Ryan Strome Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, nuckin_futz said: Once again, it's not what you know it's what you can prove in a court of law. Gathering evidence in a war torn region is a tall order. Especially considering that dead people don't talk. If the guy admitted to joining Daesh it shouldn't be difficult convicting him (you'd hope). Then again, like you said we do have a crap legal system. But what we have is still better than street justice. Not when it comes to dealing with terrorists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Ryan Strome said: Not when it comes to dealing with terrorists. OK, someone with an axe to grind accuses you of being a terrorist. A crowd gathers and beats you to death without a trial or conviction. Is street justice still better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 22 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: Short of having photo/video evidence there’s not a lot we can do. Even when they openly admit performing killings they seem to get away. Would you feel safe living next door to Abu Huzaifa http://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.4658607 Imprisonment is a crap situation as is means they just become a tax burden on the rest of us. I wouldn't want to live next to that guy. As far as I am concerned 1 confession is plenty for me. Though confessing to a reporter doesn't mean a whole lot. It's not a crime to lie to reporters. I agree, imprisonment is a crap situation but so is executing people. There's no easy answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, nuckin_futz said: OK, someone with an axe to grind accuses you of being a terrorist. A crowd gathers and beats you to death without a trial or conviction. Is street justice still better? Yes, because in this case the government knows who and what these people were involved in. Groups like JTF 2 are experts at gathering intelligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 2 hours ago, Ryan Strome said: Hence the Assad will deal with them. And if he deals with them by deporting them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 39 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said: And if he deals with them by deporting them? Something tells me he would have other plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 8 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said: Something tells me he would have other plans. Most likely, but it still doesn't cover the "what then?" question. You can't have an official policy that a foreign country will "probably" look after your problem citizens if you decide you don't want them to be citizens anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 2 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said: Most likely, but it still doesn't cover the "what then?" question. You can't have an official policy that a foreign country will "probably" look after your problem citizens if you decide you don't want them to be citizens anymore. To be fair I only want this implemented for citizens who have joined terrorist groups and fought against or hurt Canadians. I would also support capital punishment for terrorist attacks committed in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Ryan Strome said: To be fair I only want this implemented for citizens who have joined terrorist groups and fought against or hurt Canadians. I would also support capital punishment for terrorist attacks committed in Canada. I don't support Capital punishment for anyone, but that's another argument. As far as revocation of Canadian citizenship, I believe that you (and the poster who first suggested it) are over simplifying. You can't just say to a Canadian citizen, "you're someone else's problem now". Someone has to agree to take that problem on. Until you have such an agreement in place, you can't simply revoke citizenship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 Just now, RUPERTKBD said: I don't support Capital punishment for anyone, but that's another argument. As far as revocation of Canadian citizenship, I believe that you (and the poster who first suggested it) are over simplifying. You can't just say to a Canadian citizen, "you're someone else's problem now". Someone has to agree to take that problem on. Until you have such an agreement in place, you can't simply revoke citizenship. Oh I understand it's not a simple thing. Remember Harper tried and it turned into a major debacle. I imagine this is why the U.S, France and the U.K are hunting their citizens turned terrorists down in Syria and Iraq and killing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Neilsons Towel Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 2 hours ago, Ryan Strome said: Oh I understand it's not a simple thing. Remember Harper tried and it turned into a major debacle. I imagine this is why the U.S, France and the U.K are hunting their citizens turned terrorists down in Syria and Iraq and killing them. Let’s call this “Option A” shall we. Option B can be revoking citizenship. Option C going to trial in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 Just now, Roger Neilson's Towel said: Let’s call this “Option A” shall we. Option B can be revoking citizenship. Option C going to trial in Canada. I have no issue with option A. I hope most Canadians would agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Neilsons Towel Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 Just now, Ryan Strome said: I have no issue with option A. I hope most Canadians would agree. Other Canadians on this board who don’t share our point of view about to disagree in 3.... 2..... 1...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 2 minutes ago, Roger Neilson's Towel said: Other Canadians on this board who don’t share our point of view about to disagree in 3.... 2..... 1...... You state it's your point of view We state it's enshrined in to the Canadian constitution. Far be it for us to simply agree to the words and laws that make this country what it is over your opinions gentlemen. But feel free to express them based on that same document Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Neilsons Towel Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 Just now, Warhippy said: You state it's your point of view We state it's enshrined in to the Canadian constitution. Far be it for us to simply agree to the words and laws that make this country what it is over your opinions gentlemen. But feel free to express them based on that same document A couple seconds late there. Laws can be changed. Citizenship has been revoked before. Anyway, I share my opinion. You tell me why my opinion is stupid. That’s what makes our country great. Carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 On 5/18/2018 at 2:19 PM, Roger Neilson's Towel said: A couple seconds late there. Laws can be changed. Citizenship has been revoked before. Anyway, I share my opinion. You tell me why my opinion is stupid. That’s what makes our country great. Carry on. it has. But that is typically for fraud in the application. I completely understand the idea of wanting these people stripped of their citizenship, but how do you do that and not create two classes of citizens or undermine some other part of our constitution? Harper wasn't able to figure that one out. For me I'd prefer to not amend our constitution just for these losers, I'd rather they rot in jail the rest of their lives or be watched by CSIS. And we do our part for the world not making it someone else's problem where maybe they are free to hurt people at will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 On 5/18/2018 at 2:13 PM, Roger Neilson's Towel said: Other Canadians on this board who don’t share our point of view about to disagree in 3.... 2..... 1...... I don't believe in summary executions. By whom exactly ? What makes them competent to be judge and jury If they are Canadian citizens, they are entitled to trial and our legal system. Our constitution needs to be respected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 On 5/18/2018 at 2:19 PM, Roger Neilson's Towel said: A couple seconds late there. Laws can be changed. Citizenship has been revoked before. Anyway, I share my opinion. You tell me why my opinion is stupid. That’s what makes our country great. Carry on. I think "stupid" is an unnecessary modifier, Roger. Surely we can disagree on something like this without insulting each other? It's a complex issue and of course, there are going to be multiple views on it, each with their own merits and faults.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 58 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said: I don't believe in summary executions. By whom exactly ? What makes them competent to be judge and jury If they are Canadian citizens, they are entitled to trial and our legal system. Our constitution needs to be respected. I agree KOS. Like Roger said, laws can be changed, but if Capital Punishment was ever reinstated for such cases, we still need to respect due process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said: it has. But that is typically for fraud in the application. I completely understand the idea of wanting these people stripped of their citizenship, but how do you do that and not create two classes of citizens or undermine some other part of our constitution? Harper wasn't able to figure that one out. For me I'd prefer to not amend our constitution just for these losers, I'd rather they rot in jail the rest of their lives or be watched by CSIS. And we do our part for the world not making it someone else's problem where maybe they are free to hurt people at will. Great point. The problem with "leaving Assad to deal with them" is that it leaves them free to carry out more attacks, quite possibly on North American targets. Far better to lock them up and throw away the key, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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