The Captaincy question

[blackpluto96]

2 hours ago, NUCKER67 said:

Just for fun:

 

Canucks get the #1, Draft Jack Hughes

 

to CAR - Horvat

to VAN - Ferland and a 2nd

 

Ferland - Pettersson - Boeser

Leivo - Hughes - Goldobin (may need to upgrade the wingers)

 

 

That's not for fun, that's for a drunk. I'd rather play Bo and Petey on the same line than trading him for a 2/3-line winger and a low-odds lottery ticket.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, blackpluto96 said:

That's not for fun, that's for a drunk. I'd rather play Bo and Petey on the same line than trading him for a 2/3-line winger and a low-odds lottery ticket.

Exactly.  If we trade Bo (which would be stupid) he returns a Seth Jones type young D man.  

[LegionOfDoom]

Why is everyone so concerned to have a player with a C on his jersey, we are a young team and we don’t need to add any pressure or make and forced decisions yet, I’m fine having 3 CO captains until we see our young team unfold, 

[StarGirl]

On 1/10/2019 at 11:43 PM, LegionOfDoom said:

Why is everyone so concerned to have a player with a C on his jersey, we are a young team and we don’t need to add any pressure or make and forced decisions yet, I’m fine having 3 CO captains until we see our young team unfold, 

There's a bit of speculation that we will name a Captain next year as it fits into our 50th anniversary celebration time period though, since Henrik was named Captain during our 40th anniversary celebration time. Just saying---I don't mind waiting longer to name a 'C' either, but there's a possibility that the Organization is just waiting until next season comes to name one.

[captainhorvat]

On 1/4/2019 at 11:56 AM, Fateless said:

It will be Horvat without question.

 

If you've listened to comments Petey's teammates have made about his demeanor, they all indicate that he is quiet, reserved, and doesn't say much - those aren't things that people say about a future NHL captain. That isn't to say that Petey isn't a great teammate or player, simply that he isn't NHL captain material. 

 

On the other hand you have Horvat who is continually the first to deal with the media after a tough loss, the first guy on the ice in practice, and continually the guy speaking up on hot topic matters. That is what makes Horvat captain material.

Quiet, reserved and doesnt say much is expected from a rookie. 

[189lb enforcers?]

On 1/10/2019 at 11:43 PM, LegionOfDoom said:

Why is everyone so concerned to have a player with a C on his jersey, we are a young team and we don’t need to add any pressure or make and forced decisions yet, I’m fine having 3 CO captains until we see our young team unfold, 

[oldnews]

On 1/4/2019 at 11:56 AM, Fateless said:

It will be Horvat without question.

 

If you've listened to comments Petey's teammates have made about his demeanor, they all indicate that he is quiet, reserved, and doesn't say much - those aren't things that people say about a future NHL captain. That isn't to say that Petey isn't a great teammate or player, simply that he isn't NHL captain material. 

 

On the other hand you have Horvat who is continually the first to deal with the media after a tough loss, the first guy on the ice in practice, and continually the guy speaking up on hot topic matters. That is what makes Horvat captain material.

You could probably say the same about Horvat as a rookie.   Listen and learn - that's what future captains do imo as young players - very few are ready to lead in the dressing room or on the ice at that point.

 

Pettersson doesn't need to say a lot imo - he plays 'angry' = his drive is his leadership by example at this point - and I imagine that the more command over the language he develops and more footing he gets in the league, he'll probably be a candidate for captaincy. 

 

At the same time, Horvat is consistently growing his game to where he's now capable of handling quantity of hard minutes - and producing at the same time = plays the game at both ends of the ice like you want a captain to.

 

So the team has a nice problem - of wealth of young leadership imo.  I'd consider Motte another guy that approaches the game with leadership qualities - may not be a 'top 6' but no one competes harder or with more consistency - and he's also only Horvat's age.   The emerging young core looks rich in character imo.

[buddyguy]

On 1/4/2019 at 2:05 PM, EdgarM said:

 

Before this season, I was also thinking Bo was the shoe-in. I would like a leader who wants to win at all costs and will do anything to get there. EP has done everything in his power to win, every game. Bo lately has looked tired or disinterested. 

I don't want the leader to all of a sudden "give up" when the going gets tough I want that fight in him until the very end. Right now that person is Petey, without a doubt.

Ummm did you forget how much of a workhorse Bo was when everyone including Petey was injured. Bo will be the next captain and imo it's not even close.

[JM_]

3 minutes ago, buddyguy said:

Ummm did you forget how much of a workhorse Bo was when everyone including Petey was injured. Bo will be the next captain and imo it's not even close.

Bo is the best choice. He's got a maturity beyond his years (actually so does Brock and Petey but not quite the same way), he's got the work ethic, the demeanour, the experience.

Edited January 27, 2019 by Jimmy McGill

[EdgarM]

5 minutes ago, buddyguy said:

Ummm did you forget how much of a workhorse Bo was when everyone including Petey was injured. Bo will be the next captain and imo it's not even close.

Yeah I remember that but he has gone into a lull lately and I gave him the benefit of the doubt that it was going to get better when "help" returned and then I thought it was because of the long road trip but these last few games have me wondering if its something else.

I see attributes in Petey that you rarely see. He is relentless in doing what ever it takes to win. Just watch him even behind the play he is always thinking what can I do. He never just stands on the ice and watches the play. I could only imagine if every player on the ice did that.

Oh its close and I am so glad that they waited to see who was Captain because its not so cut and dry as it was last year.

[alt kilgore]

Horvat is still miles ahead of Petey IMO.  Pettersson is way too new to the league, to his team mates, to the English language. He already has a lot of pressure on him as our saviour, to also add responsibilities of captaincy?  No. Maybe if he had been introduced a couple of years ago.  Also, I think he'd himself not want it now. He'd feel a bit like he was stealing it from Bo. And I'm sure some radio hosts, and message board trolls, would also give that decision a lot of grief

 

But that doesn't mean Bo checks all the boxes either.  I too am baffled at his non-response to altercations against one of our players. I don't know if I've even ever seen him scrum it up in front of the net. He really shys away from physical aggressiveness. He's not afraid to, its just not what he likes to do. That's fine, and maybe he took his cues from watching Henrik, but I'd prefer a captain that will, when warranted of course, put aside his comfort zone, and even if its acting out of character for him,  have more pushback when other teams/players get nasty with us.  But that said, there is  no doubt of his passion for the game. He gets visibly p'd off when he doesn't score, when its a close game, for instance. He can talk to the refs, lots of experience there. He is talented enough on the ice and scores important goals to be a captain. And also, maybe not the most important, he has the physical stature.

 

So weighing in everything, Bo is by far the leading candidate. Its hard to get the perfect captain who checks every box. Bo is the closest to that we have. I think he'd make a fine captain indeed.

[cyoung]

The captaincy here reminds me of the king's situation a few years ago when they gave Dustin Brown the C until Kopitar was ready to take the reigns (also brown regressed a bit). 

 

I think Pettersson will and should be the captain eventually but right now Horvat is our guy. 

[Slegr]

2 hours ago, kilgore said:

But that doesn't mean Bo checks all the boxes either.  I too am baffled at his non-response to altercations against one of our players. I don't know if I've even ever seen him scrum it up in front of the net. He really shys away from physical aggressiveness. He's not afraid to, its just not what he likes to do. That's fine, and maybe he took his cues from watching Henrik, but I'd prefer a captain that will, when warranted of course, put aside his comfort zone, and even if its acting out of character for him,  have more pushback when other teams/players get nasty with us.  

This is my biggest regret about Horvat too. He has more potential to push back, but he hasn't so much. I saw stats from someone on here recently that show how rarely he is hitting these days too. 

So if he's not hitting much or helping protect his teammates much, there aren't as many differences between him and EP, except that Horvat can win a lot of faceoffs. Meanwhile, EP is way more talented offensively. They both back check hard and are good two way players. You could argue Horvat is more vocal with leadership, but I'm not convinced, as EP already seems to be coming into his own with that.

My concern is that they're both still relatively young, and even if Horvat might be beating out EP today with captaincy qualities, Pettersson's ceiling isn't yet known, and he may become one of the league's best players and leaders. It would be pretty awkward and demoralizing to have to strip Horvat of the captaincy in two seasons if the organization realizes it made a mistake on it. I still think they could both be made captain pretty easily. But given how much potential I see with EP, if I was management, I'd be nervous to not give it to him. 

[EdgarM]

6 minutes ago, Slegr said:

This is my biggest regret about Horvat too. He has more potential to push back, but he hasn't so much. I saw stats from someone on here recently that show how rarely he is hitting these days too. 

So if he's not hitting much or helping protect his teammates much, there aren't as many differences between him and EP, except that Horvat can win a lot of faceoffs. Meanwhile, EP is way more talented offensively. They both back check hard and are good two way players. You could argue Horvat is more vocal with leadership, but I'm not convinced, as EP already seems to be coming into his own with that.

My concern is that they're both still relatively young, and even if Horvat might be beating out EP today with captaincy qualities, Pettersson's ceiling isn't yet known, and he may become one of the league's best players and leaders. It would be pretty awkward and demoralizing to have to strip Horvat of the captaincy in two seasons if the organization realizes it made a mistake on it. I still think they could both be made captain pretty easily. But given how much potential I see with EP, if I was management, I'd be nervous to not give it to him. 

Bo has been on such an upswing for such a long time .it seems, and then after that fight he got into he has done nothing since. Yes he has played awesome as a shutdown center and has helped the team with a crazy amount of faceoffs but his bid for the next Captain has eased up a bit.

I eerily see the habits that Hank exhibited slowly creeping into his game. Not finishing checks along the boards, non-chalantly skating back to the bench, giving up on plays during a shift and generally not really leading his team to victory.

I sincerely believe he has it in him but recently I am seeing all of the qualities of a good Captain in Petey. I agree, the part that separated Bo from the rest was his aggressive ,hard hitting play and his play lately is resembling a finesse player who skates away when the going gets tough.

I am still cheering for Bo but he now has competition in a natural born leader who it seems will not let anyone stop him in succeeding in this league.

[Slegr]

2 hours ago, cyoung said:

I think Pettersson will and should be the captain eventually but right now Horvat is our guy. 

How would that even work? We'd give it to Bo for like 3 years, then take it away from him and give it to EP? They're both young players. This isn't a Brown or Thornton situation.

I imagine all that would do is damage relations between the Canucks organization and Horvat for years to come.

[cyoung]

10 minutes ago, Slegr said:

How would that even work? We'd give it to Bo for like 3 years, then take it away from him and give it to EP? They're both young players. This isn't a Brown or Thornton situation.

I imagine all that would do is damage relations between the Canucks organization and Horvat for years to come.

 I can't tell the future man. In my opinion, eventually, Petey should wear the C. The way he carries himself, leads by example, the kid is a leader. 

[rekker]

6 minutes ago, cyoung said:

 I can't tell the future man. In my opinion, eventually, Petey should wear the C. The way he carries himself, leads by example, the kid is a leader. 

Love Petey but I would put the C on Bo instead any and every day. He's a born leader. 

[rekker]

49 minutes ago, EdgarM said:

Bo has been on such an upswing for such a long time .it seems, and then after that fight he got into he has done nothing since. Yes he has played awesome as a shutdown center and has helped the team with a crazy amount of faceoffs but his bid for the next Captain has eased up a bit.

I eerily see the habits that Hank exhibited slowly creeping into his game. Not finishing checks along the boards, non-chalantly skating back to the bench, giving up on plays during a shift and generally not really leading his team to victory.

I sincerely believe he has it in him but recently I am seeing all of the qualities of a good Captain in Petey. I agree, the part that separated Bo from the rest was his aggressive ,hard hitting play and his play lately is resembling a finesse player who skates away when the going gets tough.

I am still cheering for Bo but he now has competition in a natural born leader who it seems will not let anyone stop him in succeeding in this league.

I suspect Bo comes out flying after the break. He has been rode hard this first half, both in hard ice time, and as a leader with so many veterans out. We forget he is still quite young to take that much on. 

[EdgarM]

4 minutes ago, rekker said:

I suspect Bo comes out flying after the break. He has been rode hard this first half, both in hard ice time, and as a leader with so many veterans out. We forget he is still quite young to take that much on. 

Yeah that's what I am hoping and I know he has learned so much since he came into the league and he hasn't disappointed yet. I guess time will tell how this plays out. Any kind of playoffs would really separate the men from the boys and show who's destined to lead this team.

[rekker]

2 hours ago, EdgarM said:

Yeah that's what I am hoping and I know he has learned so much since he came into the league and he hasn't disappointed yet. I guess time will tell how this plays out. Any kind of playoffs would really separate the men from the boys and show who's destined to lead this team.

For sure. Bo was a stud vs the Flames as a rookie in the playoffs. Cant wait to see him play there again.