Welcome to Vancouver losers (Macleans Magazine article)

[riffraff]

9 hours ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

That part really confused me. Glad I’m not alone. Kept looking at the thread and wondering, did Maclean’s really publish an article titled “Welcome to Vancouver losers?” 

Did Maclean’s really publish this too?

 

smh.

 

losers is right.

 

 

 

 

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

24 minutes ago, riffraff said:

Did Maclean’s really publish this too?

 

smh.

 

losers is right.

 

 

 

 

Hadn’t seen that yet. The online version has a different title. And since I haven’t been to my doctor for a while, I haven’t had a chance to pick up the latest waiting room copy of Maclean’s.

[kingofsurrey]

Vancouver is over rated.

 

Chilliwack / Abbotsford area  is the hottest place  right now for the young hipsters....  both cities have much more to offer than Vancouver.

[mpt]

People want to live in a 3-4 bedroom detached house with a large yard in one of the best cities on the planet and they want it for cheap.  Good luck finding a detached house in Manhattan for cheap.  Maybe people need to embrace the condo world when wanting to live in a top 5 city.  If you want a big house with a big yard and you want it affordable, then move out to the suburbs, like in every other great city.

 

Instead we ask the government to take more control over us by limiting our freedom, increasing our taxes, and dropping the value of our homes hurting every homeowner in our province.  Great idea...

[Violator]

11 hours ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

That part really confused me. Glad I’m not alone. Kept looking at the thread and wondering, did Maclean’s really publish an article titled “Welcome to Vancouver losers?” 

Posted this all on my phone.Could not figure out how to post the pic of the magazine cover.

[riffraff]

1 hour ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Hadn’t seen that yet. The online version has a different title. And since I haven’t been to my doctor for a while, I haven’t had a chance to pick up the latest waiting room copy of Maclean’s.

I saw it last week in the supermarket.

 

i couldn’t believe my eyes.

 

we wonder why the world is they way it is.

 

Didn’t  realize the online version was different and that’s why this thread made the cover that much more funny/horrible to me at least - that nobody noticed the photo but were drawn to the Vancouver loser story title instead.

[canuckster19]

There's a simple reason homes aren't being built, it's the same in Europe, there's a housing shortage in Sweden, and that has moved to Spain and other countries because rich northern Europeans are buying cheap southern European property, it's simply to prop up the market. This is the new economy, our new export is real estate, and it's certainly not free, the problem is, like oil, it's limited, and at the moment we certainly don't know how long it will last, and the longer it takes the bubble to burst, the worse the consequences will be. 

 

IMO we need to bite the bullet and allow the natural population decline that has been happening, but that's too "controversial" for some people.

[taxi]

22 hours ago, mpt said:

People want to live in a 3-4 bedroom detached house with a large yard in one of the best cities on the planet and they want it for cheap.  Good luck finding a detached house in Manhattan for cheap.  Maybe people need to embrace the condo world when wanting to live in a top 5 city.  If you want a big house with a big yard and you want it affordable, then move out to the suburbs, like in every other great city.

 

Instead we ask the government to take more control over us by limiting our freedom, increasing our taxes, and dropping the value of our homes hurting every homeowner in our province.  Great idea...

Except that in Vancouver, even the suburbs aren't affordable. It costs over 1 million for a liveable house in Port Coquitlam.

[PhillipBlunt]

On ‎6‎/‎29‎/‎2018 at 6:26 PM, ReggieBush said:

I think you are severely undervaluing Vancouver.

Fair enough

Quote

Lets look at it this way.

 

What Vancouver has going for it.

 

1. The natural landscape, what major city has Mountains overlooking ocean?

Mountains over looking an inlet really. Seattle has Puget Sound with Rainer in the background, to me, it's just as "breathtaking" as Vancouver's scenery.

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2. Mild climate, It doesn't get to cold or hot here.

Seattle, Portland

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3. Crime rate, in particular, violent crimes. We do pretty well in that category

Crime in metro Vancouver ebbs and flows. Violent crime? You remember the names Clifford Olson and Robert Pickton?

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4. Public health care, not perfect and is a country wide thing, but it is a pull factor to the city

Canada wide, so can't really consider this as a Vancouver draw, although plenty of "homemakers and students" from China seem to enjoy it.

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5. Clean Air

That's debatable. I don't think Vancouver has cleaner air than most western cities.

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6. Clean Water, drinkable tap water is best in the world

Chilliwack and Hope have been winners of drinkable tap water, not Vancouver.

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7. Not overly busy.

Traffic wise? It's a headache getting anywhere in the city, due to a severe lack of infrastructure.

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8. Diversity, and the emphasis on it

Toronto is just as diverse. Montreal as well.

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9. Very sustainable and green city

Please clarify. There's a lot of talk, but focus on "green" bike paths is really pandering to a demographic, as it puts much more pressure on major arterial routes in the city, many of which are inadequate in width, and then cause back up and congestion which in turn releases more exhaust.

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10.  Outdoor activities.

California, Oregon, Washington, Montana, Colorado have tons of outdoor activities available.

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What it struggles with or doesn't have.

 

1. Infrastructure is meh, not great, not awful

2. Business/commerce/finance sector isn't huge. However it is on the up and up

 

Find me a city in the world that offers what Vancouver does, in addition to having or being a business center

Seattle and Portland are two cities that offer pretty much exactly what Vancouver has, with healthier arts and music communities. Calgary is more cosmopolitan than most realize.

 

Vancouver is still a place that I love because I was born here, but it's vastly overrated for what it offers the average citizen. From a bang for your buck perspective, it's woefully underperforming. Kinda like Loui Eriksson or Milan Lucic.

[redhdlois]

On 6/28/2018 at 12:29 PM, Standing_Tall#37 said:

Same as here in the North Cariboo. About 3-5 years ago $350,000 could buy you a 8 bedroom house on the lake on an acre. $100,000 could buy you a 4/5 bedroom house maybe even with a shop or garage anywhere else in town. 

 

 The last 2 years or seems like prices have went up about 3x. 

 

 

 Also big global corporations are buying sections of farmland like crazy. They’re buying up like 2000,3000, 4000 acre plots when those farms go up for sale. Apparently it’s because they can use that as carbon credits for their industrial endeavours in other countries.

Our government is so stupid......selling off our country to foreign interest....as well as our natural resources. 

[redhdlois]

On 7/2/2018 at 10:13 AM, mpt said:

People want to live in a 3-4 bedroom detached house with a large yard in one of the best cities on the planet and they want it for cheap.  Good luck finding a detached house in Manhattan for cheap.  Maybe people need to embrace the condo world when wanting to live in a top 5 city.  If you want a big house with a big yard and you want it affordable, then move out to the suburbs, like in every other great city.

 

Instead we ask the government to take more control over us by limiting our freedom, increasing our taxes, and dropping the value of our homes hurting every homeowner in our province.  Great idea...

Vancouver was affordable until foreign investment came charging in. 

[mpt]

12 minutes ago, redhdlois said:

Vancouver was affordable until foreign investment came charging in. 

Until illegal proceeds from foreign investment came charging in.

 

Its funny how people think they should have the right to buy a house in Hawaii or in Phoenix etc but forbid people buying houses in Vancouver.

 

If the invested money coming in is from criminal activities then the police need to do a better job.  

 

I’m ok with a protectionist approach to our housing concerns as long as people are willing not to cry foul when they aren’t allowed to buy real estate in other countries or provinces.

 

However having the government intervene and pass legislation to drop housing prices will hurt everyone whom has a house, take away our own freedom, and hurt everyone financially.    Its not a simple problem to solve.

[Standing_Tall#37]

18 minutes ago, redhdlois said:

Our government is so stupid......selling off our country to foreign interest....as well as our natural resources. 

I think it’s more corruption. 

[mpt]

3 hours ago, taxi said:

Except that in Vancouver, even the suburbs aren't affordable. It costs over 1 million for a liveable house in Port Coquitlam.

Keep moving East; Maple Ridge, Mission, Abbotsford, Chilliwack are all more affordable.  I sure dont want the government to wreck the value of my house by purposefully trying to drop prices.  All that does is screw over every family who’s bought a house in the last 5 years.

[taxi]

35 minutes ago, mpt said:

Keep moving East; Maple Ridge, Mission, Abbotsford, Chilliwack are all more affordable.  I sure dont want the government to wreck the value of my house by purposefully trying to drop prices.  All that does is screw over every family who’s bought a house in the last 5 years.

Define "affordable". It still costs about $600-700k for a 1500 sq ft bugalow in the Abbotsford/Chilliwack area. You're now looking at a 2+hour drive into downtown on a workday. If you're working in downtown, how is that even an option? Not everyone can just move their work out to Abbotsford/Chilliwack. Even then, you're going to need a household salary of $150k+ to buy one of these places.

 

As for current owners, anyone who has bought in the last 5 years, knew they were taking a huge risk. The prices were clearly not linked to the local economy. Even then, prices will also recover in 5 years or so, no matter how bad the crash is.

 

And the biggest factor affecting foreign investment, had absolutely nothing to do with local taxes (which btw are very easy to skirt around). China itself is cracking down:

 

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/chinese-investment-in-australia-11-2018-6

 

Quote

The slide was caused by regulatory changes in China to squeeze the flow of cash out of the country, with Chinese overseas direct investment falling globally by 29%.

This annual result returns investment to 2015 and 2012 levels in US terms which at the time were regarded as strong results but below the mining and gas driven investment peak of 2008.

Read more at https://www.businessinsider.com.au/chinese-investment-in-australia-11-2018-6#GZLpdOSblfMBDH8J.99

 

In other words, the crash was always coming and expect prices to fall into the 2012-2015 range. Many of the things that local governments are doing are just softening the blow. When you tie your horse to something as unpredictable as the Chinese government's tolerance for capital export, I really have little sympathy. Do you really think it's an option to have the housing prices keep going up the way they were? It's very difficult to find good staff in Vancouver, as no one can afford to live here. What happens if there's another crash in Asia? You are suggesting tying our entire economy onto how well China is doing. That's awful policy. 

[PhillipBlunt]

1 hour ago, taxi said:

Define "affordable". It still costs about $600-700k for a 1500 sq ft bugalow in the Abbotsford/Chilliwack area. You're now looking at a 2+hour drive into downtown on a workday. If you're working in downtown, how is that even an option? Not everyone can just move their work out to Abbotsford/Chilliwack. Even then, you're going to need a household salary of $150k+ to buy one of these places.

 

As for current owners, anyone who has bought in the last 5 years, knew they were taking a huge risk. The prices were clearly not linked to the local economy. Even then, prices will also recover in 5 years or so, no matter how bad the crash is.

 

And the biggest factor affecting foreign investment, had absolutely nothing to do with local taxes (which btw are very easy to skirt around). China itself is cracking down:

 

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/chinese-investment-in-australia-11-2018-6

 

 

In other words, the crash was always coming and expect prices to fall into the 2012-2015 range. Many of the things that local governments are doing are just softening the blow. When you tie your horse to something as unpredictable as the Chinese government's tolerance for capital export, I really have little sympathy. Do you really think it's an option to have the housing prices keep going up the way they were? It's very difficult to find good staff in Vancouver, as no one can afford to live here. What happens if there's another crash in Asia? You are suggesting tying our entire economy onto how well China is doing. That's awful policy. 

Solid post. Moving out into the Fraser Valley, while a beautiful place, is hell in a handbasket if one has to then drive for 2-3 hours, each way, per day. Spending a quarter of your day in your car, plodding along an inadequate highway doesn't smack of work/life balance to me.

[mpt]

5 hours ago, taxi said:

Define "affordable". It still costs about $600-700k for a 1500 sq ft bugalow in the Abbotsford/Chilliwack area. You're now looking at a 2+hour drive into downtown on a workday. If you're working in downtown, how is that even an option? Not everyone can just move their work out to Abbotsford/Chilliwack. Even then, you're going to need a household salary of $150k+ to buy one of these places.

 

As for current owners, anyone who has bought in the last 5 years, knew they were taking a huge risk. The prices were clearly not linked to the local economy. Even then, prices will also recover in 5 years or so, no matter how bad the crash is.

 

And the biggest factor affecting foreign investment, had absolutely nothing to do with local taxes (which btw are very easy to skirt around). China itself is cracking down:

 

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/chinese-investment-in-australia-11-2018-6

 

 

In other words, the crash was always coming and expect prices to fall into the 2012-2015 range. Many of the things that local governments are doing are just softening the blow. When you tie your horse to something as unpredictable as the Chinese government's tolerance for capital export, I really have little sympathy. Do you really think it's an option to have the housing prices keep going up the way they were? It's very difficult to find good staff in Vancouver, as no one can afford to live here. What happens if there's another crash in Asia? You are suggesting tying our entire economy onto how well China is doing. That's awful policy. 

It is more affordable to live in the valley.  If you want to live in Vancouver you need to make sacrifices.  Not everyone in New York lives in New York, those who do live in condo’s not large houses.  That’s the sacrifice to live in the big city.  

 

As for current owners whom were taking a risk, the risk that people take isn’t that the government will purposefully drop housing prices to appease the minority of people whom don’t own a house.  Prices in desirable cities are never linked to the local economy.  So instead of the government trying to help out a few by screwing the majority, the government could introduce legislation to retard the increase in house values and then everyone maintains their equity and in 5 years like you said, you’ll be paying the same anyways.  

 

Local taxes will never stop foreign investment; eliminating the ability for non permanent residents would.

 

As for the crash.  Prices in Abbotsford have doubled in the last 12 years, rent hasn’t doubled in 12 years, and the stock market has more than doubled.  The stock market has outperformed the real estate market, including the entire crash in 2008.  So I can’t say the increase in housing prices has been that out of control.  Vancouver the detached housing market prices tripled, but out in the valley, prices have had reasonable increases that have underperformed the stock market.

[Stelar]

On 2018-07-02 at 11:03 AM, kingofsurrey said:

Vancouver is over rated.

 

Chilliwack / Abbotsford area  is the hottest place  right now for the young hipsters....  both cities have much more to offer than Vancouver.

lol, you kill me man  Its like you don't live anywhere near the lower mainland.  

[mpt]

1 hour ago, Stelar said:

lol, you kill me man  Its like you don't live anywhere near the lower mainland.  

Yes, Chilliwack and Abbotsford have nothing compared to Vancouver besides more churches and gangs, and less shopping and cars.

[Russ]

10 hours ago, Stelar said:

lol, you kill me man  Its like you don't live anywhere near the lower mainland.  

Don't you be bashing my valley!

9 hours ago, mpt said:

Yes, Chilliwack and Abbotsford have nothing compared to Vancouver besides more churches and gangs, and less shopping and cars.

Way to many churches on prime land, not to many gangs, and I am more than ok with less shopping places and cars.  The less people in in these areas the better for all I am concerned. 

On 02/07/2018 at 10:03 AM, kingofsurrey said:

Vancouver is over rated.

 

Chilliwack / Abbotsford area  is the hottest place  right now for the young hipsters....  both cities have much more to offer than Vancouver.

Keep those damn hipsters in Vancouver, we don't need them out in the Valley.  We already got to many stupid unused bike lanes, stupid looking stores, hippy drinks being made, etc.