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Our coach: Mr. Travis Green (discussion)

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Jester13

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I wonder how open to players' suggestions Green is?  Particularly as regards the power play.  Who's idea was it to have Boeser as the designated puck carrier (from the drop pass) when clearly both Petey and Bo are more adept at zone entry? And why does the second unit, in their 35 seconds, find it easier to get into the offensive zone than the first unit?  Maybe because they attack as a 5 man unit, with Stecher or Hutton carrying it in  (or Granny, or Jake, or, yes, even Loui)

 

(As an aside, I wonder how many more pp goals Bure would have had if the drop pass had been invented then - with his blazing speed I could see maybe 15 to 20 more!!)

 

But back to Green - does he just give the floor to the Assistant Coaches when drawing up PP and PK strategies?  I recall in one of the Podkolzin video snippets him leaning over the boards drawing on the coach's whiteboard during a power play - I wonder how receptive Green will.be to that from Podz or Petey?

 

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23 hours ago, smokes said:

Everyone is talking about how he turned Jake around. I would argue if he did or not. Jake was a first rounder projected to play in the top six and is now a bottom six player who can easily be replaced. He's trying to turn Goldobin into a two way player when he is clearly meant to play on the offense. He turned what was one a promising young defence man in Hutton into a free agency giveaway. He got Eriksson, a 14 year veteran who we haven't heard a complaint from, ever, call him out. When you look at the improvements of the team last year, we need to ask ourselves, did the Canucks improve because of Green's coaching or because the diamond Benning uncovered in Petey.

I appreciate the objective observations and putting it out there against the norm. I kinda agree. 

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18 hours ago, Chickenspear said:

1:) First off, WD didn't talk to his "doghouse players" about why they were in the doghouse in the first place. How is Jake (and Tryamkin) supposed to improve if his coach isn't talking to him? TG does, and you can see the improvement from the second season of TG (first season Jake spent the bulk of the season in Utica). Besides, you're putting unrealistic expectations on a 22 year old.

 

2:) 2-way play is how teams win nowadays. If you're 1 dimensional, you're not going to have a very long or good career. It's all on Goldy to improve his defensive abilities.

 

3:) Seriously blaming TG for Hutton going to free agency? You realize the GM signs players right? I'm sure he would have been resigned if the $ from arbitration wouldn't have been so high (rumored to be ~$4-$4.5m last I heard).

 

4:) Didn't Loui complain after his one healthy scratch in 3 years? He's got no right to complain after his lackluster effort, and TG's defended him everytime. I could go on, but we don't need another Loui thread.

 

5:) Yes, Petey was the gem of the draft, and accounted for a lot of offense last season, but that doesn't explain the buy-in and effort from the rest of the team.

1) Here is my issue with Jake. He is a former 6th overall draft pick with a then potential of a top six forward who can drive to the net and make something happen in the offensive zone. The Canucks messed up by keeping him on the roster instead of sending him to the Hitmen and let him destroy the league for a year. That was on WD. They then send him over to Utica to work with Green for a while. He comes back into the roster playing with the bottom six, very rarely even tried on the top six even when the injuries mounted. TD to me has turned Jake from a potential offensive force to a checker. I think we have lowered out expectations of Virtanen. To me Virtanen showed more flashes of his offensive potential with WD than he ever did with TD.

 

2) There are a lot of excellent 1 dimensional players out there in the NHL, most coaches balances that out with the strength of other line mates. Boeser is also pretty one dimensional. He'll try a little but he floats at times. He's forgiven because he is a great goal scorer. Goldobin was the third leading scorer on the Canucks for a long time so he was effective at putting points on the board. He has some defensive deficiencies so TD decides to call him out in the media? A rookie? Like you can't tell the media "Oh it's a team game and he wasn't the only cause" then talk to him privately in the locker room? Knowing what kind of fish tank market Vancouver is, he could have at least protected his rookie by backing him up to the media then try to improve him behind closed doors. Look around the NHL and try to see how many coaches would do that to their rookies? Usually if the coaches talk about a player, it is a veteran or a superstar that can withstand the scrutiny because they have been in the league a few years.

 

3) The Canucks could have walked away from the arbitration decision if they wanted to, instead he was not even qualified. While he was relied on more last year, he was still not what TD tried to get him to be. A once promising defenceman who we can't even get a draft pick for because he plays an invisible game on the ice. That's on the coach for not getting the most out of his players.

 

4) What worries me about the LE comment is not really about LE on the ice for me but the fact that TG is ineffective in creating a buying in atmosphere. 

 

5) The only reason there was a buyin effort was because the other guys saw what Petey was doing. What happened to the buy in effort when Petey was on injury?

 

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Where'd Luongo? said:

I appreciate the objective observations and putting it out there against the norm. I kinda agree. 

I guess I was spoiled during the AV days but I remember the Sedins, Burrows, Kesler, Hansen etc. when they were coming up. AV let them be who they were offensive or defensive and put the pieces in from there. He never really try to control who the players were. With Green, it seems like everyone needs to be the type of player he wants them to be. 

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29 minutes ago, smokes said:

I guess I was spoiled during the AV days but I remember the Sedins, Burrows, Kesler, Hansen etc. when they were coming up. AV let them be who they were offensive or defensive and put the pieces in from there. He never really try to control who the players were. With Green, it seems like everyone needs to be the type of player he wants them to be. 

I think you have a bot of revisionist history with AV, who is still my favourite Canucks coach.

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15 hours ago, Googlie said:

None so blind as those that will not see

 

(31 straight penalty kill shifts without conceding a goal - first with Sutter, then with Granny,   Shorthouse thought that was a record....... best PK shots blocked percentage,  best PK takeaway percentage, fewest PK giveaway percentage ..... throw in 11 goals and 18 apples, and that's not " a pitiful effort"    Is it what we wanted. - no, but if his cap hit was Beagle's, we would be lauding him, not vilifying him

 

I will leave you with this one thought about Loui, then no more .........

 

Only 2 players in the entire history of the NHL can say that they assisted on Petey's first ever NHL goal  - Eriksson was one, with an exquisite pass (and Goldy with the other on an equally good pass)

so would it be safe to say that the fans ex[ect the first $3 million to pay for good defense 

and the second $3 million to pay for offense?

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How many times did we see Pouliot in the line up last season? And Gudbranson got benched exactly 0 times even tho he was significantly the worst player not only on the team at the time, but the entire league. Green is OK at best, if the team improves this season I'll be happy, but if they regress for any reason it is probably bye bye Green and/or  Benning.  

I'm not convinced Green is players coach either, which I am unsure if this is a good or bad thing. 

Anyone remember his reaction to Petey getting hurt? He says a lot of the right things but maybe strategy isn't his best suit? 

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8 hours ago, stawns said:

I think you have a bot of revisionist history with AV, who is still my favourite Canucks coach.

AV was absolutely terrible at coaching any offense for our team. Even when he 'lucked' into Burrows with the sedins, he made some comment about trying it out, not a comment about noticing Burrows' offensive awareness and compete level to complement the Sedins. I remember the '06-'07 season or so when the best any player on our team could ever do when we had any offensive chance was to shoot it into the goalie's mid-section - for ALL our players, and our entire offense revolved around dump and chase. So often whenever we did get the puck moving towards the offensive side of the rink, the players would dump it and change. It was brutal.

 

He did however have a good mind for the defensive side of the game, which allowed us to stay into and win a lot of 1 goal games for those years before the Sedins broke out into their Art Ross trophy winning performances.

 

Additionally, he was terrible at adapting to coaching strategy changes. So frustrating watching Chicago change their style up a game or three into any of our 3 seasons in a row playoff matches and Vigneault coming up with no changes of his own costing us 2 and almost 3 of those series. I remember everyone getting mad at Willie Mitchell when he coughed up the puck and we lost game 6 of whatever year that happened in, but it was AV coaching a no-offense sit on the 1 goal lead strategy that cost us that game, among others.

 

 

For Green, I'm not looking forward to the Playoff learning he'll need to go through. Personally I think he's a good coach overall, but he does have his deficiencies, as others have pointed out, particularly with not making the best use of offensively talented players, as Vigneault didn't either.

 

For all the hate Eriksson's getting in this thread I sure appreciate that some people in here see his value. Beyond his ability to steal the puck from the opposing team, his defensive awareness is probably the best on the team. Does that make him worth the $6 million dollar bill he's collecting? No. But it certainly makes him the best of any of the players we have in our bottom 6. I'd be surprised if he wasn't playing in our top 9 when the season starts (apart from being traded).

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6 hours ago, DS4quality said:

How many times did we see Pouliot in the line up last season? And Gudbranson got benched exactly 0 times even tho he was significantly the worst player not only on the team at the time, but the entire league. Green is OK at best, if the team improves this season I'll be happy, but if they regress for any reason it is probably bye bye Green and/or  Benning.  

I'm not convinced Green is players coach either, which I am unsure if this is a good or bad thing. 

Anyone remember his reaction to Petey getting hurt? He says a lot of the right things but maybe strategy isn't his best suit? 

What's your definition of a player's coach?  

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The upcoming season will be the year we will be able to judge Green's coaching abilities with much more ease.

 

He was simply to handicapped by horrendous rosters previously. On paper, we look to be somewhere in the 12-20 range this year. If Green can pull us into the playoffs it will be a success. If they win a round, huge success. If they miss, I'd think Green likely has just one more year to prove himself.

 

So far I do really like Green as a coach and as a person. You can tell he's a really funny person but he knows how to hold back and keep serious with the media. He seems to be really in tune with how to get the best out of each individual player. Favorite coach since AV by far. I'd love to see him have some success here.

Edited by dank.sinatra
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Right now I don't see Green as being a good coach or a bad coach. His first year we improved by 4 points, and then by 8 points. 

In terms of his style the team plays dump and chase. Not very exciting but maybe it is him adapting to his roster. 

 

In terms of young players, we have had Horvat develop into a 1st line centre, Boeser come into the league with a lot of success, EP winning a calder, and some modest improvement from JV. 

 

Since Green took over I felt this team went from being a painful joke to a clumsy puppy. At times we have it together but lack consistency and go through bad stretch. But at the very least I felt this past year we weren't a pushover and started to feel things were turning around. 

Now what is interesting is with Quinn Hughes we probably have a top 10 puck carrier in the league. Also, Benn and Myers were both second best on their teams last year in carrying the puck out of the zone. Our two worst, Pouliot and Gudbranson, are now gone. So replace those guys with Benn & Myers then add an elite carrier in Hughes and this team could look a lot different next year.

Up front we have so many options as well. If Green can't get this team to the playoffs over the next two seasons I would say he has failed and should be canned. Expectations are wild card, anything better and I would give him a very high grade. 

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On 8/9/2019 at 10:18 AM, Jester13 said:

Especially since it's the dog days of summer, the time is now for CDC to have a Travis Green thread - how has this not been created already?!

 

This thread is now a place to discuss our coach; what you like, dislike, his line combos, late-in-the-game decisions, his approach to players, how he differs from previous coaches, etc. 

 

I know this may be a hopeful plea, but it would be great if we could all try to refrain from using loaded, troll-type language, or knee-jerk responses to others, regardless if you're a supporter or dissenter of our coach. I find it most useful to "seek to understand and not to be understood", as the saying goes, before responding to someone. If we can do this, I really feel like great discussion can be had.

 

I get a sense that this thread may stall at times, and that's okay, but hopefully it gets bumped from time to time and continues to provide worthwhile discussion throughout the year and into the post season. As the creator of this thread, I guess I'll start it off. So here I go...

 

I have a huge coach crush on Green. He's a player's coach. His open and honest communication style is refreshing and exciting. It's obvious the high level of buy-in he has received from players is rampant throughout the locker room, which is ever so important for a team to be successful. I love his play-hard-or-don't-play-at-all approach, and that he's applying it to everyone, regardless of who they are. Playing favourites with players who don't deserve their ice time (yes, this is a knock towards good ol' Willie) is a recipe for disaster (seriously, Megna? Yeesh). Green just has a way of knowing each of his players and knowing what it takes to get them going. The level of compete we've seen since he came on his, well, impressive, and our record last year with the team and injuries we had says to me that we are playoff bound this year with how our team now looks.

 

I really hope, however, that he names Bo the captain this year. His latest comment on still not being in a rush says he may hold off another year, but another part of me thinks he's just keeping it under wraps that Bo will be named captain at some point; I mean, how can you not have a captain on our 50th anniversary and to kick off the next generation?! 

 

Okay, that's enough from me. Share your thoughts... 

 

GCG :towel:

 

P.S. I'm not the best at creating threads, so all feedback is welcome. 

Excellent job. Don't ever worry about your thread creations, this is a comprehensive subject that obviously has great participation. 

 

I have to start out with what Mr Green was left to work with. His predecessor WD left a mess behind playing career minor leaguers and scaring off Tryampkin which I'll never forgive him for doing. 

So Gree had a $hit show to clean up. A redo of the overall mind set of the team. 

 

Then he had to deal with the Sedins retiring and reinstating a new team mindset with a new inner leadership group in the locker room and on the ice.

 

He;s dealt with our new young players well. He's not just handing out spots on his roster. Players are earning  it. Green has used the roster hes been given well and this team has steadily grown under his leadership. He too has grown as a coach.

 

Over all he gets a big thumbs up from me.

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Perfect coach and style for the rebuild phase, but we’re out of that phase and we’ll find out what he can do with this new roster. 

 

I’d like to see him kicked in the nuts for his “response” to EP’s being power choke-slammed, but other than that, I’ve been happy with his Tenure. I also like his demeanour with the media. 

 

We can revisit this question in February and have a better understanding of how to assess his tactics. 

Edited by 189lb enforcers?
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I think we still have not seen the best from Travis. He has not had the personnel. His first years he had to try and win with a declining top six, whether it was to give the twins one more shot or not. Burdened with Eriksson and other underperforming and injury prone contracts through the years. Not knowing if he should develop the young guys or go for that eighth spot.  Now its pretty clear we are definatley shooting for the playoffs, and have a solid more physical veteran support group, plus a few legit young stars with at least some NHL playing experience.  Green has paid his dues, and I'm excited to see what he can do with less confusing mandate, and a more balanced team roster.

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18 hours ago, kilgore said:

I think we still have not seen the best from Travis. He has not had the personnel. His first years he had to try and win with a declining top six, whether it was to give the twins one more shot or not. Burdened with Eriksson and other underperforming and injury prone contracts through the years. Not knowing if he should develop the young guys or go for that eighth spot.  Now its pretty clear we are definatley shooting for the playoffs, and have a solid more physical veteran support group, plus a few legit young stars with at least some NHL playing experience.  Green has paid his dues, and I'm excited to see what he can do with less confusing mandate, and a more balanced team roster.

Great point I missed. So far Mr Green has seemingly maximized what he has to work with. Especially when the team is injured and he has to tinker. I don't think he over tinkers  though. 

I'm sure its a fine line for a coach not to over mix the lines. 

 Again i think of WD and wonder what were they thinking when they hired this guy?

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On 8/10/2019 at 11:11 AM, smokes said:

1) Here is my issue with Jake. He is a former 6th overall draft pick with a then potential of a top six forward who can drive to the net and make something happen in the offensive zone. The Canucks messed up by keeping him on the roster instead of sending him to the Hitmen and let him destroy the league for a year. That was on WD. They then send him over to Utica to work with Green for a while. He comes back into the roster playing with the bottom six, very rarely even tried on the top six even when the injuries mounted. TD to me has turned Jake from a potential offensive force to a checker. I think we have lowered out expectations of Virtanen. To me Virtanen showed more flashes of his offensive potential with WD than he ever did with TD.

 

2) There are a lot of excellent 1 dimensional players out there in the NHL, most coaches balances that out with the strength of other line mates. Boeser is also pretty one dimensional. He'll try a little but he floats at times. He's forgiven because he is a great goal scorer. Goldobin was the third leading scorer on the Canucks for a long time so he was effective at putting points on the board. He has some defensive deficiencies so TD decides to call him out in the media? A rookie? Like you can't tell the media "Oh it's a team game and he wasn't the only cause" then talk to him privately in the locker room? Knowing what kind of fish tank market Vancouver is, he could have at least protected his rookie by backing him up to the media then try to improve him behind closed doors. Look around the NHL and try to see how many coaches would do that to their rookies? Usually if the coaches talk about a player, it is a veteran or a superstar that can withstand the scrutiny because they have been in the league a few years.

 

3) The Canucks could have walked away from the arbitration decision if they wanted to, instead he was not even qualified. While he was relied on more last year, he was still not what TD tried to get him to be. A once promising defenceman who we can't even get a draft pick for because he plays an invisible game on the ice. That's on the coach for not getting the most out of his players.

 

4) What worries me about the LE comment is not really about LE on the ice for me but the fact that TG is ineffective in creating a buying in atmosphere. 

 

5) The only reason there was a buyin effort was because the other guys saw what Petey was doing. What happened to the buy in effort when Petey was on injury?

 

 

 

 

You know I almost wrote the exact same as your first paragraph in the "why can't we produce a power forward" thread.

and I think you could add Brendan Gaunce in there as well. He started his career with Green in Utica and they immediately wanted him to "grind" more and moved him to the wing, rather than working with what they had and what he had to offer.

Its not just Green though, AV / Gilllis went to the Playoffs with Rookie Kassian as our tough guy the year after Victor Oreskovich played 19 playoff games.

Then Willie went to the media on Sestito and Tryamkin for not being in shape. ( I swear Willie thought every player should match the Sedins on the Grouse Grind, no matter their body type) 

 Its like the team looks at body stats, (height and weight) and decides "This Kassian, Oreskovich, Sestito, Gaunce, Virtanen kid can be the next Cam Neely"

"We just need to pound that triangular peg into that oblong hole."

And the question remains, is Myers the next Buyfuglien and Tryamkin the next Chara or is Myers the next Gudbranson and Tryamkin the next Oreskovich?

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