thrago Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 I personally like Guddy. Is he the complete package he was once hoped to be? No but he certainly has NHL skills and attributes that are valuable in the NHL. He is entering his prime on a contract that I think is very fair for both sides. I hope he has a speedy and complete recovery. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 4 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said: That length of time sounds like labrum (or other side) surgery which will be a few months of imobility followed by increasing stretching etc. He can cardio away etc and nowadays the fixed shoulder is often as strong or stronger than prior dependent on nature of cumulative damage. 37 minutes ago, SilentSam said: Not a Dr myself, but have been close to an injury my adult nephew sustained playing hockey.. played through the injury too long,. Had 4 bad labrum tears on his shoulder.. The Doc/Surgeon showed me the the before and after pictures the same hour after the surgery. Went from barley anything holding it together,. To a tight, well knitted artwork of real tendon and synthetic. Was told he would make a full recovery and be able to return to hockey in 6 months.. Was not allowed to do anything for 5weeks while initial healing allowed blood flow to do its wonders. Started Re-Hab on 6th week.. 5 months later was shoulder dumbbell pressing 4x10’s with 90lbs in each hand. Said his surgically repaired shoulder was tighter and stronger than his untouched shoulder. Returned to hockey in fantastic shape. Have a great recovery Eric! Maybe get that big Rusky 88 over to train with you through this, this Summer! Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.DirtyDangles Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said: That length of time sounds like labrum (or other side) surgery which will be a few months of imobility followed by increasing stretching etc. He can cardio away etc and nowadays the fixed shoulder is often as strong or stronger than prior dependent on nature of cumulative damage. yeah nope : ) Once you tear or rip tendons the scar tissue makes it stronger but some range of motion is lost. IF you damage the surrounding cartilage/soft tissue especially if it is a re injury in the same area getting back to 100% is extremely rare. Still some guys are tough as nails and can play through alot of issues. Edited March 15, 2018 by Mr.DirtyDangles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, Mr.DirtyDangles said: yeah nope : ) Once you tear or rip tendons the scar tissue makes it stronger but some range of motion is lost. IF you damage the surrounding cartilage/soft tissue especially if it is a re injury in the same area getting back to 100% is extremely rare. Still some guys are tough as nails and can play through alot of issues. Depends on what it is. I know a lot of people with non-displaced shoulder issues who think they are better after surgery than they ever felt at any point in life. Never with knees. Never with wrists. Sometimes with elbows (TJ) but often with shoulders. At least in people I have worked with and/or spoken to. I think one other poster had some anecdote about a family member in this regard. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.DirtyDangles Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 39 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: Depends on what it is. I know a lot of people with non-displaced shoulder issues who think they are better after surgery than they ever felt at any point in life. Never with knees. Never with wrists. Sometimes with elbows (TJ) but often with shoulders. At least in people I have worked with and/or spoken to. I think one other poster had some anecdote about a family member in this regard. For sure there have been many advancements in surgery for these types of injuries. I have a buddy who had his shoulder totally rebuilt and he is definitely better off now and relatively back to the same strength. He swears his grip strength has increased but thinks this is a direct result from the physical therapy and new exercises that he never did before. Either way I think you are right in the fact that there really shouldn't be a worry in terms of Guddys abilities once he is cleared to play. Doctors and procedures are getting better by the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Mr.DirtyDangles said: yeah nope : ) Once you tear or rip tendons the scar tissue makes it stronger but some range of motion is lost. IF you damage the surrounding cartilage/soft tissue especially if it is a re injury in the same area getting back to 100% is extremely rare. Still some guys are tough as nails and can play through alot of issues. ... he only needs 5-6 good years out of it. ... it’s the “freedom 35” plan he’s on, not the freedom 55. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crabcakes Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 I haven't gone more than 2 pages back in the thread so forgive me if this has been said. The Canucks knew that Guddy was injured in November and tried to rehab the injury. A number of months later, it was clear that rehab wasn't going to do the trick and that surgery was going to be necessary. The team and Guddy has decided that now is the time for surgery so that Guddy will be fully recovered in time for training camp next season. Why sign him knowing that he is damaged goods? 1. The alternative is not good. Expiring RFA contract. Or, trade an injured player and get a really poor return. 2. Signing him was the best alternative because they got less term and less cap hit than they would have got otherwise. Remember, Guddy reportedly refused a better contract with Florida 2 years ago (the figures reported are not reliable though) The bottom line is that Benning still wants the type of player that Gudbranson is. He hasn't been fully healthy for most of his time in Vancouver but they know what the prognosis and liklihood of success for surgery is. Gaunce had a similar injury and surgery last year that was successful. 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crabcakes Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, The 5th Line said: But would a team sign him for more than 4 mil in the off season If he is recovering from shoulder surgery? Other teams wouldn't be privy to inside information like the Canucks are. The Canucks know his exact health status over the last 2 seasons. So it is likely that Guddy felt he couldn't have done better elsewhere. $4M factors in the uncertainty but I think the Canucks still think they have a top 4 player when healthy. This is obviously up for argument. If he regains form of 2 years ago, it's a bargain. If not, they're on the hook for 3 years which i guess is not a disaster. (ie not 6 years). Edited March 16, 2018 by Crabcakes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 6 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said: LOL - you did it without even saying their names yet you still made the point. Well played, well played. What can I say, just a sensitive and compassionate fellow... Kanpai! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedinyoureyesontheprize Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Crabcakes said: Other teams wouldn't be privy to inside information like the Canucks are. The Canucks know his exact health status over the last 2 seasons. So it is likely that Guddy felt he couldn't have done better elsewhere. $4M factors in the uncertainty but I think the Canucks still think they have a top 4 player when healthy. This is obviously up for argument. If he regains form of 2 years ago, it's a bargain. If not, they're on the hook for 3 years which i guess is not a disaster. (ie not 6 years). 2 well said. 3 years is not the worst especially if you consider the stage of rebuild/transition the Canucks are at. The issue I have with the signing and with the Gagner, Eriksson signing, is that management keeps overvaluing and overpaying players, giving them the salary and term they don't deserve. This isn't an issue now but in 3 years when you are trying to round out your roster for a playoff push, you don't want to have wasted all those valuable dollars and cap space. But like you mentioned the Canucks still think they have a top 4 player when healthy.This is obviously up for argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 12 hours ago, Mr.DirtyDangles said: For sure there have been many advancements in surgery for these types of injuries. I have a buddy who had his shoulder totally rebuilt and he is definitely better off now and relatively back to the same strength. He swears his grip strength has increased but thinks this is a direct result from the physical therapy and new exercises that he never did before. Either way I think you are right in the fact that there really shouldn't be a worry in terms of Guddys abilities once he is cleared to play. Doctors and procedures are getting better by the day If he was a pitcher, I would have some unease. Perhaps it will help his shooting percentage! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 10 hours ago, Setyoureyesontheprize said: The issue I have with the signing and with the Gagner, Eriksson signing, is that management keeps overvaluing and overpaying players, giving them the salary and term they don't deserve. The issue I have with CDC'ers is not understanding player valuation, inflation or bargaining leverage on a shallow, rebuilding team. It's not 10 years and $23M in cap space ago anymore. Nor do they seem to understand that with the combination of salary coming off, the rising cap and players on ELCs etc, that salary is not remotely an issue with this team for another 4+ years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post PhillipBlunt Posted March 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, aGENT said: The issue I have with CDC'ers is not understanding player valuation, inflation or bargaining leverage on a shallow, rebuilding team. It's not 10 years and $23M in cap space ago anymore. Nor do they seem to understand that with the combination of salary coming off, the rising cap and players on ELCs etc, that salary is not remotely an issue with this team for another 4+ years. I mean, Gudbranson is signed for 3 years at $4M with no clauses. He played through a separated shoulder for months and was excellent in the last month or so. So not only is he a large, imposing defenseman who's only 26 years old, but he has a high threshold for pain, and, to top it all off, he wants to be here. But somehow, there is a negative to find in all that? Edited March 16, 2018 by PhillipBlunt 3 2 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: I mean, Gudbranson is signed for 3 years at $4M with no clauses. He played through a separated shoulder for months and was excellent in the last month or so. So not only is he a large, imposing defenseman who's only 26 years old, but he has a high threshold for pain, and, to top it all off, he wants to be here. But somehow, there is a negative to find in all that? He's certainly had his issues since coming here (both injuries and consistency) but the guy is a young, legit, 2nd pair D with size, physicality, leadership, toughness, plays right side, skates well, solid defensively/on the PK etc, etc... We can't pay a guy $4m for 3 years of his prime on a rebuilding team when the cap will likely be flirting with (if not over) $80m by the time his deal expires? A bunch of somebodies have their valuation meters broken. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 1 minute ago, aGENT said: He's certainly had his issues since coming here (both injuries and consistency) but the guy is a young, legit, 2nd pair D with size, physicality, leadership, toughness, plays right side, skates well, solid defensively/on the PK etc, etc... We can't pay a guy $4m for 3 years of his prime on a rebuilding team when the cap will likely be flirting with (if not over) $80m by the time his deal expires? A bunch of somebodies have their valuation meters broken. Certainly he's had issues, and has beat them for the most part. He's been one of the bright spots on the defense this year, along with his most steady defensive partner in Edler. This team has needed the elements he brings to the team for quite a while now. Those who look at him and his contract as an issue will see how valuable he is in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attila Umbrus Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 55 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Certainly he's had issues, and has beat them for the most part. He's been one of the bright spots on the defense this year, along with his most steady defensive partner in Edler. This team has needed the elements he brings to the team for quite a while now. Those who look at him and his contract as an issue will see how valuable he is in time. I love that pairing. They were lights out in pre-season too. Glad Green finally paired them up. Also i'm impressed like you with his pain tolerance. That contraption he was wearing to support his shoulder was massive. Makes me think it was just hanging on by a friggin thread. Guy is a beast. Glad he's on our team. Him and Edler could be our next Hamhuis and Bieksa. People forget that Edler is only 32, and it's shown in the past that if he's partnered with the right dman he can really shine. People knock Eddy, but he is a minute munching dman. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post PhillipBlunt Posted March 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted March 16, 2018 6 minutes ago, Attila Umbrus said: I love that pairing. They were lights out in pre-season too. Glad Green finally paired them up. Also i'm impressed like you with his pain tolerance. That contraption he was wearing to support his shoulder was massive. Makes me think it was just hanging on by a friggin thread. Guy is a beast. Glad he's on our team. Him and Edler could be our next Hamhuis and Bieksa. People forget that Edler is only 32, and it's shown in the past that if he's partnered with the right dman he can really shine. People knock Eddy, but he is a minute munching dman. Edler and Gudbranson has been the best defensive pairing this year. I always thought that pairing an equal sized or larger defenseman, especially one adept at physicality, would be the best situation for Edler. I thought that it would allow him more freedom to create some offense, which he has. As well, being paired with a defenseman as fearless and physical as Gudbranson has reinvigorated the beast in Edler too. The way Edler went after that coward Johansen was awesome. I've never seen that from him before and it was a very welcome sight. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attila Umbrus Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) 2 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Edler and Gudbranson has been the best defensive pairing this year. I always thought that pairing an equal sized or larger defenseman, especially one adept at physicality, would be the best situation for Edler. I thought that it would allow him more freedom to create some offense, which he has. As well, being paired with a defenseman as fearless and physical as Gudbranson has reinvigorated the beast in Edler too. The way Edler went after that coward Johansen was awesome. I've never seen that from him before and it was a very welcome sight. Agreed, I like the way Edler plays when paired with Guddy. Seems to bring a bit of nasty out in him. I likey lol. It's nice to see him show emotion for once! Edited March 16, 2018 by Attila Umbrus 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post -Vintage Canuck- Posted March 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted March 16, 2018 2 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 27 minutes ago, -Vintage Canuck- said: Shoulder looked up to the task there...... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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