Phil_314 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 2 hours ago, VegasCanuck said: In general, Petterson is probably worth 2 x 1st on his own, so, yes, I'd make that trade. Schaller and Mazanec were contract dumps. Madden is an interesting prospect, but we don't know for sure how he will develop as far as ceiling. 2nd round pick has about 33% chance of having an NHL career of 100 games or more 3rd round pick is about 20% chance. Would be pretty happy to do that. Sounds about right. Petey, right now, on an ELC could definitely command that. An all-star, young, cost controlled center who can lead the team for years to come and isn't even at his peak is arguably the most valuable piece on a team, maybe besides an all-round dominant defenseman. 1st and blue-chip, can't miss prospect or 2 x 1st are arguably the same in value IMO. For context sake, JG Pageau alone cost nearly half of the offered value (Madden and 1st to offset Schaller and Mazanec?) and he's one guy. That's insane value. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coryberg Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 3 hours ago, Phil_314 said: Sounds about right. Petey, right now, on an ELC could definitely command that. An all-star, young, cost controlled center who can lead the team for years to come and isn't even at his peak is arguably the most valuable piece on a team, maybe besides an all-round dominant defenseman. 1st and blue-chip, can't miss prospect or 2 x 1st are arguably the same in value IMO. For context sake, JG Pageau alone cost nearly half of the offered value (Madden and 1st to offset Schaller and Mazanec?) and he's one guy. That's insane value. You would have to be insane to trade pettersson for 2 firsts. The closest instance that I can think of where a young star was traded so early for picks was Phil Kessel after his 3rd season. But even then not very comparable.... -Phil was 22 Pettersson is 21 -Phil had 126 points in 222 games (.57ppg) Pettersson has 129 points in 135 games (.96ppg) -Kessel was a one way winger Pettersson is a 2 way center All these factors add up to higher value. Not to mention Kessels poor reputation and contract demands at the time. Despite that he still fetched 2 firsts and a second. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil_314 Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 15 hours ago, coryberg said: You would have to be insane to trade pettersson for 2 firsts. The closest instance that I can think of where a young star was traded so early for picks was Phil Kessel after his 3rd season. But even then not very comparable.... -Phil was 22 Pettersson is 21 -Phil had 126 points in 222 games (.57ppg) Pettersson has 129 points in 135 games (.96ppg) -Kessel was a one way winger Pettersson is a 2 way center All these factors add up to higher value. Not to mention Kessels poor reputation and contract demands at the time. Despite that he still fetched 2 firsts and a second. Don't get me wrong lol, I'm not saying trade him. The context of my post was regarding the cost it took to build the 1st line that someone else wrote about. I'm also saying that it's a bare minimum starting point, and even then I'd hesitate to move him unless another substantial asset is included. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me_ Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 2 hours ago, Phil_314 said: Don't get me wrong lol, I'm not saying trade him. The context of my post was regarding the cost it took to build the 1st line that someone else wrote about. I'm also saying that it's a bare minimum starting point, and even then I'd hesitate to move him unless another substantial asset is included. All matters considered, Benning paid a very small organizational price to get what could be one of the most productive lines the Canucks will have built in their history. Toffoli signs, the Canucks go very far and for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 I am worth at least 4 first round picks, are you kidding me? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarnBurner Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 On 3/1/2020 at 8:54 PM, VegasCanuck said: In general, Petterson is probably worth 2 x 1st on his own, so, yes, I'd make that trade. Schaller and Mazanec were contract dumps. Madden is an interesting prospect, but we don't know for sure how he will develop as far as ceiling. 2nd round pick has about 33% chance of having an NHL career of 100 games or more 3rd round pick is about 20% chance. Would be pretty happy to do that. Plus you have to remove - 1st ‘17 (5OA17) - from the list, which is Pettersson. So, for Miller and Toffoli, HELLO YEAH, I'd make that trade! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me_ Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 (edited) 43 minutes ago, BarnBurner said: Plus you have to remove - 1st ‘17 (5OA17) - from the list, which is Pettersson. So, for Miller and Toffoli, HELLO YEAH, I'd make that trade! True. VAN Miller Toffoli NHL Schaller Mazanec Madden 1st ‘20 or ‘21 2nd ‘20 3rd ‘19 Even better return value to the Canucks. Edited March 3, 2020 by Me_ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarnBurner Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Me_ said: True. VAN Miller Toffoli NHL Schaller Mazanec Madden 1st ‘20 or ‘21 2nd ‘20 3rd ‘19 Even better return value to the Canucks. Actually, I think that's pretty much how it played out... Miller for 1st '20 or '21 - 3rd '19 - Mazanec Toffoli for Madden - 2nd '20 - Schaller Let's just hope we are able to resign Toffoli. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peaches5 Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 On 2/17/2020 at 11:26 AM, D-Money said: Killorn's NTC has been in place since 2017. Gourde's kicked in on July 1st, but as I said, he just signed that extension during last season, as he was originally set to become a UFA. Had the team signed him during the season with a NTC, and then traded him prior to July 1st, it would have looked terrible on management, and no doubt affected their future dealings with young players. That's exactly what they did with JT Miller. They signed him to a cap friendly contract and then gave him a NTC and then traded him before it kicked in on July 1st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BPA Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 10 hours ago, Me_ said: True. VAN Miller Toffoli NHL Schaller Mazanec Madden 1st ‘20 or ‘21 2nd ‘20 3rd ‘19 Even better return value to the Canucks. But but Madden!!! But but 1st!!! LOL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks Curse Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Toffoli looks great, I think Miller, Pearson, Toff were all great trades 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks Curse Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 madden is 155lbs, now has a broken hand, good prospect, but will he move the needle much? when? and that second- look at Demko, Lind, gadjo- they will all take 5 years after they were drafted to have an impact, Demko is at the 5 yr mark now... 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Twilight Sparkle Posted March 7, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted March 7, 2020 On 6/22/2019 at 10:57 AM, Twilight Sparkle said: JT Miller was one of the hardest working guys in Tampa XD cry harder, boys. I'm thirsty! On 6/22/2019 at 10:59 AM, Twilight Sparkle said: thanks to @oldnews unearthing these, these posts aged quite well xD 2 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeneedLumme Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 I just went back and read about ten pages after your posts. There sure were a lot of pushy arrogant simpletons frothing at the mouth about how stupid JB was to "throw away a first round pick" for this "third-line cap dump." An awful lot of posts that didn't age well - I guess it would be tacky to quote them now, eh, since one of the lovely aspects of the Internet is a complete lack of accountability. On March 6, 2020 at 10:35 PM, Twilight Sparkle said: thanks to @oldnews unearthing these, these posts aged quite well xD 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, WeneedLumme said: I just went back and read about ten pages after your posts. There sure were a lot of pushy arrogant simpletons frothing at the mouth about how stupid JB was to "throw away a first round pick" for this "third-line cap dump." An awful lot of posts that didn't age well - I guess it would be tacky to quote them now, eh, since one of the lovely aspects of the Internet is a complete lack of accountability. Miller was pretty much a steal for the price paid. But I think the timing was too early to give up a first for a 27 year old, regardless of how much JB won the trade. I think we should have saved our trade chips for a couple more years. The trade was a steal, but the timing was wrong. When Petey and Hughes are mature and playing their best, Miller will be gone. I just don’t see how that helps us? We should have had at least one more top 10 pick. Now we will be drafting (when we have our pick) in the middle of round one. IMO, JB made us mediocre, and that’s the worst place to be when you gave up picks and prospects to get there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 50 minutes ago, Alflives said: Miller was pretty much a steal for the price paid. But I think the timing was too early to give up a first for a 27 year old nonsense Alf (and he was and is 26 if the facts matter) They hold Miller's rights - he's not a frozen asset - in other words if they elected to regain those assets for him, they could easily do so and gain in the process. He's an appreciating asset - considerable uptick on his value - at 71 pts in 67 games, one of the league's top faceoff guys, most physical forward on the team, very versatile... you've got your crap goggles on my friend - they're fogging your perception. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzle Posted March 9, 2020 Share Posted March 9, 2020 (edited) On 2/28/2020 at 2:13 PM, Kanukfanatic said: Ouch. Yeah, his post looks pretty bad now. Shows that people who sound like they know what they're talking about don't actually know. Such is Provost. Edited March 9, 2020 by Dazzle 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nergish Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 Just to clarify, is the condition on the 1st strictly based on making/not making the playoffs? Or are we able to defer regardless? (Just imagining we make the playoffs based on winning percentage in a shortened season, but land a lottery draft pick) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastal.view Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 1 hour ago, nergish said: Just to clarify, is the condition on the 1st strictly based on making/not making the playoffs? Or are we able to defer regardless? (Just imagining we make the playoffs based on winning percentage in a shortened season, but land a lottery draft pick) i wonder what the trade conditions on that deal provide if the current hockey season is suspended or cancelled? does that mean we no longer are required to provide tampa (which has since traded this pick) our 1st rounder ? since there is no way to determine whether or not the team made the playoffs this season ? maybe jimmy can get us out of our compensation requirements Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 5 minutes ago, coastal.view said: i wonder what the trade conditions on that deal provide if the current hockey season is suspended or cancelled? does that mean we no longer are required to provide tampa (which has since traded this pick) our 1st rounder ? since there is no way to determine whether or not the team made the playoffs this season ? maybe jimmy can get us out of our compensation requirements I'll do my best. The league won't get into worrying about trade conditions, all they need to do is determine the standings. Seems like it will be based on point percentage if the tweety talking heads are correct but we have to wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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