Has the Western World Lost Moderate/Centrist Politics?

[JM_]

On 9/7/2019 at 11:19 AM, infinitecarnage said:

 

"almond milking demo" 

[JM_]

46 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

I don’t know man, I agree with the message of the video. 

 

Its interesting how I think that you’re the one who is not getting it, but you’ll think the same of me. This is how politics has gone down since we started picking sides as monkeys or whatever. 

 

I can’t believe how others can think another way about somethings and know it’s mutual. We turn to despise and hate each other in here, not just the ideas. That’s kinda &^@#ed, but I don’t know how to fix it either. 

I don't think its really that bad out there, its just really really easy to spew reactions on people on certain platforms. There's nothing about twitter that breeds respect. 

 

You and i have some very fundamental differences on some topics but you also don't go and try to make it personal, you just call it as you see it. I can respect that, I do that all the time too. Doesn't mean I have to hate you for it. 

 

I think it comes down to being able to dislike the idea but you can still like the person. I think most people have that capacity but for some reason that switch is turned off when it comes to social media like twitter, facetube or instagram, which turns everything into a toilet eventually. I really dislike those platforms. Platforms like CDC are often better because you can have longer conversations if you want to. 

 

 

Edited September 9, 2019 by Jimmy McGill

[JM_]

42 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Nicely stated 189.  We are at a point now, where a voice that is contrary to what is currently popular is one that is not valued.  

why should a contrary view hold any value just because its contrary? maybe its just a demonstrably dumb idea like many of the things Bernier is pushing. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

why should a contrary view hold any value just because its contrary? maybe its just a demonstrably dumb idea like many of the things Bernier is pushing. 

Just because an idea is dumb, doesn’t mean it has no value.  We learn from even the dumbest of ideas.  If Bernier doesn’t espouse his dumb ideas, how do we know what he truly is?  Plus, some ideas that may appear dumb now are more prophetic than they are stupid, no?  

[RUPERTKBD]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Just because an idea is dumb, doesn’t mean it has no value.  We learn from even the dumbest of ideas.  If Bernier doesn’t espouse his dumb ideas, how do we know what he truly is?  Plus, some ideas that may appear dumb now are more prophetic than they are stupid, no?  

yes it does.......

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, RUPERTKBD said:

yes it does.......

Why? 

So because the popular opinion during Copernicus’ time was that his heliocentric view of our solar system was considered dumb the rest of the people shouldn’t be allowed to hear about it?  

Don’t you think it should be up to the individual to decide if an idea is dumb?  

[RUPERTKBD]

Just now, Alflives said:

Why? 

So because the popular opinion during Copernicus’ time was that his heliocentric view of our solar system was considered dumb the rest of the people shouldn’t be allowed to hear about it?  

Don’t you think it should be up to the individual to decide if an idea is dumb?  

You're trying to make the case that heliocentricism was a dumb idea, but I'd say you're incorrect. The dumb ones were the ones who argued to the contrary...

 

In answer to your question. I'd say no. Trump thinks nuking a hurricane is a good idea. It's a stupid idea and no individual  should be allowed to argue otherwise and be taken seriously...

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

You're trying to make the case that heliocentricism was a dumb idea, but I'd say you're incorrect. The dumb ones were the ones who argued to the contrary...

 

In answer to your question. I'd say no. Trump thinks nuking a hurricane is a good idea. It's a stupid idea and no individual  should be allowed to argue otherwise and be taken seriously...

I think we agree.  A dumb idea is a dumb idea.  However, the individual should still be allowed to hear it.  Then that individual can decide if it’s dumb.  Otherwise we have censorship.  Isn’t censorship bad, because it stifles exchange of ideas, even dumb ones? 

[189lb enforcers?]

I’m just trying to use my hand-me-down senses, like my eyes, from trilobites, etc., to perceive my environment, let alone the intentions of others. 

 

We don’t have to agree on everything. 

 

Personally, I see what was described once as what the Brown Shirts were, and other examples of conscripted volunteerism, to usher in a 1984-like tomorrow by the types of antics I see groups like ANTIFA using. Rat out your enemy or brother for wrong think. We see it all over the place now. I could elaborate, but I know it’s not going to be worth the time in here. 

 

I see gun control becoming more of a thing and really question some of what I see as the narratives out there, like Accountant Turned Sniper. I don’t know, but it’s possible that these are deep-state things. After JFK and 911, I don’t think “conspiracy theorist” is a negative moniker, nor is questioning the narratives in MSM. These things are possible. Remember, a population without guns is a population easily put under martial law, as we’ve seen in at least a few examples in the world. Globalism seems to have guns/disarmament and divisiveness as a MO. 

 

I question lots of the narratives out there. 

 

BLM is as much of a sham and play on words as the Wage Gap myth. 

 

Global Warming, lol. Try Glaciation and Pangea; the earth does it’s own thing, puny, narcissistic Humans. It’s not as simple as that, but maybe it gets a convo going and flushes out some easily refutable narratives, not that it’s an enjoyable position to take - one not defending the environment, which is a false equivalence anyways. 

 

Does anybody follow the new evidence steadily mounting which clashes with the Out of Africa Theory of human migration? That oughta get some interesting discussion generated somewhere, but the media message doesn’t like that kind of stuff. No interest. No good could come of it, narrative-wise, so it’s hushed. Wonder why?

 

People seem to be so 100% addicted to MSM and the ridiculous puppet string-ideas that the decisiveness they are taught are successfully keeping generations of us distracted enough to keep us from noticing the 1984 which we are certainly heading for. Why is that?

 

Where is critical thought these days? This is the hate-fact era. Are we any better than the book-burners of yesteryear? When did we become so easily led, misled and willing to be the useful idiots we now are, squabbling while the laws change, some by our own hand, which make us weaker as a group.

 

The divisiveness isn’t accidental, it’s by design, but nobody seems to see it, they’d rather just play out the role they signed up for. That’s social engineering. So many videos and articles exist on that stuff, but they are getting harder and harder to find, but again, it seems Nobody is noticing that. I don’t get it. 

 

Left or Right. CNN or Fox. Black or Brown. Straight or Gay... it’s all the same corral people seem to just want to enter in so they can get their label and take up watch, of the other. We are being segregated. Divide and Conquer is an old game, but obviously effective.

 

Some of our resident posters just scream pawn to me. They are completely lost to the sensory input and programming they’ve been receiving via social media/ MSM, whatever. Like any addict, try telling them that, no matter how good for them the truth might be. Programming Complete!

 

This is NOT what our ancestors lived and died for, all the way back to the Cambrian. I hope everyone puts down their “news” outlets and goes out and perceives the world for themselves, with others, it’s the only way to wake up, IMO, for some. Meh, what do I know. 

 

I’d like to know wtf Deja vu is, not why cuckoldry is good for me. &^@# off, MSM, especially you CNN. 

 

 

 

Edited September 9, 2019 by 189lb enforcers?

[Warhippy]

20 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

 

you mean empty anger didn't deliver better policies or programs? huh. 

 

I think one of the reasons the right seems to be losing steam is that its pretty much performance based - not in the sense of delivering anything tangible, its literally "performance" - a show for the angry masses. Look at Trump, he's literally a reality tv show, there's nothing of substance there whatsoever. Same with Salvini, total wind bag (I hear a lot about him from my Italian in-laws). 

 

 

You might be right.

 

Alberta could be considered a microcosm of it all.  Yell screech scream, prey on the ignorant and the anger and then....fail to deliver 

 

Will be interesting to see over the next few years.

[Warhippy]

12 hours ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Where is critical thought these days? This is the hate-fact era. Are we any better than the book-burners of yesteryear? When did we become so easily led, misled and willing to be the useful idiots we now are, squabbling while the laws change, some by our own hand, which make us weaker as a group.

This is the #1 issue facing us today.

 

it's not LvR, it's not us monkeys choosing sides.  it's us monkeys willing to completely ignore basic literal fact in order to ensure we are not admitting we're wrong

[189lb enforcers?]

4 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

This is the #1 issue facing us today.

 

it's not LvR, it's not us monkeys choosing sides.  it's us monkeys willing to completely ignore basic literal fact in order to ensure we are not admitting we're wrong

Such conviction. 

 

I boil down the West’s LvR as the equality of outcome fixing and the cost of it. 

 

I am totally against anybody asking asking me to literally pay for their lifestyle choices or their ancestors arriving late to the buffet, which I’m somewhat expected to subsidize so we can all have the same starting line. 

 

Ignoring basic facts, yes. Ignoring biology, especially. Ignoring crime rates and what is happening in Europe is something I especially notice on this board. 

 

But like Gump, I am not a smart man, but I know enough to not rely on social media or MSM for “facts”. I can’t figure out what is real on TV anymore. Even the commercials are messages. It’s shaping sides for us monkeys to choose. 

[JM_]

1 hour ago, Warhippy said:

You might be right.

 

Alberta could be considered a microcosm of it all.  Yell screech scream, prey on the ignorant and the anger and then....fail to deliver 

 

Will be interesting to see over the next few years.

Alberta is the perfect example of right wing performance art. Hit the right notes and you can do anything. Kenney sings the AB fight song, and then can engineer fake opponents in his leadership bid, lies about NDP finances that, oops, were actually fine, lies about his real ability to impact the oil sector, etc etc. 

 

If you want the best example of group think in Canada, its the AB conservative movement. They'll overlook anything if you tell them what they want to hear. 

[JM_]

1 hour ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Such conviction. 

 

I boil down the West’s LvR as the equality of outcome fixing and the cost of it. 

 

I am totally against anybody asking asking me to literally pay for their lifestyle choices or their ancestors arriving late to the buffet, which I’m somewhat expected to subsidize so we can all have the same starting line. 

If that was really a thing, "they" are not doing a particularly good job of it.

 

How are you paying for lifestyle choices, more than another taxpayer is funding yours? 

 

Edited September 9, 2019 by Jimmy McGill

[JM_]

14 hours ago, Alflives said:

Just because an idea is dumb, doesn’t mean it has no value.  We learn from even the dumbest of ideas.  If Bernier doesn’t espouse his dumb ideas, how do we know what he truly is?  Plus, some ideas that may appear dumb now are more prophetic than they are stupid, no?  

theres some logic to that Alf  to truly appreciate Hughes you have to see a Pouliot from time to time. 

[Chicken.]

This video is an excellent explanation of why our society has become so polarized with extremism (lack of centre, moderate thought) on either side.

 

Is further regulation required of these massive tech platforms?  His 5 minute intro really made me rethink my own social media usage, even though I got rid of facebook many years ago. I feel used.

 

“The polarization of our society is actually part of the (big tech's) business model.”

 

 

[infinitecarnage]

 

[PhillipBlunt]

31 minutes ago, infinitecarnage said:

 

One of the best stand-up comedians in the world. Both he and Dave Chappelle are absolute comic geniuses.

[Lancaster]

On 9/8/2019 at 5:05 PM, Jimmy McGill said:

I don't think its really that bad out there, its just really really easy to spew reactions on people on certain platforms. There's nothing about twitter that breeds respect. 

 

You and i have some very fundamental differences on some topics but you also don't go and try to make it personal, you just call it as you see it. I can respect that, I do that all the time too. Doesn't mean I have to hate you for it. 

 

I think it comes down to being able to dislike the idea but you can still like the person. I think most people have that capacity but for some reason that switch is turned off when it comes to social media like twitter, facetube or instagram, which turns everything into a toilet eventually. I really dislike those platforms. Platforms like CDC are often better because you can have longer conversations if you want to. 

 

 

Politics is being more personal?

 

Now if you disagree with someone's point of view, it automatically means you have to dislike the person too and wish them ill will, etc.  

Maybe I'm just too young to remember the "olden days"... but maybe before it was a lot of "agree to disagree", whereas now it's "How dare you!  Block/unfriend/censor/cancel/etc".

 

Mental maturity, rationality, and self-discipline has gone out the window.  

[Kragar]

2 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Politics is being more personal?

 

Now if you disagree with someone's point of view, it automatically means you have to dislike the person too and wish them ill will, etc.  

Maybe I'm just too young to remember the "olden days"... but maybe before it was a lot of "agree to disagree", whereas now it's "How dare you!  Block/unfriend/censor/cancel/etc".

 

Mental maturity, rationality, and self-discipline has gone out the window.  

More and more, unfortunately. Found this link referencing a number of studies done on both US and UK, and the trend is not good.

 

https://medium.com/@NoahCarl/who-doesnt-want-to-hear-the-other-side-s-view-9a7cdf3ad702

 

When I was back home in Vancouver recently, I had a pretty heated discussion with one of my best friends over Trump and the flow of illegals coming across the southern border.  We kept it pretty civil, but the number of times I heard "if you only had an open mind..." was starting to piss me off, considering he only had one source for his points. 

 

I'm happy to talk politics with him, but it won't be worth losing him as a friend, so I'll be on the look out to try to be sure we don't cross that line in our talks.