Olli Juolevi | #48 | D

[Warhippy]

43 minutes ago, stawns said:

Nedved had 310 career goals, 700+ points.  I'm not sure I'd be using him as a disappointment

The only disappointment in him is that Jagr was picked 3 spots later which I am absolutely sure all of CDC would have been yelling about back then in their infinite hindsight granted wisdom :p

[Phat Fingers]

1 hour ago, stawns said:

Nedved had 310 career goals, 700+ points.  I'm not sure I'd be using him as a disappointment

Nedved had a good to great career.  He will always be the guy taken ahead of Jagr, to bad.  

[Phat Fingers]

2 hours ago, Westcoasting said:

If Griffin was on Utica and we had drafted him, i'm sure there would be a whole bunch of people telling us that his hockey IQ is so good and he is developing nicely lol.

Honestly, you di realize that OJ is only 20 years old.  He needs surgery, I am sure no one is more upset that he is losing a year than him.  

 

Injuries happen and they can derail anyone career.  That being said, no where has anyone said that OJ wont make a full recovery.  

 

The guy was drafted 2.5 years ago and everyone wants to call him a bust.  FFS get over yourselves.  

 

The only thing anyone is pissed about as they wanted Matt.  So what, we have Boeser.  Our top forwards are Bo Elias and Brock, whom I like a whole bunch more than Sean, Johnny and Matt.  

 

We stole Baer off them and Granlund.  What we dont have is a solid defence.  To get one you have to draft defense.  This year is proving that need more than ever.  Our forwards and Goaltending has been good, but our defence is constantly getting bailed out.  

 

When that changes by adding guys like OJ, Hughes and Woo we will be contenders.  

[Glug Datt]

2 hours ago, Standing_Tall#37 said:

My personal favourite was when people were thinking that Rodin was going to be the next Markus naslund... when he hadn’t even played a game in the nhl at age 25  

 

 I wonder how yann Sauve is doing? Or Patrick white? Or prab Rai? Haven’t heard much of Jordan Schroeder lately. Oh and I remember the time CDC had Jordan Subban ranked as the next Bobby Orr  

 

 

 Whatever happened to Cole cassels being  the next Kesler? And wasn’t there some Nicklas Jensen that everyone here thought was going to be the next ovechkin  

oh I'm sure they all would have been Hall of famers if we hadn't mis-managed their development

[Westcoasting]

16 minutes ago, Phat Fingers said:

Honestly, you di realize that OJ is only 20 years old.  He needs surgery, I am sure no one is more upset that he is losing a year than him.  

 

Injuries happen and they can derail anyone career.  That being said, no where has anyone said that OJ wont make a full recovery.  

 

The guy was drafted 2.5 years ago and everyone wants to call him a bust.  FFS get over yourselves.  

 

The only thing anyone is pissed about as they wanted Matt.  So what, we have Boeser.  Our top forwards are Bo Elias and Brock, whom I like a whole bunch more than Sean, Johnny and Matt.  

 

We stole Baer off them and Granlund.  What we dont have is a solid defence.  To get one you have to draft defense.  This year is proving that need more than ever.  Our forwards and Goaltending has been good, but our defence is constantly getting bailed out.  

 

When that changes by adding guys like OJ, Hughes and Woo we will be contenders.  

And neither have i. In fact i have stated before that another 5 years before a dman can be called a bust.

[Rob_Zepp]

Kid had an outstanding first year as a professional ending up as a top pairing Dman in last year's play-offs in one of the best leagues in the world.   This year is still second best points per game of any AHL rookie Dman in spite of playing through a period of time for the Comets when they had really rough go of it (hard time scoring, lack of good goaltending etc.).    Kid gets injured and now he is all of a sudden a lesser prospect?

 

Good grief.    

 

[Westcoasting]

30 minutes ago, Phat Fingers said:

Nedved had a good to great career.  He will always be the guy taken ahead of Jagr, to bad.  

I brought Petr into this thread because of talking about picks that may or not turn out...Petr was one that i hoped was going to have a long illustrious career  and along with Linden as another centre, take us to a Cup win. My biggest disappointment with him is he was only here 3 years i think and then the return for him (Brown and Hedican) Brown who was so good in the playoff run was only here for 1 year

[stawns]

12 minutes ago, Westcoasting said:

I brought Petr into this thread because of talking about picks that may or not turn out...Petr was one that i hoped was going to have a long illustrious career  and along with Linden as another centre, take us to a Cup win. My biggest disappointment with him is he was only here 3 years i think and then the return for him (Brown and Hedican) Brown who was so good in the playoff run was only here for 1 year

IMO, Hedican was one of the better dmen to play in this organization.......he was certainly one of, if not the best, skaters this team has seen.

[ForsbergTheGreat]

3 hours ago, flat land fish said:

We are geared to have two shut down type lines plus Bo’s line.  Both teams equally green in playoff hockey.  We would be the underdog but I say bring it on.

We would be the underdog no matter who we face. Regardless of how you think we stack up, Flames and there fan base is not the type of team you want to lose to.

[Bure_Pavel]

50 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

Kid had an outstanding first year as a professional ending up as a top pairing Dman in last year's play-offs in one of the best leagues in the world.   This year is still second best points per game of any AHL rookie Dman in spite of playing through a period of time for the Comets when they had really rough go of it (hard time scoring, lack of good goaltending etc.).    Kid gets injured and now he is all of a sudden a lesser prospect?

 

Good grief.    

 



It is disheartening, the three worst injuries long term are back/neck, concussions, and knee injuries in my opinion. Hopefully they have him in the video room and working out his upper body everyday.   

[Phat Fingers]

52 minutes ago, Westcoasting said:

I brought Petr into this thread because of talking about picks that may or not turn out...Petr was one that i hoped was going to have a long illustrious career  and along with Linden as another centre, take us to a Cup win. My biggest disappointment with him is he was only here 3 years i think and then the return for him (Brown and Hedican) Brown who was so good in the playoff run was only here for 1 year

Brown couldn't keep his hands off if other players wives or so the story goes..  It seems that we can't go to a cup final without that story making the rounds.  

 

Brown was a offensive defenseman, we still need one of those... Hedican was the disappointment IMO.  Such a fantastic skater with hands of stone.  

 

Nedved was shipped out due to some disturbing public accusations of violence against a woman.  The story faded after he left.  He went on to have a solid career and left early to go back to Europe.  

 

Those didn't surface right away but that was the story floating around at the time.  Dan Quinn was also moved out at the same time. 

Edited January 22, 2019 by Phat Fingers

[Fanuck]

51 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

Kid had an outstanding first year as a professional ending up as a top pairing Dman in last year's play-offs in one of the best leagues in the world.   This year is still second best points per game of any AHL rookie Dman in spite of playing through a period of time for the Comets when they had really rough go of it (hard time scoring, lack of good goaltending etc.).    Kid gets injured and now he is all of a sudden a lesser prospect?

 

Good grief.   

You know better Rob, you'll never convince some people with a 'fixed mind-set' that anything other than what they initially perceive will ever be the outcome. 

I get sucked into it to unfortunately, but in the end, these people believe what they believe and what makes it worse is that he'll always be compared to his draft peers even though they're different positions and different stages of their development paths. 

 

Not many people understand that you don't build a winning franchise/cup contending team without a guy like OJ playing heavy, heavy minutes on your defense. 

[Phat Fingers]

1 hour ago, Westcoasting said:

And neither have i. In fact i have stated before that another 5 years before a dman can be called a bust.

Cool, I may have jumped the gun.  I read your post differently... oops.  

[Phat Fingers]

14 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

It is disheartening, the three worst injuries long term are back/neck, concussions, and knee injuries in my opinion. Hopefully they have him in the video room and working out his upper body everyday.   

IDK I can think of many injuries that are worse long term.  But I am a paramedic and am thinking way beyond hockey.  

 

Context matters with assessing injuries.  Knee injuries are fairly common with alot of professional athletes and full recoveries are the norm.  We have come a long way since the days of Bobby Orr.  

 

OJ wasnt carted off the ice, the Zamboni didn't run him over and he wasnt hit by the team bus. 

 

I think OJ over trained and his injuries were both a direct result.  Both surgeries are being done with an eye to his future.  His rehab should be well monitored.  He is young and should be awesome at healing.  

 

He will be able to train away from the ice and next time he places up, I can bet he will be wearing the best knee brace money can buy.  

Edited January 22, 2019 by Phat Fingers

[Phat Fingers]

1 hour ago, Rob_Zepp said:

Kid had an outstanding first year as a professional ending up as a top pairing Dman in last year's play-offs in one of the best leagues in the world.   This year is still second best points per game of any AHL rookie Dman in spite of playing through a period of time for the Comets when they had really rough go of it (hard time scoring, lack of good goaltending etc.).    Kid gets injured and now he is all of a sudden a lesser prospect?

 

Good grief.    

 

https://goo.gl/images/HmoYw3

[Bure_Pavel]

7 minutes ago, Phat Fingers said:

IDK I can think of many injuries that are worse long term.  But I am a paramedic and am thinking way beyond hockey.  

 

Context matters with assessing injuries.  Knee injuries are fairly common with alot of professional athletes and full recoveries are the norm.  We have come a long way since the days of Bobby Orr.  

 

OJ wasnt carted off the ice, the Zamboni didn't run him over and he wasnt hit by the team bus. 

 

I think OJ over trained and his injuries were both a direct result.  Both surgeries are being done with an eye to his future.  His rehab should be well monitored.  He is young and should be awesome at healing.  

 

He will be able to train away from the ice and next time he places up, I can bet he will be wearing the best knee brace money can buy.  

It will likely have an effect on foot speed and conditioning come training camp  

[Phat Fingers]

2 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

It will likely have an effect on foot speed and conditioning come training camp  

Why.  Training camp is long way away.  He has plenty of time to train.  He can even work on his legs, just not in ever direction.  Kids recover quickly.  In some cases players even improved their skating by taking the time to work on technical issues.  

 

A whole lot can happen and we should wait for judgment, we just dont know.  

[HorvatToBaertschi]

14 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

Butterfly effect people.  Even if Jim Benning sneezed at the draft table in 2014 there is no guarantee we get EP 2017.  Rather EP than any player drafted in the last 5 years sans McJesus.

I wholeheartedly agree with this, and people need to realize that having EP, 2 stud dmen prospects a big body powerforward in the making and Boeser, is better than anything we could have ever hoped for out of the last 5 drafts. And don't forget Horvat in 2013. 6 years of excellence at the draft table.

[Phat Fingers]

3 hours ago, HorvatToBaertschi said:

I wholeheartedly agree with this, and people need to realize that having EP, 2 stud dmen prospects a big body powerforward in the making and Boeser, is better than anything we could have ever hoped for out of the last 5 drafts. And don't forget Horvat in 2013. 6 years of excellence at the draft table.

Best drafting GM in club history or will be.  Yet there is a vocal and hopefully a minority that doesn't get it.  

 

The need to pick apart certain draft choices is a nervous habit on the CDC.  Maybe created after decades of really bad drafting.  

 

Even after bringing in Boeser and EP40 among others JB is still vilified for taking two players Virtannen, though that noise is finally dying down, and OJ.  The anger isnt due so much to the path of the player taken vs some player taken afterwards.  

 

No thought to long term projections, serious team needs and team building.  If a LW was the BPA in 10 consecutive draft years, there are posters who would want to take all ten of them.  

 

Look at the team that is coming into focus right now and tell.me what the biggest need is.  

 

If you dont pick defence, please go away, you are an idiot.... kidding, but not really. 

 

You dont get to fix certain positions on the fly.  They are very hard to project and to develop.  Defence and Goal are the two that come to mind.  Look how long Markey has taken to get to where he is right now.  Demko was picked in the same draft as JV, he has only 2 NHL starts.  By the standards applied to others Demko is a bust.  

 

But people mostly understand that development takes time and generally pays off.  

 

Looking at JV, the team took a player who was physically well.beyond his peers, but mentally needed to mature.  So he has taken longer to develop mentally.  Now some of the hard work is paying off.  He is NHL worthy.  If he can become more consistant he will be top six worthy.  Progress.  

 

When OJ was picked, physically he was under developed compared to his peers  but very mature and smart.  He has worked at developing his physical self, but there have been some setbacks.  Yet he has by most accounts been completely committed to becoming a better player.  He hasn't lost his maturity or his intelligence, the main reasons he was picked where he was, or the skills like his passing and hockey IQ as witnessed by his ppg which were excellent in Ligia and appeared to be a strength in his injury shortened AHL season.  

 

So what's the problem with OJ? Is he getting bigger and stronger, I would say yes.  Is he committed to making the NHL, yes.  Are his injuries career ending?  No.  

 

But Matt Tkachuk was picked right after him and is playing in the NHL right now.  So what?  

 

We have other guys playing in the NHL right now too vs guys drafting before them.  A number of players on this team were steals in their draft years or scouted and traded as undervalued by their former club.  

 

The agnst displayed around these picks are that of spoiled selfish children.  It would be one thing if we had no other picks that have far exceeded their draft position or where completely sucking.   But currently we have a rookie player who is a lock for the Calder and already gaining some Hart trophy consideration.  One season after having another player miss the Calder only due to injury.  Had Brock been healthy, 40g was well within reach.  He would have won the Calder in a tight race.  

 

So we have the best and brightest toy, all shiny and wonderful and some of us are bitching to our parents that we dont have every nice shiny toy.  Selfish spoiled children.  

 

Harping on prospects before 5 years is stupid.  Development happens at different places and is different for different positions.  Or is what EP40 doing the new normal?  

 

 

 

 

Edited January 23, 2019 by Phat Fingers

[Kosmo Kramer]

1 hour ago, Phat Fingers said:

Best drafting GM in club history or will be.  Yet there is a vocal and hopefully a minority that doesn't get it.  

 

The need to pick apart certain draft choices is a nervous habit on the CDC.  Maybe created after decades of really bad drafting.  

 

Even after bringing in Boeser and EP40 among others JB is still vilified for taking two players Virtannen, though that noise is finally dying down, and OJ.  The anger isnt due so much to the path of the player taken vs some player taken afterwards.  

 

No thought to long term projections, serious team needs and team building.  If a LW was the BPA in 10 consecutive draft years, there are posters who would want to take all ten of them.  

 

Look at the team that is coming into focus right now and tell.me what the biggest need is.  

 

If you dont pick defence, please go away, you are an idiot.... kidding, but not really. 

 

You dont get to fix certain positions on the fly.  They are very hard to project and to develop.  Defence and Goal are the two that come to mind.  Look how long Markey has taken to get to where he is right now.  Demko was picked in the same draft as JV, he has only 2 NHL starts.  By the standards applied to others Demko is a bust.  

 

But people mostly understand that development takes time and generally pays off.  

 

Looking at JV, the team took a player who was physically well.beyond his peers, but mentally needed to mature.  So he has taken longer to develop mentally.  Now some of the hard work is paying off.  He is NHL worthy.  If he can become more consistant he will be top six worthy.  Progress.  

 

When OJ was picked, physically he was under developed compared to his peers  but very mature and smart.  He has worked at developing his physical self, but there have been some setbacks.  Yet he has by most accounts been completely committed to becoming a better player.  He hasn't lost his maturity or his intelligence, the main reasons he was picked where he was, or the skills like his passing and hockey IQ as witnessed by his ppg which were excellent in Ligia and appeared to be a strength in his injury shortened AHL season.  

 

So what's the problem with OJ? Is he getting bigger and stronger, I would say yes.  Is he committed to making the NHL, yes.  Are his injuries career ending?  No.  

 

But Matt Tkachuk was picked right after him and is playing in the NHL right now.  So what?  

 

We have other guys playing in the NHL right now too vs guys drafting before them.  A number of players on this team were steals in their draft years or scouted and traded as undervalued by their former club.  

 

The agnst displayed around these picks are that of spoiled selfish children.  It would be one thing if we had no other picks that have far exceeded their draft position or where completely sucking.   But currently we have a rookie player who is a lock for the Calder and already gaining some Hart trophy consideration.  One season after having another player miss the Calder only due to injury.  Had Brock been healthy, 40g was well within reach.  He would have won the Calder in a tight race.  

 

So we have the best and brightest toy, all shiny and wonderful and some of us are bitching to our parents that we dont have every nice shiny toy.  Selfish spoiled children.  

 

Harping on prospects before 5 years is stupid.  Development happens at different places and is different for different positions.  Or is what EP40 doing the new normal?  

 

 

 

 

Absolutely nailed it.

I agree with every word.

I believe in OJ to become a great #3 Dman that plays in every situation.

Edited January 23, 2019 by Kosmo Kramer