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[Trade] Lightning trade J.T. Miller to Canucks for Marek Mazanec, 2019 3rd-round pick, 2020 conditional 1st-round pick


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3 minutes ago, Smashian Kassian said:

Lots of Leafs debate.

 

 

 

It is good for perspective - regarding:

 

1) how horrible the Canucks blueline is

2) how 'desperate' they are to add RHD if they dream of competing.

3) their relative cap flexibility - ability to do what they need to in the next months.

 

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5 minutes ago, Maketherightmove said:

Sure, but losing Marner or AM significantly changes their roster. They need to somehow shed salary (Nylander would be the ideal candidate for them) and add a top defenseman without messing with their core. That's pretty difficult to do, especially since they don't have first round picks or recent top end prospects that they've drafted. 

If they lose Marner they aren’t going to sit around with all the extra cap space. They are going to spend it. Likely on one of the other big name RFA’s this year.

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27 minutes ago, Maketherightmove said:

2014 was such a horrible draft.

And two of the guys drafted after Jake (Nylander and Ehlers) who some wanted us to draft are now making Cap dollars (because of their regular season production) that is way too much for what they provide.  I wouldn't trade Jake for either of those two now, considering cap costs.  

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11 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

If they lose Marner they aren’t going to sit around with all the extra cap space. They are going to spend it. Likely on one of the other big name RFA’s this year.

With Marner off their books, the Leafs could resign Gardiner?

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18 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

 

If they left Marner walk they are just going to sit on there hands and do nothing.  they would have just gained 4 first round picks and opened up a ton of cap space to say... front load offer sheet another player on the market.  Say someone like Aho and bank the two extra first round picks they would have obtained.  

 

How are they going to do that when they have $13.5mil - $7mil for Johnsson and Kapanen leaving $6.5 mil to sign 5 more players?  Sure they might trade Zaitsev but he needs to be replaced, and that defence is an absolute wasteland right now.  And as was mentioned by another, they do not even have their 1st so any offer sheets are going to be for lower-level players.  Oh, won't that make Boy Dubas popular around the league, throwing around offer sheets at other teams' RFAs...

 

They are headed the way of the OIlers -- so heavily loaded on a few players that they're forced to fill the bottom half of their roster with journeymen and AHL-level players.  Dubas needs to get Nylander out there on the trade wire ASAP.  Something's gotta give, his "we'll keep 'em all" is pure mythology.  You're not playing Pokemon, Kyle.

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11 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

If they lose Marner they aren’t going to sit around with all the extra cap space. They are going to spend it. Likely on one of the other big name RFA’s this year.

What extra cap space? They haven't even re-signed Marner yet. Who would they get to replace him?

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6 minutes ago, oldnews said:

It is good for perspective - regarding:

 

1) how horrible the Canucks blueline is

2) how 'desperate' they are to add RHD if they dream of competing.

3) their relative cap flexibility - ability to do what they need to in the next months.

 

Dont have enough time at the moment to really read through it all. So thx for summing it up for me ON.

 

The Canucks defense is definitely a huge problem, and now Id agree they are desperate.

 

Im fully expecting an anchor Myers contract incoming but hopefully they can maintain some flexability.

 

Who's in a better spot Leafs or Canucks? As of last year Id say Leafs pretty easily, now Gardiner is a huge loss for them & we have flexability to add. We'll have to see what Benning can do.

 

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3 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said:

Marner's not even "on the books", he's RFA.  $13mil to sign 7 players to fill out their roster, INCLUDING Marner.

I knew things were bad in Toronto for their cap, but didn't realize just how bad. 

Oldnews suggested the best way for the Leafs to get their team and cap straightened out would be to trade Matthews.  I hope Dubas doesn't follow Oldnews. 

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1 minute ago, Smashian Kassian said:

Dont have enough time at the moment to really read through it all. So thx for summing it up for me ON.

 

The Canucks defense is definitely a huge problem, and now Id agree they are desperate.

 

Im fully expecting an anchor Myers contract incoming but hopefully they can maintain some flexability.

 

Who's in a better spot Leafs or Canucks? As of last year Id say Leafs pretty easily, now Gardiner is a huge loss for them & we have flexability to add. We'll have to see what Benning can do.

 

Here's a good starting point:

 

https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/mapleleafs

 

"Ouch"

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6 minutes ago, oldnews said:

What?

 

Reilly ____

Muzzin____(Zaitsev)

Dermott______

 

Top four is what builds contenders. They are one shutdown RHD from having a solid top 4

 

 

Quote

That is one shutdown D from 'really contending"?

Wow.

That is one less Hainsey, one Zaitsev cap dump, and no real RHD - closer to a a desertified right side than 'really contending'

They need to make 3 moves there - and that assumes Dermott progresses/is sufficient.

Look around the league. A strong top four defines contending D. No team has 6 superstars on the back end. Bruins iced Clifton and grzelcyk as there bottom pairing. sufficient bottom depth is extremely easy to fill as a extremely low cost. 

 

 

Quote

Additionally you propose letting Marner go - and offer-sheeting an Aho - as if Carolina wouldn't match?

 

if it’s front loaded there’s a good chance they don’t. 

 

 

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Sorry - I can't take your assessement - or your plan - seriously.

Not shocking. You take offense against anything that doesnt align with your leafs are doomed mantra. It was less than 12 month ago you were preaching the same thing saying leafs would regress and not be in post season due to the loss of JVR and bozak.

 

I get it. They are a easy team to dislike and it’s a canucks board but that doesn’t mean understanding of the sport has to go out the window. It’s like some people get a high trying to come up with ways to imagine the leafs going back to the paper bag days. 

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Just now, Alflives said:

I knew things were bad in Toronto for their cap, but didn't realize just how bad. 

Oldnews suggested the best way for the Leafs to get their team and cap straightened out would be to trade Matthews.  I hope Dubas doesn't follow Oldnews. 

I don't think he's necessarily wrong though. I would be very shocked if they traded Matthews, but they will definitely need to trade one of their top players or they won't be winning anything anytime soon. You need depth in your lineup to go far in the playoffs, not 2 forward lines and 1 or 2 defenceman.

They're in a tight spot right now for sure and Dubas needs to show that he's capable of dealing with it. 

 

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I sure like that JT Miller trade.   Sure beats spending one of those 1st round picks to get rid of a cap dump.

 

And like the Canucks chances of adding - not an entire right side while having to dump the one cap dump RHD they have  (unlike the Leafs/Zaitsev) - but just one key piece needed - with the cap space - and the assets to get it done.

 

The Leafs have a top 6 - and one of the best 1/2 center punches in the NHL.

The Canucks is improving.

 

The Canucks have a superior bottom 6 - that actually complements their top 6.  The Leafs have work to do to rebuild a viable playoff 4th line (if they get to that after all the other work they have to do).

 

The Canucks have as good a left side of their blueline (Edler Hughes Hutton /Juolevi = Reilly Muzzin Dermott - and I think that's probably a generous equation to Toronto)

The Canucks have a vastly superior right side.  Tanev/Stecher is far better than Zaitsev/void

 

The Canucks have a better goaltending system.  Demko and DiPietro are better than the Leafs pipeline.

 

The Canucks have a better prospect pool.  Is it even necessary to bother listing?   The Leafs are not only shallower, but they're continuing to deplete it.

 

The Canucks have more cap space, flexibiity and depth.

 

Does the Leafs Tavares, Matthews, Marner, Kapanen, Nylander make them a better team moving forward?   I don't think so.

I would not trade places with them - not even close.

 

 

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24 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

If they lose Marner they aren’t going to sit around with all the extra cap space. They are going to spend it. Likely on one of the other big name RFA’s this year.

Heard an insider this morning say the Avs are in on Marner.  Could be very interesting come July 1.  Leafs would have to match that. 

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26 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

If they lose Marner they aren’t going to sit around with all the extra cap space. They are going to spend it. Likely on one of the other big name RFA’s this year.

Leafs don't have the picks to sign one of the other big name RFAs this year, they gave up a conditional 1st in the Marleau trade.

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11 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said:

How are they going to do that when they have $13.5mil - $7mil for Johnsson and Kapanen leaving $6.5 mil to sign 5 more players?  Sure they might trade Zaitsev but he needs to be replaced, and that defence is an absolute wasteland right now.  And as was mentioned by another, they do not even have their 1st so any offer sheets are going to be for lower-level players.  Oh, won't that make Boy Dubas popular around the league, throwing around offer sheets at other teams' RFAs...

 

I challenge to do the math again. I ignored it the first time you posted this but the fact that you keep posting it shows you don’t understand. There’s one important piece you keep missing.... I believe in you.. you will figure it out. 

 

Like I said. Some people get a high stewing over the leafs. “What will they do with their cap. They are so screwed, might as well drop out of the league entirely”.

....Hey that is fun. 

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Just now, Alflives said:

I knew things were bad in Toronto for their cap, but didn't realize just how bad. 

Oldnews suggested the best way for the Leafs to get their team and cap straightened out would be to trade Matthews.  I hope Dubas doesn't follow Oldnews. 

That Tavares signing is really looking ill-conceived now.  Someone here had said just that when it happened, but it's become more obvious now.  Problem is, Dubas seems to be following Lou in not addressing the real needs of the team, for whatever reason.  The hole that's been there for the last couple years has suddenly yawned into a cavern. 

 

6 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

 

Top four is what builds contenders. They are one shutdown RHD from having a solid top 4

 

Um, they are four dmen short of a starting NHL defense, and don't have the cap to fill it with quality, even without Marner.  Muzzin and Reilly are the only two NHLers on their roster that will be there opening night.  Maybe they need to explore a trade for Marner's rights now in a sign and trade, and avoid him being offer-sheeted and all they get are picks?

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7 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

 

Top four is what builds contenders. They are one shutdown RHD from having a solid top 4

They have the same top 4 they bowed out of the playoffs with - minus their best defenseman in the playoffs = Hainsey.

 

How do you propose they upgrade on Hainsey with no cap space?

And are you suggesting that Gardiner is addition by subtraction - because they're losing him as well.

 

Otherwise it's a cool story.

Zaitsev is a contending top 4 - that's also a cool part of your story.

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