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Seannnp

Proposal - Draft Pick Frenzy EDM-DAL-CAR-PITS-OTT

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Is this plausible? Are the values close? I really don't want this to turn into a Lucic/EDM discussion please. Could Benning pull this off? If he could, does this mean our rebuild is complete?

 

 

TO EDM

Sutter (50%)

TO VAN

Lucic, 8th OA, 38th OA

 

Whilst most will see this as a favor to Edmonton, I think this is a package a lot of teams with cap space would jump on (if they had a 3c to move). We get 2 top 4 picks in a deep 1st round. With the amount of salary we are hoping to move or get off the books in the next two years. The additional 6 million is nothing.

 

 

TO DAL

Tanev, Goldobin, 3rd in 2020 (Conditional, changes to a 2nd if Tanev plays less than 65 games)

TO VAN

18th OA, Honka

 

Dallas needs a top 4 right handed dman that can help keep the puck out of the net. I think with an easier travel schedule and easier matchups playing behind Klingberg, Heiskanen, Tanev will thrive. We exchange projects in Goldobin and Honka who I still believe can turn out to be better than Hutton. We give them a 3rd to bring value closer and it changes to a 2nd if Tanev plays less than 65 games. Dallas was interested in Tanev two years ago I believe.

 

 

TO CAR

Hutton, Baertschi

TO VAN

29th OA

 

Carolina needs more forward depth and are particularly weak at LW especially with Ferland likely gone in free agency and Baertschi provides some secondary scoring. They get a young LHD who continues to improve, had a great year last year, can play in the top 6 and top 4 minutes for a limited time if required. This allows them to move a more valuable defenseman for more forward depth like a legitimate top 6 winger (think Nylander, Hoffman, etc)

 

TO PITS

29th OA (CAR), 38th OA (EDM)

TO VAN

21st OA

 

Pits is still looking to complete with Crosby and Malkin. The 21st doesn't hold the same value to them as it would for teams beginning their rebuild. I think dropping 8 spots in the latter 1/3 if the first round and getting an extra 2nd allows them to begin stocking up their depleted prospect pool. We could also keep the 38th and add a player or prospect that could help them right away. I think they still need some help on the wing.

 

TO OTT

Eriksson, 3rd round in 2019

TO VAN

6th round in 2020

 

6m cap hit, not much actual salary to be paid, 3rd round pick this year. Melnyk is all over this as it gets him to the cap floor without having to pay the cap hit salary!!! They have quite a few ELC's so they may be actively looking for a deal like this to hit the cap floor.

 

 

Granlund, Spooner, Schaller out for 5th, 6th, or 7th picks

 

 

We go into the draft with

8thOA - Krebs/Podkolzin/Boldy

10thOA - Krebs/Podkolzin/Boldy

18thOA - Seider

21stOA - Lavoie

40thOA - Korczak

 

 

 

OUT

Sutter (2.25)

Hutton (3.0)

Baertschi (3.5)

Eriksson (6.0)

Tanev (4.5)

Goldobin (1.5)

Granlund (2.0)

Schaller (1.9)

Spooner (3.25)

Pouliot (1.5)

Gaunce (1.5)

3rd in 2019

3rd in 2020

 

 

 

IN

Lucic(6m)

Honka (1.5)

Krebs

Podkolzin

Sieder

Lavoie

Korczak

6th in 2020

Whatever we get for Schaller, Granlund, Spooner

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Interesting how dumping Lucic costs Edmonton a high 1st and high 2nd round pick but dumping Eriksson only costs Vancouver a 3rd. Lol. 

 

All the proposals heavily favour Vancouver. 

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what about the other 1st round picks held by other teams?

don't we want those as well ?

i think you quit your posting much too soon

the draft is in vancouver

we should be at the podium drafting the entire first day

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7 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

Interesting how dumping Lucic costs Edmonton a high 1st and high 2nd round pick but dumping Eriksson only costs Vancouver a 3rd. Lol. 

 

All the proposals heavily favour Vancouver. 

Not the Lucic one though.  Milan is clearly done as a player, yet still has 4 years at 7 per.  Plus, he's got a NMC, so he must be protected in the expansion draft.  

 

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6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Not the Lucic one though.  Milan is clearly done as a player, yet still has 4 years at 7 per.  Plus, he's got a NMC, so he must be protected in the expansion draft.  

 

I don't want Lucic either Alf but he makes $6M per year. He also has his contract change to a modified no trade contract at the end of the 2020/21 season so he will not have to be protected for the expansion draft.

https://www.capfriendly.com/players/milan-lucic

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56 minutes ago, Seannnp said:

Is this plausible?

...... he asks as he suggests trading 11 roster players before the draft.  :picard:

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5 hours ago, Rick Blight said:

I don't want Lucic either Alf but he makes $6M per year. He also has his contract change to a modified no trade contract at the end of the 2020/21 season so he will not have to be protected for the expansion draft.

https://www.capfriendly.com/players/milan-lucic

Lucic unfortunately does have to be protected as the expansion draft will be before the amateur draft which both will take place before the end of June 2021.  NHL new seasons start July 1st, with the beginning of Ufa signings.  Also his contract as of 21/22 season is M-ntc, nmc.. meaning he still has a no movement even though he has to provide a limited amount of teams that he can be traded to.  The only way that he wont be protected if traded for is if he agrees to wave that portion of his contract and make it any form of an ntc 

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22 minutes ago, KariyaSakicAnderson said:

Lucic unfortunately does have to be protected as the expansion draft will be before the amateur draft which both will take place before the end of June 2021.  NHL new seasons start July 1st, with the beginning of Ufa signings.  Also his contract as of 21/22 season is M-ntc, nmc.. meaning he still has a no movement even though he has to provide a limited amount of teams that he can be traded to.  The only way that he wont be protected if traded for is if he agrees to wave that portion of his contract and make it any form of an ntc 

Players on expiring NMC's do not have to be protected so my interpretation would be that his NMC is expiring at the conclusion of the 2020/21 season and his modified NTC then kicks in and he does not, therefore, have to be protected. I have read articles arguing both sides but have not seen anything definitive at this point.

Just checked CapFriendly and they say he has to be protected so I guess I will accept their word.

https://www.capfriendly.com/expansion-draft/seattle

Edited by Rick Blight

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19 hours ago, Seannnp said:

Is this plausible? Are the values close? I really don't want this to turn into a Lucic/EDM discussion please. Could Benning pull this off? If he could, does this mean our rebuild is complete?

 

 

TO EDM

Sutter (50%)

TO VAN

Lucic, 8th OA, 38th OA

 

Whilst most will see this as a favor to Edmonton, I think this is a package a lot of teams with cap space would jump on (if they had a 3c to move). We get 2 top 4 picks in a deep 1st round. With the amount of salary we are hoping to move or get off the books in the next two years. The additional 6 million is nothing.

 

 

TO DAL

Tanev, Goldobin, 3rd in 2020 (Conditional, changes to a 2nd if Tanev plays less than 65 games)

TO VAN

18th OA, Honka

 

Dallas needs a top 4 right handed dman that can help keep the puck out of the net. I think with an easier travel schedule and easier matchups playing behind Klingberg, Heiskanen, Tanev will thrive. We exchange projects in Goldobin and Honka who I still believe can turn out to be better than Hutton. We give them a 3rd to bring value closer and it changes to a 2nd if Tanev plays less than 65 games. Dallas was interested in Tanev two years ago I believe.

 

 

TO CAR

Hutton, Baertschi

TO VAN

29th OA

 

Carolina needs more forward depth and are particularly weak at LW especially with Ferland likely gone in free agency and Baertschi provides some secondary scoring. They get a young LHD who continues to improve, had a great year last year, can play in the top 6 and top 4 minutes for a limited time if required. This allows them to move a more valuable defenseman for more forward depth like a legitimate top 6 winger (think Nylander, Hoffman, etc)

 

TO PITS

29th OA (CAR), 38th OA (EDM)

TO VAN

21st OA

 

Pits is still looking to complete with Crosby and Malkin. The 21st doesn't hold the same value to them as it would for teams beginning their rebuild. I think dropping 8 spots in the latter 1/3 if the first round and getting an extra 2nd allows them to begin stocking up their depleted prospect pool. We could also keep the 38th and add a player or prospect that could help them right away. I think they still need some help on the wing.

 

TO OTT

Eriksson, 3rd round in 2019

TO VAN

6th round in 2020

 

6m cap hit, not much actual salary to be paid, 3rd round pick this year. Melnyk is all over this as it gets him to the cap floor without having to pay the cap hit salary!!! They have quite a few ELC's so they may be actively looking for a deal like this to hit the cap floor.

 

 

Granlund, Spooner, Schaller out for 5th, 6th, or 7th picks

 

 

We go into the draft with

8thOA - Krebs/Podkolzin/Boldy

10thOA - Krebs/Podkolzin/Boldy

18thOA - Seider

21stOA - Lavoie

40thOA - Korczak

 

 

 

OUT

Sutter (2.25)

Hutton (3.0)

Baertschi (3.5)

Eriksson (6.0)

Tanev (4.5)

Goldobin (1.5)

Granlund (2.0)

Schaller (1.9)

Spooner (3.25)

Pouliot (1.5)

Gaunce (1.5)

3rd in 2019

3rd in 2020

 

 

 

IN

Lucic(6m)

Honka (1.5)

Krebs

Podkolzin

Sieder

Lavoie

Korczak

6th in 2020

Whatever we get for Schaller, Granlund, Spooner

This all just happened in your NHL game right?  I mean every single deal you are proposing is exactly like that.  No GM would make these trades.  I don't mean to be harsh, but you know these wont work.

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14 hours ago, Rick Blight said:

Players on expiring NMC's do not have to be protected so my interpretation would be that his NMC is expiring at the conclusion of the 2020/21 season and his modified NTC then kicks in and he does not, therefore, have to be protected. I have read articles arguing both sides but have not seen anything definitive at this point.

Just checked CapFriendly and they say he has to be protected so I guess I will accept their word.

https://www.capfriendly.com/expansion-draft/seattle

 

His NMC is active throughout his contract.  The expansion draft is not a trade but a movement.  He can be traded under certain conditions the final two years of his contract but he can't be moved.

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21 hours ago, qwijibo said:

Interesting how dumping Lucic costs Edmonton a high 1st and high 2nd round pick but dumping Eriksson only costs Vancouver a 3rd. Lol. 

 

All the proposals heavily favour Vancouver. 

Not the same player, not the same contract. Cap situations for Edmonton are very different compared to Vancouver. Contracts of each player are structured very differently. Let me know if I need to go into more detail to clarify for you.

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1 hour ago, CaptainLinden16 said:

This all just happened in your NHL game right?  I mean every single deal you are proposing is exactly like that.  No GM would make these trades.  I don't mean to be harsh, but you know these wont work.

But why? lol

 

I really though the values were close. Whether GM's will make the trade is a different story. Whether all of them happen before the draft, after the draft or whenever isn't really what this proposal is for. It just to gauge value and see the options that are viable for this team.
 

Edmonton does that deal 9 times out of 10.

 

Pittsburgh would likely do that deal as well. If that deal was offered to Vancouver and there wasn't really a player at 21 that I absolutely loved, I would drop 8 spots to pick up another 2nd round pick, more importantly an early 2nd round pick.

 

The Dallas deal, I admit, is likely the toughest one to make happen. With Carolina though, they have a great defense corp and have been rumored to be actively shopping one of them to upgrade their forward lineup. Ferland is gone which opens up another hole on the wing. I believe Carolina is looking to compete now. Hutton provides a solid option for their top 6 and has shown he can handle a top 4 role when called upon. He is still young and will likely sign his next contract at an affordable price and term. Alone, Hutton is likely worth a 2nd, maybe a 3rd. Baertschi, despite his injuries is still a 50 point winger that provide secondary offense and can slot in anywhere in your top 9 and has a manageable, almost cheap, contract. Carolina can then move Pesce or Hamilton for move scoring help. Don't think the 29th OA is going to be ready to help them for the next 2-3 years.

 

With Dallas I think a deal could be had for Goldobin for Honka 1 for 1. Both are 23 years old, former 1st round picks that haven't quite lived up to expectations. Tanev and 2nd might be enough to get a mid first. I might be over valuing Tanev here and Dallas may never go for it but they are very thin on the right side. Lovejoy, Fedun, Polak and Methot are all UFA's. That's 3 RD you've just lost. Klingberg is their only RD followed by Honka who is their Goldobin on defense. They could definitely use Tanev on the 2nd pairing. If Tanev remains healthy he is worth a 1st rounder without a doubt.

21 hours ago, Fanuck said:

...... he asks as he suggests trading 11 roster players before the draft.  :picard:

Are the deals individually plausible? Eriksson, Granlund, Schaller, Spooner do not have to happen before the draft and weve already moved on from Pouliot and Gaunce. That would leave Hutton, Baertschi, Goldobin, Sutter and Tanev (5 players) I really don't understand some of these smartass comments sometimes. If you don't have anything valuable to add stop wasting your time commenting :picard:.

 

21 hours ago, coastal.view said:

what about the other 1st round picks held by other teams?

don't we want those as well ?

i think you quit your posting much too soon

the draft is in vancouver

we should be at the podium drafting the entire first day

didn't NYR or one of the other teams have like 3 first round picks and 2 2nd round picks last year? I think a few years ago there was another team that had 6-7 picks in the first two rounds and if I remember correctly 4 or 5 of them were 1st round picks (1998 or 1999). Didn't realize CDC became a stage for some of you stand-up comedians

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20 hours ago, 6string said:

Yup five deals in the off season is commonplace.

There have been teams that have completed anywhere between 12-22 trades in one season. 22 trades in one year and you're here talking about 5 in an offseason.

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5 hours ago, Seannnp said:

There have been teams that have completed anywhere between 12-22 trades in one season. 22 trades in one year and you're here talking about 5 in an offseason.

Who would that have been? Let’s see a list of the trades.  You’re essentially suggesting a team turned over their entire roster in one season. I think you’re mistaken 

Edited by qwijibo

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14 hours ago, Seannnp said:

But why? lol

 

I really though the values were close. Whether GM's will make the trade is a different story. Whether all of them happen before the draft, after the draft or whenever isn't really what this proposal is for. It just to gauge value and see the options that are viable for this team.
 

Edmonton does that deal 9 times out of 10.

 

Pittsburgh would likely do that deal as well. If that deal was offered to Vancouver and there wasn't really a player at 21 that I absolutely loved, I would drop 8 spots to pick up another 2nd round pick, more importantly an early 2nd round pick.

 

The Dallas deal, I admit, is likely the toughest one to make happen. With Carolina though, they have a great defense corp and have been rumored to be actively shopping one of them to upgrade their forward lineup. Ferland is gone which opens up another hole on the wing. I believe Carolina is looking to compete now. Hutton provides a solid option for their top 6 and has shown he can handle a top 4 role when called upon. He is still young and will likely sign his next contract at an affordable price and term. Alone, Hutton is likely worth a 2nd, maybe a 3rd. Baertschi, despite his injuries is still a 50 point winger that provide secondary offense and can slot in anywhere in your top 9 and has a manageable, almost cheap, contract. Carolina can then move Pesce or Hamilton for move scoring help. Don't think the 29th OA is going to be ready to help them for the next 2-3 years.

 

With Dallas I think a deal could be had for Goldobin for Honka 1 for 1. Both are 23 years old, former 1st round picks that haven't quite lived up to expectations. Tanev and 2nd might be enough to get a mid first. I might be over valuing Tanev here and Dallas may never go for it but they are very thin on the right side. Lovejoy, Fedun, Polak and Methot are all UFA's. That's 3 RD you've just lost. Klingberg is their only RD followed by Honka who is their Goldobin on defense. They could definitely use Tanev on the 2nd pairing. If Tanev remains healthy he is worth a 1st rounder without a doubt.

Are the deals individually plausible? Eriksson, Granlund, Schaller, Spooner do not have to happen before the draft and weve already moved on from Pouliot and Gaunce. That would leave Hutton, Baertschi, Goldobin, Sutter and Tanev (5 players) I really don't understand some of these smartass comments sometimes. If you don't have anything valuable to add stop wasting your time commenting :picard:.

 

didn't NYR or one of the other teams have like 3 first round picks and 2 2nd round picks last year? I think a few years ago there was another team that had 6-7 picks in the first two rounds and if I remember correctly 4 or 5 of them were 1st round picks (1998 or 1999). Didn't realize CDC became a stage for some of you stand-up comedians

Yes NYR multiple  first rounders last draft...and NYI too (Dobson and Whalstrom)  ... but they had good assets they traded to get those with using the TDL to leverage them as well (which usually makes it a little easier to get more than other times of the year).  

 

EDM doesn’t do that deal even if Chia was still there 99/100 times.  Sutter doesn’t have much of any value to a team even with the retention.   Last year was a disaster for him, why take a gamble on a player who is usually injured  and that is easily replaceable with free agency for free and with a guy that will actually play?  They can shed a couple million in cap space without much difficulty to make room for that player to make up for the rentention aspect.  You don’t get a high first and a second for a deal like that, they need those picks to balance the books later.   Lucic is a terrible contract and but he’s not going anywhere soon if ever. 

 

The PIT trade is plausible (if they had that a similar opportunity with another team).  

 

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17 hours ago, qwijibo said:

Who would that have been? Let’s see a list of the trades.  You’re essentially suggesting a team turned over their entire roster in one season. I think you’re mistaken 

13 trades by Montreal in 1999/2000

13 trades by Buffalo in 2014/2015

22 trades by Tampa in 1999/2000

16 trades by Colorado in 2003/2004

12 trades by Penguins in 2008/2009

 

this what I found after doing google searching for 2 minutes. So when you said I was mistaken, you just assumed I was wrong? Based on what? Because you couldn't comprehend a team could turn over a roster in a year?

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17 hours ago, Pepe Silvia said:

GM's don't seem to value 1st round picks in whatever world you're living in.

Why? Because they are willing to trade them for what I perceive to be approximate value?

 

I'm certain that Carolina would prefer to upgrade their forward group then draft 29th, a player who likely doesn't help them for 2-3 years if ever. I'm sure our offer could be beaten by other teams for that 1st round pick but usually when you make a proposal you don't consider what all 30 teams may be willing to offer.

 

I seriously don't get the smartass comments? You can simply just say "hey man, don't think these trades work because of x,y,z"...what are you 12?

Edited by Seannnp

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