Horvats_Big_Head

The Status of This Year's Team is Clear: A Big Head's Take

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Do you think we should trade Ben Hutton?   

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  1. 1. Do you think we should trade Ben Hutton?



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On ‎2018‎-‎01‎-‎11 at 9:56 PM, Horvats_Big_Head said:

After a great start to the year, which saw a remarkable uptick in quality of play versus previous years, the boys caught the injury bug. They are now 2-11 without Horvat in the lineup. Boeser has been an absolute stud, he and the Sedins can't carry this team. So the results are to be expected. 

 

That leaves us in the position we are now, tanking for a shot at the #1 pick and drafting our #1 D man that has eluded this franchise since birth. Yes, Horvat may come back in time and the team could get healthy for a miracle run at the playoffs, but this is very unlikely. We should be tanking which means trading our top UFA assets at the deadline. This would include trading Vanek (a 2nd?) and Gudbranson (3rd?) no question. 

This drop in play and in standings, was caused by injury to key players, not by intentionally tanking. Now that we are at a position, where we are almost mathematically out of it, yes we should trade players that will not resign, or that are UFA's..........simple asset management for a club that will not have those assets regardless in 2 years either way.

 

On ‎2018‎-‎01‎-‎11 at 9:56 PM, Horvats_Big_Head said:

 

This does NOT include trading one of our top young Defensemen, BEN HUTTON. Hutton needs to stay, as we are still not sure if Juolevi will amount to much. I sure think he will but Ben Hutton is our insurance piece. Plus he still could get better. Defensemen progress slower than forwards sometimes. Ben is just in a slump right now and will improve. Trade the vets and all of our useless prospects, such as Cassels. We traded Subban and that was great, but we now have too many prospects who we know will not amount to anything. 

Sorry, Ben Hutton is young, but whether he is a "TOP" young defensemen is extremely debateable, I am not advocating him  bein traded, yet, as I would like to see another year before moving him.....but if the right deal comes along......I would move most

 

On ‎2018‎-‎01‎-‎11 at 9:56 PM, Horvats_Big_Head said:

 

Overall, it has been a very good first half of the season. Some of the most exciting Canucks hockey I've seen in over 5 years. And we are tanking for just one more year, then next year I expect us to take another step forwards. We are about to cash in on a lot of prospects ready to take over, and boy is it going to be a great ride. 

Maybe in energy, but really hard to gauge.......maybe the first half of the first half, before the injuries........2nd half has been disappointing, especially our goaltending....Oh well, better things ahead!

 

On ‎2018‎-‎01‎-‎11 at 9:56 PM, Horvats_Big_Head said:

 

I added a poll to make this thread more interesting. Again, I need to stress that we cannot trade Ben Hutton. 

Well, it is basically a 50/50 split............I think most fans would say yes, "IF" a good offer was made.....................it won't!........

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On 1/17/2018 at 10:44 PM, King Heffy said:

Eriksson is actually responsible defensively and is a useful forward.  Goldobin still hasn't figured out that gliding back to the defensive zone is an issue.  Goldy got the wake-up call because there's no spot in our lineup for a guy who refuses to backcheck.  Virt seems to have learned and is putting in a more consistent effort as the season progresses.

 

 

Nothing against you personally but in general tired of this excuse for Eriksson from people well he plays defensively good, 6M a year to be a good defensively.... Might as well put him on Defense then and be our highest paid Defenseman... His job is to produce offensively that's why he got that contract if he's not producing at 6M a year then he's not doing his job, and all the Defense he does doesn't fill the rest of the holes he's failing in and that is the message to be sent to be better. Goldy yeah sometimes he floated so does Vanek lol, but I brought this up before, find it funny when he played on the line with the Sedins 9/10 times Goldy was the first one back but no one seems to remember that.... Virtanen another one who has started to get more confidence in his game, but even when he was playing less then 10 mins a game he worked hard and had jump in his stride but was still sheltered and scratched over vets when he didn't need to be.

 

Will add again this is a rebuild team and it's expected we will lose games and youth will make mistakes that's part of learning on a rebuild team, but the way it's being coached is if you screw up your on a short leash and I don't agree with that because that's what we're supposed to be going through not winning the Stanley cup this year.

Edited by ChuckNORRIS4Cup
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10 hours ago, TheGuardian_ said:

The players don't purposely lose, management tanks the "team" and the players can blame management. It is when they lose year after year, hundreds of games not just a season, that acceptance creeps in. They start the year with renewed enthusiasm but are waiting for the other shoe to drop, they have a "fragile confidence" and if management doesn't change the shape of the team enough they start doubting the "team" itself.

 

Eventually the pro player start to realize that their bodies are the factor driving their careers and salary, that is one reason why some players play so much better in "contract" years.

 

If the team was tanking from a management plan, then it would not be on the players, but if management is trying for the playoffs and the team keeps losing, then the players start looking around the room and doubt can occur. Too many years of failure will result in acceptance.  

 

One other thing to consider is that almost none of these players have ever had to deal with being on a losing team before and are not equipped for losing season after season. That is why a planned tank works, one maybe two season intentionally tanked and the rebound. The players didn't/don't get a chance to get used to losing.

I didn't mention anything about the players purposely losing so I have no idea why you're even saying that. I also already stated how what you've said is flawed, yet you just keep reiterating the same thing for whatever reason rather than actually debating.

 

Like I've said though, your logic doesn't work as the players are more likely to have the mentality of at least they tried. Had they not tried, things would be far worse as I've kept saying and you haven't really argued at all against....

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On 19/01/2018 at 7:50 AM, EdgarM said:

You don't think what a Captain says in the locker room overrides what anybody else says? What would you think when your Captain sees his brother getting punched out by a Weasel such as Marchand and do absolutely nothing about it. What kind of message does that send? I beg to differ that its just a letter. Kessler went "beast Mode" in the playoffs and who followed him?

I say Daniel, as a leader, had bought into what the coach was preaching - discipline. After all, if your leaders don't buy into what the coach is preaching the coach is completely undermined. Marchand was just tried to goad Daniel into a major to get him off the ice for 5 minutes. Daniel was trying to let Marchand take the penalty. You know, what the coach had been preaching all season. I suspect your ego was bruised more than Daniels.

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On 19/01/2018 at 8:19 AM, TheGuardian_ said:

Did you look at his production? He was playing with the best Bruins his second year, but look beyond his contract year to the previous 4 years. 8 million per year for three years? For that? At his age he is not likely to improve.

Cap hit matters more than salary doesn't it? Front loading it makes it easier to trade him later to a cash strapped team, or buy him out. Nice spin though.

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13 hours ago, Baggins said:

Cap hit matters more than salary doesn't it? Front loading it makes it easier to trade him later to a cash strapped team, or buy him out. Nice spin though.

Signing bonuses make it almost impossible to trade him until 2020

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15 hours ago, Baggins said:

I say Daniel, as a leader, had bought into what the coach was preaching - discipline. After all, if your leaders don't buy into what the coach is preaching the coach is completely undermined. Marchand was just tried to goad Daniel into a major to get him off the ice for 5 minutes. Daniel was trying to let Marchand take the penalty. You know, what the coach had been preaching all season. I suspect your ego was bruised more than Daniels.

No it has nothing to do with my ego I just believe that a team must stick up for each other no matter what, especially if its your own brother. If the coach thought that the strategy of being disciplined in that series was going to help them win then what a brutal coaching strategy. The referees were not helping us one bit and the PP went 2-33.

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21 hours ago, Baggins said:

I say Daniel, as a leader, had bought into what the coach was preaching - discipline. After all, if your leaders don't buy into what the coach is preaching the coach is completely undermined. Marchand was just tried to goad Daniel into a major to get him off the ice for 5 minutes. Daniel was trying to let Marchand take the penalty. You know, what the coach had been preaching all season. I suspect your ego was bruised more than Daniels.

A pushback was required. 

Any semblance would have sufficed.  

History was made. 

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48 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

A pushback was required. 

Any semblance would have sufficed.  

History was made. 

I suppose there's 2 ways of looking at it. It's the officials job to enforce the rules. Daniel trying to let him take a penalty would be the correct course of action. I won't beat the dead horse about how incompetent the officials were during that series, but I remember feeling as if the Canucks were getting called for anything and everything while Boston got away with murder. When you've been conditioned to feel like you'll get a penalty for touching the other team regardless of context it makes you very tentative. The players had no idea what they could get away with and what they couldn't. If Daniel or any other Canuck pushed back, got called for a penalty and gave up a pp goal maybe that costs us the series. The problem was inconsistent officiating more than a lack of pushback IMO

Edited by Samgagner'sface
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I don’t remember it as the Canucks getting beat by the refs though. 

 

The SCF is not a time to rely on refs to decide the game and it is widely accepted that the playoffs see the refs put away their whistles.

 

What exactly was Sedin expecting from the ref? Or from Marchand? 

 

The refs did not decide that or any other SCF by giving out PPs like they do in the regular season. That has been the norm since I’ve been watching. I still don’t know why the team and the fans expected Sedin hockey to work in the playoffs. 

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On 19/01/2018 at 12:50 PM, ChuckNORRIS4Cup said:

Nothing against you personally but in general tired of this excuse for Eriksson from people well he plays defensively good, 6M a year to be a good defensively.... Might as well put him on Defense then and be our highest paid Defenseman... His job is to produce offensively that's why he got that contract if he's not producing at 6M a year then he's not doing his job, and all the Defense he does doesn't fill the rest of the holes he's failing in and that is the message to be sent to be better. Goldy yeah sometimes he floated so does Vanek lol, but I brought this up before, find it funny when he played on the line with the Sedins 9/10 times Goldy was the first one back but no one seems to remember that.... Virtanen another one who has started to get more confidence in his game, but even when he was playing less then 10 mins a game he worked hard and had jump in his stride but was still sheltered and scratched over vets when he didn't need to be.

 

Will add again this is a rebuild team and it's expected we will lose games and youth will make mistakes that's part of learning on a rebuild team, but the way it's being coached is if you screw up your on a short leash and I don't agree with that because that's what we're supposed to be going through not winning the Stanley cup this year.

Thanks for acknowledging that defending L.E. is borderline ludicrous.  My personal fave, and one I've used a couple times, is every team has an anchor or albatross or two that simply bleeding cap space with not much in return.  Id be ok if we paid Sutter like money....

To me this sort of money should get you 25 goals and 55-60 points for it to be fair on both sides.  

 

His other signings aren't bad, but this one sticks out as his worst.  Lucky for us he will be almost done by the time we need it for our young guys.

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Just now, IBatch said:

Thanks for acknowledging that defending L.E. is borderline ludicrous.  My personal fave, and one I've used a couple times, is every team has an anchor or albatross or two that simply bleeding cap space with not much in return.  Id be ok if we paid Sutter like money....

To me this sort of money should get you 25 goals and 55-60 points for it to be fair on both sides.  

 

His other signings aren't bad, but this one sticks out as his worst.  Lucky for us he will be almost done by the time we need it for our young guys.

That money should get you an impact player. 

Lucic might not score 30, but he can hit and fight to change momentum.

I hope JB learns to spend on multifaceted players, when he hands out money like that. 

 

 

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29 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

That money should get you an impact player. 

Lucic might not score 30, but he can hit and fight to change momentum.

I hope JB learns to spend on multifaceted players, when he hands out money like that. 

 

 

I'd much rather have Lucic on our team, even if he's scoring 50 and L.E. is scoring 70.  It's pretty disappointing so far.  Part of his production decline has a lot to do with his line mates, but hes got the pedigree to overcome that better than he's done so far.  Personally for better or worse I'd play him with the Sedins.  I think eventually they would start clicking...and if not I think it makes it easier on the rest of team as far as expectations and match ups goes.  On paper it sure looks like two scoring lines too.

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