Former player accuses Flames head coach Bill Peters of using racial slur -- Peters resigns

[Toews]

10 minutes ago, stawns said:

I can agree with that wording.........and I think that's what it was, just an unfortunate spoken error

I disagree. To me the context of the quote and who is targeted is clear.

Quote

“You people love – you, they come here, whatever it is – you love our way of life, you love our milk and honey. At least you pay a couple of bucks for poppies or something like that. These guys paid for your way of life that you enjoy in Canada. These guys paid the biggest price.”

"You people come here" or "they come here" 

 

If Cherry wasn't targeting immigrants, he could easily have "us" or "we", but then he switches to "our" milk and honey. Its clear that he is only calling out immigrants for not wearing poppies vs. everyone. Singling out immigrants to me is something that a bigot would do, and this isn't the first time Cherry had made bigoted comments so he really loses that benefit of the doubt from my perspective. 

 

The fact that he hasn't apologized underscores why he doesn't get it and why he probably should not be on national TV. I am perfectly fine with him having a podcast for those who can look past his unsavory behaviour and still see something worthwhile. I personally cannot do so anymore.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Toews

[Nucker 67]

3 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

It wasn't acceptable ten years ago either.  It's been beaten to death in this thread as to why it too so long up come out.

But it was accepted at the time, even though it was wrong and hurtful towards Akim. Coaches were mean towards most players back in the day.

 

It'll be inetresting to see all of the Babcockroaches coming out of the woodwork to tell the world all of the nasty things Coach Babcock said behind closed doors in private. Oh yeah, the roaches have already come out (Marner, TSN, etc.)

[Toews]

5 minutes ago, Tre Mac said:

When someone walks into a studio and raps incoherently with autotune over a computerized beat I call it shiza music.  I do like some rap and my buddies and I used to get messed up and rap for fun but it's pretty easy to see who has talent (The Roots) and who doesn't.  However I was talking about the song Peter's was referencing, I wouldn't want to hear that either.  Westside Connection comes to mind:  "#$%@$ wipe the #$%^ off my #$%&"  mmmmk lol.  I cant recall the last time I heard Blackthought use a Nbomb, I am sure he has but not in every song like a lot of rappers.  I will admit some of my disdain is based on jealousy, I spent years playing instruments and these guys walk in an out in an hour and have a hit song lol.

I will admit I have little to no clue about hip hop, much of it is entirely incoherent to me. The beats and the music can be appealing but the lyrics often just go over my head. Also I too am curious what song Peters was referencing.

[PhillipBlunt]

13 minutes ago, Tre Mac said:

When someone walks into a studio and raps incoherently with autotune over a computerized beat I call it shiza music.  I do like some rap and my buddies and I used to get messed up and rap for fun but it's pretty easy to see who has talent (The Roots) and who doesn't.  However I was talking about the song Peter's was referencing, I wouldn't want to hear that either.  Westside Connection comes to mind:  "#$%@$ wipe the #$%^ off my #$%&"  mmmmk lol.  I cant recall the last time I heard Blackthought use a Nbomb, I am sure he has but not in every song like a lot of rappers.  I will admit some of my disdain is based on jealousy, I spent years playing instruments and these guys walk in an out in an hour and have a hit song lol.

The rap/hip hop that's prevalent these days pales in comparison to Public Enemy, Beastie Boys, and other groups that relied far more on actual talent and originality than the likes of Drake and others who are autotuned to death.

[King Heffy]

7 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

But it was accepted at the time, even though it was wrong and hurtful towards Akim. Coaches were mean towards most players back in the day.

 

It'll be inetresting to see all of the Babcockroaches coming out of the woodwork to tell the world all of the nasty things Coach Babcock said behind closed doors in private. Oh yeah, the roaches have already come out (Marner, TSN, etc.)

No one else seems to be arguing it was accepted at the time.  The captain took issue with it.  There is a difference between not being a nice person and dropping ethnic slurs.

Edited November 27, 2019 by King Heffy

[Herberts Vasiljevs]

Times are a' changing.

[RUPERTKBD]

6 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

But it was accepted at the time, even though it was wrong and hurtful towards Akim. Coaches were mean towards most players back in the day.

 

It'll be inetresting to see all of the Babcockroaches coming out of the woodwork to tell the world all of the nasty things Coach Babcock said behind closed doors in private. Oh yeah, the roaches have already come out (Marner, TSN, etc.)

No it wasn't.

 

I played my hockey in PG....in the 60s, 70s and early 80s...lots of redneck coaches, but none of them would think of dropping the N word, or anything equivalent directed at other races. Plenty of profanity, sure, but that's the language of hockey and it doesn't single out any minority. 

[RonMexico]

Just now, PhillipBlunt said:

The rap/hip hop that's prevalent these days pales in comparison to Public Enemy, Beastie Boys, and other groups that relied far more on actual talent and originality than the likes of Drake and others who are autotuned to death.

Turns out, T-Pain can actually sing though!

 

 

[spur1]

Interesting story about D Sutter while he was with the Kings. Allegedly cursing out a flight attendant who was trying to serve the guys some food. He was saying they couldn’t eat because they played so lousy. I find that very disturbing on a lot of different levels. 

What blows me away is that as team of grown up men and millionaires they would put up with that kind of crap. 

 

[peaches5]

13 minutes ago, Alflives said:

That’s a good point.  Accepted.  We think we know someone and then wonder later how that person could have said or done something.  Still Orr does know Cherry, and we don’t.  But I do accept you point.  

There is nothing ambiguous about what Cherry said. "You people who come over here". He isn't talking about people who don't wear poppies. He is talking about immigrants who come over here and don't value and partake in his beliefs. That is 100% racism. It's his words and there is no way for them to come out accidentally unless he's thinking it. People coming out to defend him saying oh well that's not what he meant. It absolutely is what he meant. He attacked immigrants. He attacked immigrants who he feels don't value Canadian values; what he deems Canadian values. If you are defending him they you have the same beliefs as him. People think that being a racist means you want to lynch some guy for being black. Being racist means you hold your own beliefs above someone else's. 

 

It's not even so much that Cherry said these things it's his refusal to apologize and change. He doesn't want to grow as a person. Everyone at some point has said something questionable, most of us anyways, but it's about learning from it and changing for the better. Cherry just wants to be an ignorant racist asshole. All he had to do is come forward and say look I'm sorry I misspoke and the majority of people would have forgiven him.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, spur1 said:

Interesting story about D Sutter while he was with the Kings. Allegedly cursing out a flight attendant who was trying to serve the guys some food. He was saying they couldn’t eat because they played so lousy. I find that very disturbing on a lot of different levels. 

What blows me away is that as team of grown up men and millionaires they would put up with that kind of crap. 

 

And Sutter led them to two Cups.  What the hell?  It makes no sense that an abusive coach can be successful.  But time and time again it seems to happen.  

[Nucker 67]

6 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

No one else seems to be arguing it was accepted at the time.  The captain took issue with it.  There is a difference between not being a nice person and dropping ethnic slurs.

They should investigate Torts, he looks like he's said some things lol

 

I agree with you 100%, it is not acceptable, then or now, but I worry about what's happening with more and more people pointing fingers and making life-changing accusations many years after the fact. Thank goodness no one has displayed all of my less than proud moments on TV for the world to see. I guess what this would do is ensure no one says anyting in future, because it will come out.  

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, peaches5 said:

There is nothing ambiguous about what Cherry said. "You people who come over here". He isn't talking about people who don't wear poppies. He is talking about immigrants who come over here and don't value and partake in his beliefs. That is 100% racism. It's his words and there is no way for them to come out accidentally unless he's thinking it. People coming out to defend him saying oh well that's not what he meant. It absolutely is what he meant. He attacked immigrants. He attacked immigrants who he feels don't value Canadian values; what he deems Canadian values. If you are defending him they you have the same beliefs as him. People think that being a racist means you want to lynch some guy for being black. Being racist means you hold your own beliefs above someone else's. 

 

It's not even so much that Cherry said these things it's his refusal to apologize and change. He doesn't want to grow as a person. Everyone at some point has said something questionable, most of us anyways, but it's about learning from it and changing for the better. Cherry just wants to be an ignorant racist asshole. All he had to do is come forward and say look I'm sorry I misspoke and the majority of people would have forgiven him.

I accept everything you say except that by defending someone it marries you to them.  

[Duodenum]

37 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Bobby Orr, who knows Cherry way better than us, said Cherry is not racist.  

Yea, that's what I said. I don't think he's racist in a malicious way. He's just ignorant, doesn't have tact, probably low on the intelligence barometer, and is controversial. 

 

Let's not forget this is the same guy that called NHL enforcers "pukes" for speaking out against fighting after they had retired, stated that Mayor Ford would be the best mayor in Toronto history (lol), calls left-leaning Canadians "pinkos" and "kooks", constantly called out French Canadians and said the english speakers of Sault St. Marie spoke the "good language", referenced Alpo Suhonen's name to dog food, etc....

 

He's that grandpa that says a bunch of dumb things and you just nod your head and say "yes grandpa..." while secretly rolling your eyes except this grandpa was on national television. 

Edited November 27, 2019 by Duodenum

[RUPERTKBD]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

And Sutter led them to two Cups.  What the hell?  It makes no sense that an abusive coach can be successful.  But time and time again it seems to happen.  

Meh. Sometimes players succeed because of coaching and sometimes they succeed in spite of it.

[peaches5]

3 minutes ago, spur1 said:

Interesting story about D Sutter while he was with the Kings. Allegedly cursing out a flight attendant who was trying to serve the guys some food. He was saying they couldn’t eat because they played so lousy. I find that very disturbing on a lot of different levels. 

What blows me away is that as team of grown up men and millionaires they would put up with that kind of crap. 

 

Honestly, who cares? Airplane food is disgusting. If it isn't it's just snacks. Oh my god a coach said I can't eat a granola bar. Now if you're saying the disturbing part is him cursing at a flight attendant then that is another story. Let's not forget on our Stanley Cup run MG had everyone wear watches to make sure they were sleeping at proper hours and not out partying or how this current team doesn't let the players play Fortnite on the road. These types of things are really not that big of a deal. Bill Peters kicking and punching players and using racial slurs is not in anyway comparable.

[Ur a Towel]

35 minutes ago, stawns said:

I disagree, he's used the same term multiple times over the years, for the same reason.   He's a fervent Canadian and Remembrance Day has always been his rant day against people who don't appreciate the sacrifice made by men and women who serve.  I've heard tons of people who know talk about how big his heart is and haven't heard anyone who knows him call him remotely racist.

Oh don't get me wrong, I wasn't calling him racist for it. There's a reason why I said that it shouldn't be connected to Peters. I was more pointing out the fact that he was implying he meant immigrants when he was talking and not just everyone that doesn't wear poppies.
 

 

[spur1]

3 minutes ago, Alflives said:

And Sutter led them to two Cups.  What the hell?  It makes no sense that an abusive coach can be successful.  But time and time again it seems to happen.  

Much like in the real world. Had to put up with many abusing bosses. It seemed like corporate would just pick the biggest bully and make him Boss. 

A real leader has no use for mistreating his flock. 

 

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, peaches5 said:

Honestly, who cares? Airplane food is disgusting. If it isn't it's just snacks. Oh my god a coach said I can't eat a granola bar. Now if you're saying the disturbing part is him cursing at a flight attendant then that is another story. Let's not forget on our Stanley Cup run MG had everyone wear watches to make sure they were sleeping at proper hours and not out partying or how this current team doesn't let the players play Fortnite on the road. These types of things are really not that big of a deal. Bill Peters kicking and punching players and using racial slurs is not in anyway comparable.

I’m pretty sure NHL players fly either on a team plane or on charters where proper meals are provided.  For Sutter to deny the players dinner because he felt they didn’t deserve it is akin to a parent saying a poorly behaving child is going to bed without their dinner.  It’s kind of controlling beyond crazy.  What Peters did was way worse though.  I can actually see physical stuff happening between a player and a coach, but that ‘n music’ comment was racially motivated.  

[spur1]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

I’m pretty sure NHL players fly either on a team plane or on charters where proper meals are provided.  For Sutter to deny the players dinner because he felt they didn’t deserve it is akin to a parent saying a poorly behaving child is going to bed without their dinner.  It’s kind of controlling beyond crazy.  What Peters did was way worse though.  I can actually see physical stuff happening between a player and a coach, but that ‘n music’ comment was racially motivated.  

Part of the story was D Sutter hitting players as well.