Hawk eagle = hockey goal Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Hey guys, first time poster here, (btw, this is a really long post) It's pretty well known that the Canucks struggled at the draft for a while prior to Jim Benning coming in, but I was curious about how the Canucks recent history measures up against the rest of the league so I crunched some numbers looking at the Burke, Nonis, Gillis and Benning eras of drafting. I chose to simply count how many players who were drafted, ended up playing at least 100 games in the NHL and how this stacked up against league averages for each GM's era. Obviously this does not tell the whole story as it doesn't indicate much about quality of player or how long they played in the NHL so I've discussed the quality a bit and other interesting findings throughout. What I've done below is listed all players that have played 100+ NHL games drafted by each GM (or players that may still get there for recent years) and their draft position and stats to date. Then looked at the league average number of players drafted in the time period and formulated an adjusted league average which takes into account where the Canucks drafted in each draft and how many picks they had relative to other teams. Burke Era (1998 - 2003 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Bryan Allen: 1998 1st Rd, 4th OA (721GP - 29G - 107A - 136Pts) - Artem Chubarov: 1998 2nd Rd, 31st OA (228GP - 25G - 33A - 58Pts) - Jarkko Ruutu: 1998 3rd Rd, 68th OA (652GP - 58G - 84A - 142Pts) - Daniel Sedin: 1999 1st Rd, 2nd OA (1306GP - 393G - 648A - 1041Pts) - Henrik Sedin: 1999 1st Rd, 3rd OA (1330GP - 240G - 830A - 1070Pts) - R.J. Umberger: 2001 1st Rd, 16th OA (779GP - 180G - 212A - 392Pts) - Kevin Bieksa: 2001 5th Rd, 151st OA (808GP - 63G - 215A - 278Pts) - Ryan Kesler: 2003 1st Rd, 23rd OA (941GP - 253G - 312A - 565Pts) Canucks picks during era: - 6 1st rounders (2, 3, 4, 16, 23, 23) - 4 2nds, 8 3rds, 5 4ths, 7 5ths, 3 6ths, 7 7ths, 8 8ths, 6 9ths - 54 total picks, 8 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 13.80 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 13.11 players with 100+ GP Discussion: Based on the adjusted average, Burke was short about 5 players from what an average team would do with the Canucks picks. He did however find some very good players in the Sedins, Kesler, Bieksa and Umberger. Bryan Allen and Jarkko Ruutu also had fairly solid and lengthy careers. Still, missing on as many picks as he did did not bode well for the Cunucks in the long term. It's interesting that the GM that made some of the best draft floor moves in Canucks history to get the Sedins actually shows up fairly poor overall at least in terms of quantity of picks to play 100+ NHL games. Nonis Era (2004-2007 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Cory Schneider: 2004 1st Rd, 26th OA (370GP - 161W - 0.920Sv% - 2.36GAA) - Alex Edler: 2004 3rd Rd, 91st OA (758GP - 84G - 250A - 334Pts) - Mike Brown: 2004 5th Rd, 159th OA (407GP - 19G - 17A - 36Pts) - Jannik Hansen: 2004 9th Rd, 287th OA (626GP - 109G - 147A - 256Pts) - Mason Raymond: 2005 2nd Rd, 51st OA (546GP - 115G - 136A - 251Pts) - Michael Grabner: 2006 1st Rd, 14th OA (553GP - 158G - 91A - 249Pts) Canucks picks during era: - 4 1st rounders (10*, 14, 25, 26) - 2 2nds, 2 3rds, 2 4ths, 4 5ths, 5 6ths, 3 7ths, 1 8ths, 1 9ths - 24 total picks, 6 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 8.23 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 5.32* players with 100+ GP *Didn't include Luc Bourdon in any calculations as unfortunately we can't say if he would have made it or not Discussion: What's interesting here is that Nonis had fewer picks than those initially allotted to the Canucks at every draft so despite drafting 6 players over the 4 years compared to the overall league average of just over 8, the adjusted average actually shows that he beat the average by almost one player. He also didn't have a lot of high picks other than the Luc Bourdon and Michael Grabner picks and these weren't really that high at 10 and 14. Another note is that 4 of the 6 players to play 100+ Games came from the 2004 draft which is clearly one of the best drafts in recent memory. The other drafts weren't very good with only 2 players over 3 years though. Gillis Era (2008-2013 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Cody Hodgson: 2008 1st Rd, 10th OA (328GP - 64G - 78A - 142Pts) - Jordan Schroeder: 2009 1st Rd, 22nd OA (165GP - 18G - 24A - 42Pts) - Kevin Connauton: 2009 3rd Rd, 83 OA (260GP - 26G - 42A - 68Pts) - Brendan Gaunce: 2012 1st Rd, 26th OA (144GP - 5G - 7A - 12Pts) - Ben Hutton: 2012 5th Rd, 147th OA (207GP - 6G - 44A - 50Pts) - Bo Horvat: 2013 1st Rd, 9th OA (295GP - 71G - 90A - 161Pts) Others possible: - Frankie Corrado: 2011 5th Rd, 150th OA (76GP - 3G - 5A - 8Pts) Canucks picks during era: - 6 1st rounders (9, 10, 22, 24, 26, 29) - 3 2nds, 4 3rds, 5 4ths, 6 5ths, 7 6ths, 6 7ths - 37 total picks, 6 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 10.97 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 8.74 players with 100+ GP Discussion: So, honestly, this era looks pretty bad overall. They were almost 3 players short of the adjusted average, 5 short of overall average and where Burke and Nonis found a decent number of high quality players at least, Gillis failed for the most part. Only Horvat looks like a real stud from the Gillis era. Looking back at this, I feel like this draft era could be a big reason why the Canucks have struggled a lot in recent years, when you have 5 draft years from 2008 to 2012 and don't have much to show for it, it really hurts the current team. At least he picked Horvat... What do you guys think? Did the Gillis draft era really hamper the current Canucks? Benning Era (2014-2017 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Jake Virtanen: 2014 1st Rd, 6th OA (140GP - 17G - 17A - 34Pts) - Jared McCann: 2014 1st Rd, 24th OA (166GP - 19G - 34A - 53Pts) Very likely possibilities: - Thatcher Demko: 2014 2nd Rd, 36th OA (1GP - 1W - 0.867Sv% - 3.93GAA) - Gustav Forsling: 2014 5th Rd, 126th OA (79GP - 5G - 13A - 18Pts) - Brock Boeser: 2015 1st Rd, 23rd OA (71GP - 33G - 27A - 60Pts) - Adam Gaudette: 2015 5th Rd, 149th OA (5GP - 0G - 0A - 0Pts) - Olli Juolevi: 2016 1st Rd, 5th OA (0GP) - Elias Pettersson: 2017 1st Rd, 5th OA (0GP) - Quinn Hughes: 2018 1st Rd, 7th OA (0GP) Others possible: - Nikita Tryamkin: 2014 3rd Rd, 66th OA (79GP - 3G - 8A - 11Pts) - Guillaume Brisebois: 2015 3rd Rd, 66th OA (0GP) - Lucas Jasek: 2015 6th Rd, 174th OA (0GP) - Will Lockwood: 2016 3rd Rd, 64th OA (0GP) - Kole Lind: 2017 2nd Rd, 33rd OA (0GP) - Jonah Gadjovich: 2017 2nd Rd, 55th OA (0GP) - Michael Dipietro: 2017 3rd Rd, 64th OA (0GP) - Jack Rathbone: 2017 4th Rd, 95th OA (0GP) - Kristopher Gunnarsson: 2017 5th Rd, 135th OA (0GP) - Petrus Palmu: 2017 6th Rd, 181st OA (0GP) - Matt Brassard: 2017 7th Rd, 188th OA (0GP) - Jett Woo: 2018 2nd Rd, 37th OA (0GP) - Tyler Madden: 2018 3rd Rd, 68th OA (0GP) - Toni Utunen: 2018 5th Rd, 130th OA (0GP) - Artem Manukyan: 2018 6th Rd, 186th OA (0GP) - Matthew Thiesen: 2018 7th Rd, 192nd OA (0GP) Canucks picks during era: - 6 1st rounders (5, 5, 6, 7, 23, 24) - 4 2nds, 5 3rds, 2 4ths, 6 5ths, 5 6ths, 6 7ths - 34 total picks, 2 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 1.33 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 1.93 players with 100+ GP Adjusted expectations for Canucks picks (based on historical data)** - 8.52 players with 100+ GP (Before 2018 Draft) - 10.47 players with 100+ GP (Including 2018 Draft) **I used the 2005 to 2009 draft years for this data - because these were the first 5 years after the NHL went to 7 rounds and they're far enough back that most players who will end up playing 100+ games already would have. I didn't use the years before this as there were often a bunch of extra picks given away for various reasons so often the second round would have around 35 or so picks and then the 3rd would start later and subsequent rounds would also start later and later. Discussion: It's probably a little early to look at the numbers from this era. So far Virtanen and McCann have played 100 Games but that's it. Overall, 40 players have played 100+ NHL games who were drafted from 2014 onwards so Benning's slightly ahead of the league average and adjusted average for that matter. What I would rather discuss here is how many players could make the NHL and have solid impacts. The adjusted expectations based on historical data. is 8.52 players for the picks that Benning had. 2 have already made it, 2 others (Forsling and Boeser) are well on their way and I put 4 others (Demko, Gaudette, Juolevi and Pettesson) as very likley candidates to make the NHL and play 100+ games since they all have legitimate shots to make the team out of camp next year. Of the others, some are more likley to make it; I like the chances of Kole Lind for instance and there's a pretty decent chance Tryamkin comes back. If I had to guess, I'd say about 4 of the others make it, not sure who and that's a wild guess, it could very well be more or less than that. I don't think it's unreasonable to think that 10 to 14 players drafted in a 4 year period could have a solid impact in the NHL and I would be quite surprised if at least 9 players don't make it, meaning that Benning should beat the average even for his high draft picks. If 14 make it, that would be half of his picks which would be pretty incredible considering generally only about a quarter of picks make this impact from a given draft year. I would also say that the players that he has drafted appear so far to be quite high quality too. Most notable in group are Boeser and Pettersson but Demko, Juolevi, Gaudette, Virtanen, McCann etc. could be really solid, maybe even excellent players too. What do you guys think, how many of the Benning era draft picks make it? What do you think about the quality of picks? Who did the best job of drafting? Who did the worst? Edit: Added in 2018 draft picks. Figured Quinn Hughes is very likely to make it, the others went into others possible category. Adjusted numbers which now show that the average team would get 10.47 players with 100+ games given the picks Benning has had during his 5 years of drafting (again using historical data as mentioned above). I still think he is on course to beat that average with several of those players being good quality NHLers. I would change the 100 GP to 200 GP as several posters have mentioned this would be a better benchmark. At this point, however, that would involve recounting everything which is a lot of work and I don't know if it would add enough to make it worthwhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 This is the best selection of prospects we have acquired in my lifetime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Nice thread man. Thanks for taking the time to compile the data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crabcakes Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 The way to get your draft picks to the NHL is to develop them well. The Canucks practices for development began to change in 2013 when the Utica Comets were set up. Their first season was 2013-14. Only then, did the Canucks have full control over their AHL club in terms of coaches, trainers and other support staff. I would expect the success rate to improve since then. Of course, the trend is league wide by and large. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregthehockeynut Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 I think the comparison should be weighted by importance of position just to add a fun wrinkle to the puzzle of drafting. Dominant centers :1st top pair D :2nd goalies 3rd the forwards last. The order of the top 3 positions importance is entirely debatable but scoring wingers without elite 1/2/3 ain't worth a hill of beans. So I give Burke the edge with Henrik and Kessler in his regime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billabong Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 thumbs up for the effort! benning isn't a perfect drafter but he has compiled the deepest quality of players 23 and under this franchise has ever seen every time I see gillis's drafting I die a little inside. Excluding horvat because I view that as more of "trade" not "drafted" per say, His butch drafting got us in that 3 years of mediocrity with no light at the end of the tunnel and benning had to clean up his mess and ship out draft picks for reclamation projects to try fast forward some kind of youth movement.....obviously ownership played a role but we could have continued to stay competitive if we had more than horvat in the system! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shazzam Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 All did good and bad. I'll remember: Burke for what he was able to do to get both Sedins. Kesler was a beast in his prime. Most underrated trade was probably for Salo Nonis - Luongo Gillis - Adding Hamhuis and Ehrhoff which pushed us to a contender All 3 GMs played a role in our 2011 final run Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 kudos for raising the bar for 1st posts. After this season it will be unquestionably Benning with the best draft history, but Burke set the table for the best team we've had. I do think Benning will do the same, just not sure if he'll be around as GM to see it through to being competitive in the playoffs, I hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcam Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Hawk eagle = hockey goal said: Hey guys, first time poster here, (btw, this is a really long post) It's pretty well known that the Canucks struggled at the draft for a while prior to Jim Benning coming in, but I was curious about how the Canucks recent history measures up against the rest of the league so I crunched some numbers looking at the Burke, Nonis, Gillis and Benning eras of drafting. I chose to simply count how many players who were drafted, ended up playing at least 100 games in the NHL and how this stacked up against league averages for each GM's era. Obviously this does not tell the whole story as it doesn't indicate much about quality of player or how long they played in the NHL so I've discussed the quality a bit and other interesting findings throughout. What I've done below is listed all players that have played 100+ NHL games drafted by each GM (or players that may still get there for recent years) and their draft position and stats to date. Then looked at the league average number of players drafted in the time period and formulated an adjusted league average which takes into account where the Canucks drafted in each draft and how many picks they had relative to other teams. Burke Era (1998 - 2003 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Bryan Allen: 1998 1st Rd, 4th OA (721GP - 29G - 107A - 136Pts) - Artem Chubarov: 1998 2nd Rd, 31st OA (228GP - 25G - 33A - 58Pts) - Jarkko Ruutu: 1998 3rd Rd, 68th OA (652GP - 58G - 84A - 142Pts) - Daniel Sedin: 1999 1st Rd, 2nd OA (1306GP - 393G - 648A - 1041Pts) - Henrik Sedin: 1999 1st Rd, 3rd OA (1330GP - 240G - 830A - 1070Pts) - R.J. Umberger: 2001 1st Rd, 16th OA (779GP - 180G - 212A - 392Pts) - Kevin Bieksa: 2001 5th Rd, 151st OA (808GP - 63G - 215A - 278Pts) - Ryan Kesler: 2003 1st Rd, 23rd OA (941GP - 253G - 312A - 565Pts) Canucks picks during era: - 6 1st rounders (2, 3, 4, 16, 23, 23) - 4 2nds, 8 3rds, 5 4ths, 7 5ths, 3 6ths, 7 7ths, 8 8ths, 6 9ths - 54 total picks, 8 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 13.80 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 13.11 players with 100+ GP Discussion: Based on the adjusted average, Burke was short about 5 players from what an average team would do with the Canucks picks. He did however find some very good players in the Sedins, Kesler, Bieksa and Umberger. Bryan Allen and Jarkko Ruutu also had fairly solid and lengthy careers. Still, missing on as many picks as he did did not bode well for the Cunucks in the long term. It's interesting that the GM that made some of the best draft floor moves in Canucks history to get the Sedins actually shows up fairly poor overall at least in terms of quantity of picks to play 100+ NHL games. Nonis Era (2004-2007 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Cory Schneider: 2004 1st Rd, 26th OA (370GP - 161W - 0.920Sv% - 2.36GAA) - Alex Edler: 2004 3rd Rd, 91st OA (758GP - 84G - 250A - 334Pts) - Mike Brown: 2004 5th Rd, 159th OA (407GP - 19G - 17A - 36Pts) - Jannik Hansen: 2004 9th Rd, 287th OA (626GP - 109G - 147A - 256Pts) - Mason Raymond: 2005 2nd Rd, 51st OA (546GP - 115G - 136A - 251Pts) - Michael Grabner: 2006 1st Rd, 14th OA (553GP - 158G - 91A - 249Pts) Canucks picks during era: - 4 1st rounders (10*, 14, 25, 26) - 2 2nds, 2 3rds, 2 4ths, 4 5ths, 5 6ths, 3 7ths, 1 8ths, 1 9ths - 24 total picks, 6 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 8.23 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 5.32* players with 100+ GP *Didn't include Luc Bourdon in any calculations as unfortunately we can't say if he would have made it or not Discussion: What's interesting here is that Nonis had fewer picks than those initially allotted to the Canucks at every draft so despite drafting 6 players over the 4 years compared to the overall league average of just over 8, the adjusted average actually shows that he beat the average by almost one player. He also didn't have a lot of high picks other than the Luc Bourdon and Michael Grabner picks and these weren't really that high at 10 and 14. Another note is that 4 of the 6 players to play 100+ Games came from the 2004 draft which is clearly one of the best drafts in recent memory. The other drafts weren't very good with only 2 players over 3 years though. Gillis Era (2008-2013 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Cody Hodgson: 2008 1st Rd, 10th OA (328GP - 64G - 78A - 142Pts) - Jordan Schroeder: 2009 1st Rd, 22nd OA (165GP - 18G - 24A - 42Pts) - Kevin Connauton: 2009 3rd Rd, 83 OA (260GP - 26G - 42A - 68Pts) - Brendan Gaunce: 2012 1st Rd, 26th OA (144GP - 5G - 7A - 12Pts) - Ben Hutton: 2012 5th Rd, 147th OA (207GP - 6G - 44A - 50Pts) - Bo Horvat: 2013 1st Rd, 9th OA (295GP - 71G - 90A - 161Pts) Others possible: - Frankie Corrado: 2011 5th Rd, 150th OA (76GP - 3G - 5A - 8Pts) Canucks picks during era: - 6 1st rounders (9, 10, 22, 24, 26, 29) - 3 2nds, 4 3rds, 5 4ths, 6 5ths, 7 6ths, 6 7ths - 37 total picks, 6 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 10.97 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 8.74 players with 100+ GP Discussion: So, honestly, this era looks pretty bad overall. They were almost 3 players short of the adjusted average, 5 short of overall average and where Burke and Nonis found a decent number of high quality players at least, Gillis failed for the most part. Only Horvat looks like a real stud from the Gillis era. Looking back at this, I feel like this draft era could be a big reason why the Canucks have struggled a lot in recent years, when you have 5 draft years from 2008 to 2012 and don't have much to show for it, it really hurts the current team. At least he picked Horvat... What do you guys think? Did the Gillis draft era really hamper the current Canucks? Benning Era (2014-2017 drafts) Players with 100+ NHL games: - Jake Virtanen: 2014 1st Rd, 6th OA (140GP - 17G - 17A - 34Pts) - Jared McCann: 2014 1st Rd, 24th OA (166GP - 19G - 34A - 53Pts) Very likely possibilities: - Thatcher Demko: 2014 2nd Rd, 36th OA (1GP - 1W - 0.867Sv% - 3.93GAA) - Gustav Forsling: 2014 5th Rd, 126th OA (79GP - 5G - 13A - 18Pts) - Brock Boeser: 2015 1st Rd, 23rd OA (71GP - 33G - 27A - 60Pts) - Adam Gaudette: 2015 5th Rd, 149th OA (5GP - 0G - 0A - 0Pts) - Olli Juolevi: 2016 1st Rd, 5th OA (0GP) - Elias Pettersson: 2017 1st Rd, 5th OA (0GP) Others possible: - Nikita Tryamkin: 2014 3rd Rd, 66th OA (79GP - 3G - 8A - 11Pts) - Guillaume Brisebois: 2015 3rd Rd, 66th OA (0GP) - Lucas Jasek: 2015 6th Rd, 174th OA (0GP) - Will Lockwood: 2016 3rd Rd, 64th OA (0GP) - Kole Lind: 2017 2nd Rd, 33rd OA (0GP) - Jonah Gadjovich: 2017 2nd Rd, 55th OA (0GP) - Michael Dipietro: 2017 3rd Rd, 64th OA (0GP) - Jack Rathbone: 2017 4th Rd, 95th OA (0GP) - Kristopher Gunnarsson: 2017 5th Rd, 135th OA (0GP) - Petrus Palmu: 2017 6th Rd, 181st OA (0GP) - Matt Brassard: 2017 7th Rd, 188th OA (0GP) Canucks picks during era: - 5 1st rounders (5, 5, 6, 23, 24) - 3 2nds, 4 3rds, 2 4ths, 5 5ths, 4 6ths, 5 7ths - 28 total picks, 2 players with 100+ GP League average during period: - 1.33 players with 100+ GP Adjusted for Canucks picks - 1.93 players with 100+ GP Adjusted expectations for Canucks picks (based on historical data)** - 8.52 players with 100+ GP **I used the 2005 to 2009 draft years for this data - because these were the first 5 years after the NHL went to 7 rounds and they're far enough back that most players who will end up playing 100+ games already would have. I didn't use the years before this as there were often a bunch of extra picks given away for various reasons so often the second round would have like 35 or so picks and then the 3rd would start later and subsequent rounds would also start later and later. Discussion: It's probably a little early to look at the numbers from this era. So far Virtanen and McCann have played 100 Games but that's it. Overall, 40 players have played 100+ NHL games who were drafted from 2014 onwards so Benning's slightly ahead of the league average and adjusted average for that matter. What I would rather discuss here is how many players could make the NHL and have solid impacts. The adjusted expectations based on historical data. is 8.52 players for the picks that Benning had. 2 have already made it, 2 others (Forsling and Boeser) are well on their way and I put 4 others (Demko, Gaudette, Juolevi and Pettesson) as very likley candidates to make the NHL and play 100+ games since they all have legitimate shots to make the team out of camp next year. Of the others, some are more likley to make it; I like the chances of Kole Lind for instance and there's a pretty decent chance Tryamkin comes back. If I had to guess, I'd say about 4 of the others make it, not sure who and that's a wild guess, it could very well be more or less than that. I don't think it's unreasonable to think that 10 to 14 players drafted in a 4 year period could have a solid impact in the NHL and I would be quite surprised if at least 9 players don't make it, meaning that Benning should beat the average even for his high draft picks. If 14 make it, that would be half of his picks which would be pretty incredible considering generally only about a quarter of picks make this impact from a given draft year. I would also say that the players that he has drafted appear so far to be quite high quality too. Most notable in group are Boeser and Pettersson but Demko, Juolevi, Gaudette, Virtanen, McCann etc. could be really solid, maybe even excellent players too. What do you guys think, how many of the Benning era draft picks make it? What do you think about the quality of picks? Who did the best job of drafting? Who did the worst? Benning is by far the best at drafting in the last 20 years.. Benning only had a few prospects... Now his draft pick are staring to come through the system... Benning will add more great picks this year will be his 5th draft... 1. Benning = A 2. Burke = Ct 3. Nonis = C 4. Gillis = C- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyCuddles Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Nonis gets a lot of flack but his drafting actually wasn't half bad. Gillis really did come in with a very solid foundation. Burke got us the Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler. Nonis got us Edler, Schneider, Hansen and Raymond. Also drafted Grabner who is a pretty solid NHLer now. Nonis did make a lot of head scratching trades though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo fan Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 thanks for gathering the info Hawk-Eagle I think we have pretty good depth under Benning - whether or not all will make it to the NHL level remains to be seen But it looks more promising then it has in years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwags Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 In terms of potential, Benning has easily created our best prospect pool in team history. Whether it pans out is another story, but it's certainly on the right track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6string Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Outstanding work, I've been very supportive and patient with the Linden/Benning tandem as we assemble the new core and move forward together. GCG! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 4 minutes ago, N7Nucks said: Nonis gets a lot of flack but his drafting actually wasn't half bad. Gillis really did come in with a very solid foundation. Burke got us the Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler. Nonis got us Edler, Schneider, Hansen and Raymond. Also drafted Grabner who is a pretty solid NHLer now. Nonis did make a lot of head scratching trades though. Where Nonis really falls down is his poor 1st round selections. The round you're most likely to score a hit. Gillis, even looking at his 100 game successes, shows an incredibly poor ability at drafting. Horvat being the only 'wow, good pick'. And he came at the end of his reign of bad drafting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evanderkanesmoneystack Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Benning should be fired for his draft record alone. He cannot draft and he cannot sign players. If I'm the owner I'm sitting Jim and Trev down and bringing in Mike Milbury to handle drafting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 3 hours ago, Hawk eagle = hockey goal said: What I've done below is listed all players that have played 100+ NHL games drafted by each GM (or players that may still get there for recent years) and their draft position and stats to date. Then looked at the league average number of players drafted in the time period and formulated an adjusted league average which takes into account where the Canucks drafted in each draft and how many picks they had relative to other teams. Good work putting in this much effort. My only issue is 100 games is a pretty low bar and it doesn't really speak to the quality of the picks which would be a huge undertaking. For example Schroeder makes your list as a success at 22nd overall as does Schneider at 26th overall. While Scheider would be considered a high quality pick Schoeder would be considered a bust despite playing over 100 NHL games. Grabner at 14th overall is very comparable to Raymond at 51st overall. Raymond is a pretty good 2nd round pick, meaning Grabner wasn't a particularly good top 15 pick. But as I said, it would be a huge undertaking and quite subjective in setting the value of a pick in conjunction to where he was selected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6string Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 54 minutes ago, Baggins said: Where Nonis really falls down is his poor 1st round selections. The round you're most likely to score a hit. Gillis, even looking at his 100 game successes, shows an incredibly poor ability at drafting. Horvat being the only 'wow, good pick'. And he came at the end of his reign of bad drafting. As I've said before Gillis has never been interviewed for a GM job since his departure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6string Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 30 minutes ago, evanderkanesmoneystack said: Benning should be fired for his draft record alone. He cannot draft and he cannot sign players. If I'm the owner I'm sitting Jim and Trev down and bringing in Mike Milbury to handle drafting. A late night comic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 14 minutes ago, The 5th Line said: Drafting is a science now, and more scouts are hired and much more money is put in to drafting nowadays. Benning should be the best we've had Ask any scout and he'll tell you there's still luck involved. One said you scout for skill set, work ethic, and character hoping the traits will translate to the NHL. If it were a true science you wouldn't see as many high picks bust. And quality players taken in later rounds would have been taken much earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Great work for a first post. Benning's drafting won't really be able to be properly judged for at least three to five more seasons but the trend is in the right direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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