Warhippy Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 8 minutes ago, HerrDrFunk said: Yes. I'd say buyer beware when signing UFA defencemen from the high offense Capitals in a contract year. http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=58069 http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=74658 Edit** Not saying he's not a decent looking top 4 point getting defenceman. But we've seen what happens to stable defencemen once they leave the shelter of one of the top 5 teams in the league Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerrDrFunk Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 1 minute ago, Canucks Curse said: No. He plays for a stacked offensive team and he has broken 40 points once, lol, not a defensive specialist and ...7 mill? Erik "career -36" Karlsson is a defensive specialist? You're also ignoring that Carlson was well on track to crack 40 in 2016 and 2017 too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 It would cost a fortune. Not just his salary, the Canucks would have to give up the 1st this year (Dahlin, Boqvist, Bouchard, Zadina, Svechnikov, etc) and some valued prospects (Juolevi, Gadjovich, Dahlen, etc). For what? Karlsson won't be winning us a Cup during his short time here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerrDrFunk Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 1 minute ago, Warhippy said: I'd say buyer beware when signing UFA defencemen from the high offense Capitals in a contract year. http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=58069 http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=74658 I can see where you're coming from with Green but are you seriously comparing Carlson to Alzner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroSen Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Would they take Eriksson and is contract from us in such a trade? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toni Zamboni Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 if were going all in for a stud dman...i would rather target Dahlin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 1 minute ago, WiseOne said: Would they take Eriksson and is contract from us in such a trade? If we could do that I think I'd prefer to see Weber come our way and we send Loui to Montreal. We'd likely get the same production out of Weber for a much lower AAV. And he probably ends up on LTIR for the last couple of years of that deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks Curse Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 2 minutes ago, Toni Zamboni said: if were going all in for a stud dman...i would rather target Dahlin. thats a good idea Dahlin for OJ + our first and Hutton? But the thing is who would want to trade Dahlin, does not have the issues Karlsson comes with - cap, attitude, age etc, so why would anyone trade Dahlin/1st OA? Now if you offered me Horvat and Boeser and Petterson for Dahlin sure, but that is silly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush17 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 38 minutes ago, VanGnome said: I still dont make that trade taking out Juolevi. But Ottawa likely stays firm on getting quality back for Karlsson which is why a deal with Vancouver is unlikely to transpire. If anything I say we make a pitch to sign Karlsson as a UFA. No need for the Canucks to sell the farm for a pending UFA when we aren't even going to make the playoffs this year. That would just be stupid asset and risk management, there's zero guarantee Karlsson resigns here, although any deal pending an extension to be agreed upon would be an option. I think based on his cap projections it's better to walk away then. We have good depth we just need time to get all the pieces ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Dahlin would probably be more expensive than Karlsson. Besides, I don't see any team trading the 1st this year, similar to the idea of EDM trading their 1st in 2015 (McDavid). Not gonna happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodycanuckleheads Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I'm not as convinced as everyone here that Juolevi's going to be a top-of-the-heap NHL defenseman. Heck, just this week, he got healthy-scratched twice! And, when he came back, he was a bottom-pairing defenseman in the Liiga! A top-5 pick shouldn't be getting healthy-scratched in the 5th best league a year and a half after his draft. That's not a good sign. His coach is also complaining that he's tired - after 35 games this season. How's he supposed to handle 82 (plus up to 28 more) games in the world's #1 league, if 35 is already wearing him down? If we could package him and our pick (Dahlin-protected, of course), for the best defenseman in the league who's still relatively young, we should probably consider it. Strongly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 22 minutes ago, HerrDrFunk said: I can see where you're coming from with Green but are you seriously comparing Carlson to Alzner? I absolutely am. 2 very different defencemen coming from the Washington system and both suffered enormously once they weren't sheltered Buyer beware Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kloubek Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 2 hours ago, HerrDrFunk said: Obviously not but John Carlson is still a #1 D on at least 20 teams. Plus I'm relatively certain he would know what to do on a PP with Boeser. Not denying that - Carlson would be a nice addition. I'm just saying that's why you'd pay more for Karlsson. 2 hours ago, Monty said: Thing is, in 5 years time, most teams in the NHL will likely have at least one contract of $10M+. So if you’re going to have that, best to use it on one of the best players in the NHL. Actually, this is a fair point. With the cap going up and wages following in kind, $10m (it would probably take more) won't seem like such a huge wage in 5 years time. Still don't like the idea much, but it makes it a bit more palatable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shift-4 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 At times last year I saw him as the best player in the game. I would be quite happy to have him. It is just a measure of what it takes to get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kloubek Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 24 minutes ago, Toni Zamboni said: if were going all in for a stud dman...i would rather target Dahlin. I was thinking about that as well. So, we should be getting a top 6 pick. How much would it cost us to move from whatever position we get to 1st, and would it be more or less than it would cost to acquire Karlsson? It would certainly help from a cost perspective - at least for the first 3 years. Then there is the question as to whether or not Dahlin will indeed develop into the best defenseman in the NHL as hoped, so there is a risk factor as well. Say for the sake of argument we get 5th overall. What do you guys think would we have to give up to make that the 1st OA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sbriggs Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 5 hours ago, canuckleface77 said: @dellowhockey on how: http://bit.ly/2DSfJOq Botch also discusses it in the Provies: http://theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks/the-provies-gaunce-v-jpat-a-guddy-warning-a-hawks-warning-and-the-karlsson-case So Canuck Nation...a Karlsson, Petersson, Boeser PP does kinda have a nice ring to it. THOUGHTS? No Karlsson please. Draft and develope unless we can get a defenceman in our age group Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shift-4 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 3 hours ago, D-Money said: Was my first thought as well. But then I saw the article was not only from The Athletic, but was written by Tyler Dellow - someone very knowledgeable whose opinions I respect - so I gave it a read, and there were some great points. ........... Thanks for sharing the article. It is very well written. The only thing I am curious about is what we offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tower102 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 2 minutes ago, kloubek said: I was thinking about that as well. So, we should be getting a top 6 pick. How much would it cost us to move from whatever position we get to 1st, and would it be more or less than it would cost to acquire Karlsson? It would certainly help from a cost perspective - at least for the first 3 years. Then there is the question as to whether or not Dahlin will indeed develop into the best defenseman in the NHL as hoped, so there is a risk factor as well. Say for the sake of argument we get 5th overall. What do you guys think would we have to give up to make that the 1st OA? Think about it this way, if we got the 1st overall, what would it take for us to trade down to 5? I wouldn't consider it unless it was absolutely outrageous. It would be a massively risky move to trade Dahlin so you would have to be 100% sure you are winning the trade now and in the future. And a trade like that doesn't make sense for the team trying to move up. I think when you are dealing with two unknown commodities like high end draft picks, you trade from the perspective of whats the best mine will turn out to be vs the worst theirs will turn out to be for risk management. This is likely why we never see trades like this, and it is even harder when the 1st overall is a clear 1st and a potential franchise player. Can you imagine what would have happened if Edmonton traded down with McDavid, or Toronto with Matthews. If I was a team that won the 1st overall this year it would take Boeser, Petterson or Horvat along with the 5th pick for me to make the trade. Even then dependent on which team it is and their needs I might still be hesitant. From the Canucks perspective, I wouldn't trade any of those 3 with the pick for Dahlin, so it wouldn't get anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c00kies Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 The thing is, it would likely cost us our first and Pettersson to start, and those are two key, young pieces we need to build around. If it was simply a free agency signing, then you'd only have to worry about managing the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 20 minutes ago, kloubek said: I was thinking about that as well. So, we should be getting a top 6 pick. How much would it cost us to move from whatever position we get to 1st, and would it be more or less than it would cost to acquire Karlsson? It would certainly help from a cost perspective - at least for the first 3 years. Then there is the question as to whether or not Dahlin will indeed develop into the best defenseman in the NHL as hoped, so there is a risk factor as well. Say for the sake of argument we get 5th overall. What do you guys think would we have to give up to make that the 1st OA? For Karlsson or the 1st OA this year Our 1st round pick and one or two of OJ/Boeser/Petterson/Horvat Simply put, it's not worth it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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