[PGT] Vancouver Canucks at Pittsburgh Penguins | Nov. 27, 2019

[Kanukfanatic]

2 hours ago, Coconuts said:

Most of us will be here Sunday whether we beat Edmonton Saturday or not, that bandwagon piece is garbage tbh. The reactions in this thread don't mean people don't support the team. Most folks wouldn't bother coming round if they didn't.

 

Yeah, we're a team in transition. Yeah, we're a team missing some pretty big pieces thanks to injury. But when a team gets ventilated for five goals in a period it's fans are gonna be pretty frustrated. Fans are going to get emotional, criticisms are going to be (fairly and unfairly) made. In this case it's just cumulative frustration. Fans will do this because they're invested on some level. Lot of us have already been dealing with a team in transition for a few years now. I wager most of us will be here the next few years too, regardless of whether this team makes the playoffs or not. 

 

You don't have to like the PGT reactions, and yeah they can get ugly after a loss, but they're valid reactions after an ugly loss. 

Excellent post. Calling us band wagoners because we don't like a loss where the canucks give up 6 goals in a period is stupid.

[AlwaysACanuckFan]

1 hour ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

A great example of how some things are bigger than the sport itself.

[PhillipBlunt]

2 hours ago, Coconuts said:

Most of us will be here Sunday whether we beat Edmonton Saturday or not, that bandwagon piece is garbage tbh. The reactions in this thread don't mean people don't support the team. Most folks wouldn't bother coming round if they didn't.

 

Yeah, we're a team in transition. Yeah, we're a team missing some pretty big pieces thanks to injury. But when a team gets ventilated for five goals in a period it's fans are gonna be pretty frustrated. Fans are going to get emotional, criticisms are going to be (fairly and unfairly) made. In this case it's just cumulative frustration. Fans will do this because they're invested on some level. Lot of us have already been dealing with a team in transition for a few years now. I wager most of us will be here the next few years too, regardless of whether this team makes the playoffs or not. 

 

You don't have to like the PGT reactions, and yeah they can get ugly after a loss, but they're valid reactions after an ugly loss. 

Well said, Coconuts. While I try my best to straddle the fence and look at the team's performance through a subjective lens, there are times where the performance (excellent or atrocious) renders me incredulous and I tend to share that reaction, for better or worse.

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, GritGrinder said:

US Thanksgiving and that means that 76% of the teams currently in the playoffs will more than likely still be there at the end of the season. The West is really tightening up and the Canucks could very easily wake up Monday morning and find themselves tied with the Wild for 14th in the West slightly ahead of the Kings. The 2 games against the Oilers this weekend are important, they don't want to all of a sudden be chasing 5-6 teams for a wildcard.

 

This list probably won’t look at all the same by the time the playoffs are around, too many teams under and over achieving and it’s so close a couple wins or losses either way is the difference between being in the top 6-16 and not.   Crazy that with OT wins and losses padding everyone’s stats there are a couple below .500 teams in it at all.   Don’t think the list will be in concrete until after the all-star game ...

[EP Phone Home]

I’m here to humour you all as well as find the silver linings in all this frustration and misery of last nights loss.

 

Don’t know if anyone else posted this but it is something to be excited about. Only behind the great Ray Bourque. What a stud we finally have. 

Edited November 28, 2019 by EP Phone Home

[IBatch]

19 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said:

Excellent post. Calling us band wagoners because we don't like a loss where the canucks give up 6 goals in a period is stupid.

After a “game like that” fans get a bye for any sort of crap they say.   98% of people on the CDC that log on regularly are mega-fans IMO.   Especially us old dudes/dudettes that have trouble with technology.   I’d add some funny gif if I could figure it out - hold on here is what you get 

[fecklund]

Came across this interview Rintoul did a couple days ago with Paul Reinhart.
Good insight into how the game has changed, and how it hasn't, with respect to an NHL defence corp.
Best offensive defenceman the Canucks ever had. Back to back 57 point seasons before his back gave out, and he had to retire at 30. 
Of note: He did actually play Center once in a while when in Calgary/Atlanta... so call him the Brent Burns of that era.

Also.... he's available.. just sayin'   -) 

http://pmd.sportsnet650.ca/audio_on_demand/Reinhart-with-Rintoul-srs-20191126-Interview.mp3

[Tre Mac]

24 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said:

Geez I must be watching a different Boeser. I see a guy who fore checks hard, and is putting up points. I see a guy who is actually skating better then he did all of last year.

He was on the ice for like 4 goals against last night, he finished -2 when his team scored 6 goals.  He missed his man twice on the backcheck  in the third period.  I know he isn't getting paid to be a Selke winner but this isn't anything new to him, he had a couple of awful games defensively last year and vowed to be better.  He was hustling and forechecking well earlier in the year but this roadtrip he's been pretty bad.

[SergioMomesso]

Still have a hard time defending down low in our end no matter who is on the ice.

[DIBdaQUIB]

13 hours ago, samurai said:

Benning doesn't do new jerks - Green is not going anywhere

 

No Sutter, Beagle, Ferland, Roussel.

 

 

That depends.  Benning made some big moves this summer to take this team to the next level. If that isn't happening, he may feel pressured to make a change coaching to save his own neck.

[J.I.A.H.N]

9 hours ago, DS4quality said:

The problem is that there is no strategy with this team, it has nothing to do with who is in the line up. Colorado and Pittsburgh have  had more devistating injuries than the Canucks, the some problems I see are:

Zone exits, zone entries, defensive sets, a stagnant powerplay, a 6 million dollar forward who can't get going playing 6 minutes on the 4th line, dump and chase, playing a 34 year old defenseman  25 minutes a game, no consistency with lines or coaching, benching useful players, bad bench minor penalties, and giving up huge leads...

 

Other than that the team is fine. 

 

Imagine Travis in a 7 game series, do you actually think he'd out coach his opponent? 

Petey on the ice for 3 last goals should tell you that our best players can't get out of the zone because the strategy is awful. 

So, Let's take this 3 /4 years down the road and look back to these past few years

 

Aqualini hired a rookie GM, who had only been AGM before. so he had experience, but never running an entire franchise

 

Aqualini hire, what he thought was the best canidate…...and as time has shown, the learning curve was full of bumps, but ultimately he has built up

 

the most talented young core we have ever had

 

Same thing could be said for Travis Green, how many times has he ever had this much young talent to work with, all at one time? And Green was a green

NHL coach. But again Benning hire who he thought was the best candidate to work with a  young up and coming core......But there has been bump and the learning curve

it steep...…...

 

So now we slide down to the young core, who have never played in the NHL, and again Benning picked the players he thought would make the best core

and who he thought would be the very best team, but again, they are also young and there is a steep learning curve.

 

Our best 2 players, Pettersson and Hughes are still trying to figure this all out and are 2 to 4 years away from playing their best hockey, as can be said for Gaudette, 

Boeser, and Demko

 

We have a young captain...…..etc, etc, etc...…...

 

Have some patience and give these guys a chance to mature, both within the league, and as people...…...

 

This is a exciting time, and CDC will miss it all, if they just look at all the negatives………...

 

We don't even know what this team will look like in 3 years, out side the core. we don't know who will be coaching, nor who will be our GM, or who will own it....

 

Sit back and enjoy this

 

For those old enough to have kids...…...remember those early years, when not all the events with them were successes? The best years of my life!

And now, I get to look and am proud of how those times made my kids who they are today...…..not perfect, but perfect to me!

 

That is how I see our Canucks right now...…...

[IBatch]

4 minutes ago, EP Phone Home said:

I’m here to humour you all as well as find the silver linings in all this frustration and misery of last nights loss.

 

Don’t know if anyone else posted this but it is something to be excited about. Only behind the great Ray Bourque. What a stud we finally have. 

And it’s not even December yet...I’ve brought this up before and will again we are literally witnessing history go full circle again.  For all of you who missed what some or most of what Borque, Coffey, Murphy, Chelios, Pronger, Lidstrom, Blake, Macinnes, Leetch, Zubov, Wilson, Minister of Defense, Robinson, Park, Orr, Potvin, Babych, Carlyle and a few others did (Festivov) ... well it’s come full circle.   In the past 20 years or so only EK, Burns, Chara, Doughty and Keith are shoe ins for the HHOF.  20 years before that well over a dozen and just as many that didn’t get in (Wilson, Babych, Caryle etc)... 

 

Now with Dahlin, Makar, Q Hughes, Heiskanen, Chabot plus a bunch more promising guys about to get in or just starting... all I can say ITS ABOUT TIME.

 

Only EK has finished in the top ten in scoring three times the past generation (joining Orr, Potvin and Coffey as the only guys that have ever done that)...

 

Nice to have such a great crop of young defenseman again - it will absolutely help keep games closer to 5-4 then 2–1.  

[J.I.A.H.N]

2 hours ago, Coconuts said:

Most of us will be here Sunday whether we beat Edmonton Saturday or not, that bandwagon piece is garbage tbh. The reactions in this thread don't mean people don't support the team. Most folks wouldn't bother coming round if they didn't.

 

Yeah, we're a team in transition. Yeah, we're a team missing some pretty big pieces thanks to injury. But when a team gets ventilated for five goals in a period it's fans are gonna be pretty frustrated. Fans are going to get emotional, criticisms are going to be (fairly and unfairly) made. In this case it's just cumulative frustration. Fans will do this because they're invested on some level. Lot of us have already been dealing with a team in transition for a few years now. I wager most of us will be here the next few years too, regardless of whether this team makes the playoffs or not. 

 

You don't have to like the PGT reactions, and yeah they can get ugly after a loss, but they're valid reactions after an ugly loss. 

Well, as I just posted....I sure hope it isn't the way they raise their kids, when the kid is trying to learn to walk or learning to spell...…..LOL

 

Yes, I get they are disappointed...…..but look for the positives...….there were lots!...…..Even strength goals, Virtanen, Hughes, Miller, zone entries...etc

 

It will come Grass Hopper...it will come!

[Squamfan]

1 hour ago, khay said:

That was nice of him. 

 

By the way, why didn't Marky start yesterday? I just realized Demko started against Flyers and then again versus the Pens. Is it just Green rewarding a solid performance from the previous game or are they testing out Demko to see if he's ready to take over as #1? 

 

Dhaliwal said it might be injury 

[LateNightBus]

Most likely this has been said before. My opinion is that the Canucks need better defense, from all players, perhaps a new defense only assistant coach can be brought in. This will still give coach Green a chance to improve the team, changing coaching at this point is too soon? especially with coaching problems from many other teams.

 

My main xperience is collecting broken hockey sticks as a youth from the Montreal old forum and hockey cards with the flat bubble gum inside the card pack.

[Topcheeze86]

15 hours ago, Johnny Torts said:

Goldy is in TG's doghouse for a while now. He needs to start kissing ass like LE does for gametime / icetime. What a waste of a roste spot probably another TG move.

Like i said before green loves grinders and he wants goldy to play like a grinder its a waste of offensive talent 

[Smashian Kassian]

Gaudette last night is kind of a microcosm of our young team.

 

Scores 2 big goals, then also gets caught standing+watching as Malkin rifles the goal that shifts the game.

 

The one thing I'd say about the coaching is we sit back too much in our defensive structure. We collapse too much. Could use some more aggressiveness.

[fecklund]

4 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

So, Let's take this 3 /4 years down the road and look back to these past few years

 

Aqualini hired a rookie GM, who had only been AGM before. so he had experience, but never running an entire franchise

 

Aqualini hire, what he thought was the best canidate…...and as time has shown, the learning curve was full of bumps, but ultimately he has built up

 

the most talented young core we have ever had

 

Same thing could be said for Travis Green, how many times has he ever had this much young talent to work with, all at one time? And Green was a green

NHL coach. But again Benning hire who he thought was the best candidate to work with a  young up and coming core......But there has been bump and the learning curve

it steep...…...

 

So now we slide down to the young core, who have never played in the NHL, and again Benning picked the players he thought would make the best core

and who he thought would be the very best team, but again, they are also young and there is a steep learning curve.

 

Our best 2 players, Pettersson and Hughes are still trying to figure this all out and are 2 to 4 years away from playing their best hockey, as can be said for Gaudette, 

Boeser, and Demko

 

We have a young captain...…..etc, etc, etc...…...

 

Have some patience and give these guys a chance to mature, both within the league, and as people...…...

 

This is a exciting time, and CDC will miss it all, if they just look at all the negatives………...

 

We don't even know what this team will look like in 3 years, out side the core. we don't know who will be coaching, nor who will be our GM, or who will own it....

 

Sit back and enjoy this

 

For those old enough to have kids...…...remember those early years, when not all the events with them were successes? The best years of my life!

And now, I get to look and am proud of how those times made my kids who they are today...…..not perfect, but perfect to me!

 

That is how I see our Canucks right now...…...

This isn't the old NHL anymore. You keep mentioning a timeline..... in 4 years, more than half of this current team will be gone - and that possibly includes some of the "new core" because we wont be able to keep/afford them all.

Hence why fans now are a lot less patient than they may have been in the past.

We've already pee'd through multiple ELC contracts given to some of our top new players without even having made the playoffs. Remember when Bo Horvat made the team?Feels like yesterday he was getting the green light from Desjardins..... but that was FIVE YEARS AGO already.

There's even more pressure on a management group (use that term loosely in regards to us) these days because the window to win can open and close a helluva lot faster than it has in the past. Over just the last 10 years or so, suddenly you have a landscape where young kids, barely out of high school, are making immediate and substantial impacts to their respective clubs. 
Strike when the iron is hot, so to speak. 

The upside for us I suppose, is that we seem to have some legit talent coming up that could offset some of the players we may need to move on from due to a future cap crunch.
Guys like Madden, Hoglander, even Tryamkin... there are more, but if you can simply offset a loss by inserting a new player and starting that ELC timeclock over again on-the-fly i think we should be ok. But that's a big "if" because for every *top prospect, there's a Daigle in hiding.
This is (obviously) why drafting well is so important, and it never has been moreso than today. 

While I agree with some of the stuff you said there, we can't overlook the timeline we're locked into, and the respective contracts that are tied into it with respect to our new core. There's not much time to waste. 
In the words of the mighty Ricky Bobby " If you're not first, you're last!" 


 

[c00kies]

15 hours ago, Dr. Crossbar said:

We went through this with AV too. 

Yup, the 06-07 season. We weren't even .500 at Christmas, then went on an absolute tear and won the division.

[Coconuts]

56 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said:

Excellent post. Calling us band wagoners because we don't like a loss where the canucks give up 6 goals in a period is stupid.

Bandwagoners are those who jump off a wagon when things get bad or jump on a wagon when things are taking off (Chicago post 2010). In my experience most Canucks fans stick around through the bad times. Hell, at this point most of the seasons following 2010/2011 and 2011/2012 qualify. Those seasons had bright spots sure, but there were certainly more valleys than peaks. 

 

I get emotional when we win or lose, I'm very invested. Perhaps too invested. Sometimes I'll check out early when the games get real ugly, but I'm usually back to reading up on the team and following them intensely the next day. There are a lot of folks in the same boat. Our criticisms, frustrations, our emotional and rational calls for change, ect don't make us bad fans. Nor do they make us bandwagoners. Sometimes folks get carried away, sometimes we say dumb $&!#. Doesn't mean those reactions aren't valid. 

 

We get worked up, frustrated, ect because we give a damn. 

44 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Well said, Coconuts. While I try my best to straddle the fence and look at the team's performance through a subjective lens, there are times where the performance (excellent or atrocious) renders me incredulous and I tend to share that reaction, for better or worse.

You're probably better at that than I am, but I def get where you're coming from. We're only human, humans react. Sometimes it's hard to be objective. 

14 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

Well, as I just posted....I sure hope it isn't the way they raise their kids, when the kid is trying to learn to walk or learning to spell...…..LOL

 

Yes, I get they are disappointed...…..but look for the positives...….there were lots!...…..Even strength goals, Virtanen, Hughes, Miller, zone entries...etc

 

It will come Grass Hopper...it will come!

I like to think most people can see the positives of this young group, problem is it's not all positives regarding this team and people are gonna dig into those things as well. Looking for silver linings is great, but there's a lot more to a big picture than it's silver linings and positives. 

 

I know you mean well, and I wasn't trying to stir anything up. But people expressing their frustration, bewilderment, their grievances, calls for change, ect is important too. People are going to express those things, I'm going to express those things. There were good things about last night, sure. We scored a bunch of goals at even strength finally, Hughes and Petey picked up points, Miller scored. But we also had one shot on goal after the first ten minutes, collapsed despite having a sizable lead, didn't show the same resilience Pittsburgh did (they're missing guys too) and gave up five goals in a period. There's always going to be both sides, even after the games we win. 

Edited November 28, 2019 by Coconuts