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[Trade] Kings trade Tyler Toffoli to Canucks for Tim Schaller, Tyler Madden, 2020 2nd-round pick, conditional 2022 4th-round pick

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1 minute ago, Devron44 said:

The point is to not miss the playoffs

Dangerous gamble. The fans will be very unhappy if we gave up a top prospect for a rental in a non playoff season..... 

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JB pulled off this deal before Rantanen got injured. He will be out for weeks according to the Avs.

 

imagine what the price had been if he didn't pull the trigger right away! We'd be in a bidding contest with the Avs. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, RRypien37 said:

Sure. Marginally better on the 2nd line. Is a temporary boost worth the long term negative impact? If this team was a contender, sure, it would be a great justified move. It is not a contender though, so it's irrelevant.

 

Shades of Derek Roy for a 2nd round pick + Connauton.  

Actually reminds me more of hunter shinkaruk trade , except we got a much better player in return

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Just now, Darkstar said:

Finally, got some content for an actual conversation.

 

a) Motte was a Hobey Baker finalist on a stacked Michigan team. Connor and Compher both finished ahead of him and points, and that team also had Werenski. 

The NCAA developed Quinn Hughes and Gaudette so it's not some "farce" league. There was no discussion of Pods and Hoglander, but Madden was still a top prospect on the team. He's carrying Northeastern on his back.

 

b) It's the classic "truculence" obsession on CDC. I really thought this was a thing of the past, especially after we drafted Pettersson and Hughes. Tyler Toffoli isn't going to defend Pettersson on the same level as Martin or Hughes. If the Canucks wanted "truculence", they should've went after Blake Coleman or Wayne Simmonds.

 

c) Many on CDC have this weird obsession with weight. You can build a skilled team that is complemented with tougher players. Toffoli isn't the grit you are looking for though, so I have no idea where this conversation enters the fray. If the Canucks traded Madden for a young power forward, it's a completely different situation. 

 

d) The trade does improve if Toffoli re-signs, but that is up in the air on either side.

I was just pointing out the fact that it doesn't always translate the way you think. He has promise but do you think he's honestly better than Hog or Pod or would get an opportunity ahead of them. What makes you think he's a top prospect? He can carry a team on his back but success in the NCAA isn't a sure thing, especially for people underweight. You can bring up Hughes and Petey but i'll just bring up where they were drafted. They are that damn high in the draft and that damn good.

 

The fact of the matter is he does have it tough breaking this lineup. We have needs in the bottom 6 that he doesn't bring and we have guys ahead of him that bring more to the table for the top 6. He's also gonna take time physically. The NHL isn't an easy league. He isn't a top 10 pick who's underweight, he's a 3rd round pick. He's gonna have a lot more hurdles than most top 10 picks. Topple the fact that he'll take time with the possibility that in that time as he develops we draft/sign someone who better fits our team needs further rendering him down the depth charts.

 

Point is, don't hang your hat on him playing 10 years when you are just speculating without considering every variable that goes with Madden and the Canucks as an organization. It doesn't make your points look good at all. Don't get me wrong I like Madden, or liked him as a prospect(until he was a king), but he has a lot more issues and flaws to deal with than most prospects have. That to me doesn't make him a sure thing and a top prospect to me is a sure thing. To me he has a lot of promise.

 

Canucks wouldn't of traded him if they weren't comfortable with it. These are the guys who have people that watch him on a strict basis to see what they got.

 

Even after Madden look at the centres behind him. Costmar's is blowing everyone's expectations as a 7th rounder having a killer season in Sweden's junior league, scored a goal during a SHL call up. It was stated here that Jasek ever since making the moved to center has been a key part of Utica. We arguably gave up our best piece at C but have some depth and with how good JB's drafting record is we shouldn't be uncomfortable, he can get a lot more promising players like Madden, he's gotten better at higher positions like Gaudette. 

 

Also the reason why we got Toffoli is because Boeser is out 3+weeks and Bo needs a 2nd line winger. He has chemistry with Pearson, so in theory there's a good chance it'll be a fit. We definitely can't complain about more goal scoring. It was never about size or grit, whoever made that point against you was mistaken. Also thanks for retorting a bit on if Toffoli re-signs. I really hope he re-signs cause we both agree it would be a better trade then.

 

FYI I still think team grit needs to be addressed. bottom 6 needs a new look and we definitely need a defenseman.

 

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1 minute ago, canuck73_3 said:

The fear of success on here from the usual suspects is hilarious

No, it’s the fear of next season, and the one after that.  We want a team that competes every year for a Cup, don’t we?  We have two phenomenal players now in Petey and Hughes.  Considering that we should be Cup competitive for a decade.  

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1 hour ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

After acquiring Toffoli you now want to trade Tanev?

Calm down. Did I say I personally want to trade Tanev? No. If Toffoli is re-signed however, he may end up being the casualty of that. As well, (remember to remain calm) there is rumour out there that Tanev might not be in the team’s future plans. 

1 hour ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 In what world does that make sense?

Clearly not in yours. 

1 hour ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

DId the Oilers or Flames get cap relief from that trade? The answer is no.

He was moved without high firsts going with him. 

1 hour ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

I can't believe you actually just asked those two questions. 

Who cares?

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12 minutes ago, redhdlois said:

Wait...what?!   You wanted to keep Schaller?

nope. I love Toffoli. I just hate giving away Madden. That will prove to be a 1 vs 1  in the future. Not to mention that 2nd pick...

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1 minute ago, RRypien37 said:

No one thinks that and no one said that. 

 

The top 6 is marginally better. Schaller is warm body on an expiring contract with no implications. 

I guess we will see. But Horvat deserves another winger and some semblance of stability on both his wings. Pearson has been good for Bo. And Toffoli on the other side is going to make things so much better for Horvat (hopefully). Chemistry can’t be understated either right. Toffoli and Pearson played on the same line together in L.A. that bodes well for chemistry with the Canucks assuming Green decides to play them together. 

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2 minutes ago, coastal.view said:

sweet

you bump this year into next

next year into the next

or plan to recapture them in a given season

 

guess what

you are crying over spilled milk

that bonus issue is already bumped to next season

ferland will remain on ltir

how do you propose to fix that without paying with assets

that totally out value the 1.5 million being bumped

you'd have to move a bad contract before the tdl

 

there are smarter ways to deal with that accounting item

 

Bumping them year to year doesn't solve any problems; it creates problems in those years. If we want to cover our bonuses for next year we're going to have to be under the cap, which means letting at least one of our UFAs walk (Tanev or Markstrom) and/or paying assets to move a contract. Tell me how that's a good thing?

 

It's too late for this year. We'd have to dump 5+ million in cap to cover the bonuses for this year. Next year is where we really have to save. I'd rather not mess around when we have to re-sign our two franchise players. That will be a pivotal point for our organization just like how this past summer was pivotal for the Leafs. 

 

If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that the price we would have to pay to fix this problem (moving assets to offload contracts) would not be worth freeing up around 1.5 million in cap space. So I ask you then, would you simply absorb the dead cap space? 

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1 minute ago, Alflives said:

No, it’s the fear of next season, and the one after that.  We want a team that competes every year for a Cup, don’t we?  We have two phenomenal players now in Petey and Hughes.  Considering that we should be Cup competitive for a decade.  

That is the point of improving the team Alf. Which JB did. And Toffoli can be re-signed. 

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1 minute ago, Alflives said:

No, it’s the fear of next season, and the one after that.  We want a team that competes every year for a Cup, don’t we?  We have two phenomenal players now in Petey and Hughes.  Considering that we should be Cup competitive for a decade.  

Alf - some poster here hope to maybe have 2 home playoffs games this year.... or next.

 

Others like you WANT a  cup  and hopefully a dynasty club.

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4 hours ago, -AJ- said:

Honestly a lot to pay, but where was Madden going to play on our team?

 

EP

Horvat

Gaudette

Madden? I think we'd need a Sutter/Beagle type here, not a 150lb skill player.

On the wing?

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3 hours ago, J-23 said:

Gillis deserves another opportunity imo

Not here I hope

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1 minute ago, Alflives said:

No, it’s the fear of next season, and the one after that.  We want a team that competes every year for a Cup, don’t we?  We have two phenomenal players now in Petey and Hughes.  Considering that we should be Cup competitive for a decade.  

hey alf

madden is not that big a difference maker

have no idea why you think he is

you realize we traded madden

not pods

not joulevi

not hughes

not hog

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1 minute ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Calm down. Did I say I personally want to trade Tanev? No. If Toffoli is re-signed however, he may end up being the casualty of that. As well, (remember to remain calm) there is rumour out there that Tanev might not be in the team’s future plans. 

Clearly not in yours. 

He was moved without high firsts going with him. 

Who cares?

 

I think I can conclude that you're trolling. 

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1 minute ago, canuckledraggin said:

nope. I love Toffoli. I just hate giving away Madden. That will prove to be a 1 vs 1  in the future. Not to mention that 2nd pick...

Sorry, I don't see this coming back to bite the Canucks in any meaningful way.

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6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

So what’s the plan?  How do we resign Marky, Tanev, Tofoli, and all our other guys due new (and more expensive) contracts?  If the goal is to build a team that can compete for a Cup over several season, what’s the plan to keep all our best players?  JB already said what the plan was.  He said last summer that as guys get too expensive he will replace them with young ELC players.  Now where do these young (and good enough to make a difference) ELC players come from.  Oh, that’s it!  They come from the draft, especially the first two rounds.  And sometimes they even come from a later round, like Tyler Madden.  Considering this is JB’s plan for coping with the cap, and being competitive over a several year period, can you not see why some posters are saying JB is selling the future to make the playoffs this season?  

Now saying all this, I want us to not only make the playoffs this season, but I want us to win the Cup too.  

I hope and think JB has a plan to keep these guys, obviously it would require guys like Beagle, Sutter, Baertschi and Eriksson to move on.  Will they all be gone by the beginning of next season (I wish) but likely not. I wouldn’t be surprised if Tanev moves on thoughwhich will hurt a little but I think we will manage to definitely keep Markstrom, Hughes, Petey and hopefully Toffoli too. If Tanev moves on it would hurt a little but Raferty or Tryamkin would be a cheaper solid fill in. I’d be happy to get a 1st for Tanev while we can (he will get hurt eventually). Then maybe pickup Bogosian for Baertschi or maybe Schenn. 

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Meh. We'll see how this plays out. 
 

Toffoli definitely balances out the top 6. 

 

Biggest need for this team now, is size and physicality. 

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