stawns Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 5 minutes ago, Jtutino said: He was also - 4 in his last 4 games and a plus player in 3 out of 18 games. I know +/- can be skewed if you are playing a shutdown role. As an AHL rookie he wasnt in that role and rightfully so. People always say its a meaningless stat. I guess its just a coincidence that the Canucks wanted to improve there D and the two main guys the sent out were Huttton -23 and Guddy -27 the two worst +/- players on the team. The 3rd worst player was -12. It's not a meaningless stat, it's just not an individual stat. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 On 7/29/2019 at 3:54 PM, 48MPHSlapShot said: I can see him and Woo being a really good tandem in a few years. Juo to Woo! Goal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 22 minutes ago, Jtutino said: He was also - 4 in his last 4 games and a plus player in 3 out of 18 games. I know +/- can be skewed if you are playing a shutdown role. As an AHL rookie he wasnt in that role and rightfully so. People always say its a meaningless stat. I guess its just a coincidence that the Canucks wanted to improve there D and the two main guys the sent out were Huttton -23 and Guddy -27 the two worst +/- players on the team. The 3rd worst player was -12. Have a look at the Utica team +/- stats. Overall, they are poor defensively and most everyone on the team has a terrible +/- . Not an effective way to assess OJ's defencive game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jtutino Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 (edited) 49 minutes ago, higgyfan said: Have a look at the Utica team +/- stats. Overall, they are poor defensively and most everyone on the team has a terrible +/- . Not an effective way to assess OJ's defencive game. I agree you dont just asses a player based on +/- but it can be a good indication. -12 in 18 isnt a positive stat when you're playing sheltered AHL minutes. if he was +12 everyone would be pumping his tires. I wasnt trying to start a debate on +/-, just pointing out like most young D Olli needs to work on his game in his own zone. If you watched Utica play I think its pretty obvious.He looked great on the PP, offensively id say he was NHL ready. But still needs to up his compete and defensive game. It doesnt get easier as you move up. How would you assess OJ defensive game? do you think hes NHL ready? Edited August 2, 2019 by Jtutino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 22 minutes ago, Jtutino said: I agree you dont just asses a player based on +/- but it can be a good indication. -12 in 18 isnt a positive stat when you're playing sheltered AHL minutes. if he was +12 everyone would be pumping his tires. I wasnt trying to start a debate on +/-, just pointing out like most young D Olli needs to work on his game in his own zone. If you watched Utica play I think its pretty obvious.He looked great on the PP, offensively id say he was NHL ready. But still needs to up his compete and defensive game. It doesnt get easier as you move up. How would you assess OJ defensive game? do you think hes NHL ready? I think he needs more time in Utica. Perhaps getting a callup after Xmas if he is playing well. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 59 minutes ago, Jtutino said: I agree you dont just asses a player based on +/- but it can be a good indication. -12 in 18 isnt a positive stat when you're playing sheltered AHL minutes. if he was +12 everyone would be pumping his tires. I wasnt trying to start a debate on +/-, just pointing out like most young D Olli needs to work on his game in his own zone. If you watched Utica play I think its pretty obvious.He looked great on the PP, offensively id say he was NHL ready. But still needs to up his compete and defensive game. It doesnt get easier as you move up. How would you assess OJ defensive game? do you think hes NHL ready? I think his knee injury that had his season shut down early was effecting his ability to react quickly defensively. A healthy Juolevi is better defensively IMO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 2 minutes ago, aGENT said: I think his knee injury that had his season shut down early was effecting his ability to react quickly defensively. A healthy Juolevi is better defensively IMO. Considering that Hunter used him as his shutdown guy (while also sheltering a rookie), I have to agree. He also was quite the offensive/defensive beast in the playoffs in his last year in Jrs. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heius Bettersson Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 If my memory serves me I thought he had a good playoff run in the year he was in Finland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heius Bettersson Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 If my memory serves me I thought he had a good playoff run the year he was in Finland too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Googlie Posted August 3, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) Interesting PITB article today: https//www.vancourier.com/pass-it-to-Bulis/1.23905185 (I couldn't find a way to save the link on my tablet, so here is the webpage ref - if someone with better skills could enter it and paste the link, would be awesome) Edited August 3, 2019 by Googlie 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post RowdyCanuck Posted August 3, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) https://www.vancourier.com/pass-it-to-bulis/yes-olli-juolevi-is-still-a-top-prospect-for-the-canucks-1.23905185 there yea go @Googlie fyi. It's a good read thx. Edited August 3, 2019 by RowdyCanuck 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilduce39 Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 Quote The Canucks’ left side on defence is pretty much set for the start of the season: the Canucks re-signed Alex Edler and signed Jordie Benn and Oscar Fantenberg in free agency, while Quinn Hughes turned pro. That means Juolevi, barring injuries, will start the season in Utica again. He should still make his NHL debut next season at the age of 21 and that’s not a bad thing. To show why that’s not a bad thing, let’s take a (somewhat) random sampling of top-end NHL defencemen. Of the 23 defenceman that received at least one vote for the Norris trophy last season, 10 of them didn’t make their NHL debut until they were at least 21, including Norris winner Mark Giordano. Another 10 (not necessarily the same 10) didn’t become full-time NHLers until they were at least 22. Again, that doesn’t mean Juolevi’s going to be a Norris-caliber defenceman, just that it’s not an emergency that he has yet to play an NHL game. Interesting part of the article considering I've read some dismay over his delay. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 Please! Ppppppppllllllleeeeaaaassssse turn out like Roman Josi!!!!!! 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollieo Del Fuego Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 Who does Juolevi remind you of right now....Josi ...or Gragnani...? For me, there is no comparison Gragnani just skated in circles, avoiding checks or making one... Josi's calm but effective approach is just how Oli plays.... From the "pass it to Bulis article; Josi bears the closest similarity to Juolevi according to pGPS. Josi played his entire 20-year-old season in the AHL and didn’t make his NHL debut until he was 21, though he quickly established himself as a full-time NHLer. Now he’s a legitimate top-pairing defenceman, with six 40+ seasons under his belt, including 61 points in 2015-16. That’s a best case scenario for Juolevi, but there are some cautionary tales among Juolevi’s cohort. For example, the players in Juolevi’s cohort with the closest similarity, higher than Josi, is Marc-Andre Gragnani. Gragnani also made his AHL debut at 20, putting up 52 points in 78 games. While he was an AHL star, winning the Eddie Shore Award in 2011 as the league’s best defenceman, he never quite established himself in the NHL. He played 78 NHL games, 14 of them for the Vancouver Canucks during the 2011-12 season, before heading to the KHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post GoldenAlien Posted August 4, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted August 4, 2019 Let's look at a couple smooth skating, cerebral, two-way top pairing defensemen: Duncan Keith 20 year old: 75GP - 7G - 25PT - 0.33PPG in the AHL, 8GP - 1G - 2PT in the playoffs. 21 year old: 79GP - 9G - 26PT - 0.33PPG in the AHL, 6GP - 0G - 0PT in the playoffs. Nick Lidstrom 19 year old: 39GP - 8G - 16PT - 0.41PPG in the SHL, 2GP - 0G - 1PT in the playoffs. 20 year old: 38GP - 4G - 23PT - 0.61PPG in the SHL, 4GP - 0G - 0PT in the playoffs. Olli Juolevi 19 year old: 38GP - 7G - 19PT - 0.5PPG in the Liiga, 11GP - 2G - 7PT in the playoffs. 20 year old: 18GP - 1G - 13PT - 0.72PPG in the AHL Though stylistically different, the AHL and the SHL/ Liiga are comparable in terms of quality of competition, and Juolevi is easily better than Keith/ Lidstrom as a 19 and 20 year old. And if you were to judge Lidstrom and Keith by their earlier records, it would suggest that they're poor playoff performers who disappear once the pressure is on. But luckily for their teams, fates aren't determined at 20 years old. Keith: 2x Norris, 4x All-Star, 1x Conn Smythe, 3x Stanley Cup, 2x Olympic Gold. Lidstrom: 7x Norris, 12x All-Star, 1x Conn Smythe, 4x Stanley Cup, 1x Olympic Gold, 1x WC Gold. Seems like most of the criticism surrounding Juolevi is centred on: 1. did not light the world on fire in his D+1; or 2. did not make the NHL in his D+2/ D+3. Imagine the uproar if he pulled a Keith and spent all of next season in Utica, and put up 0.3-0.35PPG. Cam Barker played 35 games in the NHL as a 20 year old. Giordano spent his 20 year old season as an overager in the OHL. Now Barker is floating around Europe and Giordano is a Norris winner. Doesn't mean Juolevi will be a 60+pt franchise defenseman, but it's completely illogical to put a cap on his potential because he didn't make the NHL before his fellow draftees. 2 2 4 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuck1991 Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 any updates, is he skating or still not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoneypuckOverlord Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 On 8/3/2019 at 11:37 PM, Heius Bettersson said: If my memory serves me I thought he had a good playoff run the year he was in Finland too top 4 in scoring in points for his team during their playoff run. Although injury to the top 2, he clawed his way up the depth chart for his team when it mattered. he just turned 20 around that time too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Googlie Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 10 hours ago, Nuck1991 said: any updates, is he skating or still not? Been skating for 6 weeks now (since June 17) per Sportsnet 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 On 8/2/2019 at 2:22 PM, Jtutino said: I agree you dont just asses a player based on +/- but it can be a good indication. -12 in 18 isnt a positive stat when you're playing sheltered AHL minutes. if he was +12 everyone would be pumping his tires. I wasnt trying to start a debate on +/-, just pointing out like most young D Olli needs to work on his game in his own zone. If you watched Utica play I think its pretty obvious.He looked great on the PP, offensively id say he was NHL ready. But still needs to up his compete and defensive game. It doesnt get easier as you move up. How would you assess OJ defensive game? do you think hes NHL ready? Cough, playing on a bad knee. Cough. His defence could need work but it's just as likely that his defence suffered due to his knee injury. 3 years post his draft and we still need to see the real OJ. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 7 hours ago, Phat Fingers said: Cough, playing on a bad knee. Cough. His defence could need work but it's just as likely that his defence suffered due to his knee injury. 3 years post his draft and we still need to see the real OJ. Sure we have......a smooth skating two way dman with strong offensive instincts. He's been the same player everywhere he's played, we just haven't seen enough of him 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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