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7 hours ago, Lazurus said:

:lol::lol::lol:

So you grant a player that asks for a trade carde blanche, you give all the power to him and screw the team in a trade. That isn't good for a team. On the ohter hand a player that keeps wanting more ice time is motivated. I would hope there are more than 5 or 6 on the team now.

1 -Kesler asked for a trade so dim jim didn't bother to shop him around because Kesler didn't want to be traded to some teams right? What gave Kesler the power to select where he would be traded? He didn't have a clause contract. Benning limited himself and the team.

2-FYI Benning had nothing to do with the Luongo trade and if you did know anything it would be that the team had already told him he was to be traded before they dealt Schneider, they had already jerked him around.

3-You know by your standards player should pay the Canucks to play here right? Crosby and McDavid should demand to be here for free! As far as player paying to be here what do you think taking a home town discount is? Kesler led the way there which got more players following and accepting less to play here, in a sense they did pay to play here.

Playoff spot, in your fantasy game maybe but in reality they are still not in the playoffs and to that end they are barely over a .500 team, 36W and 33L.and still in the bottom third of the league.

4-I don't see Roussel, Beagle, Sutter, Ferland, helping the team, they aren't hurting iy but they are not driving up the standings and they are not getting better each year either as they get into their mid 30's. But they can't be traded so they take up a roster spot that a younger player might have delaying improved performance by the team as the new players get acclimatized to the NHL game.

FA signed by Benning do get more than market value and he throws in a clause to boot for a longer term, just so they don't want a trade after getting here.

Maybe instead of signing ALL the older guys 2 or 3 prospects should have been given an opportunity, you know all those great draft picks,5 - maybe a few more of the 40+ should have been given a roster spot to compete for, I mean it isn't like this is or was a winning team, over the last years they have been the worst, so really all Benning did was spend money and delay younger players from getting a real shot for an open roster spot on the team. 50 losses is 50 losses but there were no youong players on it to learn and improve, only older over paid thankful veterans on retirement contracts.

I like Myers as a signing, a lot more than the Gudbranson trade.

I think Tryamkin will return to form and be better than before.

6-I think the team should have traded for more draft picks

I think the team should have used capspace and the rebuild time to trade for more draft picks

7- I think seven to eight years with only 4 young drafted players on the team is a disgrace.

I think just about every team in the league having more players under 24 on it shows a lack of rebuilding by Benning.

I think capping out the team every year hurt in the trade market at TDL time.

I think Benning handcuffed the team with all the clause contracts he signed

8 -I think Benning thinks fans are stupid and will drink any kool aid he supplies

I think the team has been losing so badly for so long that fans think not being 2nd to last in the division is a huge accomplishment even if it only because two teams faltered

 

9-I think, but hope not, the team will be doing another rebuild in two years something like Colorado did where young stars are traded for multiple picks and top prospects and top five draft picks will play significant roles. Ya, ya, Pettersson, Boeser and Hughes, but what about the other first rounders

 

1 - pure speculation, you have zero details of what happened in this or any other trades. Have you heard what Brain Burke said if a player asks to be traded? They're gone. I do agree that spoiled don't get the same treatment that they would have in Burke's day.

 2 - I didn't say Benning made that trade, i said it started the rebuild especially when Kesler demanded a trade. You're a lot like Fox news/CNN, purposely misconstruing words to try and legitimize your unfounded points.

3 - This makes less sense than the first two, Kesler had a 6 year deal at $5 million a year, Thats 30 million the Canucks paid him. Jonathan Toews was making $6.3 million a year at the time, Crosby was making 8.7 and still is, and he's considered one of the best ever. Thats the Canucks ripping off Kesler? I never heard that was why he asked to be traded, makes him look worse in my opinion. I'm Canuck fan, not a Kesler fan.

4 - This is why people that think this way do not run hockey teams. This is exactly why the Oilers sucked for 10 years with all those high draft picks. You develop players in the AHL, thats why the league exists. You ruin careers by throwing them to the wolves right away. The Canucks are lucky Virtanen is improving as well as he has lately. You need Veterans to teach and instill good work ethics. Rousell and Beagle have been good defensively, Who else stood up for the young players before they came? Wasn't that one of your guys gripes? Thats why they were signed. Beagle is 34 and the best conditioned Canuck. He wasn't signed to score points, he was signed to give them the type of 4th line centre you need. You know the one that played all those years with Washington winning a cup in his last there. Guess what? He was a 4th line centre that scored at the same clip he does here, they were sad to see him go.

5- You have to be good enough to play, you wanted them to gift spots simply because they were drafted? Most players outside the top ten picks of every draft are YEARS away from being ready to play in the NHL. Again, look at the Oilers and how come literally no team anywhere uses your philosophy.  They must be making these NHL video games to easy these days.

6- You have to have assets to trade first. Other than the Dallas Stars and Gagliari's personal vendetta with the Aqualini's screwing over the Hamhuis trade at the last second, who did they have to get the picks? Other teams don't give them away like EA sports 2004. You weren't acquiring draft picks for players like Megna and Chaput, not in the real world.

7- This is the biggest load of tripe in the post so far and thats saying something. Only 4 young drafted players? CNN?Fox mode again? Horvat, Boeser, Pettersson, Hughes, Virtanen , Gaudette, Demko with Hoglander, Podz, Lind, Juolevi, DiPietro and more in the pipeline. I also like the way you bemoan the draft picks and free agent signings but give no credit to the undrafted ones like Stecher, MacEwen, Rafferty and Michalis.

8-  No actually he's just doing his job, building a good team.   

9- I think you're alone on that sentiment, almost every one agrees the Canucks are an improving team that will be in the playoffs in at least one of the next two years.

 

 

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51 minutes ago, theo5789 said:

I'd also argue that the UFA signings were mostly meant to be stop gap signings until prospects took over. So he probably didn't have the intention of looking for the best player, but rather simply build competition that is surpassable (stealth tank if you will). So harder to say if he's poor with UFA signings or more calculated.

 

I agree that the bulk of his UFA signings were stop gaps. These signings let us take our time and develop prospects at their own pace with no rush. The challenge arose when EP and Hughes developed so quickly since their drafts.  This sped up our rebuild by at least a year or two.  I think JB expected guys like Sutter, Baetschi, Rousell, Beagle, Schaller to be off the books by the time this team was competitive and needed the cap space. 

 

LE is his worst deal by far, but I do't think any GM saw his play falling off as sharply as it did, LE was very good in Boston the year before he signed with us.  He had be a pretty consistent 30/30ish type player.  

 

UFA signings have been the area he has struggled in the most but as I said in my earlier post, I'm very happy with the job JB has done for us.  

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7 minutes ago, BCNate said:

 

I agree that the bulk of his UFA signings were stop gaps. These signings let us take our time and develop prospects at their own pace with no rush. The challenge arose when EP and Hughes developed so quickly since their drafts.  This sped up our rebuild by at least a year or two.  I think JB expected guys like Sutter, Baetschi, Rousell, Beagle, Schaller to be off the books by the time this team was competitive and needed the cap space. 

 

LE is his worst deal by far, but I do't think any GM saw his play falling off as sharply as it did, LE was very good in Boston the year before he signed with us.  He had be a pretty consistent 30/30ish type player.  

 

UFA signings have been the area he has struggled in the most but as I said in my earlier post, I'm very happy with the job JB has done for us.  

LE is no doubt the most obvious poor signing. I take the other hit or misses with a grain of salt because they were never long term solutions for us anyway. This past year's UFA was probably more indicative of targets that we had hoped would be players that took us to another level. Myers has been debated on, but I feel is a good addition in a position of need. Ferland was a gamble, but he potentially was top 6 material for a "bargain" price at that risk. Unfortunately the concussions caught up to him, but hopefully he can bounce back from it. Fantenberg and Benn were still a couple of stop gaps signings IMO.

 

I agree that I think that even Benning may have been surprised at how quickly things were turning around. However I think the signings were by designed to come off the books at strategic times. I think where he's been underrated though and doesn't get a lot of credit is his RFA signings where he's been getting players to sign for less than what most think they would've gotten because I think he's got the young guys buying into the system. This stems back to drafting for character, so these guys have a common goal on doing moreso what's best for the team rather than simply for themselves.

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1 hour ago, theo5789 said:

LE is no doubt the most obvious poor signing. I take the other hit or misses with a grain of salt because they were never long term solutions for us anyway. This past year's UFA was probably more indicative of targets that we had hoped would be players that took us to another level. Myers has been debated on, but I feel is a good addition in a position of need. Ferland was a gamble, but he potentially was top 6 material for a "bargain" price at that risk. Unfortunately the concussions caught up to him, but hopefully he can bounce back from it. Fantenberg and Benn were still a couple of stop gaps signings IMO.

 

I agree that I think that even Benning may have been surprised at how quickly things were turning around. However I think the signings were by designed to come off the books at strategic times. I think where he's been underrated though and doesn't get a lot of credit is his RFA signings where he's been getting players to sign for less than what most think they would've gotten because I think he's got the young guys buying into the system. This stems back to drafting for character, so these guys have a common goal on doing moreso what's best for the team rather than simply for themselves.

Well said, I agree with everything you wrote.  Meyers was solid last year, not outstanding, but was a big part of our D.  Without him I doubt we are in the position that we were when the season ended.  Benn and Fantenburg were good low cost stop gaps.  Tryamkin, Rathbone, Woo, Joulevi will eventually push them out of the lineup, maybe not quite yet, and certainly not last season.  Again, who though Hughes was going to be as good as he has been this soon, but more importantly, play as many minutes as he has.

 

 

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So not sure if I'm reading this right.

Ferland is training (Doesn't say if he's still on IR, I assume yes).

Markstrom is cleared to play.

Tanev is cleared to play

Leivo is still rehabbing. 

 

From what I can see on cap friendly:

- Domingue, MacE would have to go to the minors ( I really wish we could keep Zack).

- Fanta and Eriksson would have to be sent to the minors. 

 

We do that the team has about $200,000 in cap space. 

Would Eriksson deal with demotion? 

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10 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

So not sure if I'm reading this right.

Ferland is training (Doesn't say if he's still on IR, I assume yes).

Markstrom is cleared to play.

Tanev is cleared to play

Leivo is still rehabbing. 

 

From what I can see on cap friendly:

- Domingue, MacE would have to go to the minors ( I really wish we could keep Zack).

- Fanta and Eriksson would have to be sent to the minors. 

 

We do that the team has about $200,000 in cap space. 

Would Eriksson deal with demotion? 

If the season does restart I don't know if cap compliance is possible without a trade if everyone is healthy again.... too many damn F's on this team. 

 

Certainly Loui has to be papered to Utica. I doubt they'd make him actually report there since there's nowhere to go given that the  AHL is likely done no matter what. 

 

 

 

 

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I have to bend a knee and ask for forgiveness about the Kesler deal, he did have a NTC, he could reject 15 teams.

12 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

So not sure if I'm reading this right.

Ferland is training (Doesn't say if he's still on IR, I assume yes).

Markstrom is cleared to play.

Tanev is cleared to play

Leivo is still rehabbing. 

 

From what I can see on cap friendly:

- Domingue, MacE would have to go to the minors ( I really wish we could keep Zack).

- Fanta and Eriksson would have to be sent to the minors. 

 

We do that the team has about $200,000 in cap space. 

Would Eriksson deal with demotion? 

 

All of those would be exposed to waivers.

 

The long lay off has hurt the Canucks cap, players where they used the LTIR coming back force them to expose players and alter their line up. How much longer can they say Leivo is rehabbing an injury first estimated to take him to just after the playoffs started? I think JB was hoping that these LTIR players would come back in the playoffs and offer high level depth because the cap doesn't count in the playoffs.

 

This was clearly a one time big push for a playoff game or two but at a huge cost in the future. I guess he figured if the team made a playoff series fans would forget about the cost, they used to by naive fans in markets down south.

21 hours ago, Timbermen said:

3 - This makes less sense than the first two, Kesler had a 6 year deal at $5 million a year, Thats 30 million the Canucks paid him. Jonathan Toews was making $6.3 million a year at the time, Crosby was making 8.7 and still is, and he's considered one of the best ever. Thats the Canucks ripping off Kesler? I never heard that was why he asked to be traded, makes him look worse in my opinion. I'm Canuck fan, not a Kesler fan.

I am sure the quote is still out there where Kesler said he signed for less than market value to help the team keep it's players together. I don't know where the ripping off Kesler is in that. What I was pointing out in response to the post was in a sense taking a team friendly lower salary is similar to "paying" the team to stay because they could have got more on the market.

22 hours ago, Timbermen said:

9- I think you're alone on that sentiment, almost every one agrees the Canucks are an improving team that will be in the playoffs in at least one of the next two years.

When at the bottom of the well there is only going up.

Do you think this group of players are all going to be here next year and better than this year? Older players skill often declines I actually thought Benning maybe had a pretty decent playoff group for the bottom two lines but the cap shows this is a "one off" team and will likely or might take a step backwards next year. Markstrom's play was unconscious this year, he must have stole 4 to 5 wins mostly on his own.

 

The time is coming, the end of the season. I do find it curious that Bracket is still on the sidelines but part of the team.

 

Benning has said he wants to recoup his draft picks, so I wonder who he trades for 1rst's and 2nd's, it won't be Eriksson, Sutter or Beagle that's for sure.

It does leave the young players without clause contracts though. Horvat, Boeser, Virtanen, Demko, and Miller other than them I can't see any players that other teams would trade for top picks. Gaudette might get a 2nd but who else? There isn't even cap space to use.

 

If Tanev goes and Tryamkin steps into a shut down role is it a plus, minus or status quo? The big guy adds a different element to the team which Tanev doesn't, truclulence and they save on the cap hit.

If Markstrom is replaced by Demko it might be best for the future but after Markstrom's unreal play this year a small minus and big savings on the cap hit.

 

Resigning Stecher might work but he could be trade bait for later once under contract.

 

Holander's skill might mitigate the loss of Toffoli, he has deep roots in LA and they still like him there, LA is much improved after this draft and will improve even more this FA season But it helps the cap hit and youth movement.

 

2019-20 CAP SPACE

 UPPER LIMIT: 81.5M| LOWER LIMIT: 60.2M

 

Canucks current cap hit with all players healthy equals 88.7 mil. And 7 million in bonuses, recapture and buyout against next year.

If a flat cap then their cap upper limit is 74 mil, 77 mil? I am not sure about the penalty for being over the cap, a draft pick?

 

But with Covid that might change the end of season penalties but not what happens the next year, other teams have had to jettison players to make the cap.

 

.

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On 5/1/2020 at 10:58 AM, Lazurus said:

I have to bend a knee and ask for forgiveness about the Kesler deal, he did have a NTC, he could reject 15 teams.

He had a full NTC. He could reject any trade. He was only going to waive it for Anaheim or Chicago (on top of demanding a trade).

 

https://www.nhl.com/news/ducks-get-kesler-in-trade-from-canucks/c-724128

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Hard to figure out why Benning hasn't done more than sign a kid that isn't in the plans for next year.

 

I know the present excuse is not knowing the cap number for next year but how will that change much for this group of players.

 

They team is way over the cap no matter what number they come up with so on a grander scale signing players, the sub 5 million guys should be a priority even if they are traded next year, try to keep what assets the team can because there is a lack of draft picks and the team will have to shed 10 or 12 mil in contracts to sign even one of Tanev, Markstrom or Toffoli, the latter they would need to offer over 7 mil a season to get him to stay.

 

Some of the RFA's should not be hard and actually planning out next season's and the one after cap hits should be worked on even now.

 

I heard a tribute to Botchford and his description of the "Plan, no plan" approach of the team and it occurred to me that this is something that would fit right in there.

 

Brackett, still ongoing to the last minute, no signings or even negotiations, just a chat now and then with an agent.

 

It is like with the Covid shut down the team has stopped working and is using the new cap hit as an excuse for what would have happened anyway, some thing else to blame for the problems.

 

3 things can happen with the cap, it goes up a couple of mil, it stays flat or it goes down a bit and then the possibility of a salary roll back which is more possible.

 

Whatever, some decisions can be made with regards to forming a cap for the next two years.

 

Sure it won't be a slam dunk especially with the Seattle expansion but it isn't like they don't already know that some players will have to be let go and they should sign as many assets to recoup the losses of higher priced vets.

 

They already know some of it, all the guaranteed contracts, the clause deals that prevent trades, the lack of cap space that is going to happen and the dearth of draft picks to fill in at this time. Funny but LA decided to retool just this season and they ended up with 21 draft picks over the next two years and the Canucks "A" prospect that is projected to play next season, in less than a season they will have retooled.

 

Not one FA signed, not one RFA deal done, no front office signings and no draft picks for the first two rounds so what are they doing, watching soap operas? This is all season and not just the last 3 months.

 

And if they get gifted a playoff spot, I say gifted because they were not good the last 11 games winning only 4 so they were going in the wrong direction even with Markstrom in net, will that fool everyone into thinking this is a real playoff threat and Benning did a great job in 7 or 8 years?

 

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3 hours ago, Lazurus said:

Hard to figure out why Benning hasn't done more than sign a kid that isn't in the plans for next year.

 

How does JB do anything with any roster player, as there is still a trade freeze, remember the season isn't over yet. 

Have to make room on the Canuck Cap in order to any real adjustments to next years team.

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3 hours ago, Lazurus said:

Hard to figure out why Benning hasn't done more than sign a kid that isn't in the plans for next year.

None of us has any idea what he is our isn't working on.

 

Quote

...the team will have to shed 10 or 12 mil in contracts to sign even one of Tanev, Markstrom or Toffoli, the latter they would need to offer over 7 mil a season to get him to stay.

You might want to check your math there. And Toffoli is not going to see anywhere near $7... I'd be pretty surprised if he gets much over $5.

 

Tanev is likely only to see a couple hundred k raise. Markstrom +/- $2m. Simply buying Baer out is enough to cover +/- 3/4 of Markstrom's raise.

 

Quote

 

Some of the RFA's should not be hard and actually planning out next season's and the one after cap hits should be worked on even now.

 

I heard a tribute to Botchford and his description of the "Plan, no plan" approach of the team and it occurred to me that this is something that would fit right in there.

 

Brackett, still ongoing to the last minute, no signings or even negotiations, just a chat now and then with an agent.

 

It is like with the Covid shut down the team has stopped working and is using the new cap hit as an excuse for what would have happened anyway, some thing else to blame for the problems.

 

3 things can happen with the cap, it goes up a couple of mil, it stays flat or it goes down a bit and then the possibility of a salary roll back which is more possible.

 

Whatever, some decisions can be made with regards to forming a cap for the next two years.

 

Sure it won't be a slam dunk especially with the Seattle expansion but it isn't like they don't already know that some players will have to be let go and they should sign as many assets to recoup the losses of higher priced vets.

 

They already know some of it, all the guaranteed contracts, the clause deals that prevent trades, the lack of cap space that is going to happen and the dearth of draft picks to fill in at this time. Funny but LA decided to retool just this season and they ended up with 21 draft picks over the next two years and the Canucks "A" prospect that is projected to play next season, in less than a season they will have retooled.

 

Not one FA signed, not one RFA deal done, no front office signings and no draft picks for the first two rounds so what are they doing, watching soap operas? This is all season and not just the last 3 months.

 

And if they get gifted a playoff spot, I say gifted because they were not good the last 11 games winning only 4 so they were going in the wrong direction even with Markstrom in net, will that fool everyone into thinking this is a real playoff threat and Benning did a great job in 7 or 8 years?

 

A bunch of conjecture, hyperbole and nonsense... Weeee!

Edited by aGENT
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On 5/1/2020 at 5:02 PM, Jimmy McGill said:

If the season does restart I don't know if cap compliance is possible without a trade if everyone is healthy again.... too many damn F's on this team. 

 

Certainly Loui has to be papered to Utica. I doubt they'd make him actually report there since there's nowhere to go given that the  AHL is likely done no matter what. 

 

Apparently no cap limit expected once the season resumes.  The Canucks can activate Ferland without making any roster moves.    

 

 

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1 minute ago, mll said:

 

Apparently no cap limit expected once the season resumes.  The Canucks can activate Ferland without making any roster moves.    

 

 

wow thats great news for us. 

 

And its nice to see Leipsic get kicked onto waivers. What an a-hole. 

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5 minutes ago, mll said:

 

Apparently no cap limit expected once the season resumes.  The Canucks can activate Ferland without making any roster moves.    

 

 

That's an interesting tweet on multiple levels!

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36 minutes ago, mll said:

 

Apparently no cap limit expected once the season resumes.  The Canucks can activate Ferland without making any roster moves.    

 

 

Lucky Jim, it is. 


Team was sliding and was crippled up... surprise... then a virus likely saves the day in regards to pausing the season and eliminating some cap issues. 

 

Lucky Jim.

 

As I’ve stated elsewhere, I’ll take a lucky GM over most, any day. 
 

As much as I’ve criticized previous management decisions, going back to 2014, I admit that he has been lucky of late and I’m feeling pretty good about that today. 
 

Not really much to gripe about concerning the roster, for my tastes at least. Still a bit wimpy, but Lowry and Edmundson fit the age-build, if he could swing a deal. 
 

Lucky Jim, do your thing. 
 

 

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47 minutes ago, aGENT said:

None of us has any idea what he is our isn't working on.

 

You might want to check your math there. And Toffoli is not going to see anywhere near $7... I'd be pretty surprised if he gets much over $5.

 

Tanev is likely only to see a couple hundred k raise. Markstrom +/- $2m. Simply buying Baer out is enough to cover +/- 3/4 of Markstrom's raise.

 

A bunch of conjecture, hyperbole and nonsense... Weeee!

The skeletons are starting to come out now

 

You don't know what Toffoli made this year? 4.8 mil, he was on the top 2 lines in LA. So he wants to move to a higher tax bracket and have his young wife quit her job and buy an overly expensive home here or just live in a hotel? He was always a rental.

Tanev, TO or Montreal will go after him.

Sign Markstrom and trade Demko, good move! Increase the Cap and get rid of more of the future.

Baer is already over the cap even if they buy him out.

 

At least you are true to your convictions that Benning etal are the best ever. Looking like Brackett will be with the many fired by these guys.

42 minutes ago, mll said:

 

Apparently no cap limit expected once the season resumes.  The Canucks can activate Ferland without making any roster moves.    

 

 

There would be teams demanding the Canucks comply with the rules.

 

Multiple stories from multiple reputable sources coming out now.

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16 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Lucky Jim, it is. 


Team was sliding and was crippled up... surprise... then a virus likely saves the day in regards to pausing the season and eliminating some cap issues. 

 

Lucky Jim.

 

As I’ve stated elsewhere, I’ll take a lucky GM over most, any day. 
 

As much as I’ve criticized previous management decisions, going back to 2014, I admit that he has been lucky of late and I’m feeling pretty good about that today. 
 

Not really much to gripe about concerning the roster, for my tastes at least. Still a bit wimpy, but Lowry and Edmundson fit the age-build, if he could swing a deal. 
 

Lucky Jim, do your thing. 
 

 

Gear probably already had a plan for this, they may have used the Kane loophole to get Ferland into the lineup once the playoffs started. The cap issues as far as this year goes were minimal. We will have to see how they manage next year, hopefully "Lucky Jim" can roll on a couple of a compliance buyouts. B)

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