[PGT] Calgary Flames at Vancouver Canucks | Feb. 08, 2020

[Lazurus]

4 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

11 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said:

 

How this season will end, should help determine Greens' tenure as coach.  Imo, he is still developing (just like our young core) and I hope he wins with this group but his destiny is, mostly, in his hands and the players.

I think he’ll be canned if they miss the playoffs. For sure. 
 

He has some great ideas that have been shown to have positive outcomes, for sure. That being said, this team has major issues that Green can’t seem to fix. His assistant coaches should be canned immediately. Benning made a big mistake re-signing those two.

I don't know, how many coaches can a GM fire before his job is on the line? Green has stated a few times that they need "bigger" players, he can't say fighters, that is not allowed, even Burke had to use the word "truculence". Boston still has 4 or 5 guys that will drop them, Chara is still a beast at 42 nobody wants to dance with him, Washington, well they have one or two and then there is Ovy, get him riled and he might start running over players, Vegas went out and got the champ of the day, who wants to take on Benn or Getzlaf, Burns or Kane? There is just nobody on the Canucks, the team is not good enough to carry any dead weight or support a player that would rely on others to make up a difference in play. Lucic is certainly not effective by  himself anymore but he is still the "nuclear deterrent" and can put up points when helped.

 

Green has all but said what he wants, he can't say much more with criticizing the boss, even a media scrum where he complains about the reffing is hinting to management the team needs help in that area. Think on it, what combination, threats or other things can he do? 

[LowerMainLander18]

12 minutes ago, 'NucK™ said:

So what you're saying is the team responds to verbal abuse but does nothing when being physically abused?

That doesn't make me feel any better or see that dumb fight any differently.. 

Not at all. 

If he fought because he couldnt take some chirps from the Turtle, that would be a horrendous timing and ur point is valid.

But situation changes perspectives. 

 

EP40 was playing hurt. Flames knew that. Turtle would love to pounce on that. 

That faceoffs, the Turtle lined up against EP40. Wasn't caught on camera but who knows what was being said/ done there.

 

Miller was sending a message to both the Nux and the Turtle to stay off his linemate.

That is the reason why I think the fight wasn't so bad despite terrible timing. 

 

Green called out to the team and he wanted to respond. 

 

I would be a lot more mad if Turtle was taking runs at EP40 that shift after our early goal. 

Flames had less to lose that game than us. We scored a goal like that early. Nothing holds Turtle back from targeting EP40. 

 

[Bo fan]

25 pages of negativity but there was the odd positive to take out of all off it

It does no good to get angry - the team is what it is - trade deadline is coming - hope JB can pull off some moves

 

Our defense is bad - infact it is worse then bad and maybe Rafferty is ready for the NHL and maybe not - Oly? we don't know - Tram - well if he comes back I am not convinced he is better then we have - sure he's a big body but  Willie couldn't coach meanness into him. Good d men are hard to come by - I think Winnipeg fans warned us that we would have a love/hate relationship with Myers - when he is good id is great but when he's bad - yikes

 

We have some key pieces but we still need more - this re build is not yet complete

The goal for this season was to push for the playoffs - so far they are doing that - and I agree with most on here that we wouldn't go far if we make the playoffs - what  we would gain is the kids getting some playoff experience even if it is only the 1st round.

 

And I do agree 100% that we need some team toughness - we have guys that are capable but for whatever reason they don't answer the bell very often.

 

Hope as a team they show up for Sedin week -  would be pretty depressing to lose the games this week

[PhillipBlunt]

Just now, Lazurus said:

I don't know, how many coaches can a GM fire before his job is on the line? Green has stated a few times that they need "bigger" players, he can't say fighters, that is not allowed, even Burke had to use the word "truculence". Boston still has 4 or 5 guys that will drop them, Chara is still a beast at 42 nobody wants to dance with him, Washington, well they have one or two and then there is Ovy, get him riled and he might start running over players, Vegas went out and got the champ of the day, who wants to take on Benn or Getzlaf, Burns or Kane? There is just nobody on the Canucks, the team is not good enough to carry any dead weight or support a player that would rely on others to make up a difference in play. Lucic is certainly not effective by  himself anymore but he is still the "nuclear deterrent" and can put up points when helped.

 

Green has all but said what he wants, he can't say much more with criticizing the boss, even a media scrum where he complains about the reffing is hinting to management the team needs help in that area. Think on it, what combination, threats or other things can he do? 

Yet his team plays with zero urgency and guts. Certainly Benning may get the ax too if the team falls out of playoff contention this season, but he’s brought a lot of hard nosed players here to shape the roster. He’s provided Green with the types of players he’s asking for, yet they play a weak game. 

[Gawdzukes]

7 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

I think it more than that, I think it has to do with Hughes and Stecher not being able to control the bigger players in their own zone. Hughes is great at offence and that makes a difference but he is not very good on the board battles or moving guys from the front of the net, the same with Stecher, lots of try but not much luk along the boards. Edler is trying to step up and make hits, way more than he did the last three seasons and Tanev has always been a "contain" and block shots type player so that puts a lot of pressure on Myers, Benn and Fantenberg to win the board battles. No doubt this will get flack but they only need to lose these battles badly three or four times a game. StLouis, as noted by Benning, have a huge defense and as a result great goalie stats now. Good and effective defense usually results in great goalie stats and wins. Markstrom has been outstanding by comparisons.

Again the type of player dictates the type of defense played and with all the rushes by the defense there are forwards often defending rushes instead of the correct players. A tradeoff if you like, Hughes has big numbers but lousy +/- numbers, at -4 and because he doesn't kill penalties, that means that for his 42 points it cost the Canucks 46 points against. That he has 35 PP points mean he has actually really bad numbers, defensively, 5 on 5. But this is a young player being showcased and helped for a chance at rookie of the year, but there is that cost.

 

 

I agree. People talk about push back and, 'do to Johnny Hockey what they did to Petey' stuff but I think the biggest problem is our D. Edler is big and lays the body but he is slow and less aggressive than when he was younger. Tanev isn't a deterrent, he's a reactionary player. Myers is slow as well and doesn't give out many big hits even though he's huge. Our most aggressive/chippy D are probably Fanta and Benn but they switch for each other and don't play much when they're in. Hughes is not deterring anybody and while Stetch tries his ass off neither does he.

[rekker]

Just now, Lazurus said:

I don't know, how many coaches can a GM fire before his job is on the line? Green has stated a few times that they need "bigger" players, he can't say fighters, that is not allowed, even Burke had to use the word "truculence". Boston still has 4 or 5 guys that will drop them, Chara is still a beast at 42 nobody wants to dance with him, Washington, well they have one or two and then there is Ovy, get him riled and he might start running over players, Vegas went out and got the champ of the day, who wants to take on Benn or Getzlaf, Burns or Kane? There is just nobody on the Canucks, the team is not good enough to carry any dead weight or support a player that would rely on others to make up a difference in play. Lucic is certainly not effective by  himself anymore but he is still the "nuclear deterrent" and can put up points when helped.

 

Green has all but said what he wants, he can't say much more with criticizing the boss, even a media scrum where he complains about the reffing is hinting to management the team needs help in that area. Think on it, what combination, threats or other things can he do? 

Not a single threat on this team for legit, physical pushback. Really sad state of affairs. Any team we face from here on out will be pounding us with no help from the refs to deter dirty plays. JB knows this and its why he signed Ferland. Canuck luck has Ferland looking like he's one more concussion away from some serious time off. Guys like Schaller and LE have to go and legit, young, physical players that will actually pose a threat need to be brought in. It's sickening to watch. 

[oldnews]

To Edmonton

Roussel

To Van

Kass

 

Why does Edmonton do that?   they don't

 

wish we poached him back when he was asking for a trade last season....

 

Realistically at this point;

To Edmonton

Roussel +

probably still not gonna happen.

 

EP MIller Kassian

Pearson Horvat Boeser/Gaudette

Ferland/Simmonds Sutter Virtanen

Motte Beagle MacEwen

 

 

 

[PhillipBlunt]

1 minute ago, oldnews said:

To Edmonton

Roussel

To Van

Kass

 

Why does Edmonton do that?   they don't

 

wish we poached him back when he was asking for a trade last season....

 

Realistically at this point;

To Edmonton

Roussel +

probably still not gonna happen.

 

EP MIller Kassian

Pearson Horvat Boeser/Gaudette

Ferland/Simmonds Sutter Virtanen

Motte Beagle MacEwen

 

 

 

Kassian is happy in Edmonton. Won’t happen. 

[ShawnAntoski]

21 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

The last good team didn't get to be good until the coach gave up the room to the players. Still different times though and the team was together longer and didn't rely only two or three sub 24's to win, although they did have a elite defensive group and a HoF goalie. Great job done by two GM's.

Imo, team identity, can come from both the coaching ranks and players but it is the coach that sets up the rules/team environment.

Edited February 9, 2020 by ShawnAntoski

[PhillipBlunt]

You think he’d accept a trade to Vancouver when he’s playing with McDiva?

[rekker]

Just now, PhillipBlunt said:

Kassian is happy in Edmonton. Won’t happen. 

Yip. 100 percent Kassian doesn't get traded. He's a valued commodity in the league. A talent difficult to obtain, which is why the Canucks are getting pounded lately. Im guessing JB is trying to find such players.

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[PhillipBlunt]

Just now, rekker said:

Yip. 100 percent Kassian doesn't get traded. He's a valued commodity in the league. A talent difficult to obtain, which is why the Canucks are getting pounded lately. Im guessing JB is trying to find such players.

He found one, who’s seemingly damaged goods. 

[PhillipBlunt]

Just now, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

Will be interesting to see how Green responds to questions about the lack of pushback (again) in last night’s game. 

 

Can see him avoiding answering the questions again. 

[You Mad Bro?]

3 hours ago, Alflives said:

Na, Petey should never take his gloves off.  It’s his stick that is his weapon.  He needs to take up fencing. 

I didn’t mean so he could fight. Squats and deadlift will make him so much better at staying on his feet and protecting the puck. Crosby has tree trunk legs and no one is better on their edges and protecting the puck low then him. I know Petey’s game is more skill than strength, but I feel more lower body strength would do wonders for him. Just my 2cents 

Edited February 9, 2020 by You Mad Bro?

[oldnews]

11 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

You think he’d accept a trade to Vancouver when he’s playing with McDiva?

did you read the post you responded to?

sounds like a bit of maxwell smart here.

Kassian has no clauses btw.

[rekker]

Times like this I think back to the low, low times in the re-build. I remember advocating for suiting up a gooned squad. Just get a bunch of goons to play along side what little talent we had. Maybe this would have gone a long ways to help the perception other teams have of the Canucks now.  

[rekker]

14 minutes ago, You Mad Bro? said:

I didn’t mean so he could fight. Squats and deadlift will make him so much better at staying on his feet and protecting the puck. Crosby has tree trunk legs and no one is better on their edges and protecting the puck low then him. I know Petey’s game is more skill than strength, but I feel more lower body strength would do wonders for him. Just my 2cents 

I'm not convinced. He has a gumby like physique to him that I think helps him avoid injuries. Like Rubberman. Petey and Quinn are fine and should not be asked to change their games at all. It's up to management to surround them with players who will drop mitts, hit, stick, punish, in whichever way any cheapshots on our stars. Is that really too much to ask?

[Lazurus]

38 minutes ago, Bo fan said:

Tram - well if he comes back I am not convinced he is better then we have - sure he's a big body but  Willie couldn't coach meanness into him. Good d men are hard to come by - I think Winnipeg fans warned us that we would have a love/hate relationship with Myers - when he is good id is great but when he's bad - yikes

Thank goodness Willie didn't coach meanness into him, in 79 games he had fights or had 8 players fight with him, there was that 5 on 1 game in Anaheim when he just tossed Getzlaf and others around, maybe not a fight and not all 5 because the one hit hit didn't get up. 175 hits in 79 games, at least 7 fights and he was not playing angry, nope don't need this guy. BTW McDavid couldn't get around him either.

Tram is a filled out Myers, if Myers put on 50 lbs he would be devastating. Tram reportedly actually lost some weight with his new training regime, he is down to 260 lbs but stronger and faster.

 

 

I like Myers but he is trying to play with defensemen that can't handle larger players or are not there at all when they rush, too much to do in his own zone. He will be a good core player in a year or two.

 

 

Rafferty should be given an opportunity, he has some size and is doing great. 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Lazurus

[PhillipBlunt]

10 minutes ago, oldnews said:

did you read the post you responded to?

sounds like a bit of maxwell smart here.

Kassian has no clauses btw.

Yes. I did. I know you said it ain’t going to happen. Same here. 
 

I doubt Holland would let him go though. I wonder why Kass didn’t get a clause as part of it. 

Comparing me to maxwell smart cuts deep. That hurts.