Off-Season: Free Agents Who fit Jim and Trevors Wishes (Share your thoughts)

[riffraff]

3 hours ago, alfstonker said:

Am I the only one who wants Jussi and Vanek back?

I don't think you can have both and maintain speed through the lineup.

 

if one is coming back I'll go with vanek hands down.

[alfstonker]

40 minutes ago, riffraff said:

I don't think you can have both and maintain speed through the lineup.

 

if one is coming back I'll go with vanek hands down.

I must say Jokenin has never looked slow to me. Do you think he's slow? I didn't think Vanek was slow either. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, alfstonker said:

I must say Jokenin has never looked slow to me. Do you think he's slow? I didn't think Vanek was slow either. 

Compared to Jake the rocket Virtanen they are slow.  (So is McDavid!)

[riffraff]

1 minute ago, alfstonker said:

I must say Jokenin has never looked slow to me. Do you think he's slow? I didn't think Vanek was slow either. 

I wouldn't say jokinen is fast although right now he is playing well with his linemates.  Vanek definitely trudges when he does not have the puck - chasing back to the d zone and his shifts are very short.  My reason(s) for suggesting vanek is the guy to hypothetically keep are:  he protects the puck well to make up for a lack of foot speed, can be somewhat physical when needed, high end sniper style shot, elite puck handling and playmaking, has shown amazing chemistry with Brock.

 

i base this on a small sample size of jokinens play, admittedly. Perhaps he would have value going forward but as of now vanek rates higher for me.

 

vanek didn't fetch much at the deadline in the eyes of some here.  But imo, they are wrong.  And furthermore, he would again get you more than a jokinen trade.  Essentially we took jokinen to make the deal happen.  So from an asset perspective, again, vanek is the better choice.

 

in no way am I saying that jussi hasn't been good for us.  I like what I see.  Camera pans to the bench have also shown him to be a coach communicator, which I also like.

 

selfishly from an entertainment perspective I loved watching vanek this last year. 

[alfstonker]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Compared to Jake the rocket Virtanen they are slow.  (So is McDavid!)

Some players are 5 feet faster just by virtue of their hockey IQ. I am extremely impressed with Jokenin who I must confess I didn't pay much attention to when he played elsewhere. Maybe that is part of his strength, I noticed Gagner a LOT when he came into the team - because of his f----ups.

 

Jussi doesn't seem to make these kind of howlers, he has good positioning and makes good passes and incredibly has 6 points in the last 5 games (10pts in 14, that is 60pts/season rate.) He's a +7 over his 951 game career and scored better than 1pt per 2 games and an even strength corsi of 51%

 

Gagner in comparison has a -109 and corsi of 48.9% over 770 NHL games. Gagner though has played better recently.

 

 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, alfstonker said:

Some players are 5 feet faster just by virtue of their hockey IQ. I am extremely impressed with Jokenin who I must confess I didn't pay much attention to when he played elsewhere. Maybe that is part of his strength, I noticed Gagner a LOT when he came into the team - because of his f----ups.

 

Jussi doesn't seem to make these kind of howlers, he has good positioning and makes good passes and incredibly has 6 points in the last 5 games (10pts in 14, that is 60pts/season rate.) He's a +7 over his 951 game career and scored better than 1pt per 2 games and an even strength corsi of 51%

 

Gagner in comparison has a -109 and corsi of 48.9% over 770 NHL games. Gagner though has played better recently.

 

 

We have Gagner, Errikson, Sutter, Baer, and Bo to lead our forwards.  Maybe we don’t need any UFAs?  We have Brock, Granlund, Jake, Goldy, Gaunce, and the potential of Pettersson and Dahlen.  If do get a UFA, why not get Archibald?  We need to replace Dorsett.

[Rush17]

8 hours ago, smokes said:

Perron would be a nice fit, someone Virtanen can watch.

Perron always lights it up against us. He could be a solid addition if he decides to part to Vegas.  He was actually my favorite forward because he's a good middle 6 offensive forward on a good team. He would be playing first or second line minutes here. 

 

Grabner also would be exciting but he would not come cheap with his production. A Aenter that also performs well vs us is Anton Vermette. Another guy to consider but I think he's close to 36.

 

Lots of options. Rousell would be a nice add too. Definite toughness increase and he seems a good 2-way player.

[189lb enforcers?]

Many on that list are likely to stay put.

 

Our list mainly includes the Anson Carters and the MDZs looking for a place to reclaim a safe payday. 

 

Only JB will know on July 1st what is actually out there to sign. There are a few I’d take a run at, for sure. 

[J.I.A.H.N]

I guess the type of UFA you sign depends on where the team is in the standings, which direction the team should be trending, and the cap space available

In saying that, I have seen so many times where the addition of a couple key, elite players can put an average team, over the top and competitive immediately.

So are we a bottom 6 team, a bottom 10 team, or a mid level team? Injuries aside, I do not think we are that far from being a mid level team that is trending upwards.

But, as has been proven, we are not very durable, and this continues to be our Achilles heel. 

 

I would like, Tavares, Kane and Carson, but going half way and not getting the whole thing done, really is counter productive, so I am not sold in it's entirety.........

 

I know most have expressed their displeasure of acquiring E. Kane, but I would like to believe be has grown as a human, and would fit in fine now, with his aggressive style, and his ability to score....people ask where we are going to replace the Sedin's 100 points, well Kane would be a part of that, and would also provide a more sand papery disposition to our team...........we need that almost as much as the points.

 

I also think that when we can pick up a young proven talent to replace a smaller and less skilled player for the same position, I think you do it and move the other player......to me this fits well with our plans............move Baertschi and sign Kane, and gain assets.......I am mixed admittedly.......(mostly because CDC is adamant we not sign him...what am I missing?)

 

My choices would be in this order, although Vanek gives you no sandpaper................Kane..........Perron.........Vanek

 

We shall see!

[Provost]

10 hours ago, CrazyAL said:

Weaponize the cap, they have tons of space, who knows they might be able to get some serious assets from a team that wants to off load salary to sign Tavares for example. I would be cautious to go after guys like Kane at 6x7million type deals, not sure that is the right route at this point.

The cap is going up too much this season for any teams to be in a real crunch, it is just a bad year to happen to have that as a strategy.  There will be far more teams that have cap space to weaponize than teams looking to offload cap.  Maybe some scenario could play out at the deadline, but that is a pretty low chance of getting any real return.

Lots of it depends on our draft.  If we are uncharacteristically lucky and get Dahlin, then we leverage that to go out and get all the UFAs we can and drop the middling players like Baertschi, Granlund, etc.  We would then be able to offer them a winning situation in the very near future with Boeser as a linemate or what is touted to be a bigger and better version of Karlsson as their D partner.

 

[alfstonker]

4 hours ago, Battlemonger said:

Good UFAs available, but this might not be our year for a big signing. A vet or two to help the young guns for the next couple years, and then a big signing or two in a few years to put us over the top.

 

 

 

Agreed. We know that Vanek can fit here  - he seemed to get something going with Brock. Jussi also looks to be a find  - quite honestly after watching the games he has had here you have to wonder if he wasn't being used properly that we were his 4th club this season.

[oldnews]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

We have Gagner, Errikson, Sutter, Baer, and Bo to lead our forwards.  Maybe we don’t need any UFAs?  We have Brock, Granlund, Jake, Goldy, Gaunce, and the potential of Pettersson and Dahlen.  If do get a UFA, why not get Archibald?  We need to replace Dorsett.

I agree with you Alf.  I think the team has reached a critical mass of internal young talent that could enable it to fill from within - with quality - for the first time in quite some time.

 

I see no real need to add any wingers to the mix - the team is rich in young talent on the wing (and could have a young natural center or two playing wing as it stands).

 

A few months ago I may have been less bear about the coming FA market -  but having watched the team recently, I'd be very hesitant to buy - barring an opportunity you simply can't pass up - and on reasonable terms - ie if a Carlson or Kane are wanting to come here and willing to take a Hamhuis type deal where they're at or slightly below market value - and well below what they could otherwise command on the free agent market.   But how likely is that to happen?  You never know, but my guess is highly unlikely.  We don't have that 'be a part of a contender' thing to offer (at least not yet) - and those deals also typically come with restrictive limiting clauses.

 

But more to the point - the last month or two - I've been extremely impressed with Virtanen - who is really emerging as a consistent threat who plays a 200ft game evolved beyond his young years.  Green has killed it with his development.  Leipsic has also been extremely impressive - precisely the kind of speed, drive, vision and creativity the forward group needed to add at LW imo - he is looking like a fixture.   Perhaps the biggest surprise is Goldobin - who Green seems to have really gotten through to at the eleventh hour.  It was looking like Goldobin might remain too 'young-minded' as his waiver status approaches and his game lacked the kind of assertiveness it takes to stick in the NHL (not that unlike Baertschi was in some senses, although perhaps for different reasons).  In any event, Goldobin's game without the puck just seems to have awoken and the difference is pretty stark.  Whatever is behind that, he's also looking like a serious threat to command a roster spot next year. 

 

So when I look at a potential roster without any free agent forward additions - you see some young players that are already in tight to earn a spot - but is it really worth it to go to free agency and sign guys to free agent type deals - when you have players like this on the margins who could very well prove to be productive NHLers - and on RFA type terms?

Regardless of the short term need for cap space, theres is the question of the relative asset value of these young players vs generally overpriced UFAs - and the advantage that retaining them, with the cap flexibility moving forward.  I think the signs we've seen from players like Virtanen, Leipsic, Motte, Goldobin - might be reason enough to hesitate to add much.  I've said elsewhere that I'd probably limit spending/shopping to a bottom six hard minutes center and faceoff guy - I think barring a Hammer type situation of a FA who really wants to come here, it might be best to forego free agency in general and let Green continue to uptick these young guys.  It seems as though there may be enough internal competition as it stands to drive them.

 

Leipsic/Baertschi Horvat Boeser

Pettersson/Goldobin Granlund Virtanen

Gaunce Sutter Motte/Archibald

Baertschi/Eriksson Gaudette Gagner

 

That is 14/15 viable NHL forwards (excluding perhaps more unpredictable guys like Dahlin, MacEwen, etc).  Maybe one or two are question marks - but even there I'd lean towards believing the entire lot (with the exception of Pettersson) have shown they're ready and able to play their roles at this level.

That lineup excludes the Jokkinen, Dowd, Boucher, Chaput depth types.

I'd probably just lean towards signing a Brad Richardson, Beagle, Vermette, Derek Ryan, Derek Grant type veteran depth C and call it a roster.

That roster above may not have people expecting playoff rounds, but I'd sure as hell enjoy watching it - and if a few of them prove not ready or not able to take the next step, you have that cap in your back pocket to relieve other teams of players they may want to pay to get rid of, or are willing to deal to retool or w.h.y.  If that roster overachieves, you retain the ability to add a high end guy - and probably have asset value to spend in that case, as well as cap - if you think you can improve your short term chances.

If things go well though, you've also got some good young talent you'll need to pay - so you won't hear me complaining if the team doesn't spend close to the cap this year. 

 

I think the young guys have shown enough this year to warrant not precluding their chances of commanding spots by signing multiple contracts you have to commit to somewhat regardless of their emergence, which is another reason I think it'd be prudent to simply target the veteran depth C types that would command a year or two of term and if they are outcompeted by younger players = no real loss.

 

 

 

[Junkyard Dog]

I know you guys see the abundance of youth coming and think that we can fill from within but...

 

Injuries happen, kids might not be ready right away. I also don't want to leave Utica with nothing, I want ouryoung guys down there to have good environment to grow as well.  

 

We have to have some quality depth.

 

IMO we need a top 9 center, a top 9 wing, a bottom 6 forward and a top 4 defenseman. Essentially we need to replace the Sedins and Dorsett and add a defenseman.

 

I would also like to see a trade or 2 made since we have an abundance of meh depth. Perhaps we could package a couple guys like Hutton/Baer/Goldobin for a solid young piece? 

[JamesB]

16 hours ago, TheGuardian_ said:

Rebuilding or building, there is a difference.

 

Vanek is a good safe selection even if he gets a clause contract at 2 mil or so for 2 or 3 years, easily palatable.

Green in Tanev out, depends on the money and if Tanev gets enough of a return, bad time of year to be trading Tanev, too many others out there.

 

There are loads of prospects that need to get on this team, Horvat already has 4 years here.

 

IMO just resign Vanek and maybe Jokien, the idea is to make room for the kids, it also would not hurt the draft spot next year.

 

I sure hope, one of the few times I hope, that the Nucks get lucky.

 

16 hours ago, dukeofcanuck said:

I hope we shore up the defense, forwards are not as big a concern.

 

18 hours ago, vinny_in_vancouver said:

Since our farm team is not located close by, I would really like to see the young players play so it's starting to look pretty full on both forwards and D:
C: Horvat, Gaudette, Pettersson, Sutter
W (more than full): Boeser, Dahlen, Goldobin, Virtanen, Baertschi, Granlund, Eriksson, Gagner, Leipsic, Motte
D (more than full): Juolevi, Hutton, Sautner, Edler, Stecher, Tanev, MDZ, Pouliot, Gudbranson

So the only vet I'm hoping for is a goalie better than Anders Nilsson.

As for forwards, there is not a lot of room (as indicated by Vinny's post). He lists 4 centers. In addition, Gagner and Granlund can also play center. And there is lots of competition on the wing, including Gaunce, who should be added to the list. The Canucks needs a guy who plays a physical game and also contributes to solid defensive play -- as Dorsett did. I think Archie has done pretty well in that role. In fact, his numbers are very good. He has taken some criticism for not being as tough and physical as hoped for down the stretch but he was credited with 7 hits in the final game -- more than all other forwards combined. And he and Sutter combined very well on the PK and on shutdown for the past month. But possibly there might be an upgrade available in that spot -- a tough physical guy who can play.

 

Obviously if Tavares for some reason wanted to come here at a reasonable salary we should jump at it, but that is very unlikely. I don't see other forwards I want to slot in ahead of giving Pettersson, Gaudette, Leipsic and others a good look.  With the Sedins retiring, I think it is time to shift to young leadership. Horvat is certainly ready to take on that role and Boeser is also very mature for a young guy.

 

The bigger need is on D, where, in my view, the Canucks have only two legitimate top 4 guys (Edler and Tanev) and Tanev is injury prone and Edler is getting up there in terms of age. Green therefore seems like an attractive target. However, at age 32, he is at the age where D's typically (not always, but typically) begin to show significant age-related decline. I would be wary about signing him to anything more than a 3-year deal and even that could look bad by the 3rd year. And I see no reason why he would want to come to Vancouver unless we make a significant overbid for his services.

 

And, sorry for repeating, but trying to rebuild through the UFA market does not work. I would rather see the Canucks continue the rebuild emphasizing internal development and promotion. I certainly see no reason to bring in another 3rd pairing D type player. We have plenty of those including Weircioch, who had a good year in Utica, Brisebois, who is not that far away, Sautner, who looked good with the Canucks, and McEneny, who should return from injury.

 

So bottom line: maybe a complementary fairly cheap forward who plays a physical game or genuine top 4 D on a reasonable contract. Otherwise I would go with young guys. The Canucks don't have to spend to the Cap every year.

[70seven]

 

 

honestly as I was doing this....  there’s just far to many variables in the forward group.  Trades...they are a coming.  I’m prepared to see at least one of Baertschi, Granlund, Goldobin, Hutton at the draft to maneuver up the board.  I’m thinking they will try to add to the 38th pick, and get into the mid first round. 

 

Leipsic, Gaudette, and virtanen are on this team next year imo.  We’re stuck with Eriksson, Gagner, and Sutter.  Bo and Brock are no brainers.  That’s 8 of 12 and a need for some size and physicality....  Pettersson, Dahlen, Baer, Granny, Goldy, Motte, Gaunce, Archibald, Dowd, ????

 

As for the D...

I don’t know if there’s a deal for Tanev after that injury plagued season honestly.  I think at best they get a mid to late 1st and a prospect.  Is that enough?  Or is he more valuable to the current roster?  Also with Hank gone, depth and experience down the middle is almost a necessary addition... hence the Bozak rumours.

 

Juolevi not ready imo. Should play in Utica or Finland again.   Draft one of Hughes, Dobson, Bouchard with that 7-9 pick.   Attempt to move Tanev for another 1st... if confident you can find another top 4 to play for short term. 

 

Bottom line is this his team is going to be very young.  I see more in the way of dealing some of their current roster assets to get some players that can help insulate the young group, than scouring the UFA market.  Honestly I dont mind the idea of adding Lucic.

 

To edmonton:  Goldobin

To van: Lucic 33% retained, 3rd

 

Would give us:

 

Baertschi Bo Brock

Lucic Pettersson Eriksson

Leipsic Gaudette Virtanen

Granny Sutter Gagner

 

Edler Stecher

MDZ Green

Pouliot Guddy

 

 

???

 

as I said...  too many variables 

 

 

[wai_lai416]

I don’t care who we sign as long as it’s 1-2 year max. Sign a d and trade Tanev and try to get a decent return. The guy way he plays makes him injury prone. Not too beneficial to the team is he’s always in the press box 

[VegasCanuck]

4 hours ago, Alflives said:

Compared to Jake the rocket Virtanen they are slow.  (So is McDavid!)

Was surprised when he pulled away from McDavid last night. Virtanen has serious acceleration, really crazy.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

As far as I see it.

 

Leipsic-Horvat-Boeser

?????-?????-Gags?

Eriksson-Sutter-?????

?????-?????- Virtanen

 

Baer has to go, perhaps Granlund too but he can still play anywhere in the lineup,  be effective and is cheap.

 

Sign 2-3 vets as a stop gap and ease the youth in. Some guys will take spots like perhaps Gaud and Petts. 

 

Defense wise is different

 

Edler-Tanev?

MDZ?-Stecher

?????-Gudbranson

 

Trade Hutton. Keep Pouliot for now, he could be an extra if Juo is ready.

 

 

Injuries are bound to happen so more kids will play just need more quality depth. We also need to make trades and shed the excess fat like Hutton, Baer, maybe Goldobin and Gaunce too if they get outplayed in the preseason. 

 

[aGENT]

45 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said:

I know you guys see the abundance of youth coming and think that we can fill from within but...

 

Injuries happen, kids might not be ready right away. I also don't want to leave Utica with nothing, I want ouryoung guys down there to have good environment to grow as well.  

 

We have to have some quality depth.

 

IMO we need a top 9 center, a top 9 wing, a bottom 6 forward and a top 4 defenseman. Essentially we need to replace the Sedins and Dorsett and add a defenseman.

 

I would also like to see a trade or 2 made since we have an abundance of meh depth. Perhaps we could package a couple guys like Hutton/Baer/Goldobin for a solid young piece? 

Largely agree. Don't know if we need ALL those pieces but I do agree we need to add/upgrade at least one of the top 6 LW and a C (Kane, Domi, Jenner, Richardson etc) and ideally I'd like to add a short term RD (to facilitate a Tanev move if there's one out there). Whether that's a more offensive guy like Green or a more stabilizing/sheltering guy as ON suggests....I'm fine with either. Don't see us going hard after Carlsson though as many are suggesting.

 

Otherwise yes, TOTALLY agree that at least a couple of mediocre Hutton/MDZ/Baer/Granlund/Goldobin/Gagner need to be moved out. Whether that's packaged with a bigger pieces for something of quality, moved out for picks etc... I'm fine with either.

 

Love to also see us target cash/cap poor teams that have RFA's due raises they might not want to fork out for, contenders lacking cap space/not wanting to be patient with prospects etc up to possibly retaining on Tanev to facilitate a trade/increase return/utilize our cap space. Targets could be Trouba, Dumba, Sanheim on D, Domi, Jenner at F etc.

 

 

 

 

[Junkyard Dog]

Just now, aGENT said:

Largely agree. Don't know if we need ALL those pieces but I do agree we need to add/upgrade at least one of the top 6 LW and a C (Kane, Domi, Jenner, Richardson etc) and ideally I'd like to add a short term RD (to facilitate a Tanev move if there's one out there). Whether that's a more offensive guy like Green or a more stabilizing/sheltering guy as ON suggests....I'm fine with either. Don't see us going hard after Carlsson though as many are suggesting.

 

Otherwise yes, TOTALLY agree that at least a couple of mediocre Hutton/MDZ/Baer/Granlund/Goldobin/Gagner need to be moved out. Whether that's packaged with a bigger pieces for something of quality, moved out for picks etc... I'm fine with either.

 

Love to also see us target cash/cap poor teams that have RFA's due raises they might not want to fork out for, contenders lacking cap space/not wanting to be patient with prospects etc up to possibly retaining on Tanev to facilitate a trade/increase return/utilize our cap space. Targets could be Trouba, Dumba, Sanheim on D, Domi, Jenner at F etc.

 

 

 

 

Doesn't need to be all that but to a certain extent yeah. Really the only young guys I could see making the team next year are Gaudette, Petterson and maybe Juolevi. Other young guys will see the NHL because we will have injuries. 

 

Yeah, I agree that taking on a cap-dump would be a smart move and we could also shed some of the deadweights in the process while acquiring a solid young piece like a player mentioned.

 

We have many options and so many possibilities which are nice to have. It makes for an exciting off-season.