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Phillip Holm | #29 | D


Rollieo Del Fuego

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Holm will still be a RFA at the end of this season and next year he will be waiver eligible. He's not going to return to Sweden when he knows he'll have to make the team next year - especially if he had several suitors before signing with the Canucks re waivers.

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39 minutes ago, mll said:

^

Holm will still be a RFA at the end of this season and next year he will be waiver eligible. He's not going to return to Sweden when he knows he'll have to make the team next year - especially if he had several suitors before signing with the Canucks re waivers.

Yeah, that part of the Province article where they say Holm is gonna be “one and done” with the Vancouver organization seems like quite the stretch and a curious mindreading exercise by the writer. 

 

Do they really believe Holm is just fuming down in Utica because he’s not living the full on NHL life in his first season of NA pro hockey?

 

And if so, would we even want him in the organization?

 

I mean, he’s clearly got a good skill set, and he’s well developed and entering his prime playing years. But this is his first year in North America. And it’s not like he was an elite player in Sweden or on anyone’s list of “the best players in the world not playing in the NHL.”

 

He’s a guy with upside and a skill set that suggests he could be a viable NHL defenseman. But he had issues with his game (specifically how he reacted the pace and physicality of AHL/NHL hockey) and he needed time and coaching before he became a consistently good AHL D, never mind an NHL regular.

 

Took him a while to learn how quickly he needed to move the puck, to stop overplaying things, recognize pressure and danger, not admire his own passes, and anticipate hits. Starting him in the NHL would have been a big mistake. And it might very well have shaken his confidence and set him back. The AHL route was the right choice. And we’re just getting to the point now where he’s really scratching at deserving an NHL opportunity.

 

I think Holm understands all this. And I’d expect he’s happy with his season so far.

 

I highly doubt he feels like he’s being wronged by Vancouver. From the reports I’ve read, he recognized he needed to work on his game and he’s really listened to the coaches and implemented their recommendations. If I were to dabble in mindreading for a minute, I’d say it’s likely he feels like his first NA pro season has really gone quite well, and that he’s very much on track to achieving his goals.

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Holm has a 925k salary showing on capfriendly if he was on the Canucks. His pay is $70,000 I believe in Utica. Not a ton of money, I would assume he was making more in Sweden.

 

I would really like to see him play some games this year. But we did block his path a bit when we traded for Pouliot to start the season. We are sitting 2 healthy D as it is now also. I dont see us trading 2 D off our current roster. Likely 1, so he could be called up to practice and be #8 at some point and cash in an NHL salary for a bit I suppose.

 

Can Holm play the right side?

 

We have 4 lhd currently, Pouliot being an option to play the right side. I dont know if the Canucks would waive Biega to try send him down to Utica & then call up Holm.

 

I can see him wondering what he has to do to get an opportunity in the NHL. He has seemingly done very well in Utica. He is also 26, so he is much older than McEney, Brisebois, Sautner. So he is at the point in his career where he is more developed in his game and is trying to see if he can make the NHL or not. If he doesnt get a shot with us at all this year, maybe he re ups with us again but I could also see him wanting a better opportunity elsewhere.

 

This boils down to us moving a LHD. Do we ask Edler to waive at the deadline or the draft? Does Guddy get  re signed and JB move Hutton out? Does a team call about MDZ now or in June?

 

Also remember Juolevi will be pounding at the door to make our line up next year too. I hope we give him a chance, I also hope he is willing to stick around if he has to come to training camp next year and compete for a spot again. He may pull a Rodin, and elect to go back home, for more guaranteed ice time and a better salary who knows?

 

Has Holm ever done an interview discussing why he came to NA or what his plans are if he stays in the AHL all year?

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On 2018-01-11 at 8:19 AM, combover said:

A clip from From the Province 

 

I don’t know for certain Philip Holm can make a difference for the Canucks.

I do know for certain when Vancouver signed him in May, it was hoped by the organization he could blossom into a long-term solution on their defence.

In fact, when Benning was asked specifically about the current state of the Canucks rebuild in September, Holm was one of the first players he mentioned, and he seemed excited about the signing.

In the spring, Holm was on Team Sweden’s gold-medal winning world championship team and when it was done, he had several NHL suitors.

Some good teams wanted him, including Toronto. But he chose the Canucks. He bought into the idea there would be opportunity and, to be honest, he bought into Benning’s vision outlined in a Paris meeting.

Holm was told he had a future in Van.

But that vision has since clouded, if it hasn’t disappeared all together.

Holm hasn’t got any chance at all in the NHL and if it continues he’ll be one and done with the organization.

Thing is, Holm has lived up to his side of the bargain. He’s been really good, albeit in Utica.

With the Comets he has 18 points in 28 games — four in his last four — and he’s comfortably made the transition to North American ice.

The Canucks, of course, remain desperate for any kind of offence from their blueline. Despite the emergence of Boeser, the Canucks are 27th in the NHL in offence. One of the key reasons is the blueline can’t generate anything at all.

Vancouver has eight goals from their D combined, for the season.

Tonight was game 43 and it began with one Canucks defenceman who had more than one goal.

That was MDZ and he just got his second of the season Sunday.

It’s all pretty bleak.

The Canucks blueline lineup Tuesday has four goals total. Holm, in the AHL, has six on his own.

You would think, in this environment, the Canucks would be trying to wedge Holm in to at least give him a look in the NHL.

Do they have something in him?

Many believe they do and there are scouts who believe he could be more effective than some of the current Canucks defencemen, including MDZ.

The underlying data indicates there’s a strong-ish probability this may be true.

There are a couple layers to explain why Holm is not happening.

One traces back to the offseason when MDZ was signed. The most consistent criticism of the Canucks summer plan was that they brought in too many veterans.

A couple of questions come to mind.

Why did they think they needed MDZ?

Would they have made the move if they knew they were getting Pouliot?

Probably not.

The argument has been made that it would be bad optics to scratch MDZ after he signed as a free agent.

But what about the Holm situation?

How is this going to look to other European free agents? Especially after the Rodin mess?

Think about it this way, the Canucks D has suffered significant injuries to Stecher, Edler, Gudbranson, and Tanev (3 times now) and neither Holm or Wiercioch have played a single game.

The other issue is a pending Guddy trade. Increasingly, people around the NHL believe this one is inevitable.

But no one right now thinks it is going to happen quickly.

Moving Guddy will clear up some of the log jam.

But if the Canucks are waiting on a bidding war, we could be here for six weeks.

And if it doesn’t happen until the deadline, is it too late for Holm?

If it is, it will come off as a waste for both him and this team

 

from the province.

 

sounds like tryamkin situation all over again except they can leave him in the minors.

 

You like the National Enquirer too I bet.   This is totally baseless drivel.  Anyone who believes that an NHL organization purposefully limits development or promotion of players that will make the team they manage better really needs to check their medication.   If Holm was better with more potential upside than those currently in lineup, he would be playing.   

 

Oh, and if your tinfoil is still on your head, Canucks sent Goldobin back down today because he is clearly better than others in NHL and they want him to go back to Russia so they can waste an asset.   Their plan to get good players to leave is taking form - next will be Boeser who will head to KHL.   

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57 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

You like the National Enquirer too I bet.   This is totally baseless drivel.  Anyone who believes that an NHL organization purposefully limits development or promotion of players that will make the team they manage better really needs to check their medication.   If Holm was better with more potential upside than those currently in lineup, he would be playing.   

 

Oh, and if your tinfoil is still on your head, Canucks sent Goldobin back down today because he is clearly better than others in NHL and they want him to go back to Russia so they can waste an asset.   Their plan to get good players to leave is taking form - next will be Boeser who will head to KHL.   

I know it doesn’t just blindly heap praise on benning so I’m not suprised you don’t like it.

 

holm signed with expectations as did tryamkin that he was sold on by our salesman gm . You think Holm chose Vancouver over other clubs  because benning told him in person we will give you a  solid chance in the AHL. Lol. 

Tryamkin out of shape is was/still better than a totally fit Larsen, Holm should be on the big club because I’m pretty sure that’s what he was sold on and he would have been ,but spender jim like always loses his mind and goes ufa crazy.holm signed in May with  expectation he was sold on then MDZ wiercoat(awful) are signed and pouliot acquired, You still think Holm signs here if he knows he never had a chance of making the NHL. 

but yeah it’s all fabrication Holm is most likely totally happy and satisfied with what’s going on just like tryamkin was and no other ufas agents see this pattern and factor it in with their clients where to sign.

 

you keep reading your fairy tales of lollipops and sunshine and all that benning does and says is gold.

 

 

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2 hours ago, combover said:

I know it doesn’t just blindly heap praise on benning so I’m not suprised you don’t like it.

 

holm signed with expectations as did tryamkin that he was sold on by our salesman gm . You think Holm chose Vancouver over other clubs  because benning told him in person we will give you a  solid chance in the AHL. Lol. 

Tryamkin out of shape is was/still better than a totally fit Larsen, Holm should be on the big club because I’m pretty sure that’s what he was sold on and he would have been ,but spender jim like always loses his mind and goes ufa crazy.holm signed in May with  expectation he was sold on then MDZ wiercoat(awful) are signed and pouliot acquired, You still think Holm signs here if he knows he never had a chance of making the NHL. 

but yeah it’s all fabrication Holm is most likely totally happy and satisfied with what’s going on just like tryamkin was and no other ufas agents see this pattern and factor it in with their clients where to sign.

 

you keep reading your fairy tales of lollipops and sunshine and all that benning does and says is gold.

 

 

I don’t recall saying anything about Benning or candy of any sort but if that works for you to read what you want to read, go for it!   

 

Oh, and have you ever stopped to ask why your team’s GM is purposefully destroying the team and getting rid of prospects he went out his way to procure in the first place?  Any good conspiracy needs some form of an explanation.   Why is your GM signing players like Holm and then purposefully driving them away?   Destiny NT and then making sure he wasn’t happy?   Ever work on the why in your conspiracy?:huh:

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2 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said:

I don’t recall saying anything about Benning or candy of any sort but if that works for you to read what you want to read, go for it!   

 

Oh, and have you ever stopped to ask why your team’s GM is purposefully destroying the team and getting rid of prospects he went out his way to procure in the first place?  Any good conspiracy needs some form of an explanation.   Why is your GM signing players like Holm and then purposefully driving them away?   Destiny NT and then making sure he wasn’t happy?   Ever work on the why in your conspiracy?:huh:

I Never said it was a conspiracy. You did.

Now Poor managment I’ve said that. And I’m pretty sure that’s what the article was getting at. 

I don’t claim to know all the facts I read the story it was interesting i posted it. That’s what happens on discussion boards  maybe  find yourself  and agreeing board were nobody questions anything benning does.

I take every thing with a grain of salt but it’s a reoccurring theme you disagree fine.

The personal attacks are a sign of weakness.

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, combover said:

I Never said it was a conspiracy. You did.

Now Poor managment I’ve said that. And I’m pretty sure that’s what the article was getting at. 

I don’t claim to know all the facts I read the story it was interesting i posted it. That’s what happens on discussion boards  maybe  find yourself  and agreeing board were nobody questions anything benning does.

I take every thing with a grain of salt but it’s a reoccurring theme you disagree fine.

The personal attacks are a sign of weakness.

 

 

 

This has nothing to do with Benning.  You are claiming an NHL team is purposefully burying their talent.   That is called a conspiracy.   I call it fantasy.   That is what is being discussed.   You call that discussion a personal attack.    Interesting how you seem to never like being challenged on your conspiracy theories.   That is what a discussion board is about - if you bring a conspiracy, either invented yourself or by quoting another conspiracy theorist, you will get questioned.   That is not a personal attack.     :)

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7 hours ago, rekker said:

Still hope Holm gets a shot. Had some hope for the guy coming into the year.

Back on topic, I liked this signing and hope he can continue to emerge and push for a spot.   If he is able to break through, would be a great UFA signing but even if he cannot it has been a good thing to improve the D corp in the prospect pool without using any picks or other assets.   

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2 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

This has nothing to do with Benning.  You are claiming an NHL team is purposefully burying their talent.   That is called a conspiracy.   I call it fantasy.   That is what is being discussed.   You call that discussion a personal attack.    Interesting how you seem to never like being challenged on your conspiracy theories.   That is what a discussion board is about - if you bring a conspiracy, either invented yourself or by quoting another conspiracy theorist, you will get questioned.   That is not a personal attack.     :)

Burying better players in the minors would be a tank move, right?  

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1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Burying better players in the minors would be a tank move, right?  

LOL - 100%.    There is a plot to keep the better players in Utica so the NHL team can fail.   Further, by alienating all of Europe it can ensure tankage for decades to come.

 

Gotta admit, it is inventive way of managing - sneaky way of ensuring you have the worst possible team.    

 

maxresdefault.jpg

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3 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

LOL - 100%.    There is a plot to keep the better players in Utica so the NHL team can fail.   Further, by alienating all of Europe it can ensure tankage for decades to come.

 

Gotta admit, it is inventive way of managing - sneaky way of ensuring you have the worst possible team.    

 

maxresdefault.jpg

Holm wouldn’t make a difference to our team, but Demko might?  I don’t think we are tanking, or stealth tanking in any way.  Our current veteran laden roster is just a bottom three group.  

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2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Holm wouldn’t make a difference to our team, but Demko might?  I don’t think we are tanking, or stealth tanking in any way.  Our current veteran laden roster is just a bottom three group.  

I don't think any GM of any NHL team would every try and bury talent to make his team worse.   I do think that up/coming younger talent may stay on the farm sometimes to allow them to get a more rounded game and that can sometimes frustrate the fans (and the prospect) but those decisions come from hours and hours of discussion amongst the entire management team and, as appropriate, with the player.   Professional athletes have pride and no one wants to be held back but the reality is that there are only so many spots for NHL players and each spot needs to be earned.   Putting a younger player into a spot before that spot is earned, and in the Canucks situation it only has to be earned over a number of veterans that are not top end talent (let's face it), does no one any favours and certainly can both destroy the prospect's career let alone the GM looks like an idiot.   There is a balance - it is never perfect but what Detroit did for nearly 20 years in easing talent in and allowing prospects up to three years and even longer in AHL and similar to learn the system allowed a good team to be iced season over season.    

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