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[Rumor] Boeser Camp Eyeing 4 Year Deal Worth $28M

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9 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

It is fair to see Horvat is a harder checker. Is a physical handful. Commendably plays the game with spirit! Plus he's a pivot, and takes draws.Most in the NHL and wins them.

 

Pretty valuable. 

 

I believe that is where it ends. Boeser is still a very responsible defensive player using positioning, body strength. He's 210 lbs.  Always between his man & the net, his man & the puck. Does not take shifts off. Still a guy the coach can rely on!  He is also flat our better with the puck. Horvat tries to bull past D. But if he cannot? Chips & pushes it into the corner and ties it up.  Tries & wins a share of his battles? Brock simply protect the rubber, dangles and hold guys off. He gains the zone with possession. A key guy for zone entries. Makes plays with the puck. He then uses smarts & body position to slip away from checks. He's dangerous, you cannot leave him alone once he gives up the puck.

 

You turn your head defensively? He's backdoor. Or in Ovi's slot, at the top of the opposite circle. Ready to unload that howitzer. Gets it off quickly picking corners at will. Boeser was 0.81 points per game while playing coming off injury this year. 0.89 points per game last year.  Both better than any year put up by Horvat. A significantly more effective offensive player. Looks every bit like a guy who will be a 70 point & 40 goal man when he plays full seasons. 

 

80 or 100 points approaching 50 goals as he develops. As the Canucks also improve with him, move to a game played at pace. You are under rating Boeser IMO.

 

You are basing those predictions after 2 seasons, last year limited by an injury that clearly had an effect on his play, which was glaringly obvious.

 

I'd disagree with you on the defensive play, he is quite sluggish and I did not see much if any urgency on the back check. 

 

It's a dangerous game giving someone a massive contract in the hopes that he becomes anywhere close to netting 50/year... I am fully in the bridge contract for 5.5ish/4 years to prove it with some consistency. He can have his payday after that if he in fact does pan out to the player we all hope he does.

 

No cap issues then as the league cap will rise significantly with the new TV deal, and we will have unloaded Lu, Erikkson, and Sutter's contracts which are weighing us down. Imo of course :)

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This deal does not happen until the Eriksson fiasco is dealt with.

 

There was someone who stated that there is a big pay day for Lucic on the 17th so things might move along then. From all I’ve read, if Eriksson is blocking this anyways. 

 

My thoughts are if Eriksson doesn’t agree to the trade by the 18th, JB will say enough is enough. Lui, get ready to ride buses in Utica, we are done (there doesn’t appear to be any other teams other than the Oilers that have interest in LE).

 

Canucks will save 1M in cap space and figure things out from there on how to structure a deal with Boeser.

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1 hour ago, grandmaster said:

This deal does not happen until the Eriksson fiasco is dealt with.

 

There was someone who stated that there is a big pay day for Lucic on the 17th so things might move along then. From all I’ve read, if Eriksson is blocking this anyways. 

 

My thoughts are if Eriksson doesn’t agree to the trade by the 18th, JB will say enough is enough. Lui, get ready to ride buses in Utica, we are done (there doesn’t appear to be any other teams other than the Oilers that have interest in LE).

 

Canucks will save 1M in cap space and figure things out from there on how to structure a deal with Boeser.

Please tell us why?

 

It has been shown 100 times already we have enough cap to sign Boeser. We do not need Loui to be gone before that happens.  Shocking how many people are clueless to this.  :frantic:

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3 hours ago, grandmaster said:

This deal does not happen until the Eriksson fiasco is dealt with.

 

There was someone who stated that there is a big pay day for Lucic on the 17th so things might move along then. From all I’ve read, if Eriksson is blocking this anyways. 

 

My thoughts are if Eriksson doesn’t agree to the trade by the 18th, JB will say enough is enough. Lui, get ready to ride buses in Utica, we are done (there doesn’t appear to be any other teams other than the Oilers that have interest in LE).

 

Canucks will save 1M in cap space and figure things out from there on how to structure a deal with Boeser.

Why would we trade for Lucic now? That was the rumored trade at the deadline, not now.

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6 hours ago, st33 said:

You are basing those predictions after 2 seasons, last year limited by an injury that clearly had an effect on his play, which was glaringly obvious.

 

I'd disagree with you on the defensive play, he is quite sluggish and I did not see much if any urgency on the back check. 

 

It's a dangerous game giving someone a massive contract in the hopes that he becomes anywhere close to netting 50/year... I am fully in the bridge contract for 5.5ish/4 years to prove it with some consistency. He can have his payday after that if he in fact does pan out to the player we all hope he does.

 

No cap issues then as the league cap will rise significantly with the new TV deal, and we will have unloaded Lu, Erikkson, and Sutter's contracts which are weighing us down. Imo of course :)

I did not predict anything? 

 

I made the point he was a mcuch better offensive forward than Horvat.  

 

And correct, we disagree.  I don't see Boeser as a manic checker.  But I don't see him as sluggish.  Nor did Green, who made the point ''he gets it.''  He's not a liability and plays a solid game.  Call it my opinion.  

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3 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

I did not predict anything? 

 

I made the point he was a mcuch better offensive forward than Horvat.  

 

And correct, we disagree.  I don't see Boeser as a manic checker.  But I don't see him as sluggish.  Nor did Green, who made the point ''he gets it.''  He's not a liability and plays a solid game.  Call it my opinion.  

 
80 or 100 points approaching 50 goals as he develops. As the Canucks also improve with him, move to a game played at pace. You are under rating Boeser IMO.
 
lets be fair here. The above quote looks like a prediction to me.  

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On 7/12/2019 at 8:48 AM, Canuck Surfer said:

It is fair to see Horvat is a harder checker. Is a physical handful. Commendably plays the game with spirit! Plus he's a pivot, and takes draws.Most in the NHL and wins them.

 

Pretty valuable. 

 

I believe that is where it ends. Boeser is still a very responsible defensive player using positioning, body strength. He's 210 lbs.  Always between his man & the net, his man & the puck. Does not take shifts off. Still a guy the coach can rely on!  He is also flat our better with the puck. Horvat tries to bull past D. But if he cannot? Chips & pushes it into the corner and ties it up.  Tries & wins a share of his battles? Brock simply protect the rubber, dangles and hold guys off. He gains the zone with possession. A key guy for zone entries. Makes plays with the puck. He then uses smarts & body position to slip away from checks. He's dangerous, you cannot leave him alone once he gives up the puck.

 

You turn your head defensively? He's backdoor. Or in Ovi's slot, at the top of the opposite circle. Ready to unload that howitzer. Gets it off quickly picking corners at will. Boeser was 0.81 points per game while playing coming off injury this year. 0.89 points per game last year.  Both better than any year put up by Horvat. A significantly more effective offensive player. Looks every bit like a guy who will be a 70 point & 40 goal man when he plays full seasons. 

 

80 or 100 points approaching 50 goals as he develops. As the Canucks also improve with him, move to a game played at pace. You are under rating Boeser IMO.

 

Cant really pay him based on ppg if he's never played a full season. Fact of the matter is what hes proved this far is hes a 55 pt player so pay him like a 55 pt player give him a 2-3 year deal and if he puts up 70 pts pay him like a 70pt player. If he cant stay healthy he's not worth 7-8 m om a 8 year deal. 

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From NHL Rumors:

 

Latest On Brock Boeser’s Contract Talks

JULY 13, 2019 AT 12:47 PM CDT | BY BRIAN LA ROSE 2 COMMENTS

It appears that the Canucks and Brock Boeser are still a sizable distance apart in contract discussions.  Postmedia’s Patrick Johnston reports that Vancouver has tabled a six-year, $36MM offer to the winger while Boeser’s camp is looking for a shorter-term around $7MM per year.

Unlike most of the prominent restricted free agents out there, Boeser isn’t eligible for an offer sheet nor was he eligible for salary arbitration so he doesn’t have a lot of leverage at his disposal.  He also doesn’t have as lengthy of a track record as some of the others in this RFA class with only 140 career games under his belt.

Nonetheless, the 22-year-old has established himself as being a capable top line player already.  Those players tend to get paid more than $6MM per year in this market so Vancouver’s offer seems a little low on the surface but again, Boeser has even less leverage than most RFAs coming off their entry-level deals so that’s likely part of the equation.

Earlier this offseason, Boeser indicated that he’s open to all types of offers, ranging from a one-year deal to a max-term eight-year pact.  However, with a notable shift towards eschewing long-term contracts in an effort to get to unrestricted free agency sooner, it’s not surprising that Boeser appears to prefer a shorter deal at this time.

Vancouver also has to be mindful of their salary cap situation.  As a result of their offseason additions, they will likely have to clear out some payroll room to sign Boeser to the deal they offered let alone what the winger’s asking price is.  Earlier this week, GM Jim Benning indicated that they’re comfortable using LTIR to start the season and then they’d make room when winger Antoine Roussel is ready to return but freeing up space now would be an easier route to take.  Accordingly, they may look to try to accomplish that before finalizing a new contract with Boeser which means it could be a while before this deal gets done.

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4 hours ago, hammertime said:

Cant really pay him based on ppg if he's never played a full season. Fact of the matter is what hes proved this far is hes a 55 pt player so pay him like a 55 pt player give him a 2-3 year deal and if he puts up 70 pts pay him like a 70pt player. If he cant stay healthy he's not worth 7-8 m om a 8 year deal. 

In a perfect world, you might be right. 

 

But it is a negotiation. And his numbers extrapolated over a year are already 65 to 73 points. And approaching forty goals.  Nylander had 60 points and 22 goals. His pact, hailed as a bad one, was $6.75 mill.  The year before, with 15% lower cap, Pastrnak also got $6.75 mill. But with more accomplishments.

 

You can say we couldn't sign him based on what he has not produced? His camp will say, and math says more often than not they would be right, his best years are ahead of him. I think it is fair for his side to suggest he will improve.

 

And we are buying those years in his prime.

 

FTR my own projection is a 6 year deal for $6.75. I would love to see those 4 year $5.5 pacts, with his contract expiring RFA. Those are my two most likely outcomes.   

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55 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said:

In a perfect world, you might be right. 

 

But it is a negotiation. And his numbers extrapolated over a year are already 65 to 73 points. And approaching forty goals.  Nylander had 60 points and 22 goals. His pact, hailed as a bad one, was $6.75 mill.  The year before, with 15% lower cap, Pastrnak also got $6.75 mill. But with more accomplishments.

 

You can say we couldn't sign him based on what he has not produced? His camp will say, and math says more often than not they would be right, his best years are ahead of him. I think it is fair for his side to suggest he will improve.

 

And we are buying those years in his prime.

 

FTR my own projection is a 6 year deal for $6.75. I would love to see those 4 year $5.5 pacts, with his contract expiring RFA. Those are my two most likely outcomes.   

Math says he has played 0 full seasons so if were using averages hes projected to play 0 more full seasons. 

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25 minutes ago, hammertime said:

Math says he has played 0 full seasons so if were using averages hes projected to play 0 more full seasons. 

Good luck with that.

 

If you negotiated for a living, on behalf of Boeser?  You are not using a 55 point comparable.

 

Ask 30 times, you will get knocked back 30 times. That's how to do math. Odds = zero.

 

He's going top get paid like a top line forward. 

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7 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said:

Good luck with that.

 

If you negotiated for a living, on behalf of Boeser?  You are not using a 55 point comparable.

 

Ask 30 times, you will get knocked back 30 times. That's how to do math. Odds = zero.

 

He's going top get paid like a top line forward. 

I cant compare him to a 70 point player if hes never scored 70. That would be ridiculous. 

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Just now, hammertime said:

I cant compare him to a 70 point player if hes never scored 70. That would be ridiculous. 

Comparing potential? Its not ridiculous. We're buying what 23 to 27 year old Boeser will be. Not 20 year old. Potential impacts what players get paid all the time.

 

All the time!

 

Odd's, if we use that term again, are he gets paid somewhere in between a 55 point player.  And the 70 point plus player those results extrapolate to? ie a middle ground similar to 62 point Nylander getting $6.75 mill. Maybe slightly higher. Mayne slightly lower if Benning is a good negotiator.


Paying as if he had already produced 75 or 85 points two or three straight years would be ridiculous. That would be $8.5 or $9.5 million.

 

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9 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said:

Comparing potential? Its not ridiculous. We're buying what 23 to 27 year old Boeser will be. Not 20 year old. Potential impacts what players get paid all the time.

 

All the time!

 

Odd's, if we use that term again, are he gets paid somewhere in between a 55 point player.  And the 70 point plus player those results extrapolate to? ie a middle ground similar to 62 point Nylander getting $6.75 mill. Maybe slightly higher. Mayne slightly lower if Benning is a good negotiator.


Paying as if he had already produced 75 or 85 points two or three straight years would be ridiculous. That would be $8.5 or $9.5 million.

 

Timo Mier is the most recent comparable so if were comparing. Timo also scored 10 more points and played better away from the puck than Brock. He signed for 6x4 so imo that puts Brock around 5.5 x 4. If he wants to bet on himself he can do a cheep 1 year deal and re negotiate if he proves hes better than his current average.

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2 minutes ago, hammertime said:

Timo Mier is the most recent comparable so if were comparing. Timo also scored 10 more points and played better away from the puck than Brock. He signed for 6x4 so imo that puts Brock around 5.5 x 4. If he wants to bet on himself he can do a cheep 1 year deal and re negotiate if he proves hes better than his current average.

Meier, I agree btw might be the best comparable, is yes, $6 million.  But with $10 mill the last year, which means they have to qualify him at $10 mill a year.

 

And with arbitration rights. Add the 5th year at $10 mill / 5 years = $34 mill or $6.8 mill AAV and UFA at the youngest possible age.

 

You come up with the same figures.

 

 

Meier is more physical, but I do not agree better.  If JB gets Brock at 4 x $5.5 mill I say job well done!

 

 

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19 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said:

Meier, I agree btw might be the best comparable, is yes, $6 million.  But with $10 mill the last year, which means they have to qualify him at $10 mill a year.

 

And with arbitration rights. Add the 5th year at $10 mill / 5 years = $34 mill or $6.8 mill AAV and UFA at the youngest possible age.

 

You come up with the same figures.

 

 

Meier is more physical, but I do not agree better.  If JB gets Brock at 4 x $5.5 mill I say job well done!

 

 

Timo is more physical and scored more = better. I'm fine with having the final year of a 4 year 5.5m for Brock be 9m. If he earns the QO great pay the man if he doesnt trade his rights or let him go UFA and try to negotiate a more realistic deal. I see no problem with paying him what hes proved hes worth. I see every problem with paying him for what he hasn't proved yet. 

 

Using Nylander as a comparable is a prime example of a bad contact negotiation by a selfish player and GM acting stupidly. If brock wants to go that route he isnt the class act we know he is. If it gets to that point you trade his rights and dont go down that path. There were great offers out there for Nylander before he signed. I'm sure if JB and Brock cant agree on money or term there will be tantalizing offers out there for him. Let's hope it doesnt have to go there and Brock looks at his Captain and says let's win a cup together. 

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23 hours ago, grandmaster said:

This deal does not happen until the Eriksson fiasco is dealt with.

 

There was someone who stated that there is a big pay day for Lucic on the 17th so things might move along then. From all I’ve read, if Eriksson is blocking this anyways. 

 

My thoughts are if Eriksson doesn’t agree to the trade by the 18th, JB will say enough is enough. Lui, get ready to ride buses in Utica, we are done (there doesn’t appear to be any other teams other than the Oilers that have interest in LE).

 

Canucks will save 1M in cap space and figure things out from there on how to structure a deal with Boeser.

I think we agree where time is on Bennings side here..  even if Boeser and the Canucks agree to a contract, it dosent have to be signed in the moment.

Guaranteed if Eriksson is not freeing up his clauses, there is nothing Benning can help him with.. 

If Eriksson did free up his clauses, and wasn’t moved, at least he might start with the Canucks.. giving them time to showcase him.

But if LE is going to be stubborn, I feel he is dealing with the wrong GM .

Utica.   I’ve stated early LE will not last,  3 weeks into the New Year max..   when you have had concussion issues, you keep a Rolodex of some pretty good Doctors.   LTI.

There are still teams out there that need to meet the Cap.. chances are they take him without us or them giving anything up, just absorbing his salary.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Canuck Surfer said:

Meier, I agree btw might be the best comparable, is yes, $6 million.  But with $10 mill the last year, which means they have to qualify him at $10 mill a year.

 

And with arbitration rights. Add the 5th year at $10 mill / 5 years = $34 mill or $6.8 mill AAV and UFA at the youngest possible age.

 

You come up with the same figures.

 

 

Meier is more physical, but I do not agree better.  If JB gets Brock at 4 x $5.5 mill I say job well done!

 

 

 

i'm not really sure why so many think this benefits the player ?

the player delays receiving a bundle of money till the last year of the contract (rather then up front - getting a bundle early makes that money worth more, it can be invested and additional interest etc derived from that money)

if the player is wanted by the team a replacement contract can be and often is negotiated in the final year

and the qualifying offer never comes into play

 

if the player under performs.. how does this bump payment help him? team will not qualify him

and so he looses security ... if the last year were more reasonable the cost to qualify him after a so so year is more likely

what good will a year early to free agency get the player if he has been more mediocre ?

 

i'm sure i'm missing something here

but it is not obvious to me why this is a player driven contract structure

(i'd more readily argue it is better for the team as they defer paying till the last season)

 

 

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1 hour ago, Canuck Surfer said:

Meier, I agree btw might be the best comparable, is yes, $6 million.  But with $10 mill the last year, which means they have to qualify him at $10 mill a year.

 

And with arbitration rights. Add the 5th year at $10 mill / 5 years = $34 mill or $6.8 mill AAV and UFA at the youngest possible age.

 

You come up with the same figures.

 

 

Meier is more physical, but I do not agree better.  If JB gets Brock at 4 x $5.5 mill I say job well done!

 

 

If JB gets Boeser to sign at 5.5 that would be amazing. with that being said, I don't think that happens. 

 

I can see Boeser signing for something along the lines of 6.5 over 4 years, and then depending on how he performs during those four years, either get a sizeable raise, or not. 

 

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56 minutes ago, SilentSam said:

I think we agree where time is on Bennings side here..  even if Boeser and the Canucks agree to a contract, it dosent have to be signed in the moment.

Guaranteed if Eriksson is not freeing up his clauses, there is nothing Benning can help him with.. 

If Eriksson did free up his clauses, and wasn’t moved, at least he might start with the Canucks.. giving them time to showcase him.

But if LE is going to be stubborn, I feel he is dealing with the wrong GM .

Utica.   I’ve stated early LE will not last,  3 weeks into the New Year max..   when you have had concussion issues, you keep a Rolodex of some pretty good Doctors.   LTI.

There are still teams out there that need to meet the Cap.. chances are they take him without us or them giving anything up, just absorbing his salary.

 

 

Yeah, well, Benning's job is on the line last I checked. He doesn't have a contract extension that we know of. So he's fighting for his job as well as LE is. 

 

WIth that being said, when a GM is fighting for his job, I'd have a tendency to wager my bets on the GM. Benning seems to be making some strong moves this off-season. He probably is, like you say, the wrong GM to be dealing with, or pissing off. JB has everything to lose if he screws up this Eriksson situation. 

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