[Article] Benning seeking 2nd line left winger to take pressure off Baertschi

[WhoseTruckWasIt]

10 minutes ago, khay said:

Good article. Thanks for posting.

 

This makes me wonder about Hartnell. Hartnell should be able to produce about 20 goals for the next couple of years. And with Burrow's and Miller's contract coming off next season, we can afford him for the duration of his contract (3 more years). The only thing is that we need to send a contract back to CBJ to be able to squeeze his contract in for this season -- probably one of Burrows, Dorsett, or Sbisa.

 

Younger, faster, harder to play against.  I just don't see how the Harty-Party fits the bill.  

[WhoseTruckWasIt]

1 minute ago, ice orca said:

I wonder what Baer is thinking right now. He actually played great from the Christmas break on, looked good on the 2nd line and taking control of the situation. Does he need sheltering or does Benning want a big name player to put the ass in the seats? If you to trade for a big LW who can score you are not going to get him for Sbisa and crap, especially if the rest of the GM's know this.

Benning has seen what happens to players when offensive expectations are too high, and when rosters are too thin.  He has done a pretty good job with Baertschi so far - I don't see how this line of thinking is any different.  This is the reason he sent him to Utica too.

[Honky Cat]

Just now, ice orca said:

I wonder what Baer is thinking right now. He actually played great from the Christmas break on, looked good on the 2nd line and taking control of the situation. Does he need sheltering or does Benning want a big name player to put the ass in the seats? If you to trade for a big LW who can score you are not going to get him for Sbisa and crap, especially if the rest of the GM's know this.

Agreed...Why does Baertschi need sheltering?...I don't get it...Baertschi was a high pick,and has a big pedigree.(the Canucks are deploying him in their adverts as well)....He's a lot better than a 3rd line LW..IMO

[iinatcc]

55 minutes ago, ItsMillerTime said:

Bo Horvat and Sven Baertschi were beast together. I wouldn't mind getting Marcus Johansen in a trade with Capitals. Was in the shadows of guys like Semin, Ovi, Backstrom his whole career. 

No more trades please. If Vancouver is looking for a 2nd line winger just hope Rodin pans out.

 

Sven in the 3rd line isn't bad maybe if he can provide 30 to 40 pts as a 3rd line scorer then I'd be happy with that. It just means the 2nd line winger would be contributing either just as much as more offensivley.

[khay]

5 minutes ago, WhoseTruckWasIt said:

Younger, faster, harder to play against.  I just don't see how the Harty-Party fits the bill.  

The article says, "a winger with size, edge and scoring ability."

 

Hartnell does fit that bill. And personally, I don't think Hartnell is the idea option but he is an option. The article makes a good point. We basically need a 20 goal scorer on the 2LW to make the playoffs. Baertschi may be able to do it but too much of our season depends on Baertschi if we go with just him. I think Benning wants to make the playoffs badly and getting a 2LW that can score 20 goals and hard to play against, like Hartnell, will increase the likelihood of the Canucks making the playoffs by 2 folds (just my humble opinion).

 

 

[stonecoldstevebernier]

This pretty much confirms what we already know, which is that Benning has orders to push for the playoffs and make the team competitive at all costs... I don't know how much this is really about Baertschi's development. The guy's 23 anyway, he's not a green rookie and he showed last year that he can play. I think if you draw up the top 9 as it is now, the weak link is Virtanen, who isn't even a surefire bet for the top 9 - his element of physicality is unique to our team though so he might stick based on that factor. But it would also make sense if JB wanted to have him get big minutes in the AHL to start so I could see him wanting to acquire a winger to fill that hole.

Although the way our lineup is constructed, the Horvat and Sutter lines could very well end up being interchangeable as 2 and 3 so it could all be a moot point.

Sedin-Sedin-Eriksson

Baertschi-Horvat-Hansen

Rodin-Sutter-Virtanen

Etem/Burrows-Granlund-Dorsett

[ehdee]

1 hour ago, PhillipBlunt said:

It would seem that there is a slight disconnect between Jim and Willie. Oh well, as long as Willie falls in line, all is well.

I think it's more about splitting them up for depth. More talent around the lineup if Baer and Bo aren't together.

[WhoseTruckWasIt]

14 minutes ago, khay said:

The article says, "a winger with size, edge and scoring ability."

 

Hartnell does fit that bill. And personally, I don't think Hartnell is the idea option but he is an option. The article makes a good point. We basically need a 20 goal scorer on the 2LW to make the playoffs. Baertschi may be able to do it but too much of our season depends on Baertschi if we go with just him. I think Benning wants to make the playoffs badly and getting a 2LW that can score 20 goals and hard to play against, like Hartnell, will increase the likelihood of the Canucks making the playoffs by 2 folds (just my humble opinion).

 

 

I just don't think that he is fast enough or energetic enough.  He may be able to take punishment in front of the net, but I've never thought he was too good on the walls, mainly because he is not strong on his feet.  So the fast 2-way play that we are going for is kind of compromised.

 

But I agree, he is a viable option.  If there is a favourable deal where we get this player for cheap then certainly, good enough.  But I just see it as a poor fit.  Though I like him on the powerplay a lot.

[WhoseTruckWasIt]

26 minutes ago, Honky Cat said:

Agreed...Why does Baertschi need sheltering?...I don't get it...Baertschi was a high pick,and has a big pedigree.(the Canucks are deploying him in their adverts as well)....He's a lot better than a 3rd line LW..IMO

Because being expected to score every night can be really hard on a player.  This is why Virtanen was never penciled into the top line.

 

Giving Baertschi a little weaker competition will allow him to hang onto the puck longer and make plays.  He did have a good year, but I am sure that there is still room to grow in the confidence department.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

At least he can join Bo on Line 3.  If Line 3 produces better than Line 2, then is Line 3 not Line 2?  I think I will stop with the conventional numbers and move to names.

 

Sedin Line

Sutter Line

Horvat Line

The line Dorsett should be on, but likely won't be given Willy's man-crush

[Goal:thecup]

1 hour ago, Phil_314 said:

Honestly doubt he's that blind to notice that they do have chemistry, as evidenced from last season, and in this case (just as it was with Sutter and Horvat) it's wise to have an older, more established player who plays the same position to shield Sven as he develops at his own pace.

Problem is, the team is top-heavy in terms of the quality that they can afford to move and which would bring back a good return (in this case, 2nd line left wing) without turning the franchise into the Oilers of the past (run by kids who aren't ready for the role).

Veteran leadership to insulate youth (shouldn't trade): Twins, Eriksson,  Tanev/ Edler (at least one of the D stays)
Complementary vets (have value but can move at the right price): Hansen, Sutter, Edler/ Tanev, Miller
Youth movement (shouldn't be moved): Hutton, Gudbranson, Sven, Bo, Jake. Markstrom, Boeser, Juolevi, Demko, 1st
Little/ no return (past prime or unproven): Burr, Sbisa, Tryamkin, Larsen, Rodin, Etem, Pedan, Granlund, Gaunce 

Hoping management takes a good look at getting Hartnell; even if he is slightly over-the-hill, 23 goals and 49 points is nothing to sneeze at when you're on a crappy team like he was and there's enough play-makers to go around in this lineup that a rugged finisher like him could contribute even at his advanced age.  If Luca or Burr could be packaged for him I'd do it, since the main issue would likely be the 3 years left on his deal, but again I think there's a potential fit.

This is a pretty good way of looking at it.

Personally I would move Tryamkin up to the "shouldn't be moved" list.

 

Overall, JB has more than enough to offer up if he can pry a player he likes out of another GM's hands.

Some of the required return to land a good enough player will have some cap attached so there will be cap room enough too.

 

JB will probably surprise us a bit here if he gets the job done.  (Not limited to just Hartnell or Kane.)

He probably has his eye set on someone we haven't considered because we are not privy to GMs' phone conversations.

 

I definitely agree with the need to shore up the left side. 

The right side is covered.  (Eriksson, Hansen, Virtanen, Rodin, Etem, Burrows, Dorsett, etc.)

On the left we only have Danny, Sven, and several players like Zalewski and Gaunce who will play any position if it helps them make the team.

 

It doesn't matter which line this new left winger plays on.

We just really need another NHL left winger.

 

[mll]

Just now, Raymond Luxury Yacht said:

At least he can join Bo on Line 3.  If Line 3 produces better than Line 2, then is Line 3 not Line 2?  I think I will stop with the conventional numbers and move to names.

 

Sedin Line

Sutter Line

Horvat Line

The line Dorsett should be on, but likely won't be given Willy's man-crush

Probably will play on the Granlund line.  WD had them together each time Granlund was healthy after the TDL.  I think he was serious when he said it's better for Horvat to play with defensive wingers in a checking role (see the Horvat thread).  Also Baertschi was more creative in March as he was able to be more of a playmaker which is more his game.

[Ronalds.Kenins41]

For once I will set aside my bias and irrationality and help Benning out. 

 

 

a proven scorer that has some grit to take pressure off Baertschi he says.

Guy's gotta have a low a cap hit he says. 

Can't trade for him because win win situations are rare in trades he says. 

The younger the better he says. 

 

 

After careful analysis of all the left wings around one clear answer emerges to these needs. It is in fact the only answer. 

 

 

RONALD THE TANK KENINS! 

 

 He's physical, can score, skates like P Kane. He's fast. He's young. He's cheap. He's perfect.

 

 

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

15 minutes ago, mll said:

Probably will play on the Granlund line.  WD had them together each time Granlund was healthy after the TDL.  I think he was serious when he said it's better for Horvat to play with defensive wingers in a checking role (see the Horvat thread).  Also Baertschi was more creative in March as he was able to be more of a playmaker which is more his game.

Do you see Bo on line 4 with Etem and Dorsett? and Granlund as line 3 C with Baer and someone? If you take WD's comments literally, that could be the case, but I hope it's not.  Bo has offensive talent, I think Baer and Bo should be together on 3 if Baer isn't going to get line 2 minutes.  I'm not even happy with Bo on the 3rd line, if he is on the 4th, I'll pout and toss insults at WD for the duration of Bo's time on Line 4. 

[Bang Bang Boogie]

Baertschi playing on the 3rd line with Bo with power play time would be the perfect fit for him.  The hard part is finding this 2nd line scoring left winger and the price JB is willing to pay for it.

 

I think Hansen for Kane or Kreider deal would would work well

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

1 hour ago, WHL rocks said:

I made a post on this need yesterday. We need a 2nd line winger who's able to score 25 goals. There's a desperate need for more goals on this team and that 2nd line needs upgrading. 

 

Maybe Hansen for Kane might work. Not sure JB wants to take on that headache, but desperate times calls for desperate measures. 

“We’re not moving Jannik,” he stressed. “I thought he was excellent for us last year and with the way the game is going with speed and skill, he fits that description perfectly. And we have him under a good (cap) number the next couple of years, so we’re not looking to do anything.”

 

Doesn't really sound like Benning would be open to making a "Hansen for Kane" trade. 

 

On a side note, if we really need a guy to "take the pressure off Sven" on the left side, maybe it wouldn't be the craziest idea if the Canucks considered moving Hansen to LW? He might not be the "hulking" type winger or a power forward, but he has decent size and very underrated grit/physicality and he can be relied upon to provide 15-20 goals. 

 

And Hansen actually has lots of LW experience from junior and has played the left side for Team Denmark during several past competitions. He was actually drafted as a LW IIRC but was quickly moved to his shooting side once he joined the Vancouver system.

 

Basically, we'd have Eriksson, Rödin, Virtanen, and Burrows/Dorsett at RW and Sedin, Hansen, Baertschi, and Etem/Dorsett at LW.

 

Burrows and Eriksson can also play either side (if we want to keep Hansen as a RH-shooting RW).

 

And ultimately, I don't really think we need to protect Baertschi from playing the second line. If he can play to that level, just give him some support within the line, and  then let the kid run with the opportunity (if he plays we'll enough to earn a 2LW role). No reason to hold him back before he's even shown whether or not he can meet those expectations.

[Borvat]

This is exactly the reason Burrows should have been bought out and a UFA signed early on.  

 

I don't understand some of the indecision. Loyalty beyond what is best for the team will always bite you in the ***.

 

The thing that scares me is that ownership may have vetoed any plans by Trevor and Jim to buy out Burrows to save some cash. Only to potentially cost prospects and picks in return. Scary.

 

[DownUndaCanuck]

A trade for a young, big, top-6 winger will probably cost us a lot and I'd rather not part with any of this team's other pieces, especially on defence, now that everything's falling into place. We're one middle-6 forward away from being playoff-ready and that should come in the form of a UFA.

 

I say sign Pirri, the kid is 25, versatile, can play center, and scores consistently on different teams at a 15-20 goal pace. What more do you need. Also he'd be dirt cheap, he's always been on cheap contracts so we can definately get him under 4M, plus he's played with a lot of our roster on different teams already.

 

Sedin - Sedin - Eriksson

Baertschi - Horvat - Hansen

Etem - Sutter - Pirri

Gaunce - Granlund - Burrows

Dorsett

Rodin

[mll]

28 minutes ago, Raymond Luxury Yacht said:

Do you see Bo on line 4 with Etem and Dorsett? and Granlund as line 3 C with Baer and someone? If you take WD's comments literally, that could be the case, but I hope it's not.  Bo has offensive talent, I think Baer and Bo should be together on 3 if Baer isn't going to get line 2 minutes.  I'm not even happy with Bo on the 3rd line, if he is on the 4th, I'll pout and toss insults at WD for the duration of Bo's time on Line 4. 

In fact yes - that's how WD finished the season and he praised Horvat's game.  So my guess is that he goes with Horvat on a checking line with Etem, Gaunce, Burrows, Dorsett maybe Virtanen and Baertschi on an offensive line with Granlund as his C and Rodin as the goal scorer.

 

Green says Baertschi is at his best when he has the puck in the o-zone and makes plays - his playmaking and ability to generate offence is his strength.  It was not put to much use when he played with Horvat because WD was using them in a checking role - he had them start in the d-zone playing against the scoring lines - they were mostly scoring off the rush. 

 

It wasn't even Baertschi making the play but mostly it was Horvat just powering his way to the net and Baertschi going there to catch the pass or the rebound.  Etem/Gaunce should be able to do just as well.  Does that line really need a creative playmaker.   I think there's way more value to get Baertschi to play his game.  As I said earlier give him o-zone starts - linemates that can get him the puck back and can finish and he'll set them up.  

[The Brindy Gypsy]

1 hour ago, Odd. said:

Evander Kane.

 

Yes I know he's been an issue, but we can get this guy for dirt cheap than the other possible available LW's (Landeskog, Kreider, Hayes, JVR, etc). His value is an all-time low, take advantage of this. 

 

I'd take a gamble with Kane. This could be the very last chance for Kane if he really wants his career to go back on track. Friends and family although that might not do the trick, but certainly our great veterans in Sedins, Burrows, Hansen to straighten him up. Hell even Gudbranson can discipline Kane's butt if he ever attempts to do something stupid. 

 

Kane never had anybody quite like the veterans we have on any of his teams he played for. 

 

Kane fits this meat and potatoes model Benning is talking about. Despite his personality issues, if this guy can put his head into the right place, there's no doubting what kind of player he can be for us in the future. Kane has all the tools to be successful. It's quite sad he's taking that kind of route right now but luckily he's still young enough to turn things around.

 

Playing alongside Horvat in the future, we could see some gritty, rugged, quick, western type game. Expect a lot of dirty goals and some good hits and fights.  

 

I agree, I mean his stock is probably as low as it will ever be. For me it just depends on if he is a good team mate or not. I could care less what he does outside the rink as long as he cares about hockey when at the rink. Just because he parties does not mean the guys in the room won't accept him, that is more about the management and media who care about that crap. Its also a bit of a game with NHL'ers about not getting caught and when something goes public. Guys like Kassian and Kane haven't figured out that part yet. Trust me there are a lot worse stuff going on behind closed doors from guys you wouldn't expect, but key point to that is closed doors. Out of sight out of mind. If he can just live a little more discretely all is well that ends well.