[Speculation] Canucks all in for Jason Zucker

[aGENT]

7 hours ago, wildcam said:

I would not make a big trade offer for Zucker 27yrs old, 42 points? Never give up 10th and Virtanen.. I think Virtanen will put up between 40-50 points  soon and plays a physical game that you need to have in playoffs? Virtanen 21,  6'1, 220lbs ,fast, aggressive and needed soon when we make playoffs in 2 yrs, No to trading big Jake....Trade  bate, - Beartchi, Goldy, Tanev, Hutton, Dipietro,...

Juolevi 21, will also be a #3 D man soon, has had bud luck with injuries...Would of played 35 NHL game if not injured last season...

In no way did I suggest we should trade Virtanen. For Zucker or otherwise. The discussion you quoted was regarding Eriksson for Ryan.

[Kobayashi Maru]

56 minutes ago, timberz21 said:

But it'll cost 7M+$ instead of 5.5M

That’s true but then we keep our additional assets as well.  Worth it to me.

[Canucks Curse]

35 minutes ago, timberz21 said:

Seriously, Benning might not have gotten max value in his previous trade, but he has never traded the farm or a significant piece that went on and bite us in the a$$ either.

 

I know it was his first impression with the Kesler deal, but all thing considered, he did pretty decent for a guy that was handcuffed.  Seems like that reputation stuck since.  He acquired guys like Grandlund, Baerstchi, Goldobin and Pearson for fairly cheap and are still with the team.

 

The most significant parts he traded away beside Kesler is Bonino, McCann and 2nd rounders

You are right that’s s pretty accurate post 

[RecklessReilly]

What would the value of a Jack Rathbone or Tyler Madden be in the trade market? These are some names that haven't been thrown around in trade proposals. You have to give quality to get quality in this league.

 

Tanev + Madden + Dipietro = Top 4 d??

 

Baer/hutton + Rathebone + mid round pick = Top 9 scoring winger??

 

To a lesser extent what are the values of Briesbois or Lockwood?

 

I feel these are the kind of names we can use as add ons to surround our semi-valuable assets. Without giving up top 90 draft picks or Olli/Jake/Demko.

 

Thoughts?

 

[Gaudette Celly]

9 hours ago, J-Dizzle said:

Today I’ve seen multiple proposals including, Boeser, Virtanen and Juolevi..... CDC is in full summer meltdown and it’s only June 5th.  By August people are going to be offloading EP, Horvat and Karlsson at this rate. 

 

 

 

 

Not to mention Gaudette.  Can't believe how anxious so many are to trade him away, not to mention all the other prospects and picks being thrown into proposals.  What happened to the "good ole days" of "Benning's an idiot for throwing in 5th round picks"?

[Gaudette Celly]

9 hours ago, The Great Canucks said:

What the hell are you talking about? There are no Boeser rumors.

Yup, just trolling by the usual suspects.  Speaking of, here's Big Sniff Price, and he got laughingly roasted for it:

 

Edited June 6, 2019 by Hutton Wink

[Zhukini]

Virtanen and Hutton would be an easy yes

[The_Rocket]

17 minutes ago, RecklessReilly said:

What would the value of a Jack Rathbone or Tyler Madden be in the trade market? These are some names that haven't been thrown around in trade proposals. You have to give quality to get quality in this league.

 

Tanev + Madden + Dipietro = Top 4 d??

 

Baer/hutton + Rathebone + mid round pick = Top 9 scoring winger??

 

To a lesser extent what are the values of Briesbois or Lockwood?

 

I feel these are the kind of names we can use as add ons to surround our semi-valuable assets. Without giving up top 90 draft picks or Olli/Jake/Demko.

 

Thoughts?

 

Not sure why you would trade baertschi plus other assets for a top 9 scoring winger? Baer is already a top 9 scoring winger. 

 

In general, I’d rather keep madden and rathbone. They won’t start they’re entry level contracts for a couple years. After pettersson and boeser and Hughes are all signed, the Canucks will be relying on ELC’s to fill holes in their roster. If Benning believes there’s any chance at all that either of those guys can ba NHLers he should hold on to them. Fourth lines on cap-limit teams are filled with contracts that are under 1 million. If these players are homegrown, even better

[rekker]

2 minutes ago, The_Rocket said:

Not sure why you would trade baertschi plus other assets for a top 9 scoring winger? Baer is already a top 9 scoring winger. 

 

In general, I’d rather keep madden and rathbone. They won’t start they’re entry level contracts for a couple years. After pettersson and boeser and Hughes are all signed, the Canucks will be relying on ELC’s to fill holes in their roster. If Benning believes there’s any chance at all that either of those guys can ba NHLers he should hold on to them. Fourth lines on cap-limit teams are filled with contracts that are under 1 million. If these players are homegrown, even better

Post of the day so far. 

[timberz21]

4 minutes ago, RecklessReilly said:

What would the value of a Jack Rathbone or Tyler Madden be in the trade market? These are some names that haven't been thrown around in trade proposals. You have to give quality to get quality in this league.

 

Tanev + Madden + Dipietro = Top 4 d??

 

Baer/hutton + Rathebone + mid round pick = Top 9 scoring winger??

 

To a lesser extent what are the values of Briesbois or Lockwood?

 

I feel these are the kind of names we can use as add ons to surround our semi-valuable assets. Without giving up top 90 draft picks or Olli/Jake/Demko.

 

Thoughts?

 

Madden and Rathbone are late round draft pick and don't really have value IMO.  I know they have progressed much better than their draft position dictates, but every team have players like this.  

 

As for Dipietro, I don't think goalie prospect have good value, unless your a slam dunk like Luongo, Price and Fleury were.

 

I mean they could always be throw-ins, but I don't think teams will sees them as an important piece to the deal.

[RecklessReilly]

4 minutes ago, The_Rocket said:

Not sure why you would trade baertschi plus other assets for a top 9 scoring winger? Baer is already a top 9 scoring winger. 

 

In general, I’d rather keep madden and rathbone. They won’t start they’re entry level contracts for a couple years. After pettersson and boeser and Hughes are all signed, the Canucks will be relying on ELC’s to fill holes in their roster. If Benning believes there’s any chance at all that either of those guys can ba NHLers he should hold on to them. Fourth lines on cap-limit teams are filled with contracts that are under 1 million. If these players are homegrown, even better

Agree we should hang on to them all. I don't want to have have the club trade away prospects to make the playoffs this year. I was simply trying to see where people put the value of our prospects, haven't seen these names discussed in all these trade proposals.  As for Baer, I think we are due for an upgrade in his role. Great player, silky hands and scoring touch, however his injury history makes me believe he isn't a going to be a part of our winning combo. Hope he proves me wrong though.

[The_Rocket]

8 minutes ago, RecklessReilly said:

Agree we should hang on to them all. I don't want to have have the club trade away prospects to make the playoffs this year. I was simply trying to see where people put the value of our prospects, haven't seen these names discussed in all these trade proposals.  As for Baer, I think we are due for an upgrade in his role. Great player, silky hands and scoring touch, however his injury history makes me believe he isn't a going to be a part of our winning combo. Hope he proves me wrong though.

Good point about the concussion history. That said, I’d rather keep him and hope he pans out than sell low on him. If he ends up retiring or not being able to play than it’s a tough loss but worth the gamble imo. When healthy, he consistently produces at over 0.5 ppg while playing well in all three zones, which is top 6 production on most teams in the NHL, or really good 3rd line numbers. 

 

Keep him. Canucks only have the assets for one big trade this offseason. Not everyone has to go 

[Provost]

46 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said:

Yup, just trolling by the usual suspects.  Speaking of, here's Big Sniff Price, and he got laughingly roasted for it:

 

I was listening to them yesterday.  They entirely ignored the fact that a lot of the issue is that many folks just don’t think Zucker is good enough... not that Boeser is untouchable at any cost.

 

Zuckrr is a 20-30 goal scorer, .5 to .6 PPG guy who is 27 years old

Boeser is a 20-30 goal scorer already at 22 and gets points at a rate of .8 PPG.

 

At the most generous interpretation, assuming Boeser doesn’t improve and Zucker’s one good season is what he can return to regularly... you end up making it as a lateral move, with Zucker being on a cheaper contract, but losing 5 years of prime playing years in agreement difference.

 

At the least generous interpretation, Boeser is gong to maintain his almost PPG pace, and by playing full seasons become a regular 30-40 goal, 60-80 point guy... and Zucker stays at the 20-25 goal, 40-50 point pace he has been his entire career aside from one good year.

 

Adding in the 12OA is still risky because it is a player who may only be a middle of the lineup player, and ikely isn’t with the team,  at least in a meaningful way, for 3 years... pushing back the current momentum beyond when we have to negotiate a new contract with Petterson and Hughes, Petterson having lost his best friend on the team.

 

Boeser isn’t untouchable, and I don’t actually think that he is going to become a better than PPG player... but you can’t keep tearing a team apart and reshuffling.  You need to keep adding players to create a core, cohesion, and culture.  The mess with what we have now, the return needs to be Dumba in an larger deal.

Edited June 6, 2019 by Provost

[Pickly]

45 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said:

Yup, just trolling by the usual suspects.  Speaking of, here's Big Sniff Price, and he got laughingly roasted for it:

 

Blake and Jeff kept reiterating the point that “If its a Boeser for Zucker ++ trade then of course you have to consider” which I found dumb because Boeser is obviously the best player in this trade and the ++, unless a Matt Dumba esq defenceman, isn’t going to help this team anytime soon. I loved how Craig Button set these jabronis straight with the fact Boeser has elite goal scoring potential and Zucker, although has scored 30, isn’t even close to being on Boesers level. 

[JM_]

7 hours ago, mll said:

 

If the Zucker deal has been on the table for a few days maybe that's why he suggested it could be a possibility. 

 

Benning earlier this week to Kuzma in the Province

“Thatcher Demko is a part of that (untouchable) group and Olli Juolevihas had injury problems, but has the ability to be a very good player for a long time,” added Benning. “If I have to package guys I will, but I think Jake (Virtanen) is an important player for us. You have to be patient with this type of player and the power forward game he plays.

“You watch the playoffs and you see the size, strength and speed and as he continues to mature, he’s going to be a valuable guy. That’s not saying I wouldn’t move him, but it would have to be a good deal to include him.

“If we could add somebody to pay with Pettersson and Boeser or somebody to play with Pearson and Horvat — depending on what it takes — we’ll look at it.”

 

Fenton has been trying to trade Pateryn - right handed D.  Rask is also available.  Maybe they use Zucker to cap dump contracts rather than buy them out.  

 

Changing system might also mean changing goalies.  Dubnyk does well because of how solid they play in front of him.  Possession teams tend to turn the puck over more (have the puck more lose it more) and it leads to more rush scoring chances against.  Some goalies can't adjust - Jones hasn't been able to in SJS.  That might also be an area of focus.  

 

 

The  Wild need right hand shots.  Their top-9 are all left shots save for Kunin.  

 

Boudreau was having fits with Aberg who is far too similar to Goldobin to be of any interest.  Fenton also believes that development is done in the AHL.  In Nashville he talked about how it's in Milwaukee that you have to learn how to play to win. I can't imagine him wanting Goldobin. They are moving Zucker because they don't think he is a playoff performer - he had only 1 goal (3pts) the past 3 playoffs in 16 games where the Wild got eliminated each time in the 1st round.  They are going to look at guys who they feel can help them in the post-season.  Doubtful that's Goldobin.

 

Baertschi and Zucker are very different players.  Zucker is a lot of speed and a quick shot.  Zucker has been playing with the Wild's best players.  Granlund is a top playmaker when he is on his game.  Baertschi played a fair bit in the bottom-6 under Green - before his concussion he was playing with Gaudette.  Zucker can play dump & chase while Baertschi probably does better playing a more skilled give-and-go game.  Fenton wants to change system and go towards a more skilled possession game.  Fiala never dumps the puck and Fenton thinks his potential is sky high.  He needs guys that can make plays with him and know how to pass the puck. 

 

thats interesting stuff on Jake I hadn't seen that. That would certainly be how you'd try to sell Jake in a trade. 

 

If Fenton wants to send us a slightly overpaid 6/7 RHD to dump Zucker then yes lets be all over that. I wonder if Rask could find his game on Petey's wing? who knows, a package of those 3 guys that doesn't cost us a 1st round pick might work out well for us. 

 

 

[The_Rocket]

12 minutes ago, Provost said:

I was listening to them yesterday.  They entirely ignored the fact that a lot of the issue is that many folks just don’t think Zucker is good enough... not that Boeser is untouchable at any cost.

 

Zuckrr is a 20-30 goal scorer, .5 to .6 PPG guy who is 27 years old

Boeser is a 20-30 goal scorer already at 22 and gets points at a rate of .8 PPG.

 

At the most generous interpretation, assuming Boeser doesn’t improve and Zucker’s one good season is what he can return to regularly... you end up making it as a lateral move, with Zucker being on a cheaper contract, but losing 5 years of prime playing years in agreement difference.

 

At the least generous interpretation, Boeser is gong to maintain his almost PPG pace, and by playing full seasons become a regular 30-40 goal, 60-80 point guy... and Zucker stays at the 20-25 goal, 40-50 point pace he has been his entire career aside from one good year.

 

Adding in the 12OA is still risky because it is a player who may only be a middle of the lineup player, and ikely isn’t with the team,  at least in a meaningful way, for 3 years... pushing back the current momentum beyond when we have to negotiate a new contract with Petterson and Hughes, Petterson having lost his best friend on the team.

 

Boeser isn’t untouchable, and I don’t actually think that he is going to become a better than PPG player... but you can’t keep tearing a team apart and reshuffling.  You need to keep adding players to create a core, cohesion, and culture.  The mess with what we have now, the return needs to be Dumba in an larger deal.

Zucker and Dumba for Boeser and Eriksson otherwise no deal. 

 

Even then, i don’t think I’d do it. Giving up the best player in a trade rarely works out

[JM_]

1 hour ago, Hutton Wink said:

Yup, just trolling by the usual suspects.  Speaking of, here's Big Sniff Price, and he got laughingly roasted for it:

 

It just shows how out of touch this clown is, or how dumb he thinks we all are. Maybe both.

 

Craig Button nailed it - he said Boeser is an elite scorer, Zucker isn't. Everyone but Price seems to know that. 

 

That doesn't mean I wouldn't want Zucker here for some reasonable deal but suggesting Boeser is rightfully the stuff of ridicule. 

 

[stawns]

18 hours ago, Canucks Curse said:

I do not get nervous when we talk about JB drafting (like I did with gillis, nonis, burke) but I do get nervous when JB is involved in trade rumours

Why?

[stawns]

13 minutes ago, The_Rocket said:

Zucker and Dumba for Boeser and Eriksson otherwise no deal. 

 

Even then, i don’t think I’d do it. Giving up the best player in a trade rarely works out

Dumba is the best player in that trade, by quite a bit

[PhillipBlunt]

15 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

It just shows how out of touch this clown is, or how dumb he thinks we all are. Maybe both.

 

Craig Button nailed it - he said Boeser is an elite scorer, Zucker isn't. Everyone but Price seems to know that. 

 

That doesn't mean I wouldn't want Zucker here for some reasonable deal but suggesting Boeser is rightfully the stuff of ridicule. 

 

"Doing a bunch of shows doesn't stop you from being out of touch or a dumbass." That's awesome.