Kinder Morgan Pipeline Talk

[JM_]

I really hate it when they play up the phrase "7 fold increase in traffic!" - yeah, from 1 per week to 1 per day. Its not going to clog the harbour. We have to get things to a place where we can discuss this stuff rationally, sans hyperbole. 

[MikeyBoy44]

While perhaps more opinion still this story also kinda confirms what alot of us have been saying. 

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/4657720/b-c-researcher-argues-anti-alberta-oil-campaigns-about-protecting-u-s-interests-not-environment/amp/

 

 

B.C. researcher argues anti-Alberta oil campaigns about protecting U.S. interests, not environment

 

 

Anti-oil campaigns have called Alberta’s industry “the tar sands,” “Alberta’s dirty oil” and “Canada’s most embarrassing secret.”

But during an interview with Global Edmonton anchor Jennifer Crosby on Monday, a British Columbia researcher said the campaign against Alberta oil is more about American economic interests than protecting the environment.

 

Vivian Krause has been researching the oilsands for nearly a decade and she told her studies have led her to believe the push against the oilsands is funded by American philanthropists in an effort to land-lock Alberta oil so it cannot reach overseas markets, where it would attain a higher price per barrel.

 

 

“I’m sure the reason they are doing it is because of the environment and because of climate-related problems, but the trouble is it’s not helping the environment because the oil, if it doesn’t come from Alberta, it’s just coming from some other country.”

 

Krause said the campaign was originally funded by charitable organizations from California and the philanthropic organization Rockefeller Brothers Fund, which was created with funding from the famous Rockefeller family.

 

 

Krause said the group got together around the time of the Iraq war and California energy crisis in 2003-2004 and strategized how to get control of the United States’ domestic energy policy. She said the group now funds the Tides Foundation in San Francisco and the New Venture Fund in Washington, D.C.

 

“I think they have four goals, three of which are great: renewable energy, energy efficiency, energy security, that’s all good. But it’s the fourth goal — this idea of keeping Canada out of the global market — that’s where I think we need to bring an end to this campaign.

 

“Because unless we do, I don’t see much hope for any pipeline,” Krause said.

 

The Corporate Ethics Tar Sands Campaign website indicates its goal is to land-lock Alberta oil by blocking proposed pipelines, so the crude does not reach the international market where it can garner a high price per barrel. Krause said the acknowledgement on the website has been a game-changer for her, arguing the environmental lobby should applaud Alberta Premier Rachel Notley creation of strong environmental regulations for the oil industry.

 

Greenpeace Canada climate organizer Mike Hudema said the organization’s environmental activism is based on science, and said Krause’s research is based on “unsubstantiated conspiracy theories.”

 

“If Vivian wants to talk about, foreign influence, she should look into the massive amount of foreign dollars and foreign ownership of the oilsands that are poured into and influence our government at both the provincial and federal level all the time, but she never asks those questions,” Hudema said.

 

Hudema said Greenpeace is almost entirely funded by individuals who donate between $10-$20 and is not directed by corporate interests.

“We’ve got to ask themselves, ‘Why Alberta has been singled out, even though it’s the only jurisdiction in the world with a cap on emissions from oilsands, the only place with a carbon tax as it is, and even though the province has created a very large boreal forest reserve? Why is there is there still a campaign against Alberta?” Krause said.

 



Krause said the anti-Alberta oil campaign bullies Alberta and Canada, and does nothing to reduce global oil use.

Krause spoke about her research in Edmonton on Monday and will be speaking in Fort McMurray on Thursday.

[Dash Riprock]

Exciting option to Trans Mountain!

 

Fraser Interim Detour Option: Brings WCS Discount Near Zero

 

The Fraser Interim Detour Option (FIDO) involves terminating the existing pipeline right at the Continental Divide Alberta/BC border near Valemount, the headwaters of the Fraser River, and shooting the oil through high pressure monitors directly over the mountain into the drainage, where it slowly oozes down and flows to tidewater. Without the restrictive, uncooperative, regulatory gridlocked BC pipe portion ahead of it, the present Trans Mountain Pipeline on the Alberta side could quadruple it's capacity by being able to run at over design pressure, along with some simple modifications.

After the oil winds it's way down the 1375km long Fraser River, it would be caught and recovered by a series of large surface log boom arrays and vacuum barges positioned at strategic points throughout the delta.  It gets separated and pumped into VLCC ships quietly at anchor safely away from the Southern Resident Killer Whale sensitive areas in the Straight of Georgia.

Billions and billions of newly recovered revenue would be rolling in from all the previously stranded Alberta oil which would be sold at world market prices without any WCS discount. A portion of the cash windfall could be put into a trust account to pay for clean up costs, import some lost fish for the locals, and even include a few jars of new salmon eggs to plant if the TMX expansion ever gets approved and construction starts.

Some oil volume losses would be expected due to BC's summer forest fires creating a few isolated river oil infernos (making Hell's Canyon a must see tourist attraction on everyone's bucket list), and there would also be some losses of oil due to the absorbtion by billions of bird feathers. Suprisingly, up to 75% of the oil could be wasted due to environmental and other factors before approaching the break even point, as present economic losses now incurred with the current WCS discount are so brutally devastating.

The Alberta energy pricing situation has actually become so dire and critical, that the Fraser Interim Detour Option (FIDO) is increasingly a viable option to save our country and industry from the current Liberal path of economic ruin, and at the same time provide new funding to those whining for new Eco friendly whale rescue centres with solar powered boats made of floating hemp bundles. 

 

[Violator]

On 2018-11-13 at 4:38 PM, MikeyBoy44 said:

While perhaps more opinion still this story also kinda confirms what alot of us have been saying. 

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/4657720/b-c-researcher-argues-anti-alberta-oil-campaigns-about-protecting-u-s-interests-not-environment/amp/

 

 

 

 

What people on here have been saying for months if not years.

[Gurn]

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/oil-vessel-off-the-newfoundland-coast-spills-250000-litres-of-crude-into-the-ocean/ar-BBPMWzD?ocid=spartandhp

 

"An oil leak from a flowline to a vessel off the coast of Newfoundland caused an estimated 250,000 litres of crude to spill into the ocean, Husky Energy said Friday."

 

"

Once swells shrink to four metres, remote-controlled vehicles can be sent to navigate the area around the tanker, McConnell said.

Until then, responders are unable to confirm whether the flowline is still leaking, she said."

"

The SeaRose was shut down earlier this year after the petroleum board found Husky violated operations protocols during a near miss with an iceberg in 2017.

In that incident, the vessel did not properly disconnect the lines which it uses to onboard oil as the iceberg approached.

More than 80 crew members and 340,000 barrels of oil were on the vessel at the time, according to the board. An investigation showed the decision not to disconnect was "economically driven," according to documents obtained by CBC News at the time."

[Warhippy]

1 hour ago, gurn said:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/oil-vessel-off-the-newfoundland-coast-spills-250000-litres-of-crude-into-the-ocean/ar-BBPMWzD?ocid=spartandhp

 

"An oil leak from a flowline to a vessel off the coast of Newfoundland caused an estimated 250,000 litres of crude to spill into the ocean, Husky Energy said Friday."

 

"

Once swells shrink to four metres, remote-controlled vehicles can be sent to navigate the area around the tanker, McConnell said.

Until then, responders are unable to confirm whether the flowline is still leaking, she said."

"

The SeaRose was shut down earlier this year after the petroleum board found Husky violated operations protocols during a near miss with an iceberg in 2017.

In that incident, the vessel did not properly disconnect the lines which it uses to onboard oil as the iceberg approached.

More than 80 crew members and 340,000 barrels of oil were on the vessel at the time, according to the board. An investigation showed the decision not to disconnect was "economically driven," according to documents obtained by CBC News at the time."

It's almost like...there is someone or some entity somewhere  feeding the no pipeline side arguments that they can use seamlessly to push the reason why not to have this project go through

[Gurn]

It is more like there are pros:

Jobs

Money

Self sufficiency

 

and cons:

spills

marine damage

marine animal deaths

[Dash Riprock]

On 11/13/2018 at 5:38 PM, MikeyBoy44 said:

While perhaps more opinion still this story also kinda confirms what alot of us have been saying. 

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/4657720/b-c-researcher-argues-anti-alberta-oil-campaigns-about-protecting-u-s-interests-not-environment/amp/

 

 

 

 

Those American philanthropists know how to get the job done. Our oil now goes for $13 a barrel.  Mexico gets over $60 for the same stuff.

[MikeyBoy44]

9 hours ago, Dash Riprock said:

Those American philanthropists know how to get the job done. Our oil now goes for $13 a barrel.  Mexico gets over $60 for the same stuff.

Exactly. And until we find a way to get our oil to the open market Canada's economy will continue to lose hundreds of millions. If only mother nature paid so well. 

[LordCanuck]

On 11/17/2018 at 12:09 PM, gurn said:

It is more like there are pros:

Jobs

Money

Self sufficiency

 

and cons:

spills

marine damage

marine animal deaths

Self sufficiency, lol, we should be investing heavily into green technology at this point. lets be world leaders at that, they create more or will create more jobs than fossil fuels ever will. a few thousand added jobs is a joke and what money? these multinational companies own the oil, pay no or nearly no taxes, get subsidized out the wazzo. 

 

This is all being figured out 20 years too late, should have been build in the 90s. Demand for oil is peaking and prices are crashing again. Canadian oils worth like 15 bucks a barrel which is a joke.

 

Edited November 18, 2018 by LordCanuck

[MikeyBoy44]

1 hour ago, LordCanuck said:

Self sufficiency, lol, we should be investing heavily into green technology at this point. lets be world leaders at that, they create more or will create more jobs than fossil fuels ever will. a few thousand added jobs is a joke and what money? these multinational companies own the oil, pay no or nearly no taxes, get subsidized out the wazzo. 

 

This is all being figured out 20 years too late, should have been build in the 90s. Demand for oil is peaking and prices are crashing again. Canadian oils worth like 15 bucks a barrel which is a joke.

 

Invest what money? At this point there is none to invest with. If only there was a way Canada could capitalize on the oil prices while at the same time investing profits into greener variants... if only there was a way...

[Dash Riprock]

On 11/18/2018 at 5:19 PM, MikeyBoy44 said:

Invest what money? At this point there is none to invest with. If only there was a way Canada could capitalize on the oil prices while at the same time investing profits into greener variants... if only there was a way...

This morning a major player in the oil sands suddenly shut down all it's drilling and sent everyone home. Half drilled holes all over the place.  Can't absorb $15 a barrel oil.  The good news for the workers is they will be moving to the US where oil has a means of accessing markets.  A huge victory for American philanthropists and our First Nations community.

 

Edited November 21, 2018 by Dash Riprock

[MikeyBoy44]

35 minutes ago, Dash Riprock said:

This morning a major player in the oil sands suddenly shut down all it's drilling and sent everyone home. Half drilled holes all over the place.  Can't absorb $15 a barrel oil.  The good news for the workers is they will be moving to the US where oil has a means of accessing markets.  A huge victory for American philanthropists and our First Nations community.

 

That's pretty much what's happening out here right now. Any American based oil companies are heading back south. Pace has slowed down to a small crawl. I mean sure I am slightly biased due to it directly affecting my life, but at the same time (while noting your last line was a tongue in cheek line) how anyone in Canada can consider this a win is mind blowing. Anytime an industry as big as this is the entire country will feel it. If people aren't making money how are we supposed to spend it?

[JM_]

56 minutes ago, Dash Riprock said:

This morning a major player in the oil sands suddenly shut down all it's drilling and sent everyone home. Half drilled holes all over the place.  Can't absorb $15 a barrel oil.  The good news for the workers is they will be moving to the US where oil has a means of accessing markets.  A huge victory for American philanthropists and our First Nations community.

 

first off, excellent old tyme reference on the avitar.

 

But I wouldn't lump all first nations into this as a victory, many want to see and participate in resource development. 

[Dash Riprock]

11 minutes ago, MikeyBoy44 said:

That's pretty much what's happening out here right now. Any American based oil companies are heading back south. Pace has slowed down to a small crawl. I mean sure I am slightly biased due to it directly affecting my life, but at the same time (while noting your last line was a tongue in cheek line) how anyone in Canada can consider this a win is mind blowing. Anytime an industry as big as this is the entire country will feel it. If people aren't making money how are we supposed to spend it?

Yesterday a Canadian financial institution stated Canada is transferring $89 million a day to the US due to lack of pipeline capacity.

[JM_]

17 minutes ago, MikeyBoy44 said:

That's pretty much what's happening out here right now. Any American based oil companies are heading back south. Pace has slowed down to a small crawl. I mean sure I am slightly biased due to it directly affecting my life, but at the same time (while noting your last line was a tongue in cheek line) how anyone in Canada can consider this a win is mind blowing. Anytime an industry as big as this is the entire country will feel it. If people aren't making money how are we supposed to spend it?

a lot of people will say just get the green economy going, but its not that easy. If you want a timeline for when that might be a reality, Horgan announced yesterday that he wants to legislate all new cars and light trucks to be zero emission or electric by 2040. Thats the timeline we're looking at for the green shift, 20 years not tomorrow. So what to do in the meantime? 

[MikeyBoy44]

1 hour ago, Dash Riprock said:

Yesterday a Canadian financial institution stated Canada is transferring $89 million a day to the US due to lack of pipeline capacity.

I just don't understand how anyone can let it get to a point where you have to pay to unload your goods. But hey at least Trump is happy.

[Alflives]

2 hours ago, Dash Riprock said:

This morning a major player in the oil sands suddenly shut down all it's drilling and sent everyone home. Half drilled holes all over the place.  Can't absorb $15 a barrel oil.  The good news for the workers is they will be moving to the US where oil has a means of accessing markets.  A huge victory for American philanthropists and our First Nations community.

 

Alberta's economy has been directly connected to Oil since the big Leduc strike.  Now, with interest in the tar sands diminishing, their economy is (again) on the skids.  House prices there will drop by big numbers.  I wonder if one of their hockey teams relocates?

[MikeyBoy44]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Alberta's economy has been directly connected to Oil since the big Leduc strike.  Now, with interest in the tar sands diminishing, their economy is (again) on the skids.  House prices there will drop by big numbers.  I wonder if one of their hockey teams relocates?

Interest in the tar sands has not diminished. Infact it is the total opposite. They building more projects up there.

 

Edit: Also why does it seem like anyone not in Alberta thinks it is only the tar sands that exist out here? 

Edited November 21, 2018 by MikeyBoy44

[Violator]

6 hours ago, MikeyBoy44 said:

Interest in the tar sands has not diminished. Infact it is the total opposite. They building more projects up there.

 

Edit: Also why does it seem like anyone not in Alberta thinks it is only the tar sands that exist out here? 

Ignorance would be the big reason why people think its only fort mac