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Another Boeser Deal(Discussion)


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18 hours ago, xereau said:

Only reason would be for a serious upgrade at D.

I've been biting my tongue on this recently but was wondering what CDC thought about Brock for Dumba straight up.

I'd only be willing to part ways with "the flow" for a top 4 defender.

Actually came on to possibly start a thread on this in proposals and came across this. Not down for a Greenway type player but like your thoughts on a stud D man.

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I like this proposal by "bad alice french".  Boeser gets to go home to Minny and we get a 25 year old very solid D man (Matt Dumba).  We could even package up Troy Stecher to get a first or second round draft pick from Minny.  I really like Troy and I think he is underestimated by CDC and Canucks fans but Minny will want a youngish D man coming back or a D prospect.  I would prefer we send them Juolevi but I don't think that would get the deal done.  Boeser's contract is very attractive.  I'm a little concerned about Brock's play since his back injury.  His skating hasn't been as quick from a dead stop (not as explosive).  

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6 hours ago, bad alice french said:

I've been biting my tongue on this recently but was wondering what CDC thought about Brock for Dumba straight up.

I'd only be willing to part ways with "the flow" for a top 4 defender.

Actually came on to possibly start a thread on this in proposals and came across this. Not down for a Greenway type player but like your thoughts on a stud D man.

Custance asked an executive a few weeks ago for his take on Boeser for Dumba.  He would seriously consider the deal because he really likes Dumba but thinks Vancouver wouldn’t do it because Boeser is a core player for them.

 

Friedman, Dreger, Russo are all reporting that the ask by Guerin is a C1 or C2 plus an add.  They are apparently discussions with Florida about Trochek.  Florida would like Brodin but the Wild prefer to move Dumba - they won’t move both.  One is available because Soucy has emerged as a replacement for whichever gets moved. 

 

Vanek was a Gopher hero and ended up being so criticised in Minnesota because he couldn’t produce at the same level as on his earlier teams. He explained that he had been used to get in position, be fed the puck and shoot.  In Minnesota he had no one to set him up and had to completely change his game and it rendered him ineffective. 

 

Boeser is at risk of being in that same situation there.  They have no playmakers to set him up and don’t have a lot of speed in their lineup.  It’s hard to see him doing well in that environment.  He’d have to create his own chances and  because they are a slow team and his average skating - he would have so little space.  The Wild are better off to bring him in once they’ve found playmakers and added speed.

 

Dumba has plenty of tools, lots of variety in his shots but they are not going in this season.  He also needs a very strong defensive partner that can cover for him otherwise it can be quite the adventure in his own zone.  Feels like the wrong D to target for the Canucks.

 

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7 hours ago, mll said:

Custance asked an executive a few weeks ago for his take on Boeser for Dumba.  He would seriously consider the deal because he really likes Dumba but thinks Vancouver wouldn’t do it because Boeser is a core player for them.

 

Friedman, Dreger, Russo are all reporting that the ask by Guerin is a C1 or C2 plus an add.  They are apparently discussions with Florida about Trochek.  Florida would like Brodin but the Wild prefer to move Dumba - they won’t move both.  One is available because Soucy has emerged as a replacement for whichever gets moved. 

 

Vanek was a Gopher hero and ended up being so criticised in Minnesota because he couldn’t produce at the same level as on his earlier teams. He explained that he had been used to get in position, be fed the puck and shoot.  In Minnesota he had no one to set him up and had to completely change his game and it rendered him ineffective. 

 

Boeser is at risk of being in that same situation there.  They have no playmakers to set him up and don’t have a lot of speed in their lineup.  It’s hard to see him doing well in that environment.  He’d have to create his own chances and  because they are a slow team and his average skating - he would have so little space.  The Wild are better off to bring him in once they’ve found playmakers and added speed.

 

Dumba has plenty of tools, lots of variety in his shots but they are not going in this season.  He also needs a very strong defensive partner that can cover for him otherwise it can be quite the adventure in his own zone.  Feels like the wrong D to target for the Canucks.

 

Is there another center in the Canucks system I cannot find one, Madden may have worked with Boeser, both players of the future, is there another?

 

Gaudette might fit but then any deal is for more than just Dumba, there has to be a young NHL forward coming back. IMO with StLouis and the other large defense in the conference a bigger forward will help much more in the playoffs hence the Greenway suggestion.

 

There is Buffalo that might like a trigger man to play with Eichel or Reinhart but this might be a bigger trade involving more pieces both ways, not something the Canucks have done the last 6 years.

 

The Devils have the team's 1rst and a few large forwards Lots of potential win win moves possible with this team.

 

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Just now, Lazurus said:

Is there another center in the Canucks system, Madden may have worked with Boeser, both players of the future, is there another? Gaudette might fit but then any deal is for more than just Dumba, there has to be a young NHL forward coming back. IMO with StLouis and the other large defense in the conference a bigger forward will help much more in the playoffs hence the Greenway suggestion.

 

There is Buffalo that might like a trigger man to play with Eichel or Reinhart but this might be a bigger trade involving more pieces both ways, not something the Canucks have done the last 6 years.

 

The Devils have the team's 1rst and a few large forwards Lots of potential win win moves possible with this team.

 

They want a C1 or a C2 plus.  Friedman talks of a couple of 1st round as the add to a C2.  There’s no deal to be made with Minnesota given their asking price.  Guerin is under no pressure to move anyone and can wait like he did before dealing Zucker.

 

Devils talks of using picks to bring in players like they did Palmieri, Johansson.  Would think that they would gladly trade picks to bring in Boeser.

 

An executive told Custance that the Canucks won’t trade Boeser a few weeks ago.  He was commenting on Boeser for Dumba (before Guerin made it known that it had to be for a C1).  That executive would consider that deal because he really likes Dumba but said the Canucks wouldn't.

 

Burnside just this week in a Q&A asking about trading Boeser answered that he sees zero chance that the Canucks are interested in trading him.

 

Boeser is a core player.  It’s not him to move to create cap space.  It’s role players.  Chicago kept their core because those are the guys that are hard to find and moved out the support players.  

 

 

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24 minutes ago, mll said:

They want a C1 or a C2 plus.  Friedman talks of a couple of 1st round as the add to a C2.  There’s no deal to be made with Minnesota given their asking price.  Guerin is under no pressure to move anyone and can wait like he did before dealing Zucker.

 

Devils talks of using picks to bring in players like they did Palmieri, Johansson.  Would think that they would gladly trade picks to bring in Boeser.

 

An executive told Custance that the Canucks won’t trade Boeser a few weeks ago.  He was commenting on Boeser for Dumba (before Guerin made it known that it had to be for a C1).  That executive would consider that deal because he really likes Dumba but said the Canucks wouldn't.

 

Burnside just this week in a Q&A asking about trading Boeser answered that he sees zero chance that the Canucks are interested in trading him.

 

Boeser is a core player.  It’s not him to move to create cap space.  It’s role players.  Chicago kept their core because those are the guys that are hard to find and moved out the support players.  

 

 

I think that is a little bit of a generalization, C1 or C2, there are just not any established centers out there unless he wants a player like Kopitar, Getzlaf or Carter, a veteran, otherwise saying that is essentially saying he is not going to make any deals at all, which team will trade their #1 center away or #2? If they are any good thet keep them.

 

As you pointed out before, Boeser is not an exceptional skater or play-maker, he not large and is not really a boards guy and back checker. While not totally one dimensional it has been his effort that has been his biggest asset since his shot seems to have gone south. It may have been premature to stop rebuilding because he was labeled a "core" piece, maybe not but this team still needs more players for the future under 24 and he might be able to solidify either the defence for years to come or get a couple of young players in picks or prospects.

I know I see alot of posters stating 1rst round picks are carp shoots but that is not really the case even with this team, Giliis's only two top ten picks were very good players, one was traded but he had a very serious back problem and the other is the Captain, he was 2 for two, as a matter of fact the Canucks since Linden was drafted only had 3 bombs in top ten picks, so they are almost sure things as a matter of fact and just about all the teams best players have come through the draft.

 

Hugher, Petterson and Horvat maybe even Miller are core players

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31 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

I think that is a little bit of a generalization, C1 or C2, there are just not any established centers out there unless he wants a player like Kopitar, Getzlaf or Carter, a veteran, otherwise saying that is essentially saying he is not going to make any deals at all, which team will trade their #1 center away or #2? If they are any good thet keep them.

 

As you pointed out before, Boeser is not an exceptional skater or play-maker, he not large and is not really a boards guy and back checker. While not totally one dimensional it has been his effort that has been his biggest asset since his shot seems to have gone south. It may have been premature to stop rebuilding because he was labeled a "core" piece, maybe not but this team still needs more players for the future under 24 and he might be able to solidify either the defence for years to come or get a couple of young players in picks or prospects.

I know I see alot of posters stating 1rst round picks are carp shoots but that is not really the case even with this team, Giliis's only two top ten picks were very good players, one was traded but he had a very serious back problem and the other is the Captain, he was 2 for two, as a matter of fact the Canucks since Linden was drafted only had 3 bombs in top ten picks, so they are almost sure things as a matter of fact and just about all the teams best players have come through the draft.

 

Hugher, Petterson and Horvat maybe even Miller are core players

There are in discussions with Florida about Trockek but it depends on the add and Florida apparently prefers Brodin but the Wild are more leaning towards using Dumba in a trade. They won’t move both.

 

Trading Dumba weakens their D.  They only do it if it improves their C position.  They can’t just add top-6 wingers when they are already stuck with Zuccarello and Parise who aren’t suited for bottom-6.  Lines have to make sense and can’t just be a discombobulated construction.  The Wild want to compete too.

 

Russo: “but as much as Guerin would love not to trade Brodin or Dumba, if either player could get the Wild closer to a No. 1 center or bring back a No. 2 center and other assets, he’d seriously consider it.”   

 

Russo is conducting a fan Q&A at the Wild’s arena this morning and advertised by the Minnesota Wild themselves - he’s very plugged in. 

 

Friedman: “I don’t get the sense he’s inclined to do anything with either (Dumba or Brodin), unless it involves an elite centre, or maybe a No. 2 centre, providing that includes something extra — like a couple of first-rounders or something along those lines.”

 

There’s a video of Dreger somewhere saying the same thing.

 

Dumba is one of their best available trade chips.  They aren’t going to waste his trade value to bring in someone that doesn’t fill a need.  Minnesota has been stuck in mediocrity because they have never been able to have that one-two punch down the middle.  Guerin wants to change that.  They desperately need top-playmaking Cs.  They might need more 1st round picks to draft one.   Boeser doesn’t fill a desperate need and is more likely to struggle on their team.

 

For now every indication is that Benning has no interest in moving Boeser.  If he does I would think that NJD would be interested.  They are looking for young Ds of their own so I don’t see them moving Severson but rather draft picks and/or non core players.

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6 minutes ago, mll said:

There are in discussions with Florida about Trockek but it depends on the add and Florida apparently prefers Brodin but the Wild are more leaning towards using Dumba in a trade. They won’t move both.

 

Trading Dumba weakens their D.  They only do it if it improves their C position.  They can’t just add top-6 wingers when they are already stuck with Zuccarello and Parise who aren’t suited for bottom-6.  Lines have to make sense and can’t just be a discombobulated construction.  The Wild want to compete too.

 

Russo: “but as much as Guerin would love not to trade Brodin or Dumba, if either player could get the Wild closer to a No. 1 center or bring back a No. 2 center and other assets, he’d seriously consider it.”   

 

Russo is conducting a fan Q&A at the Wild’s arena this morning and advertised by the Minnesota Wild themselves - he’s very plugged in. 

 

Friedman: “I don’t get the sense he’s inclined to do anything with either (Dumba or Brodin), unless it involves an elite centre, or maybe a No. 2 centre, providing that includes something extra — like a couple of first-rounders or something along those lines.”

 

There’s a video of Dreger somewhere saying the same thing.

 

Dumba is one of their best available trade chips.  They aren’t going to waste his trade value to bring in someone that doesn’t fill a need.  Minnesota has been stuck in mediocrity because they have never been able to have that one-two punch down the middle.  Guerin wants to change that.  They desperately need top-playmaking Cs.  They might need more 1st round picks to draft one.   Boeser doesn’t fill a desperate need and is more likely to struggle on their team.

 

For now every indication is that Benning has no interest in moving Boeser.  If he does I would think that NJD would be interested.  They are looking for young Ds of their own so I don’t see them moving Severson but rather draft picks and/or non core players.

They may be motivated, they are very old and have Suter and Parise under contract forever.

Because of the ages of the untouchables they may be willing to trade their pick for a speed up, Boeser does still have the stats to impress the fans and be their poster boy, It might take a little sweetner, Juolevi? And ?, included to get their first and a forward.

 

Buffalo and New Jersey are both teams of interest and motivated for a Boeser deal, both have lots to offer. But both might wait until the season is done unless they really want him.

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1 hour ago, Lazurus said:

They may be motivated, they are very old and have Suter and Parise under contract forever.

Because of the ages of the untouchables they may be willing to trade their pick for a speed up, Boeser does still have the stats to impress the fans and be their poster boy, It might take a little sweetner, Juolevi? And ?, included to get their first and a forward.

 

Buffalo and New Jersey are both teams of interest and motivated for a Boeser deal, both have lots to offer. But both might wait until the season is done unless they really want him.

Not anymore.  Guerin has carte blanche to do whatever it takes to build an elite Cup contending team.  He just traded Zucker for futures.  The team is no longer on Parise/Suter’s timeline.  They are starting to identify their new core.

 

There’s even discussions about trading Parise but he would need to waive - there’s a team that is interested.  If he gets traded then it does open up a winger spot in the top-6.  They likely would have to take an ugly contract back so not sure they are even interested.  

 

I would think that they want to keep their 1st round picks to draft those Cs.  They seem to finally realize that they will be stuck in no man’s land if they continue to try and take shortcuts.  

 

Minnesota is willing to trade a D because they have Ds.  Vanek was such a fiasco - elite goal scorer with no playmaker on the Wild and too little speed.  He was a local hero for his Minnesota Gopher days but fans turned on him.  Don’t want that to happen to Boeser.

 

Boeser to Minnesota feels too early unless they can change the makeup of their team at this TDL or in the summer.  Maybe they can.  Guerin does want to get younger.  

 

I don’t think that trading Boeser is an option that Benning is considering.  The Canucks will have so many decisions to make and will need to find cap somehow.  A discussion for this summer.  

 

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2 hours ago, mll said:

I don’t think that trading Boeser is an option that Benning is considering.  The Canucks will have so many decisions to make and will need to find cap somehow.  A discussion for this summer.  

True Minny has to get younger they have 3 players signed until they are 40 but I think they will be stuck with those contracts because if theytrade them and they retire the cap recapture is very punitive.

 

Benning said he wanted to recoup the first round pick, he didn't say how but it won't happen by trading most of the team to someone. There are other markets that would be interested in Boeser that could give a first.

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He's a "core"..he's "part of the CORE"..media tires me. Is the team a F***ing MacIntosh or Granny Smith?!

 

Sorry, they might lose Jacob, Tanev or others due to a lack of cap. Some pieces will be shuffled out, & some puzzle can get snapped in. THEN there's the added variable of an approaching ED. You think that might make picks/ELC's a touch more attractive, in relation to established vets(or assets that must be listed)?! Yeah..figure it just mmmight.

 

Anywho we must all see the team's got pretty nice depth for offensive weapons(& more in the pipeline); whereas it's a little less impressive on the blueline(& in toughness/PO grit). Therefore I figure we need to transfer some of that O-power to guarding our own. It'll be interesting to see how Gent Jim plots this out...

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2 hours ago, Lazurus said:

True Minny has to get younger they have 3 players signed until they are 40 but I think they will be stuck with those contracts because if theytrade them and they retire the cap recapture is very punitive.

 

Benning said he wanted to recoup the first round pick, he didn't say how but it won't happen by trading most of the team to someone. There are other markets that would  interested in Boeser that could give a first.

we have been looking for another good top six forward  and we found one in Toffilo hopefully, you think Benning is going to get rid of Boeser when he finally has what he wanted. I think not!

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Why is when a need is filled someone else always has to go. You guys are nutcases with this. 
 

Are we really going to go another year of Boeser trade proposals..  23 years old, fools 

 

Can we just stop with Dumba too. Like hard on city around here for that guy

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On 2/21/2020 at 9:47 PM, naslund.is.king said:

Why trade a player who has 161 points in 196 games at the age of 22?

 

 

Why?  I like Brock but this may be the best time to trade him while his value is high but when we also know this is a time when there are other concerns with Brock such as:  successive serious injuries, goals have been less frequent in his last 20 games and his quickness/explosiveness has decreased since his back injury.  Also, he has a very reasonable and attractive salary that kicks in next year.  Other reasons to trade him to Minny:  1) they want him badly (young star and hometown boy) and may overpay to get him and 2) we will need cap space to pay Hughes, Toffoli and Petterson.  Based on his NHL stats (games played and points), Toffoli is more durable than Brock.  

 

If we do trade Brock to Minny, I'd like to see Matt Dumba in a Canucks uniform.  However, I would also be happy if we didn't trade Brock.  I'm just giving reasons why a trade to Minny wouldn't be a crazy idea.

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In a perfect world: This current cast(incl Brock) would win it ALL this spring, a 50th treasure. I love this collection of great troopers.

 

THEN at draft, we would be bold & deal a few heavy contracts, becoming younger, deeper, faster, bigger, everything positive _____er.

 

Just this moment, hope the HockeyGawds reward a team that has so much character, & fans who've waited patiently.

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8 minutes ago, sockeye said:

Why?  I like Brock but this may be the best time to trade him while his value is high but when we also know this is a time when there are other concerns with Brock such as:  successive serious injuries, goals have been less frequent in his last 20 games and his quickness/explosiveness has decreased since his back injury.  Also, he has a very reasonable and attractive salary that kicks in next year.  Other reasons to trade him to Minny:  1) they want him badly (young star and hometown boy) and may overpay to get him and 2) we will need cap space to pay Hughes, Toffoli and Petterson.  Based on his NHL stats (games played and points), Toffoli is more durable than Brock.  

 

If we do trade Brock to Minny, I'd like to see Matt Dumba in a Canucks uniform.  However, I would also be happy if we didn't trade Brock.  I'm just giving reasons why a trade to Minny wouldn't be a crazy idea.

Guerin again told Russo today that he is not trading Dumba unless he gets a C1 in return.  The Wild themselves organised a fan Q&A with Russo in their own facility.  They advertised it on their website and twitter account.  

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1 minute ago, mll said:

Guerin again told Russo today that he is not trading Dumba unless he gets a C1 in return.  The Wild themselves organised a fan Q&A with Russo in their own facility.  They advertised it on their website and twitter account.  

Interesting but I would bet that they would fall over themselves to land a local star like Brock. I bet the Minny fans would bring out the pitchforks if they didn't trade for Brock if it was known he was available.  Even if we couldn't land Dumba which I bet we could, we could at least land a first round 2020 draft pick and a good young D prospect which wouldn't be a bad idea.  What is said publicly by management isn't always the same as what is said privately.

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7 minutes ago, mll said:

Guerin again told Russo today that he is not trading Dumba unless he gets a C1 in return.  The Wild themselves organised a fan Q&A with Russo in their own facility.  They advertised it on their website and twitter account.  

Don't put gospel-stock in who said what. It's poker..are they required by law to clearly, publicly discuss their hand of cards & future intentions?

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1 minute ago, sockeye said:

Interesting but I would bet that they would fall over themselves to land a local star like Brock. I bet the Minny fans would bring out the pitchforks if they didn't trade for Brock if it was known he was available.  Even if we couldn't land Dumba which I bet we could, we could at least land a first round 2020 draft pick and a good young D prospect which wouldn't be a bad idea.  What is said publicly by management isn't always the same as what is said privately.

The Wild have wingers and some exciting ones coming at that.  The have no C1 or C2.  Waltz was again talking today about how the team has no chance to ever win anyting if they can’t find Cs.  Wild owner is fed up with mediocrity and doesn’t want to make the playoffs just to make the playoffs.  Their priority is really to get a C1. 

 

Fans wanted local hero Vanek and it ended up in a monumental fiasco.  Not sure they care about the local boy factor.  There are so many Minnesotans across the league.  Parise and Suter came back home but haven’t won them a Cup. 

 

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22 minutes ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

Don't put gospel-stock in who said what. It's poker..are they required by law to clearly, publicly discuss their hand of cards & future intentions?

Look at their roster.  It makes too much sense.  For years they have been lamenting not having appropriate Cs.  Guerin is not going to start his GM tenure by lying to fans.

 

Fenton got fired also for his lack of communication with fans and media.  You don’t have to disclose who you are talking to but a GM can perfectly admit the obvious. Top 6C is a major issue in Minnesota.

 

Benning is pretty transparent on what he is looking to add.  He talked of adding top-6 wingers and did just that.

 

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