Green Building Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 1 hour ago, RRypien37 said: This is why I stopped eating seafood a few years ago. The oceans are already so incredibly polluted as it stands, you are pretty much poisoning yourself every time you eat any. That's a pretty silly narrative. While you're at it, you should probably stop eating commercially grown fruits and vegetables, farm raised animals, and processed foods of any kind, you know, just to be safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lock Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, inane said: It's incredibly obtuse to try to make the argument that because I think x I therefore think y with absolutely no supporting rationale as to why I think y or why y is the only possible alternative that I could be thinking of. It's intentionally obtuse because they know it's an inane argument to make but it easily makes my position look weak by fabricating it to such an extreme position that anyone who reads it would say 'wow what a ridiculous argument'. Cause it is a ridiculous argument and one I would obviously never make. But that's again why he did it. Better? Well considering the first thing you said in this thread was that he was being stupid and then continued calling him names, that's certainly going to justify a whole lot of your arguments, right? I understand if someone's offended, but I can't understand acting like a kid about it. If you disagree with someone, why not just say "I disagree" and then point out why? Anyway, I digress. It's your call how you want to react to things, but it baffles me what people think they can accomplish from kicking and screaming rather than debating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inane Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Just now, The Lock said: Well considering the first thing you said in this thread was that he was being stupid and then continued calling him names, that's certainly going to justify a whole lot of your arguments, right? I understand if someone's offended, but I can't understand acting like a kid about it. If you disagree with someone, why not just say "I disagree" and then point out why? Anyway, I digress. It's your call how you want to react to things, but it baffles me what people think they can accomplish from kicking and screaming rather than debating. His argument is stupid. I don't know about him. That's different. It's hard to discuss with someone when their starting point is so wildly intellectually dishonest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lock Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Just now, inane said: His argument is stupid. I don't know about him. That's different. It's hard to discuss with someone when their starting point is so wildly intellectually dishonest. If you want respect with what you are saying then you have to respect him, regardless of if you think it's stupid or not. It's hard to discuss with someone when you keep calling them stupid and somehow magically expect to come out on top. That's not how debates work. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Absolutely. And you will be on the bill for some costs in one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inane Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Lock said: If you want respect with what you are saying then you have to respect him, regardless of if you think it's stupid or not. It's hard to discuss with someone when you keep calling them stupid and somehow magically expect to come out on top. That's not how debates work. lol Again, he's not stupid. The argument that he made is. Those are different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 2 hours ago, inane said: lol what kind of ridiculous strawman is this lol Talking to you is like talking to a wall, pointless and a waste of time. Peace out. At least I can have a intelligent convo with Jimmy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 4 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said: Yes, however the issue is does one province - AB - have the right to put another provinces economy at risk? AB wants its billion dollars from oil through this line, but BC also wants its billion dollar fishing industry. Both provinces have a right to their resources, and I don't believe the issue has really been tested in court. If its the case that AB can do something that can't be cleaned up or permanently damages the BC fishing economy, then why shoudln't BC do something that equally threatens the AB economy or be allowed to stop it? In this case the risk-reward is very imbalanced. AB gets most of the money, BC takes most of the risk. There's a fundamental unfairness to this that can't be brushed off. That is why one needs a strong federal government which Canada right now is lacking. You need leadership that can bridge these impasses versus looking for new ways to be politically correct about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 5 hours ago, The Lock said: Crap Music - hope you don’t listen to this stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 38 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: That is why one needs a strong federal government which Canada right now is lacking. You need leadership that can bridge these impasses versus looking for new ways to be politically correct about them. A strong CDN government would never approved a pipeline to transport low revenue toxic Tar sludge into a Vancouver Harbour. Encouraging / supporting a dead / dying industry and global warming at the same time. That is not leadership. Leaders make brave decisions that are long term good for all of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heretic Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 3 hours ago, inane said: Again, he's not stupid. The argument that he made is. Those are different things. I'm just giving back what you threw - if you call that "stupid" then you're calling your argument stupid. I can't help it if you fail to see it. Oh, I did preface it with "sarcasm" so as to not go too far over your head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heretic Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 On 8/14/2017 at 9:46 AM, inane said: Harv is an obvious troll, self admittedly. Heretic says obtuse things like 'context or not' and that should be mocked. All communication is about context. To just ignore it so you can make your meaningless point is ridiculous. 3 hours ago, inane said: lol at this. so incredibly intentionally obtuse. So what you're really saying is, only yourself is allowed to mock anyone, but heaven forbid someone mocking you. Edit: Oops, I mean "mocking what someone says" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 14, 2018 Author Share Posted February 14, 2018 4 hours ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: Too much focusing on the worst possible scenario doesn’t do anybody any good. If we all did that to our everyday lives we’d be living in bubble wrap. I risked flying in an airplane in December. But I know the chances of the worse possible outcoming happening were so slim that it was worth taking, so I could enjoy the whistler slopes. Chances of the worst case tanker spill in BC is just above 0% Says the guy sitting in Calgary How about this, if AB oil spills on the BC Coast, then AB has to pay us all its royalties for as long as it takes to clean it up. You shouldn't worry, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRypien37 Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 3 hours ago, chon derry said: NO, have you even been to B.C. ? the entire west coast of Vancouver island , and the rest of the west coast north of Vancouver island ,all the way up the Alaskan pan handle is still fairly pristine comparted to the densely populated east coast . from the northern tip of van isle to the Alaskan border 54 40 LAT. there might be 20,000 people over 270 miles. the only contamimated fish ,seafood i'm aware of is the long lived species like red snapper (70 80 yrs) or the large bivalves ,geoducks have lead contaminantes , the problem on the west coast is OVER FISHING , throw in the mismanagement of the fisheries not all sectors ,but the salmon for instance (dwindiling) and cant compete with a harmful atlantic salmon farm fish. So trying to protect whats left in our Ocean IS important, certain fish specie's are already at critical levels I don't understand why that's so hard to comprehend. by pipeline ,tanker advocates? a total unwillingness to acknowledge 'OUR ' resource's or our willingness to fight to protect those resources ,the irony of it all one day there will be no fish, one day there will be no oil. CAN YOU SAY GREED.? I live in Vancouver and have been all along the west coast all the way up to Alaska. The water can be clean, doesn't mean it isn't contaminated. The radiation alone from Fukushima is a huge concern, not to mentioned the countless other spills or leaks from numerous sources that happen all the time. Like it or not all the worlds oceans are dirty at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attila Umbrus Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 3 hours ago, Green Building said: It's not well known what happens with them on the China spill scale, and if it is it hasn't been made public knowledge yet. Feel free to add any inside info you may have on the subject. As for your next point, negligence is exactly why some people are fed up with it. I understand there is a huge market for oil, I myself use it on a daily basis, but that doesn't for a second mean that we can't as a province demand more of Alberta for assuming the risk. The idea that a spill is worse than it should have been because people were dragging there feet staring at the clock or selling off stock is precisely the problem. I'm also of the mindset that we're getting boned day in and day out over softwood lumber, so why we're selling any unrefined products at all is as stupid as letting Yanks come up and log our land for a fee. We should be refining our own product, at least then it would be somewhat cleaner to ship, but more importantly we'd have more jobs here instead of shipping them wherever the oil goes. I see your point now, with the magnitude of the spill size. I was just stating that they do know how condensate and other products spread thru water, they call them dispersement models. We use them to determine gas leaks as well. IE: say a gas leak occurs on a section of pipeline, we have to determine as operators of the pipeline that it is an actual leak. Once leak is determined we go about isolating the issue to control the damage (isolating the pipeline and shutting the flow of gas off), we then look at our dispersement models to see how far a potential gas release on said pipe line will go, then create an action plan to resolve the issue. If residents are near by we must go door to door to evacuate or tell people to shelter in place (their home). Long story short these are all things that are paid for by industry so we know how to reduce the impact as much as we can if an incident does occur. We have maps hanging on our board room walls of our pipelines and gathering system marked up with estimated release zones so we know as best we can how large the effected area will be. And practice our emergency response plans yearly. For the condensate spill in China, they know the volume of the released fluid, and they know from spill dispersion models how condensate will move through salt water, on and on. But the question is whether they executed on an emergency response plan quick enough to reduce the damage and contain the area. This is however China we are talking about and I’ve worked with guys in the past who have been over there for work...their health, safety, and environmenta regulations are behind the times to put it frankly. So from my birds eye view of the spill i’d say the mess that now has occurred was due to negligence and sub standard practices more than anything. Unfortunately the the rest of the world does not follow Canada in its safe practices in health/safety/environmental policies. We are one of the most stringent countries in the world for these kinds of work place practices. Norway and Australia are close. But for mega oil and gas producers of the world we are top notch...take that for whatever it’s worth. I’m just glad we live in a country that is forward thinking in these areas when it comes to industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRypien37 Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 3 hours ago, Green Building said: That's a pretty silly narrative. While you're at it, you should probably stop eating commercially grown fruits and vegetables, farm raised animals, and processed foods of any kind, you know, just to be safe. I don't eat meat so yes. I try to get a much organic food as possible as well. Obviously you can never be fully protected, doesn't mean you can't do your best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Would you piss in the well in your back yard ? What if someone paid you 20 bucks.... then would you ? How would you justify this to your wife and kids... ? Say no to Kinder Morgan toxic tar sludge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riffraff Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Rob_Zepp said: That is why one needs a strong federal government which Canada right now is lacking. You need leadership that can bridge these impasses versus looking for new ways to be politically correct about them. Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Give up your car, and Big house, and comfortable lifestyle, and all the benefits of living in our developed society, because that’s what it will take to remove oil use from our advanced world. The terrible spill, like the one off China, are a an evil that we are ALL responsible for. The Kinder Morgan pipeline, and many other oil delivery systems will be built. It’s inevitable. People will not accept giving up their pleasures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 10 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: Says the guy sitting in Calgary How about this, if AB oil spills on the BC Coast, then AB has to pay us all its royalties for as long as it takes to clean it up. You shouldn't worry, right? Sure, the only thing i'd have to worry about is some loonie protestors... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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