theo5789 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Apple Juice said: Honestly I believe Tatar will have a bounce back year. Detroit was just a bad team overall this year and a change of scenery may help him. I'll give him some time in the offseason, training camp, preseason and maybe first couple of months of next season before I really start to assess if the Tatar trade was a success or if it was another McPhee flop. Neal is at 5m this year and Tatar at 5.3m so really its not that big of a difference. If Tatar doesn't produce similar to Neal, then Vegas will have a problem but for now, it's a decent deal up until the point where Tatar isn't producing at the level he should be. Vegas has about 26 million in cap to work with assuming they don't re-sign anyone (unlikely) so it's not a bad deal for them up until the point they need to start giving raises to a few players like Tuch, Subban, Glass, Suzuki, etc. I mentioned that they have lots of cap space so it's not a critical problem, but that doesn't make the deal any better. Of course he can bounce back next season, but this was a trade deadline deal, so one has to believe this should have been a move to bolster their immediate future. To me, it looks like maybe Detroit wanted to dump his cap and do it before his NTC kicked in. The leverage should've been all towards Vegas and they gave up not only a 1st, but two more higher end picks for a player having his worst season. If Vegas was throwing 1sts around, Baertschi could've been a better option who is younger, likely to be cheaper, has been trending up and was on pace for 45 points this year (Tatar's best season was only 56 points 4 seasons ago). If Leipsic turns into a decent player for us, it could be another lopsided trade because currently Holm's AHL production has dropped off since leaving Utica. I would say this was a pretty bad trade deadline for Vegas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apple Juice Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 On 2018-04-24 at 10:27 PM, theo5789 said: I mentioned that they have lots of cap space so it's not a critical problem, but that doesn't make the deal any better. Of course he can bounce back next season, but this was a trade deadline deal, so one has to believe this should have been a move to bolster their immediate future. To me, it looks like maybe Detroit wanted to dump his cap and do it before his NTC kicked in. The leverage should've been all towards Vegas and they gave up not only a 1st, but two more higher end picks for a player having his worst season. If Vegas was throwing 1sts around, Baertschi could've been a better option who is younger, likely to be cheaper, has been trending up and was on pace for 45 points this year (Tatar's best season was only 56 points 4 seasons ago). If Leipsic turns into a decent player for us, it could be another lopsided trade because currently Holm's AHL production has dropped off since leaving Utica. I would say this was a pretty bad trade deadline for Vegas. Made sense for Detroit like you said. Gives them the room to sign Athanasiou early in the offseason and give a significant raise to Larkin and small raise for Mantha and Bertuzzi.. For Vegas, I guess it was just an extra push to get the deal done. I'm sure they'll try and snag a late 1st somewhere during the draft if possible or an extra 2nd. They've got 7 picks this year and 11 next year so I don't think they're too worried about losing draft picks.. Tatar at least can play on the top 6 on a good team whereas Baertschi won't scratch top six minutes on a good/healthy team. But I see your point... I guess Vegas just really wanted to get it done and sent the 1st as a sweetener Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theo5789 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 21 minutes ago, Apple Juice said: Made sense for Detroit like you said. Gives them the room to sign Athanasiou early in the offseason and give a significant raise to Larkin and small raise for Mantha and Bertuzzi.. For Vegas, I guess it was just an extra push to get the deal done. I'm sure they'll try and snag a late 1st somewhere during the draft if possible or an extra 2nd. They've got 7 picks this year and 11 next year so I don't think they're too worried about losing draft picks.. Tatar at least can play on the top 6 on a good team whereas Baertschi won't scratch top six minutes on a good/healthy team. But I see your point... I guess Vegas just really wanted to get it done and sent the 1st as a sweetener Has Tatar been on a good team? He joined a Detroit team on the decline and was part of the team's end of their 25 year playoff streak. He's on a decent team now and cannot crack the roster. I'm sure Baertschi's numbers would be just as good as Tatar if he was playing with the likes of Zetterberg and Datsyuk. To be clear, I agree that Baertschi isn't a bonafide top 6 player yet, but Baertschi is younger and is trending up and likely to be cheaper even after his new contract while Tatar is having the worst season of his career when the trade happened (lots of leverage, cap dump, no cap retained). I'd think there is more justifiable reason to give up what they did for Baertschi, but at the end of the day, it was/would be way too much to give up for either player. Just because they have tonnes of picks which they did a good job acquiring while having teams bent over is no excuse to be throwing them away. McPhee would be the first GM I would call for the next trade deadline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 It's funny how many "mistakes" Las Vegas appears to have made (in short order) - and yet they've overcome them by making that many more good decisions. Part of the business - when you make that many decisions and take that many risks,you're going to make your share of mistakes - but those mistakes won't necessarily define you in the end. I think they may get a bit too much credit - when they were really served an extremely plum set of circumstances in the expansion draft - but nevertheless, one thing that is undeniable is what they have gotten out of the assets they've put on the ice in the end. How much of that goes to Gallant and the coaching staff, and how much goes to good pro scouting is hard to say, but you can't separate either of those from the overall results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rekker Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 Nice trade Mcphie. Erat for Forsberg. This trade. Better stop trading dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 2 hours ago, rekker said: Nice trade Mcphie. Erat for Forsberg. This trade. Better stop trading dude. I don't know, he made a couple good ones in the 5 years between those trades. Getting Marchessault in order to take Reilly Smith in the expansion draft? Friggin larceny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rekker Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 3 minutes ago, D-Money said: I don't know, he made a couple good ones in the 5 years between those trades. Getting Marchessault in order to take Reilly Smith in the expansion draft? Friggin larceny. Ya. Made some good trades to build the team for sure. Had a lot of leverage and currency though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 It's not even that Tatar is a poor player. It's just he's new to the team and system. As long as they're rolling and winning, the guys who have been there from day 1 and know the system best will likely play. They have also been pretty healthy up front - had a top forward got hurt they'd be happy to have Tatar to draw in. And a few guys will walk in free agency, so Tatar will be needed next season. Had McPhee paid less for an insurance guy who was also walking at the end of the year, that would have been a waste (see: Leafs paying a 2nd for Boyle, when they had virtually no chance of winning a round). At least Tatar is a long-term asset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rekker Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 1 minute ago, D-Money said: It's not even that Tatar is a poor player. It's just he's new to the team and system. As long as they're rolling and winning, the guys who have been there from day 1 and know the system best will likely play. They have also been pretty healthy up front - had a top forward got hurt they'd be happy to have Tatar to draw in. And a few guys will walk in free agency, so Tatar will be needed then. Suppose time will tell. Doesn't look good so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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