Lets open this to discussion Mike Gillis returning President

[Me_]

On 4/30/2019 at 3:44 PM, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

This one tweet assures me that everything will be fine.

 

EVERYTHING.

[YummyCakeFace]

There’s no way in hell he comes back to work with this loony tune ownership group. 

[mikeyman109]

50 minutes ago, YummyCakeFace said:

There’s no way in hell he comes back to work with this loony tune ownership group. 

Thank goodness, why not see if we can dig up Jake Milford or maybe ask Harry Neale to come back as well? hell Harrys 82 but he got the team to the finals in 82.

Lets move forward not backwards.

[aqua59]

I'm thinking Gillis might be headed to where ever the new ownership of Arizona moves that team. Speculatively speaking of course. But its evident hes not coming back here.

 

[-DLC-]

I'm of the "there's no going back" team.

 

I feel that there are reasons that we've moved on from people and that doesn't change.  Fresh ideas/new identity, etc.

 

Unless we're talking players returning in order to coach or be in some other capacity with the team, I just don't know that it's forward facing.  Personally, I tend to file things away once I've gotten over the emotional roller coaster of my team dismantling.  It just doesn't make sense to me to go back in time and "try again".  Especially with coaches/and or management.  There's generally a reason to move on and that doesn't change over time.

 

Linden was an exception.  Burr/Bieksa would have been too (for me).

[grandmaster]

I wonder if MG was the worst drafting GM in Canuck history. So many first round busts 

[Jetliner]

hell no

[JesseBlue]

heck yes

[ItTakesAnArmy]

Yes, he modernized the front office.

On 5/26/2019 at 10:11 PM, grandmaster said:

I wonder if MG was the worst drafting GM in Canuck history. So many first round busts 

Wow, just about as many as Benning.by rankings. Benning selections apart from the year Boeser slipped is far worse. In top ten picks Gillis was two for two, Cody Hodgson and Bo Horvat. Both were players out of the box.

 

Jake Virtanen - not a 6 overall, a bad selection

Jared McCann -  a good pick but not valued in Vancouver, given away for free.

Brock Boeser - good pick, exceptional player ranked by 25 scouting offices at #25,

Oli Juolevi - So far behind his drat class he can not even be rated as an NHL player, very bad pick.

Elias Pettersson - Great pick by comparisons.

Quinton Hughes - too early to tell if he can manage the bigger stronger NHL players but has skating and puck handling skill.

Gaudette - A pick from Gillis starting out, he if he can make the team

 

But where are the others? The other 35 draft picks?

What about ALL those clause contracts Benning has handcuffed the team with? Even more than Gillis did, but the Sedins were much better players than Eriksson.

[EP Phone Home]

1 hour ago, ItTakesAnArmy said:

Yes, he modernized the front office.

Wow, just about as many as Benning.by rankings. Benning selections apart from the year Boeser slipped is far worse. In top ten picks Gillis was two for two, Cody Hodgson and Bo Horvat. Both were players out of the box.

 

Jake Virtanen - not a 6 overall, a bad selection

Jared McCann -  a good pick but not valued in Vancouver, given away for free.

Brock Boeser - good pick, exceptional player ranked by 25 scouting offices at #25,

Oli Juolevi - So far behind his drat class he can not even be rated as an NHL player, very bad pick.

Elias Pettersson - Great pick by comparisons.

Quinton Hughes - too early to tell if he can manage the bigger stronger NHL players but has skating and puck handling skill.

Gaudette - A pick from Gillis starting out, he if he can make the team

 

But where are the others? The other 35 draft picks?

What about ALL those clause contracts Benning has handcuffed the team with? Even more than Gillis did, but the Sedins were much better players than Eriksson.

Thatcher Demko

MDP

Breis 

Jet Woo

Tyler Madden

Kole Lind

Gadget

Forsling (traded but made the bigs with the Blackhawks)

 Jack Rathebone

and many more that I’m forgetting that have great potential of being NHLers.

Jake is a good player that has a purpose on this team and it doesn’t always mean to score goals. OJ is behind on his development but to cast him out already would be a mistake.

 

Will all of them make it, no but it’s a lot heftier cupboard then just a Hutton,Gaunce and Horvat (MGs best pick of his tenure).

 

I think that MG did a lot of good things for this team when he was here, however drafting was certainly not one of them. Benning on the other hand has had mixed results with trades and free agent signings but his drafting has been the best this team has had in a very long time if not ever. Gillis was a master at getting the best of the players when it came to diet,sleep and schedule. He helped change the locker room into what it is today as other teams have copied the layout of the locker room. Anyhow all I’m saying is there are strengths and weaknesses to every GM and these two were good in different areas. But to say MG was a good drafter is offside IMO. 

 

(I will also say that the team was on different terms, MG was contending and Benning is rebuilding. So of course Benning will get some easy picks with drafting so high but nothing in life is guaranteed and that goes with top picks) 

 

 

P.S. your handle reminds me of what Botch used to say. RIP

Edited May 28, 2019 by EP Phone Home

[wai_lai416]

9 hours ago, EP Phone Home said:

Thatcher Demko

MDP

Breis 

Jet Woo

Tyler Madden

Kole Lind

Gadget

Forsling (traded but made the bigs with the Blackhawks)

 Jack Rathebone

and many more that I’m forgetting that have great potential of being NHLers.

Jake is a good player that has a purpose on this team and it doesn’t always mean to score goals. OJ is behind on his development but to cast him out already would be a mistake.

 

meh players with potential.. all players have potential of being in the NHL hence why we draft them.. and what is jake's purpose on this team if he's not scoring goals? coz he sure as hell doesn't use his body to play big... 

Jake and OJ will always be fodders here in Vancouver unless they miraculously turn into a borderline star.. considering what was drafted after and directly after them.. since we like to do redrafts all the time.. i doubt Jake or OJ will even be in the first round in a redraft

[EP Phone Home]

7 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

meh players with potential.. all players have potential of being in the NHL hence why we draft them.. and what is jake's purpose on this team if he's not scoring goals? coz he sure as hell doesn't use his body to play big... 

Jake and OJ will always be fodders here in Vancouver unless they miraculously turn into a borderline star.. considering what was drafted after and directly after them.. since we like to do redrafts all the time.. i doubt Jake or OJ will even be in the first round in a redraft

You can find that all teams that missed on good players, not all of them are going to hit. Would I have liked JV and OJ to be impact players? Of course but I sure as hell would rather have Jake playing in the NHL then picking someone like Sonny Milano, Ho-Sang or a Del Colle. There can always be better choices but there certainly be worse and it’s easy as fans to always pick apart the picks. I’d rather have meh drafted players then don’t make the show at all. Jim has drafted a hell of a lot more players that are on the team playing then Mike ever did and that can’t be disputed. Again two different timelines for the teams goals but I get tired of people questioning the drafting of this team. Not every player drafted will be an all star. 

 

Also if you want to grasp straws with missed picks we drafted Boeser at 23rd (the last time we made the playoffs we also got our top line trigger man). That and we drafted the best player in the 2017 draft. You win some and you lose some, not every pick is going to be a home run. That can be said for every team.

Edited May 29, 2019 by EP Phone Home

[Me_]

On 5/26/2019 at 6:11 PM, grandmaster said:

I wonder if MG was the worst drafting GM in Canuck history. So many first round busts 

Definitely up there. But Nonis. Brought in Luongo yes. But what else?

 

There is this tendency in Canucks GMs to become frozen by indecision. It is stunning to me.

 

Gillis profited from the Burke riches.

Only two players from the entire Gillis era are left on the Canucks; Markstrom who was traded for Luongo, and Horvat who as a 1st round pick was traded for Schneider.

 

Based on how he managed the Luongo/Schneider/Lack fiasco he should never be near an NHL team again.

[khay]

 

 

 

 

3

20 hours ago, ItTakesAnArmy said:

Yes, he modernized the front office.

Wow, just about as many as Benning.by rankings. Benning selections apart from the year Boeser slipped is far worse. In top ten picks Gillis was two for two, Cody Hodgson and Bo Horvat. Both were players out of the box.

 

Jake Virtanen - not a 6 overall, a bad selection

Jared McCann -  a good pick but not valued in Vancouver, given away for free.

Brock Boeser - good pick, exceptional player ranked by 25 scouting offices at #25,

Oli Juolevi - So far behind his drat class he can not even be rated as an NHL player, very bad pick.

Elias Pettersson - Great pick by comparisons.

Quinton Hughes - too early to tell if he can manage the bigger stronger NHL players but has skating and puck handling skill.

Gaudette - A pick from Gillis starting out, he if he can make the team

 

But where are the others? The other 35 draft picks?

What about ALL those clause contracts Benning has handcuffed the team with? Even more than Gillis did, but the Sedins were much better players than Eriksson.

Gillis would be 1-for-2. If you say Virtanen is a bad selection, then Hodgson is a bad selection. Not Hodgson's fault but he didn't have a successful career, fitting of a top 10 pick. Virtanen will not live up to the expectations of a #6 overall pick but it looks like he will be a player in the NHL for at least as long as Hodgson was in the league for.

 

And Gaudette is not Gillis pick though, is he?

 

Yes, OJ is quite behind his draft class, only exacerbated by the injuries.

 

I'd say JB has hit 3 home runs in the 1st round: Boeser, EP, and Hughes. But to be fair to MG, he never drafted higher than 9th overall. I think MG was a good manager but there's no denying that drafting was his and the team's downfall. 

 

[EP Phone Home]

Gillis traded Raffael Diaz for a 2015 5th rounder which then in 2015 Benning picked AG88. So it was Gillis who acquired the pick and Benning that used it, and used it well. Hobey Baker winner to boot!

[wai_lai416]

18 hours ago, EP Phone Home said:

You can find that all teams that missed on good players, not all of them are going to hit. Would I have liked JV and OJ to be impact players? Of course but I sure as hell would rather have Jake playing in the NHL then picking someone like Sonny Milano, Ho-Sang or a Del Colle. There can always be better choices but there certainly be worse and it’s easy as fans to always pick apart the picks. I’d rather have meh drafted players then don’t make the show at all. Jim has drafted a hell of a lot more players that are on the team playing then Mike ever did and that can’t be disputed. Again two different timelines for the teams goals but I get tired of people questioning the drafting of this team. Not every player drafted will be an all star. 

 

Also if you want to grasp straws with missed picks we drafted Boeser at 23rd (the last time we made the playoffs we also got our top line trigger man). That and we drafted the best player in the 2017 draft. You win some and you lose some, not every pick is going to be a home run. That can be said for every team.

lol sure we got boeser at 23rd.. but at the same time there's like 13-14 others picks that year that were just as good if not better that went ahead of boeser. 

 

the elite tiers Mcdavid, Eichel, Rantanen, marner, then we have to great tier in Werenski Hanifin, Barzal, Chabot, boeser, then we have the good tier in Meier, Strome, Debrusk, Conor. there's also the top goalie prospect in samsonov that went just ahead of boeser too. don't make it sound like we have the steal of the draft.. if anything Matthew Barzal at 16 is the steal of the draft.. Center, Playmaker, can play defense.. or you can argue Rantanen at 10 potential 100 point + player. 

 

as for the best player in 2017? time will tell.. is Pettersson's massive production decline have to do with fatigue/injury? other team figuring out how to play him? can he get back to the pre all star level dominance? at this time i'll say Miro Hesikanen is the best player of the draft as he's instrumental in the stars making the playoff and he's been great for them the entire year and gotten even better in the playoff. production wise he can't compete with pettersson as a defenseman but he has the future norris candidate written everywhere.

 

seldom team misses in the first 5-6 picks of the draft, but missing back to back hurts when you are in the top 10 where that's usually where you will get your core foundation player and not your supplementary player where u can find later on in the draft.

[ItTakesAnArmy]

On 5/28/2019 at 9:11 PM, EP Phone Home said:

Thatcher Demko

MDP

Breis 

Jet Woo

Tyler Madden

Kole Lind

Gadget

Forsling (traded but made the bigs with the Blackhawks)

 Jack Rathebone

and many more that I’m forgetting that have great potential of being NHLers.

Jake is a good player that has a purpose on this team and it doesn’t always mean to score goals. OJ is behind on his development but to cast him out already would be a mistake.

 

Will all of them make it, no but it’s a lot heftier cupboard then just a Hutton,Gaunce and Horvat (MGs best pick of his tenure).

 

I think that MG did a lot of good things for this team when he was here, however drafting was certainly not one of them. Benning on the other hand has had mixed results with trades and free agent signings but his drafting has been the best this team has had in a very long time if not ever. Gillis was a master at getting the best of the players when it came to diet,sleep and schedule. He helped change the locker room into what it is today as other teams have copied the layout of the locker room. Anyhow all I’m saying is there are strengths and weaknesses to every GM and these two were good in different areas. But to say MG was a good drafter is offside IMO. 

 

(I will also say that the team was on different terms, MG was contending and Benning is rebuilding. So of course Benning will get some easy picks with drafting so high but nothing in life is guaranteed and that goes with top picks) 

 

 

P.S. your handle reminds me of what Botch used to say. RIP

You forgot Benning's other 25 GREAT draft picks and the ones that left the team for whatever reason, but being that there was more than one, it sort goes that is is the team and not the players. OR really bad evaluating skills from the GM.

 

Many of Gilis's draft picks could be shown as Higgins, LaPierre, Torres, Maholtra, Erhoff, Ballard and other high skilled players that played in the league for well over 100 games, Benning's can't be said to do that yet.

[ItTakesAnArmy]

On 5/29/2019 at 4:30 PM, khay said:

Gillis would be 1-for-2. If you say Virtanen is a bad selection, then Hodgson is a bad selection. Not Hodgson's fault but he didn't have a successful career, fitting of a top 10 pick. Virtanen will not live up to the expectations of a #6 overall pick but it looks like he will be a player in the NHL for at least as long as Hodgson was in the league for.

 

And Gaudette is not Gillis pick though, is he?

 

Yes, OJ is quite behind his draft class, only exacerbated by the injuries.

 

I'd say JB has hit 3 home runs in the 1st round: Boeser, EP, and Hughes. But to be fair to MG, he never drafted higher than 9th overall. I think MG was a good manager but there's no denying that drafting was his and the team's downfall. 

 

Really, you want to compare a player with a congenital disease as a failure? Fine, in Hodgson's 1rst 80 games he has more points than Jake in 4.

Hodgson's problem was not known at the time and it took years to find out.

Jake on the other hand already had shoulder surgery and was injured when drafted. Shoulder injuries are not the same as others, this was shown by how easy he re-injured it in a fight, which most fans want him to do again even knowing the shoulder issue.They drafted damaged goods. And to make it worse for Jake, his draft year he was drafted for his high out put of offence and what did they do, made him into a third line player.

 

OJ's back injury was less harmful than Boeser's but it has been used as an excuse for 18 months. This is how many years now? Hey, did you see that great goal McAvoy got.

 

3 home runs out of 6? 50% is good enough? At that rate Horvat is retiring before the team is a cup contender.

Edited May 30, 2019 by ItTakesAnArmy

[wai_lai416]

if benning is drafting consistently in the top 10.. you'd expect him to be finding top line players at a much higher clip.. if he's so good at drafting.. then why did he pick virtanen and OJ.. not saying they are bad.. but no way they warrant where they are drafted... and picking hughes is not hitting a home run.. he's the consensus bpa that other team for whatever reason passed on.. if Hughes becomes a star in this league.. it's not because of benning's genius.. it's because other teams are retarded for passing on him. 

[Me_]

On 5/31/2019 at 3:02 AM, wai_lai416 said:

if benning is drafting consistently in the top 10.. you'd expect him to be finding top line players at a much higher clip.. if he's so good at drafting.. then why did he pick virtanen and OJ.. not saying they are bad.. but no way they warrant where they are drafted... and picking hughes is not hitting a home run.. he's the consensus bpa that other team for whatever reason passed on.. if Hughes becomes a star in this league.. it's not because of benning's genius.. it's because other teams are retarded for passing on him. 

That “whatever reason passed on” gave us a future 1D.

 

That “whatever reason passed on” also got Benning to select Pettersson who didn’t get drafted before the Canucks’ turn.

 

That “whatever reason passed on” also gave us Boeser. 

 

Not one Canucks GM would have had the savvy to know the importance of such players being available when there were available but Benning because Benning does his homework all year round; Not just for a few days before the draft.

 

Virtanen I get your point. The book is still being written as the kid is just gonna turn 23 next month. He has now gained Green’s confidence enough to pull increasing minutes in important roles.

 

Juolevi to me is the anomaly. i knew back then when Finland won the Worlds that some teams were going to bandwagon on that roster. Juolevi, Puljujarvi and Laine were the top players on that gold 2016 team. Did we fall for it?

 

Ask Linden. I for one am very glad Linden is out of the picture. As much as we loved him as a player and man was he good in the 1994 Finals, to me he is not a winner. I see Linden as that boss that doesn’t know much about the job but you must respect him because you have to, he’s the boss. It’s a very toxic environment to work in, especially when you know exponentially better than the boss.

 

Let Benning do his thing before you complain about his savvy knowledge of upcoming players. He has revamped the entire farm system and drafts very well:

 

1st Round

Pettersson

Boeser

Hughes

Virtanen

McCann

Juolevi

 

2nd Round

Demko

Gadjovich

Lind

Woo

 

3rd Round

Tryamkin

Brisebois

Lockwook

Madden

DiPietro

 

4th Round

Zhukenov

Rathbone

 

5th Round

Gaudette

Frosling

Neill

Candella

Gunnarsson

Utunen

 

Sixth Round

Jasek

Manukyan

Petit

Stukel

 

7th Round

Stewart

Olson

Brassard

McKenzie

Abols

Thiessen

 

Obviously the lower the round the less chance of success there is on a player. But after five years, Benning has accumulated the best selection of prospects in Canucks history. Burke’s list comes close but give a couple more years and Benning will have passed Burke by a far far margin.

 

And hopefully the Benning Era will survive the “seek and destroy” haters and bring us a couple of Cups. 

 

Edited June 2, 2019 by Me_