JB: I’ll make the phone call about the 1st overall pick

[BabychStache]

Hughes will be good, but i haven't seen anything about him that says he'll be great. 

 

If 10+Demko+OJ gets him, ok fine. I doubt it though. 

 

Perfect world they grab Kakko at 1 and JB has a deal chambered with the Rangers for 2. Although Rags need a "Face of the Franchise" Jack is that. 

[IBatch]

58 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said:

Like I said, he deserves to be in the NHL's top 100, but he never got close to living up to his hype.  3 things made him an excellent player.  First and foremost his aggressive play followed by his accuracy and skating.

 

He had the tools to be better than he became, but 90's style hockey partially tamed the beast.

 

On occasion I wonder how he would do today.  The rules would negate his aggressive playing style but at the same time would have kept him from being injured as often. 

 

Would he be just another talented big man in today's game or would he live up to his previous billing...

He’d be awesome in today’s game, checking isn’t illegal, just checks to the head and he played all but his first couple years in the dead puck era (and even those years scoring was on a decline).  He was built for that era given he could bulldog away from the hooks and holds, but imagine what he could do without that hooking and holding in the first place.  It was a rodeo back then, watch some Lemuiex highlights and it’s amazing how much I have forgotten about how the game was played, he’s always scoring while getting taken down or two or three guys on him with holds and hooks (no penalties of course). 

 

Remember who else was playing at the time, Bure, Federov, Yzerman, Sakic, Selanne, Kariya, Hull....there was a huge list of guys and during that time for a three or four year period he was considered the best of them all.  How would these guys fair today?  Pretty awesome I’d say.

 

Imagine how many goals Bure would have playing today too...I feel bad for guys that spent the bulk of their careers in a ten year time period from the time NJ won their first cup until the lockout year.  Hockey needed a shot to the arm by then.  Lindros was Uber skilled and Uber sized.  A tank on skates that moved with the best of them (his stickhandling was better than his skating IMO, as was his passing and shot).

 

edit:  As per the hype I’d say he did live up to it, what was it his third year in he won his hardware?  It was short lived (like I say three of four years) but it was there, and PHI entered their final the favourites to win and Detroit spoiled their party.   Shanny talks about it how all the press were telling them it was Eric’s time and they didn’t have a chance, and how three shifts in he knew they were going to beat them on toughness which they did...that 97-98 two cup team was ruthless.

Edited April 13, 2019 by IBatch

[Alflives]

6 minutes ago, BabychStache said:

Hughes will be good, but i haven't seen anything about him that says he'll be great. 

 

If 10+Demko+OJ gets him, ok fine. I doubt it though. 

 

Perfect world they grab Kakko at 1 and JB has a deal chambered with the Rangers for 2. Although Rags need a "Face of the Franchise" Jack is that. 

I think Jack Hughes is a game changer.  Look at what Marner does for the Leafs. That’s what Hughes will do for whomever gets him.  Getting Marner from the Leafs would require an offer sheet (not matched) that costs 4 firsts.  I don’t see the Devils taking anything less for Hughes.  For us, that would mean OJ + Demko + 10 OA + 2020 (unprotected) 1st.  And I still don’t think that’s enough.  

[Hindustan Smyl]

5 hours ago, Hindustan Smyl said:

 

 

-Horvat

-10th OA

-Hutton

-Virtanen

-2020 1st

 

Don’t mind me guys........just thinking to myself outloud, lol.

 

Pearson-Pettersson-Boeser

Panarin-J.Hughes-Gaudette

Leivo-Sutter-Eriksson

Roussel-Beagle-MacEwan

 

Motte

 

Edler-Stecher

Q.Hughes-Tanev

Tryamkin-Schenn

 

Sautner

 

Markstrom

Demko

 

(Juolevi and Woo eventually replace Edler and Tanev).  

[IBatch]

52 minutes ago, Alflives said:

The Big E was great during his time, but (because he was so much bigger than the kids he played against while in junior) he played with his head down too much.  

Yep.  He ragdolled NHLers a lot too, that legion of doom line weighed 1/3 of a ton and it was the best line in hockey for some time.  Stevens crunched him so bad he never fully recovered.  He spoke about it last year in an interview and how the half dozen or so diagnosed concussions changed the way he played later on, he played scared and didn’t cut to the middle nearly as often which before was his calling card and his bread and butter.  He was also a feared fighter and a big hitter himself.  About as a complete a hockey player this game ever had in the same mould as Howe...just not as durable.   In a different era (today’s, and pretty much anyone not including the one he played in) he’d have been an unstoppable force.    

 

The nineties was the start of the dead puck era (95), and the start of the arms race with enforcers.  There was some big scary men back then that loaded up pretty much ever fourth line in the league. It was quite the rodeo and he was the top dog until Stevens crushed him.  

[ilduce39]

I swear the price for “first overall” will likely be a whole lot more than the price for “Jack Hughes” in about a year.  

 

If we really need another brother combo let’s just wait.

[Maniwaki Canuck]

7 hours ago, Tystick said:

10th overall + Horvat + Baertschi + 2nd round pick

for

1st overall

 

Would you make this trade for Jack Hughes?

No, I wouldn't, but that (or something comparable) would be the ask.

From a team-building perspective, I don't know that Petterson + Hughes is better than Petterson + Horvat.  Horvat is super valuable as a guy who can produce offense while shutting down the other team's top line.  If Madden/Gaudette can eventually center an offensive 3rd line and 4th line that does shutdown but also contributes offensively, we're good to go.  No point in blowing assets to get another center when we're already strong there. 

Let's keep the 10th overall, get Soderstrom, make a couple of good UFA signings, and be a powerhouse in 2-3 years.

[KKnight]

15 hours ago, Generational.EP40 said:

- Top 10 pick

- Juolevi (5th overall) adds to their poor defence prospect pool

- Madden/Lockwood are one of the best college prospects with certainly an NHL future

- Demko is one of the best goalie prospects ready to become a starter / or a 1st next year which is never bad

 

...I’d say that’s a fair share of quality and quantity.

Only problem I have with that is we have little to no quality of d prospects coming through pipeline. 

 

Q.hughes 

J.Woo

Tryamkin? Who knows 

Rathbone. 

Brisebois. No offense to his game. 

Sautner? Ummm. Grasping at straws here. 

Rafferty?

Teves?

 

That's not a lot man. 

 

If Our d had three studs that were fairly young and locked in to long term deals, then I'd say "hell yeah!" I just don't feel we are in a position to give up the necessary package for him. 

[Hindustan Smyl]

1 hour ago, BabychStache said:

Hughes will be good, but i haven't seen anything about him that says he'll be great. 

 

If 10+Demko+OJ gets him, ok fine. I doubt it though. 

 

Perfect world they grab Kakko at 1 and JB has a deal chambered with the Rangers for 2. Although Rags need a "Face of the Franchise" Jack is that. 

If the Rags land Jack Hughes, I wonder if we’ll see “Messier meets Hughes” commercials (with sexual and pedophilia undertones) just as we saw with Messier meets McDavid from 2015?

[Sbriggs]

10 hours ago, ktcy2 said:

That’s a very very interesting situation. But no, Quinn is a special player and one that we haven’t had for decades. So we will keep him unless they give us Hall straight up.

No way we want more then Hall for Quinn, I would not make that trade

[vannuck59]

39 minutes ago, KKnight said:

Only problem I have with that is we have little to no quality of d prospects coming through pipeline. 

 

Q.hughes 

J.Woo

Tryamkin? Who knows 

Rathbone. 

Brisebois. No offense to his game. 

Sautner? Ummm. Grasping at straws here. 

Rafferty?

Teves?

 

That's not a lot man. 

 

If Our d had three studs that were fairly young and locked in to long term deals, then I'd say "hell yeah!" I just don't feel we are in a position to give up the necessary package for him. 

After this draft we will have lots of D prospects.

[Salacious Crumb]

2 hours ago, vannuck59 said:

Personally I would target Picks in the 10 to 15 range.

Flyers Pick # 11 Trade, Virtanen and Hutton and draft  Newhook

Panthers Pick # 13 Trade Markstrom and Tryamkins rights and draft Lavoie

 

Really?

 

Hutton and Virtanen are two know NHLers for a maybe?

 

Trade a top 10 goalie to a team that by all reports is looking at signing goalie Bob as a free agent?

 

Spitballing is fun but can we stick within the realm of possibility?

[The Great Canucks]

17 hours ago, peaches5 said:

The only Obvious players who are untouchables are Pettersson and Hughes. Horvat is 100% expendable if you're trading for a 1st overall centre and already have a number 1 two way centre in Pettersson. Markstrom made this team look way better than it actually was. Without Markstrom, this team was last in the NHL. If you give up Horvat + keep your first this year and get the first overall... The rebuild is looking pretty solid. 

Umm, no. Horvat isn't expendable, especially for a player who is actually projected to play wing in the NHL.

[Pete M]

Virtanen for Tiffoli....sorry, wrong thread...

[xereau]

16 hours ago, runtzguy said:

Jesus Christ, if Benning is really thinking about acquiring the 1st overall because we are hosting it and Jack Hughes is Quinn Hughe's brother then we should fire Benning. It is this kind of sentiment towards players that made us draft Jake Virtanen in his draft year because he is a BC boy and can be like Cam Neely? Wtf? How does this logic make sense?

 

 

That's a very precarious pile of strawmen you have assembled there.

[xereau]

3 minutes ago, Pete M said:

Virtanen for Tiffoli....sorry, wrong thread...

[oldnews]

12 hours ago, HOFsedins said:

I disagree with Matthews being "generational". That term has been beaten hard.  

 

The only generational players in the NHL right now are Crosby, Ovechkin and McDavid.

Agree entirely.  Probably no one as overhyped and over-rated as Matthews has been.

 

If the game were simply about one team's scoring, he's 'elite'

But the game goes both ways.

 

He's as spoon-fed as any Leaf at 58.4% ozone starts.

1 second less powerplay ice-time / game than Tavares - in other words as much pp ice time as anyone on the Leafs.

 

3.9 on ice goals against per 60 is the worst on the Leafs - by a fair margin.

He's -9 in the what are as opportune minutes as any Leaf plays....

 

He has a long way to go in developing his game without the puck to be considered one of the best in the game.

 

And further, he needs to start showing up when it matters - in the playoffs - where he's looking as vacant as he did in last year's postseason.

Personally, I'd deal him to cash in on his pedigree - would have tried to do so before this point because I think the Leafs would be / would have been a better team if they had another young top 4 D, and a relative replacement forward - which they could probably get for him.

 

I think the irony is that the tank thing, at least in the Leafs case - looks as much like a 'speed up the rebuild' thing as anything.

They have merely one other pick in their lineup (Dermott, a high 2nd and 6th D)  from the "stockpile the picks" era.  It was a cool story while it lasted, but....they still have work to do imo.

Edited April 13, 2019 by oldnews

[SabreFan1]

2 hours ago, TheRealistOptimist said:

Yet again, you're talking about the results of his career. As for the term "unique", by definition you are correct. When I hear that term though, I generally think rare/very rare, not one of a kind, but that's clearly my bad. 

 

He was a "rare" prospect at the time, due to his size, speed and skill all put together.

 

I'm not arguing that he lived up to it.

 

He was believed to be a generational talent at the time, Jack Hughes is not.

Most people believe Hughes will be a star, but for sure the hype has dimmed a little over the last couple of years.

 

Lindros was the poster boy for the danger of hyping up a superior junior player too much.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, SabreFan1 said:

Most people believe Hughes will be a star, but for sure the hype has dimmed a little over the last couple of years.

 

Lindros was the poster boy for the danger of hyping up a superior junior player too much.

Lindt is was great, but the Flyers gave the Nordiques/Avs a couple cups with the traded assets used to get him, didn’t they?  

[canuck73_3]

3 hours ago, vannuck59 said:

Personally I would target Picks in the 10 to 15 range.

Flyers Pick # 11 Trade, Virtanen and Hutton and draft  Newhook

Panthers Pick # 13 Trade Markstrom and Tryamkins rights and draft Lavoie

 

 

those are VERY gross overpayments