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Charges Laid In Tragic Humboldt Crash


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This is a tragic example on how the freight industry has gone to $hit.  When you replace $40/hr union drivers with inexperienced drivers making half as much you're going to get plenty of accidents like this one.  And a lot of those drivers are new to the country and probably cheat on getting fully licensed.  That's how these companies make money, by lowballing the reputable truckers and skimping on safety regulations.   I see it every day with the freight we ship out and the materials we receive. 

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11 minutes ago, Tre Mac said:

This is a tragic example on how the freight industry has gone to $hit.  When you replace $40/hr union drivers with inexperienced drivers making half as much you're going to get plenty of accidents like this one.  And a lot of those drivers are new to the country and probably cheat on getting fully licensed.  That's how these companies make money, by lowballing the reputable truckers and skimping on safety regulations.   I see it every day with the freight we ship out and the materials we receive. 

back in 87ish most LTL  over the road freight was hauled by bigger more reputable outfits with motor carrier licence point A TO b either scheduled or charter , big bucks tied up in licence to haul ,say van to PG , or Rupert , Rupert was always a good haul because of the backhaul (fish) and then one day no  over the road motor carrier  licence required , that meant great news for the econmie ie; lumber , fish ,historical back haul loads for lowermainland truckers. however for northern outfits this was ALWAYS headhaul, and every scabby trucking outfit sprung out of the woodwork, undermining hard fought rates /hrly /mileage. it also meant the quality of drivers dropped significantly, you want to pay peanuts your going to attract monkeys...…….

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1 hour ago, Kanukfanatic said:

Canada has no justice system and hasn't since the 90s. We clearly have a LEGAL system. Lawyers just f around with the system charging excessive amounts to actually show up in court so they can charge those court appearance fees.

 

Judges in this country stopped giving out appropriate sentences more than two decades ago.

 

I know of one case where a career criminal / junkie was charged in 70 home break and enters. His first conviction in the 70s got him more jail time (2 years) then his 70th (probation). Has your house ever been broken into? Mine has and my 11 year old daughter got home after school to find the house ransacked. The criminal code says the maximum sentence for break and enter in Canada is life in prison. Our idiot judges give out no jail time (conditional sentences).

 

For the Humboldt case in particular, without knowing the full details, we have a 29 year old truck driver who screwed up somehow (on the phone? ran a sign? - who knows what the specifics are). This 29 year old did screw up and affected many families and killed and seriously injured many....all from some stupid action that may not, and probably not was intended. I highly doubt he had intent but that does not matter. He will get put through the ringer (court) as he should.

 

Other cases though...such as the case where that psycho, Vince Li, cut off the head of the bus passenger a few years ago and ate some of it. Our pathetic court system tried the guy and found "... was found not criminally responsible for beheading and cannibalising a fellow passenger on a Canadian bus".

 

Our brilliant Judge and court system basically let the guy go and he is free to walk around in public. Absolutely disgusting. I for one could not care less if Vince Li has mental health issues. That psycho should be locked up into a deep hole never to see the light of day again after he killed and ate part of some innocent bus travellers HEAD!! Imagine the horror he put that victim and the victim's family through. Yet he gets to walk around thanks to good ole Canada and it's legal system (don't misinterpret this -- I LOVE Canada -- I just despise its broken and pathetic legal system).

 

Our court system continues to let gang members and organized crime out after being tried after those scum bags kill people. Our judges are a joke.

 

As I stated, Canada's Justice system is non existent. We merely have a legal system. 

 

I feel horrible for all the families affected by Humboldt and horrible for all the lives lost. I even feel a bit bad for what is probably a normal 29 year old guy who drives a truck for a living who screwed up and caused this mess.

 

And we will continue to let real killers like Vince Li and gang members out to roam our streets and kill innocents.

 

Pathetic.

 

Sorry for the rant.

Are you seriously grouping Li with gang members who have committed homicide?

 

The man was deeply confused and frightened, did not understand what he was doing (he did it under delusional assumptions), and is a very low risk to do something like that again.

 

Is it his fault nobody gave him help in time?

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28 minutes ago, 112 said:

Are you seriously grouping Li with gang members who have committed homicide?

 

The man was deeply confused and frightened, did not understand what he was doing (he did it under delusional assumptions), and is a very low risk to do something like that again.

 

Is it his fault nobody gave him help in time?

I don't care at all about Li. He cut someone's head off and ate some of it. I DO NOT care if Li has mental health issues. He killed an innocent and he destroyed that victim's family forever. Mental health issues or not, he should have forfeited his life when he committed such a despicable act.

 

Your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the legal system. You sound like you are more worried about the mental health of a guy that viciously cut someone's head off more than the disgusting horrid act he committed. You care more about a killer than a victim. Exact problem with this legal system.

 

And just a little info for you, some of the most violent gang members and offenders also have mental health issues. Do you just feel they are misunderstood? Pathetic.

 

I DO NOT care. They commit horrid acts and the legal system does nothing. 

 

Tell me how you would feel if Li cut off your wife's head, or child's, or family members. Probably wouldn't be such a social worker then I suspect.  

 

EDIT: We need to change Canada Corrections to something like CRIMINAL PUNISHMENT and start actually punishing criminals. You can't correct the behaviours of violent criminals. You sound like you are part of the legal system with your statement of  "and is a very low risk to do something like that again." That is what every judge says when they release violent criminals such as domestic abuse cases. Someone kills a family member and some IDIOT Judge releases the killer and says the KILLER is "a very low risk to do something like that again" using the reasoning that the KILLER only killed their wife...we should release them cuz they probably won't kill anyone else...they ONLY KILLED THEIR WIFE. 

 

Pathetic.

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3 hours ago, Squamfan said:

This was just careless drving. He should be stripped of a driving licence for his life...... a person who commits a driving error is jailed, something is wrong. 

This really downplays this collision.   A driving error is missing a turn off...when you barrel through a stop sign in a double trailer rig while on the job it's a bit more than that.  Remember...many fatalities.  This is part of the issue...that we're focusing more on the driver's mishap than we are very dangerous operation of a big rig. 

We have to get past this mindset that careless driving is a "just".  Which is part of what D's touched on here:

2 hours ago, D-Money said:

Here's the thing - throwing the book at this guy accomplishes little. Because whatever exactly he did, it was likely something that happens thousands of times per day in this country, and usually with little to no consequences.

 

If you really think this is a serious matter that needs more attention, then you should be in favour of increased penalties and surveillance for all major traffic offenses. More punishment for the action, rather than just the result. Should there be more photo radar, and traffic light cameras? Perhaps even more monitoring of stop signs? Should current fines and penalties for speeding, running red lights, and distracted driving be doubled? Tripled?

 

Most people I know would balk at the suggestion. But the fact of the matter is, this was a terrible tragedy because the size of the two vehicles and the number of passengers involved. But any one of you could just as easily take out a family in a minivan with your vehicle. And if you really want people to change, you need to punish the action, not just the rare time it results in severe consequences.

 

I don't agree that it accomplishes nothing.  When someone is responsible for killing multiple people that's a good place to at least start sending a message out.  We are seeing increased penalties, cameras, etc. on the roads and punishing the action is exactly what needs to happen here.  I'm quite sure anyone who takes out a family is put through the same investigative process and, if deemed appropriate, penalties.
 

2 hours ago, Monty said:

Back when I worked for a certain financial institution, I worked a lot with small business owners, many of whom were truck drivers who ran 2-4 trucks. And to be honest, there’s only so much that small business truck owners like him do. This guy, like majority (see: all) of small trucking businesses, wouldn’t provide their drivers with long haul truck driving training, as they aren’t usually certified to provide the training. That’s usually done by a third party long haul training company. 

 

As for indiviual training? I can’t say what he would provide in a “15 day training session.” But considering he gives a 15 day training session to drivers that are already certified, that’s 15 days more than other drivers get when signing onto an independent trucking company.

 

For example, both my neighbors are truck drivers who drive for an ex-client of mine who also lives down the street. When he started his business 6 years ago, he ran one other truck. He’s now up to 9. He doesn’t provide any additional training that’s not required by law. He hires guys that completed their long haul license and have some experience driving for another company, large (ie: Gardewine) or small.

 

Long story short, the guy who owns the company likely provided, at least from what I’m familiar with in my province, with more training than he’s required to.

It was a two man operation...the owner and this guy who was reportedly a family friend.  He SAYS there was training but we have no way to really confirm that.  Was it sitting in the backyard having a beer and discussing routes?  It'll be interesting to see what's uncovered in all of this  But stricter regulations obviously will be considered.  A guy running a trucking company out of his house may or may not be legit...but that will become known soon enough.

 

The victims and their families.  Those people deserve this process....

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18 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:

A guy running a trucking company out of his house may or may not be legit

If the business is registered (which it is), I’m sure like all other small trucking companies, running it out of ones house is not uncommon. In fact, it would be far more uncommon if a 2-10 truck outfit was run out of an actual leased/owned building.

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10 minutes ago, Monty said:

If the business is registered (which it is), I’m sure like all other small trucking companies, running it out of ones house is not uncommon. In fact, it would be far more uncommon if a 2-10 truck outfit was run out of an actual leased/owned building.

Quote

 

A trucking business “connected” to Adesh Deol Trucking Ltd., the company involved in the Humboldt Broncos crash that killed 16 people, has opened at the same Calgary address as Adesh Deol, Global News has learned.

Alberta’s Ministry of Transportation confirmed that while Adesh Deol Trucking remains suspended, one of the drivers connected to the Calgary-based business is working with the new company.

“Alberta Transportation is aware that a numbered company has been registered that is connected to the company involved with the Humboldt incident,” said John Archer, a spokesperson for Transportation Minister Brian Mason. “It is our understanding that one of the trucks and one of the drivers listed from Adesh Deol Trucking Ltd. are operating with this numbered company.”

The ministry said the driver was not the one involved in the Humboldt crash but did not say who the company is registered to. A corporate records search shows that numbered company, 1929282 Alberta Ltd., lists Quality Logistics as a trade partner name and first registered in October 2015.

Quality Logistics was removed from the provincial registry on April 2 for failing to file its annual returns, but eight days after the deadly crash the company was revived on April 14.

On April 20, Quality Logistics – which lists two directors Kuldeep Randhawa and Baltej Singh Brar – changed the company’s address to a home in Calgary where Adesh Deol is located, according to its public corporate profile.

An internal document from the Alberta government, shared with Global News by a source, states that the new company has the same address as the “carrier involved in the accident.”

“Alberta Transportation received information that the carriers’ remaining truck has transferred ownership to a new carrier operating on a temporary Safety Fitness Certificate,” wrote Trudy Nastiuk, executive director of safety and compliance. “Although the new carrier has different ownership, its address is the same as the carrier involved in the accident. Therefore, Alberta Transportation is currently investigating the linkage.”

When reached for further comment, the ministry did not answer questions about the address of the new company or the identity of the owner citing privacy concerns.

“We are not in a position to identify the personnel affiliated with a private company,” Archer said in an email. “The carrier provided proof of training for its sole driver. This training was verified as acceptable.”

Adesh Deol Trucking Ltd. is registered to Sukhmander Singh at a residential address in northeast Calgary. The small company had just two Peterbilt trucks at the time of the Humboldt crash, according to a public profile.

 

By legit, I was more referring to the behaviour rather than registration.  I worked in an industry that found easy work arounds if they ran into trouble...until CBC caught up with them.  Took me awhile to catch on...they pleaded innocent and ignorance but, really, were scamming every which way they could.

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4 hours ago, King Heffy said:

Except we don't know for a fact that's what he was doing.  I'm not saying he should get off scot-free or avoid jail time altogether, but the likelihood of him re-offending is next to zero.  If there's any hope of taking anything positive at all away from this tragedy, I'd prefer we at least consider it.

I'd suggest there is no way he is getting off scot-free no matter what the outcome for the driver. Doing time or not his life essentially ended as he knew it that night as well. Don't get me wrong we've all heard the stories of the famillies struggling, being devastated and destroyed. But mistakes happen, may be unpopular to say but I suspect this is a trauma you don't recover from anyways with that much guilt ? no way. 

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3 hours ago, D-Money said:

Here's the thing - throwing the book at this guy accomplishes little. Because whatever exactly he did, it was likely something that happens thousands of times per day in this country, and usually with little to no consequences.

 

 

The magnitude of the accident- 16 dead and 13 injured warrants "throwing the book at the guy".   If the maximum sentence is not given now, when should it be?

 

Someone must be held accountable for the huge loss of life.

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2 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

This is a tragic example on how the freight industry has gone to $hit.  When you replace $40/hr union drivers with inexperienced drivers making half as much you're going to get plenty of accidents like this one.  And a lot of those drivers are new to the country and probably cheat on getting fully licensed.  That's how these companies make money, by lowballing the reputable truckers and skimping on safety regulations.   I see it every day with the freight we ship out and the materials we receive. 

Sadly a lot of sectors have done this. I have yet to ever have a support guy on the phone or email who wasn't from India or Mexico.

 

Anyway, in the context of this case, if any of that is true then the company itself needs to be held responsible criminally as well. If you don't make it their problem, then they'll just keep continuing their practice without consequence. 

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19 minutes ago, Mike Vanderhoek said:

But mistakes happen, may be unpopular to say

A mistake is forgetting to put on a blinker.   Blowing through a stop sign (I believe that's what happened) in a big rig when the other vehicle has the right of way is reckless and showing no regard for safety.   I'm  concerned that the parents will be even further traumatized knowing someone was responsible and it wasn't just "an accident".  That their children may be lost to someone's complete disregard for other's lives.

 

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https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/charges-laid-humboldt-bus-crash-1.4736826

 

Quote

What we know about Sidhu

Sidhu worked for the trucking company for a month prior to the fatal collision, according to owner Sukhmander Singh. Singh said Sidhu trained with him for two weeks and was driving on his own for two more weeks before the crash.

Although Sidhu was not injured in the crash, he did receive trauma counselling in the aftermath. 

Sidhu was a bachelor of commerce student at Panjab University in Chandigarh, India, from 2008 until 2012, according to his LinkedIn profile.

 

He made his way to Calgary on a student visa in 2013 to study for a diploma in business administration at Bow Valley College from 2014 until 2015.

Sidhu's lawyer declined to comment on his client.

The Saskatchewan Junior Hockey League's Humboldt Broncos were heading to Nipawin for a playoff game when the collision occurred.

Ten Broncos players died. The six other deaths included the bus driver, an athletic therapist, the head coach, assistant coach and two employees of Humboldt's FM radio station.humboldt-victims-graphic-all.png

Ten members of the Broncos died in the crash. The six other deaths included the bus driver, an athletic therapist, the head coach, assistant coach and two employees of Humboldt's FM radio station. (CBC)

Dangerous driving vs. criminal negligence

Saskatoon-based criminal defence lawyer Brian Pfefferle said dangerous driving is just one of the possible charges that can be laid after serious collisions in Saskatchewan.

Criminal negligence causing death and bodily harm would be among the other possible charges.

Pfefferle said the RCMP's decision to charge Sidhu with dangerous driving suggests the Crown will argue that the driver's behaviour was more than negligence or a momentary lapse of judgment.

In order to secure a conviction, Pfefferle said the Crown will have to prove that the accused was driving in "a manner that constituted a marked departure from the standard of a reasonably prudent driver in the circumstances."

"There's lots of accidents that happen on Saskatchewan roadways where these types of charges aren't laid," said Pfefferle.

"So I'm slightly surprised, I guess, by the fact that they've laid the charge but they obviously know information that the rest of the public doesn't know."

The stop sign

Police have not disclosed the findings of their investigation into how the crash happened.

Brad Muir, an accident investigator with the Collision Reconstruction Group in Ajax, Ont., said he is pleased to see charges laid.  

"I think we need to look and dig a little further into the facts of not just going through a stop sign, but what was the speed?" he said. 

"We've got obviously a heavily laden commercial vehicle."

Muir believes professional truck drivers need to be held to a high standard.

"I think that's going to go into the decision-making of laying that higher level criminal charge," he said.

 

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I should add that I'm being harsh, but do have empathy for this driver....just not enough to excuse the behaviour that got him into this predicament.  We have options as adults and have to have regard for others around us when making decisions.  He may have been busting his tail on the job, however, taking precautions should not have been compromised as a result.  Blowing through a stop sign was a recipe for disaster more so than an accident.   I don't know that in my decades of driving I've ever missed one...it's called defensive driving.  Be aware and pay attention.

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7 hours ago, HI5 said:

I wonder if the truck driver was on his cell phone. I’ve received plenty of videos on WhatsApp of truckers recording dumb videos of themselves whilst driving and unfortunately I don’t think they realize they’re driving a weapon. 

This isn't just Truck drivers it's all drivers and it's pathetic and getting worse. The text and driving is unreal, I watch a woman texting at rush hour on deerfoot with two kids in the car. Just terrible, no respect or concern for your own kids wow.

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18 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

This isn't just Truck drivers it's all drivers and it's pathetic and getting worse. The text and driving is unreal, I watch a woman texting at rush hour on deerfoot with two kids in the car. Just terrible, no respect or concern for your own kids wow.

I agree. I was driving home before I even walked the 5 blocks to my car, there was 3 vehicles, swearing at pedestrians, other drivers, and nearly hit an older woman in a crosswalk, 2 cars waiting to turn left at an intersection. That's BEFORE I was driving home. There was another left hand turner who zoomed through the light with his middle digit in the air. It's insane. 

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5 hours ago, Kanukfanatic said:

I don't care at all about Li. He cut someone's head off and ate some of it. I DO NOT care if Li has mental health issues. He killed an innocent and he destroyed that victim's family forever. Mental health issues or not, he should have forfeited his life when he committed such a despicable act.

 

Your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the legal system. You sound like you are more worried about the mental health of a guy that viciously cut someone's head off more than the disgusting horrid act he committed. You care more about a killer than a victim. Exact problem with this legal system.

 

And just a little info for you, some of the most violent gang members and offenders also have mental health issues. Do you just feel they are misunderstood? Pathetic.

 

I DO NOT care. They commit horrid acts and the legal system does nothing. 

 

Tell me how you would feel if Li cut off your wife's head, or child's, or family members. Probably wouldn't be such a social worker then I suspect.  

 

EDIT: We need to change Canada Corrections to something like CRIMINAL PUNISHMENT and start actually punishing criminals. You can't correct the behaviours of violent criminals. You sound like you are part of the legal system with your statement of  "and is a very low risk to do something like that again." That is what every judge says when they release violent criminals such as domestic abuse cases. Someone kills a family member and some IDIOT Judge releases the killer and says the KILLER is "a very low risk to do something like that again" using the reasoning that the KILLER only killed their wife...we should release them cuz they probably won't kill anyone else...they ONLY KILLED THEIR WIFE. 

 

Pathetic.

There is a large bridge in responsibility for equivalent immoral acts between a person who is capable of understanding the nature + severity of it but suffers, say, depression or anxiety that sometimes affects them and a person experiencing an acute psychosis who performs the act because an auditory hallucination threatened them to do it and they believed the threats to be real and genuine (and the presumed consequences were severe enough to justify the act).

 

Li isn't a criminal, as far as I know, so I don't think it's quite fair to imply that he is one.

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9 minutes ago, 112 said:

There is a large bridge in responsibility for equivalent immoral acts between a person who is capable of understanding the nature + severity of it but suffers, say, depression or anxiety that sometimes affects them and a person experiencing an acute psychosis who performs the act because an auditory hallucination threatened them to do it and they believed the threats to be real and genuine (and the presumed consequences were severe enough to justify the act).

 

Li isn't a criminal, as far as I know, so I don't think it's quite fair to imply that he is one.

Vince Li cut an innocent persons head off and ate it. I could not care less why. I DO NOT CARE if he claims its a mental health issue. He murdered a person as violently as any person could destroying the his dead victim's family. He is a deviant and should be punished imo. People like you have destroyed this country by letting violent acts go unpunished. Disgusting.

 

I won't respond to you again in this Humboldt thread...and hope never to meet a person like you in life. 

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19 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said:

Vince Li cut an innocent persons head off and ate it. I could not care less why. I DO NOT CARE if he claims its a mental health issue. He murdered a person as violently as any person could destroying the his dead victim's family. He is a deviant and should be punished imo. People like you have destroyed this country by letting violent acts go unpunished. Disgusting.

 

I won't respond to you again in this Humboldt thread...and hope never to meet a person like you in life. 

I think it's more a problem in our culture that people think tagedies always need someone to blame and punish.

 

And ok- you don't have to talk to me. But you're going to have a sad life if you throw insults like that at people upon a disagreement in values. Why you felt the need to respond to me and then state you wouldn't be responding to me any further I don't really understand, but w/e.

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5 hours ago, debluvscanucks said:

This really downplays this collision.   A driving error is missing a turn off...when you barrel through a stop sign in a double trailer rig while on the job it's a bit more than that.  Remember...many fatalities.  This is part of the issue...that we're focusing more on the driver's mishap than we are very dangerous operation of a big rig. 

We have to get past this mindset that careless driving is a "just".  Which is part of what D's touched on here:

I don't agree that it accomplishes nothing.  When someone is responsible for killing multiple people that's a good place to at least start sending a message out.  We are seeing increased penalties, cameras, etc. on the roads and punishing the action is exactly what needs to happen here.  I'm quite sure anyone who takes out a family is put through the same investigative process and, if deemed appropriate, penalties.
 

It was a two man operation...the owner and this guy who was reportedly a family friend.  He SAYS there was training but we have no way to really confirm that.  Was it sitting in the backyard having a beer and discussing routes?  It'll be interesting to see what's uncovered in all of this  But stricter regulations obviously will be considered.  A guy running a trucking company out of his house may or may not be legit...but that will become known soon enough.

 

The victims and their families.  Those people deserve this process....

You like most already jumping to the standard "guilty until proven innocent" narrative and talking out of anger and personal feelings.

 

You're sending off the vibe that he intended to cause an accident and kill people that day.  It was an accident, something that happens daily in this world and always will.  Human error is inevitable.

 

I gurantee you, me and everyone else that drives has had lapses of not seeing something or simply errors.  I don't think that necessarily makes anyone reckless or dangerous.  

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IMO the fault lies with Sidhu and the trucking company.. because according to the article posted above by Deb he only had less than 1 month of driving experience (2 weeks to exact). IMO that doesn't seem nearly enough time to learn how to drive a big rig especially on a winter climate like Saskawatchen with slippery roads.. 

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