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[Trade] Lightning trade J.T. Miller to Canucks for Marek Mazanec, 2019 3rd-round pick, 2020 conditional 1st-round pick

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On 7/12/2019 at 12:21 PM, Kanukfanatic said:

No he didn't.

 

He paid market value for a very good player. 

 

Nice try.  :picard:

 

On 7/13/2019 at 5:34 PM, aGENT said:

Under, in fact.

 

11 hours ago, CanuckGAME said:

Well no offense bud but you dont really know what the market value is for any player.  None of us do. Unless you work the phones and discuss trades with NHL General Managers,  you really have no clue. So to say so matter of factly that he paid Market value is just an embarrassing thing to say. So facepalm yourself.

 

I'm a big fan of Bennings work I really like what hes built so far,  I think if Francesco let's him see this rebuild through and doesnt fire him too early,  I truly think Benning is building a real cup contender,   but in my OPINION,  Benning paid too much for Miller.  I love the player coming back,  but that 1st really hurts.  But sometimes you have to give, to get.  I just really hate giving up that 1st. 

 

It is what it is.  I think well end up making the playoffs this season anyways with the new additions.

It doesn't make to say he went for market value when the centerpiece from our end is a conditional pick.  Could be anywhere from 1st overall to 30th.

 

The narrative will change from it being a good deal real quick if we make the playoffs and get bounced within 5 games and surrender a 18th overall pick.  Adding a potential star piece that can be a part of this organization for 10 - 15 years is much more important at this point in time as opposed to a few games of playoff experience.  

 

The GM wants playoffs so he can add it to his resume to help any future business endeavors and the owner wants playoffs so he can make some cash.  Trading firsts is the easiest way to do those two things.  The fans want a great team with sustainable success and a championship, trading firsts is not ideal for this situation.  

 

Us the fans are just sheep following along because we have no choice.  We want to stay positive so of course we will try to say it was a fair deal but in reality we are watching our future dwindle during this playoff' arms race.

 

Consider ourselves lucky.  No long term plan should involve banking on free agents to sign with us year after year.  What if Myers or Ferland decided to sign somewhere else?  We wouldn't be anywhere close and would still be lacking the same amount of assets.  

 

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47 minutes ago, aGENT said:

I think an under good contract, a versatile play all position, young PWF, with a proven track record would normally cost you a late 1st, a decent prospect and likely a mid pick.

 

We saved on the prospect.

He is a two way player not a PWF, does not uses his size to his full advantage (although he does win board battles). People in Tampa were not really high on him either. He is not a first line winger, he is a second line winger with great versatility (tampa saw him as a third line player). 

 

https://www.rawcharge.com/2019/5/10/18537098/2018-2019-tampa-bay-lightning-player-grades-j-t-miller-is-a-solid-depth-player

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1 minute ago, Bure_Pavel said:

He is a two way player not a PWF, does not uses his size to his full advantage (although he does win board battles). People in Tampa were not really high on him either. He is not a first line winger, he is a second line winger with great versatility (tampa saw him as a third line player). 

 

https://www.rawcharge.com/2019/5/10/18537098/2018-2019-tampa-bay-lightning-player-grades-j-t-miller-is-a-solid-depth-player

:bored:

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13 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

What are people in Tampa high on these days? First round sweeps?

True, their dream team didn't fair well at all (definitely built for the regular season). JT Miller's playoff production scares me a bit too though, only 3 goals in 61 career NHL playoff games. 

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6 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

True, their dream team didn't fair well at all (definitely built for the regular season).

They are the very definition of a team built for the regular season. The way they flamed out was spectacularly average. Very little players showed any drive to fight for survival.

6 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

JT Miller's playoff production scares me a bit too though, only 3 goals in 61 career NHL playoff games. 

His utilization will definitely change on the Canucks roster. If he achieves the same level of success on a new team, then, in my opinion, your fears are warranted. Hopefully having a center like Bo will inspire him.

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To the people that hate this trade I have a question. Not a judgement, but an honest question. What other moves could JB have done to improve the team more or as much for fewer assets. JT is debatably a top line player but generally accepted as an NHL level top six. He is a big body, plays a solid 200 foot game and can play all three forward positions. He has demonstrated enough skill to fit in on a top line as well as grind it out on the third or fourth when needed. Additionally he is in the right age group for our core and locked into a reasonable contract. What other player could we have picked up for a conditional first and a third that would be better?  I don’t believe that he could have been had a lot cheaper or that JB wouldn’t have tried to get him for less. What else is out there actually available at around that value that’s better than JT Miller?

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7 hours ago, CanuckGAME said:

Lol  if you're going to come back with this verbal diarrhea,  atleast read my post in its entirety before making yourself look like a fool.

You made yourself look like a fool with your silly attitude. No use reading the rest. :picard:

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2 hours ago, Amebushi said:

To the people that hate this trade I have a question. Not a judgement, but an honest question. What other moves could JB have done to improve the team more or as much for fewer assets. JT is debatably a top line player but generally accepted as an NHL level top six. He is a big body, plays a solid 200 foot game and can play all three forward positions. He has demonstrated enough skill to fit in on a top line as well as grind it out on the third or fourth when needed. Additionally he is in the right age group for our core and locked into a reasonable contract. What other player could we have picked up for a conditional first and a third that would be better?  I don’t believe that he could have been had a lot cheaper or that JB wouldn’t have tried to get him for less. What else is out there actually available at around that value that’s better than JT Miller?

Don't try and use logic. They just wanna cry and yell "JB paid too much".....derp......

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5 hours ago, Baggins said:

To me there's a difference between clearing cap space and a cap dump. The former being a player that is well worth his contract and easily traded and the latter being a player not living up to his cap hit and/or salary who you essentially have to pay to take him off your hands.

 

Imo the fact Tampa needed cap space is completely irrelevant to this trade. Miller had no restrictive ntc of any form. Had Arizona offered say a late second (far less than he's worth) should no GM in need of a top 6 forward offer more simply because Tampa needs cap space? Totally foolish. You'd be doing Arizona a huge favor. The opposite is also true, why would offense starved teams like Anaheim, LA, Dallas, Minnesota, or Arizona let Benning get Miller at a bargain price when they're in need of such a player themselves? 

 

 

Agreed Baggins. We have no idea who else was kicking the tires and what else they were offering. The biggest contention obviously is our 1st rounder... the way the lineup is shaping up does anyone seriously think we're going to be a high percentage lottery team this season? Even then, god forbid the wheels completely fall off and we DO end up out of the playoffs, its protected until the following season for God's sake!

 

I love talking hockey, arguing the merits of this trade or that signing... I just can't debate with people so dead set on remembering Bennings mistakes along the way that any actual smart, strategic move he makes now in their minds is garbage. 

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55 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said:

You made yourself look like a fool with your silly attitude. No use reading the rest. :picard:

Says the guy who agrees with the homer who says Miller will score more points than Matt ****in Duchene.

 

Miss me with your ignorance.  

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9 hours ago, The 5th Line said:

 

 

It doesn't make to say he went for market value when the centerpiece from our end is a conditional pick.  Could be anywhere from 1st overall to 30th.

 

The narrative will change from it being a good deal real quick if we make the playoffs and get bounced within 5 games and surrender a 18th overall pick.  Adding a potential star piece that can be a part of this organization for 10 - 15 years is much more important at this point in time as opposed to a few games of playoff experience.  

 

The GM wants playoffs so he can add it to his resume to help any future business endeavors and the owner wants playoffs so he can make some cash.  Trading firsts is the easiest way to do those two things.  The fans want a great team with sustainable success and a championship, trading firsts is not ideal for this situation.  

 

Us the fans are just sheep following along because we have no choice.  We want to stay positive so of course we will try to say it was a fair deal but in reality we are watching our future dwindle during this playoff' arms race.

 

Consider ourselves lucky.  No long term plan should involve banking on free agents to sign with us year after year.  What if Myers or Ferland decided to sign somewhere else?  We wouldn't be anywhere close and would still be lacking the same amount of assets.  

 

Franchise defining player at 18th overall?

Slim chance. 

Actually a cherry picker of a chance. 

Ease up on the drama boys. Geez. 

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3 hours ago, Silver Ghost said:

stepped

 

3 hours ago, Silver Ghost said:

Do you understand the concept of calculated risk?

 

Theoretically, the pick could be 1st to 31st. But what is the realistic chance it ends up a lottery pick next year?

 

The Canucks making the playoffs this year or next is a pretty high percentage chance vs the alternative of not making the playoffs and finishing bottom of the league the next two years.

 

Name the last 18th overall pick that stepped in and was an immediate star in the league. Hell, who was the last 18th overall that stepped in and was immediately a better, more versatile player than JT Miller?

 

I know its hard for some fans to see that the Canucks are shifting from being completely reliant on the draft. They now need to start taking advantage of as many prime years as possible from their young core group by surrounding them with quality players. Thats what Benning is doing.

 

Tampa may draft a star player with that pick a year or two years from now. But the Canucks would have to "waste" 2 years of prime EP, Horvat, Bo, and Hughes time to pick high. 

 

Its a great show of faith by the Canucks at exactly the right time. Doesnt mean it cant backfire, it just means the calculated risk is sufficiently low to make this a good trade now and even in hindsight if a good player is picked.

Beautiful. 

Pretty much summarizes my dismay towards draftists in one post. 

What? Sit around and continue to suck fir 3-4 more years hoping to win the jackpot? Youth at all costs? Please. 

Mid love to know how much heavy lifting you g draft picks have made towards hoisting the past dozen cups or so. Someone please round up some stats. 

It’s time to get going on this. 

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11 minutes ago, bad alice french said:

Franchise defining player at 18th overall?

Slim chance. 

Actually a cherry picker of a chance. 

Ease up on the drama boys. Geez. 

Talk about drama..you blew that quote way out of proportion.  

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21 minutes ago, bad alice french said:

 

Beautiful. 

Pretty much summarizes my dismay towards draftists in one post. 

What? Sit around and continue to suck fir 3-4 more years hoping to win the jackpot? Youth at all costs? Please. 

Mid love to know how much heavy lifting you g draft picks have made towards hoisting the past dozen cups or so. Someone please round up some stats. 

It’s time to get going on this. 

These “fans” seem to think guys like Horvat, Pettersson, Boeser, Hughes and Demko are going to be perfectly happy playing bottom feeder for the next 3-4 years... lol. 

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Posted (edited)

Mark my words. We are going into the playoffs and j.t. Miller scores 25 at least :) 

Edited by canuckels
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