have Baertschi (likely a 2nd line LW), and will likely be drafting a top 6.  On the right side we have possibilities with Virtanen and Boeser.  Once Henrik is gone, we're badly going to need someone to replace him in a center position, and Sutter isn't a guy who will ever be able to do that.

 

The ONLY way I'd accept Horvat getting traded is if we were to somehow manage to land Stamkos.  I'd still prefer to have Horvat as the 2nd line center, but Sutter can man that position in a pinch.

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6 minutes ago, kloubek said:

He better not.  Horvat is our only young player who is pretty much a lock for a top six role and might even progress to a top 3 role going forward.  On our left wing we have Baertschi (likely a 2nd line LW), and will likely be drafting a top 6.  On the right side we have possibilities with Virtanen and Boeser.  Once Henrik is gone, we're badly going to need someone to replace him in a center position, and Sutter isn't a guy who will ever be able to do that.

 

The ONLY way I'd accept Horvat getting traded is if we were to somehow manage to land Stamkos.  I'd still prefer to have Horvat as the 2nd line center, but Sutter can man that position in a pinch.

Bo is a top six forward, and so are virtanen and Boeser.  Baer, on a good team, is not on the team.  So we really only have three current top six forwards in our system.  We need a center, with that I agree.  If we sign Stamkos (not a chance) he would be one more.  Lucic (more likely) is one, but only for a couple to three seasons.  We really need to hit a home run with this draft, and come out with an elite number one center - Logan Brown and Bo Horvat would be a nice one two punch.

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17 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Bo is a top six forward, and so are virtanen and Boeser.  Baer, on a good team, is not on the team.  So we really only have three current top six forwards in our system.  We need a center, with that I agree.  If we sign Stamkos (not a chance) he would be one more.  Lucic (more likely) is one, but only for a couple to three seasons.  We really need to hit a home run with this draft, and come out with an elite number one center - Logan Brown and Bo Horvat would be a nice one two punch.

Alf, your man-crush on Brown and Lucic is as strong as CHYCHRUNS' is for his player. Lol

 

I don't see draft day going as planned for either of you.

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5 minutes ago, Salacious Crumb said:

Alf, your man-crush on Brown and Lucic is as strong as CHYCHRUNS' is for his player. Lol

 

I don't see draft day going as planned for either of you.

Considering I'm a puppet, I'm kind of getting a liking for your little avatar.  Is it part cat?  Wanna come for dinner? :ph34r:

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^^ 

 

Agreed with crumb. No offence Alf.

 

Back  to Bo.  Awesome, don't ever trade him.  I see Shane Doan like abilities in Bo, maybe better as Bo plays center;)

 

That type of leadership and playing ability is going to be all important for this club. He is the type if player that you want to retire in a canucks jersey.  

 

Edited by Eastcoast meets Westcoast
Positive vibes. Don't wan to bring any negative waves.

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55 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Bo is a top six forward, and so are virtanen and Boeser.  Baer, on a good team, is not on the team.  So we really only have three current top six forwards in our system.  We need a center, with that I agree.  If we sign Stamkos (not a chance) he would be one more.  Lucic (more likely) is one, but only for a couple to three seasons.  We really need to hit a home run with this draft, and come out with an elite number one center - Logan Brown and Bo Horvat would be a nice one two punch.

I think you are making big assumptions on our players.  Horvat, sure.... he's a minimum 2nd line center.  Virtanen is so far unproven, and flashes of what we expect from him isn't enough to define his career.  Boeser looks great, but he hasn't faced NHL competition.  There are plenty of players who looked great at lower levels, and couldn't translate that success into the NHL.  Baertschi has potential, but as of last season was not ready for a 2nd line role.  I have no idea what he will turn into, but I'm expecting (hoping?) he's going to be good enough to warrant a full-time 2nd line position.  Otherwise, we are even weaker than I thought on the left side.


Unless we traded down for a great return, I don't see us getting anyone other than MT or Dubois in this draft.  I see you are an advocate of Logan Brown, which is understandable given his size, but to me he is a noticeably bigger question mark to be a top 6 player than the LW I expect we are going to end up picking.

Edited by kloubek

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38 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Considering I'm a puppet, I'm kind of getting a liking for your little avatar.  Is it part cat?  Wanna come for dinner? :ph34r:

Salacious Crumb was a Kowakian monkey-lizard. If you are serving cat he'd probably be down with that!

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28 minutes ago, Salacious Crumb said:

Salacious Crumb was a Kowakian monkey-lizard. If you are serving cat he'd probably be down with that!

Kowakian monkey-lizard is close enough to cat for me.  Come on over and I'll serve you up. B)

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On 6/9/2016 at 8:15 AM, kloubek said:

I suppose it depends on what you mean by a "proper rebuild". 

Like "asset management", the ones who use the term most often are the ones who base it on nothing but opinion.

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